Fixxxer Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 Did you guys notice the holding penalty on Dawkins? Proposterous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 17 minutes ago, BillsInWilmingtonNC said: I know the penalty goes both ways for dropping your head, but it seems like a stretch to say Allen lowers his head, any slight drop in his head is 100% due to the fact he is trying to hold onto the ball in preparation for the big hit he is about to take. He definitely lowers his head and more runs into the defenders helmet, but I think the defender intended to hit him high anyway. He never lowered his pad level and that added with Allen going down was bad. I'm not full tin foil like a lot of people right now because I see DBs do this all the time. Look at the hits on WRs after a missed pass and you will see very similar style hits. DBs generally have the worst tackling technique of any position group. I don't know that anyone fears JA enough to do "sweep the leg" move, especially in this game where he was a turnover machine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50yrpatsfan Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 Pats fan here. When I saw it on live TV and on replays, I thought the hit was questionable. But I think this angle from the opposite side will change your minds completely: https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Allen actually is the one who turns toward Jones and lowers his head. It's surprising that Allen was the one injured and not Jones. There shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone an ejection. Jones gives away 50 lbs to Allen. Allen didn't slide and was truly a RB at that point. It was 3rd down, and Allen was going to fall forward for a 1st down if Jones didn't engage him. The other tackler Harmon hadn't really started to bring him down at the moment Allen & Jones collided. Nobody wanted to see the QB hurt, but Jones did nothing wrong here. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmur66 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 31 minutes ago, nucci said: Similar hit Thursday night...Barnett on Williams...taken off on stretcher and he wasn't ejected. I don't think the league knows what they are doing....Hyde was right though....if one of our guys hit Brady like that..... Very true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) @HOUSE the tin foil hat not big enough ??? did the bastard lower his head and make head to head contact? hell yes Was he ordered to take him out Greggga Williams style ?? comeonman!! Edited September 30, 2019 by SlimShady'sGhost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 Yes. These dirty ***** always look to take out a Bills player who is a key or is playing well. Was not surprised at all it happened yesterday. I just wish they'd retaliate but they know they'll be ejected. Just another reason I've never respected them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroutDog Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, PatsFanNH said: That makes no sense. Now if Allen had been in the pocket and took the hit and not 7 yards downfield running and trying get the first down I could see your point. This is Allen acting like Cam Newton and getting lit up. (This time illegally) Allen needs to learn to slide to protect himself otherwise he will have a short career. (Like Newton. Who I like as a QB) Doesn’t make sense? Watch the replay. All the talk is that Josh lowered his head. Simply not true: he was already being tackled. If you know Josh, you know he is going to lay it all on the line to move the chains/win the game. There was ZERO need for that hit and if you can’t see that then I’m not sure why you’re even here. Edited September 30, 2019 by TroutDog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 text book targeting defender had a chance to pull up....totally deliberate hit to head 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, 50yrpatsfan said: Pats fan here. When I saw it on live TV and on replays, I thought the hit was questionable. But I think this angle from the opposite side will change your minds completely: https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Allen actually is the one who turns toward Jones and lowers his head. It's surprising that Allen was the one injured and not Jones. There shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone an ejection. Jones gives away 50 lbs to Allen. Allen didn't slide and was truly a RB at that point. It was 3rd down, and Allen was going to fall forward for a 1st down if Jones didn't engage him. The other tackler Harmon hadn't really started to bring him down at the moment Allen & Jones collided. Nobody wanted to see the QB hurt, but Jones did nothing wrong here. Good lord. Jones is looking right at him and targets his head. He knew exactly what he was doing. Typical Patriot ballwashing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 38 minutes ago, frostbitmic said: I see that the NFL has blocked that video ... Something to hide Goodell ? Really? Where did he block it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 42 minutes ago, frostbitmic said: I see that the NFL has blocked that video ... Something to hide Goodell ? say what? I watched it. You just have to go to youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 12 minutes ago, 50yrpatsfan said: Pats fan here. When I saw it on live TV and on replays, I thought the hit was questionable. But I think this angle from the opposite side will change your minds completely: https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Allen actually is the one who turns toward Jones and lowers his head. It's surprising that Allen was the one injured and not Jones. There shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone an ejection. Jones gives away 50 lbs to Allen. Allen didn't slide and was truly a RB at that point. It was 3rd down, and Allen was going to fall forward for a 1st down if Jones didn't engage him. The other tackler Harmon hadn't really started to bring him down at the moment Allen & Jones collided. Nobody wanted to see the QB hurt, but Jones did nothing wrong here. Why are you here on this board? Why do you feel you need to defend the Pats**? Let me ask you this question honestly........... Do you feel the Pats** have cheated in the past? Or many times in the past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50yrpatsfan Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, SwampD said: Good lord. Jones is looking right at him and targets his head. He knew exactly what he was doing. Typical Patriot ballwashing. Watch the video objectively, like it was 2 other teams playing. Allen aims toward Jones and lowers his head. Jones braces for a hit. The crown of Allen's helmet strikes the side of Jones' helmet. It's very clear. https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Edited September 30, 2019 by 50yrpatsfan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 This is the first time I’ve seen this angle of the hit. I still see him dropping his helmet slightly, but you can also see Allen drop his head slightly too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Holmes Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 Bojo should be sent on the field next time for D and after the play the D should rip Brady's helmet off and have Bojo punt his head off and then punt him in the balls just for added measure... Maybe we can defend that like it wasn't intentional. Also it'll get rid of Bojo, two birds with one stone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 This has happened to Cam Newton like 20 times in his career. It’s why running should never be a franchise qb’s best skill. Look at Newton now. Allen simply needs to become a better pocket passer. I love his guts and toughness but he will not last doing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Holmes Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, 50yrpatsfan said: Watch the video objectively, like it was 2 other teams playing. Allen aims toward Jones and lowers his head. Jones braces for a hit. The crown of Allen's helmet strikes the side of Jones' helmet. It's very clear. https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Brady's dild0s need some polishing ya know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50yrpatsfan Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 minute ago, BillsFan4 said: This is the first time I’ve seen this angle of the hit. I still see him dropping his helmet slightly, but you can also see Allen drop his head slightly too. Allen not only drops his head but angles his body toward Jones, taking him on directly. The crown of his helmet strikes the side of Jones'. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Dopey said: He purposely hit Josh hard, but I don't think he had had it in his mind to take Josh out. Football is still a violent game. Hes also a 5’8 180lbs guy the just stopped a 240lbs guy with momentum. While the flex aged poorly I think it was very possibly just on the high of a big hit and had no idea josh wasn’t popping back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 6 minutes ago, Sherlock Holmes said: Bojo should be sent on the field next time for D and after the play the D should rip Brady's helmet off and have Bojo punt his head off and then punt him in the balls just for added measure... Maybe we can defend that like it wasn't intentional. Also it'll get rid of Bojo, two birds with one stone! So... was I wrong about the Tin Foil Hat reference? ? ? ? Angle 1. It looks Targeted Angle 2. It looks like Josh Lowered his head and the 2 helmets met. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 No. He was just trying to hit him. It was a penalty and he should get a fine but I don't think he was trying to hurt anybody. Stop watching it in slow motion. Watch it at full speed. There's no way he "lifted his head at the last moment to target Allen's head". It was a bang bang play. I'll take some flack for this I'm sure, but I wonder how many of you posters have ever been on a football field. Things happen so fast out there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 12 minutes ago, 50yrpatsfan said: Watch the video objectively, like it was 2 other teams playing. Allen aims toward Jones and lowers his head. Jones braces for a hit. The crown of Allen's helmet strikes the side of Jones' helmet. It's very clear. https://t.co/0rc5YkIDs1 Objectively,... that’s funny. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerlyofCtown Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, mattynh said: They did add a penalty a couple years ago about runners lowing their head, not sure it has eve been called. I really think you have to consider the down and distance and the fact Allen was approaching the sticks on 3rd and 8. He was going for the first down, the defender was trying to prevent it. The play was illegal on the defenders side for sure but I have seen much worse. Allen was not using his head as a weapon. It appears from every angle that Jones is. 23 minutes ago, SlimShady'sGhost said: say what? I watched it. You just have to go to youtube How dare you ruin our conspiracy theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, NoSaint said: Hes also a 5’8 180lbs guy the just stopped a 240lbs guy with momentum. While the flex aged poorly I think it was very possibly just on the high of a big hit and had no idea josh wasn’t popping back up. It's a