Bills have released Kelvin Benjamin and Andre Holmes

[Gugny]

Just now, GG said:

 

Who would that be?

 

LOL, that's what I was thinking!!  Aunt Boo Boo Foot is on the sidelines again and only has 500 yards/3 TDs this season.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[bobobonators]

Benjamin is a classic case of addition by subtraction. Sunday vs Miami was an abomination. The guy has no heart. He doesnt lead by example. He doesnt make plays. He gives up on routes. Hes a liability to Allen and the rest of the team. Good riddance. 

[SWATeam]

14 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

LOL, that's what I was thinking!!  Aunt Boo Boo Foot is on the sidelines again and only has 500 yards/3 TDs this season.

Don't look at the stats!  He is a master decoy that opens up that entire offense!  He is the engine that makes it go!  I mean look at the Chiefs offensive production last year (no Watkins) vs. this year (with Watkins). 

 

He was also the key to the Rams offensive resurgence last year that has even carried over into this year.  He's incredible.

[dollars 2 donuts]

30 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

It's not a great look for Beane but it had to be done.  He's now traded picks and paid $$ to two former first-round receivers who have contributed nothing (Benjamin and Coleman), and traded away a first-round receiver who continues to perform at a high level.

 

No, we do not need to re-hash that here.

 

But Beane is up against it now to prove he can evaluate talent on offense.  Can't keep swinging and missing.

 

Wrt "why now," I don't think it's just that they're out of the playoffs.  I think it's also about leadership and team chemistry.  Allen is making progress as a player and a leader and this move, in part, removes obstacles to his continued ascension as a leader.  It also sends a message that they're not tolerating that kind of attitude any longer (and as bad as it was all season, it was noticeably worse on Sunday - on Zay Jones' second TD, Benjamin is literally jogging a clear-out route ahead of Jones - never seen that before and I am not convinced it was the proper route).  

 

Finally, gotta hand it to Benjamin - one of the worst contract year performances I've ever witnessed.  Can't really say it's about $$ for him because he cost himself millions this season.  He clearly doesn't love the game.

 

 

Coach, great post.

 

Additionally, though, and maybe this may seem like a defense of Beane, but I think just an overall increase on offensive talent across the board will help.  1 or 2 guys are important, but if we have five guys (WR, T, G, TE, C) that are just plain better it would improve everybody and everything that we do.

 

Stars are great, but man, do we just plain need "better" in a lot of spots.

[Coach Tuesday]

8 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

Don't look at the stats!  He is a master decoy that opens up that entire offense!  He is the engine that makes it go!  I mean look at the Chiefs offensive production last year (no Watkins) vs. this year (with Watkins). 

 

He was also the key to the Rams offensive resurgence last year that has even carried over into this year.  He's incredible.

 

He’s playing very well and he’d instantly be the best receiver on the Bills and his skill set is perfect for Josh Allen.  Jason Peters, Sammy Watkins - Bills fans never tire of misevaluating players who ask to be paid.

[GG]

A more balanced view of Benjamin's release from Fairburn at The Athletic

 

Quote

According to a source, the Bills’ strength staff loved Benjamin and had no issues with his effort. Publicly, Benjamin is often knocked as lazy and out of shape, but that view wasn’t shared by everyone in the building. Benjamin’s attitude and work ethic had nothing to do with his release.

 

[Rocbillsfan1]

13 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

He’s playing very well and he’d instantly be the best receiver on the Bills and his skill set is perfect for Josh Allen.  Jason Peters, Sammy Watkins - Bills fans never tire of misevaluating players who ask to be paid.

Jason Peters is a first ballot hall of famer. Get out of here with that Sammy Watkins nonsense. I’ve never heard so much hype for a player who has barely produced in five years of football. 2 of which were on offensive jauggernaut teams who put up crazy offensive stats. 

[st pete gogolak]

Serious question.  Have you ever seen an athlete in a CONTRACT YEAR ever put in so little effort?  In his contract year, Gilmore avoided contact like the plague but at least he seemed to put in some effort to play his position.  KB from the first snap to the last just didn't seem to care.

[26CornerBlitz]

More from Fairburn:

 

So why release him now? Well, there was little interest in Benjamin at the trading deadline because of his pedestrian statistics and $8.5 million cap hit. Some wonder if the Bills should have held on to Benjamin for the purpose of the compensatory pick formula, but that wasn’t a factor. For one, the Bills have $90 million in cap space and few free agents of their own in 2019, meaning they will out-gain their losses and not be players in the compensatory pick formula. Even if they were worried about that, the only way they would get a significant pick for Benjamin is if he signed a hefty contract elsewhere. Given the lack of interest in him at the deadline, a big payday doesn’t appear to be in Benjamin’s future.

 

The Bills elected to release Benjamin now because he wasn’t in their long-term plans. The playoffs are out of the question, so the team plans to feature their younger receivers the rest of the way. Rather than continue to cut Benjamin’s snap counts or make him inactive, the Bills elected to spare him the embarrassment and attention that would come with that and give him a chance to sign with another team. The same goes for wide receiver Andre Holmes, whom the Bills also released Tuesday.

[GG]

15 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

He’s playing very well and he’d instantly be the best receiver on the Bills and his skill set is perfect for Josh Allen.  Jason Peters, Sammy Watkins - Bills fans never tire of misevaluating players who ask to be paid.

 

He's paid at the top of his position, whose cap number will hit nearly $20 million in '19, yet his production is among the middling WRs.

[Bongo]

17 hours ago, The Jokeman said:

So you're saying he's bound for New England?

Normally I’d think this possible. Bring in for two days to pick brain on playbook and then cut. But he was such a POS that Zay was having to line him up. No value even trying to get playbook info. He is truly worthless.

[Nihilarian]

7 minutes ago, st pete gogolak said:

Serious question.  Have you ever seen an athlete in a CONTRACT YEAR ever put in so little effort?  In his contract year, Gilmore avoided contact like the plague but at least he seemed to put in some effort to play his position.  KB from the first snap to the last just didn't seem to care.

Nope, it was unbelievable watching the lack of effort and not caring attitude.

 

That said, I don't fault Beane for bringing KB to Buffalo as he looked like just the player the team needed as that big, tall red zone target this franchise has wanted for a decade. 