tough call, but yea, I'm with you. He was doing his job. I would hope our intent on that type of play was to keep the QB from gaining that 1st down in a tight game. The flex seemed more like a celebration on a good lick. It did age poorly though, but no intent to injure, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanNH Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 26 minutes ago, TroutDog said: If you know Josh, you know he is going to lay it all on the line to move the chains/win the game. This right here is utter STUPIDITY! Not you, but thinking like this for a FQB! This has shorten the careers of many good to great QBs because they fail to realize 1 1st down isn’t as important as having them for the next few games or even the next drive! as for you saying the “hit wasn’t necessary” he was trying stop him from making said first down and preserve the win. Was it a dirty hit? Yes! Was there intent? (Shrug) I don’t know.. but to say the hit was not needed shows a lack of football knowledge, he was trying prevent him from falling forward. (Weird thing is I bet they don’t throw the flag if that’s a RB.. those guys get killed running up the middle.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50yrpatsfan Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, SlimShady'sGhost said: So... was I wrong about the Tin Foil Hat reference? ? ? ? Angle 1. It looks Targeted Angle 2. It looks like Josh Lowered his head and the 2 helmets met. Yes. I'd take it even further, that this was mostly Allen's doing. He had numerous chances to go down before this collision, but decided to go all Earl Campbell to get the first down. The Bills have their hands full trying to corral this guy, or he's gonna get hurt a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, MJS said: No. He was just trying to hit him. It was a penalty and he should get a fine but I don't think he was trying to hurt anybody. Stop watching it in slow motion. Watch it at full speed. There's no way he "lifted his head at the last moment to target Allen's head". It was a bang bang play. I'll take some flack for this I'm sure, but I wonder how many of you posters have ever been on a football field. Things happen so fast out there. It’s awful to play defense in the nfl. With the way Allen was playing, folks really think the Pats wanted him out? It ended up being a dirty hit but it looks a million times worse in slow motion. It’s a physical game and dude is flying to make a play. I don’t believe that was his intention and he should be fined. But thats the danger in running the ball for a qb. It also seems like some karma from some “fans” who wished injury on other players on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Chris66 said: No. Allen is still driving forward. Allens crown of his helmet actually hits the side of Jones helmet. If the nfl see it the same way thete wont be a fine. It just a smaller guy trying to stop a bigger one. oh, Chris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 Yes, it was a purposeful dirty hit, and we should do the same to Brady, as I said in another thread, we should start a go fund me to pay our players fines, we take out Brady and it will end this scourge, and the nfl will start doing what they should do, frankly I’m a bit pissed off. Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, HOUSE said: I watched this clip over and over, my eyes hurt. If you watch closely Jonathon is aiming for a shoulder pad hit but at the last moment raises his head to hit Josh Allen helmet to helmet. IMO, its a clear attempt to injure. My blood boils watching this. Looked intentional , super unnecessary and just a brutal hit . If a fan(s) were too charge the field and go after Jones knees or hurt him in any way , I would have a GoFundMe to take care of his legal fees. I hope someone on Buf goes after Jones in the rematch. That was a despicable play.. First Gronk goes WWE on our young #1 CBs head , then Jones goes after Allen's head. Wouldn't mind seeing some revenge head shots 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsInWilmingtonNC Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 50 minutes ago, Trogdor said: He definitely lowers his head and more runs into the defenders helmet, but I think the defender intended to hit him high anyway. He never lowered his pad level and that added with Allen going down was bad. I'm not full tin foil like a lot of people right now because I see DBs do this all the time. Look at the hits on WRs after a missed pass and you will see very similar style hits. DBs generally have the worst tackling technique of any position group. I don't know that anyone fears JA enough to do "sweep the leg" move, especially in this game where he was a turnover machine. I get what you are saying about DBs tackling technique and agree that I don't think the Pats player was thinking "I need to get Josh Allen out of this game or else we're going to lose" but I do see the hit as illegal and a dirty play on the defenders part. Allen's head drops because his lower body is being held/tackled by a defender AND he is stretching forward as well as trying to hold onto the ball tightly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerome007 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) I looooooove Josh, but I say...no. A blatant try to physically punish the guy? Even take him out? Of course, it's football. But at real speed, Jones really does turn with his shoulder pad to add to the punishment, as 95% of players would do here, not only to a QB but to a RB or WR or anyone! Does he use his helmet at the last millisecond? I don't think so. It's not blatant targeting or spearing. It sucks, I want Allen back ASAP, but that's the risk he took on himself going for 1st down. BTW to those who say he has to tone it down and blablabla, he usually slides or avoids the big contacts really well. This time he went for 1st down as it was needed, and he paid a steep price. But it's not as if he took a stupid risk. Freak incident. And again, when a player is gang tackled and not down yet, defenders rarely hold back on the extra punishment! Edited September 30, 2019 by Jerome007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 This was absolutely 100% deliberate. It's how the Cheats cheat without looking like cheating. But of course, the NFL will look the other way, no suspensions, the standard CBA fine, etc. Business as usual for the Cheats. I'm done with them. The NFL can kneel down and suck Marcia's dick for all I care. GOAT my ass. Cheatin' *****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, BillsInWilmingtonNC said: I get what you are saying about DBs tackling technique and agree that I don't think the Pats player was thinking "I need to get Josh Allen out of this game or else we're going to lose" but I do see the hit as illegal and a dirty play on the defenders part. Allen's head drops because his lower body is being held/tackled by a defender AND he is stretching forward as well as trying to hold onto the ball tightly. Definitely dirty. It's long past time to institute a Rugby wrap rule. He is lucky he didn't injure himself by putting his head on the wrong side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, BillsInWilmingtonNC said: I get what you are saying about DBs tackling technique and agree that I don't think the Pats player was thinking "I need to get Josh Allen out of this game or else we're going to lose" but I do see the hit as illegal and a dirty play on the defenders part. Allen's head drops because his lower body is being held/tackled by a defender AND he is stretching forward as well as trying to hold onto the ball tightly. Unfortunately the defender is going high to stop his mass short and the extension for the first. Once joshs head comes down the target area in the chest range nearly disappears. It’s a hit they try to eliminate but will be very difficult to achieve no matter what the punishment. A 15 yard flag there is catastrophic for the patriots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aireskoi Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 I know he should have been ejected, and the offsetting penalty should not have erased the only punishment (but by rule it does). Why bother changing the rules for safety unless it's just for Tommy boy? NFL loves protecting him. The NFL reduced the threshold for ejection by removing the need for the hit to be "flagrant" in 2018. The player targeted, launched, and hit him in the head with his helmet. WTF else do we need? https://www.sbnation.com/2018/9/9/17492612/ncaa-targeting-rule-nfl-comparison Brian McCarthy ✔@NFLprguy Playing Rule Article 8: It is a foul if a player lowers his head to initiate and make contact with his helmet against an opponent. The player may be disqualified. Applies to any player anywhere on the field. The player may be disqualified. 312 4:35 PM - Mar 27, 2018 Twitter Ads info and privacy 386 people are talking about this Late in the preseason, after a bunch of perplexing calls, the NFL made clear that “inadvertent” helmet contact wouldn’t be treated as a penalty. “For us this is a pretty significant change,” Competition Committee chairman Rick McKay told reporters in announcing the change. “This one technique, we saw so many hits when a player lowered his head and delivered a hit and either hurt himself or the player he was hitting.” The NFL already prohibited “initiating forcible contact by delivering a blow with the top/crown” of the helmet when outside the tackle box. In effect, that’s now banned all over the field. The league also got rid of a clause that said players could be disqualified “if the action is flagrant.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50yrpatsfan Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) 32 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said: This is the first time I’ve seen this angle of the hit. I still see him dropping his helmet slightly, but you can also see Allen drop his head slightly too. This video angle completely exonerates Jones, and shows Allen to be a little too aggressive for his own good. There will be no fine, and there should not have been a penalty either. Edited September 30, 2019 by 50yrpatsfan double 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, 50yrpatsfan said: This video angle completely exonerates Jones, and shows Allen to be a little too aggressive for his own good. There will be no fine, and there should not have been a penalty either. 50 year Pats fans don't exist, troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 I dont believe it was completely intentional and malicious. Moreso careless. Should have been penalized and probably ejected. Those are textbook what the NFL is trying to eliminate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo2218 Posted September 30, 2019 Share Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, PatsFanNH said: That makes no sense. Now if Allen had been in the pocket and took the hit and not 7 yards downfield running and trying get the first down I could see your point. This is Allen acting like Cam Newton and getting lit up. (This time illegally) Allen needs to learn to slide to protect himself otherwise he will have a short career. (Like Newton. Who I like as a QB) Sliding wasn’t an option with a guy behind him pulling him down, had that not been the case you’d have a point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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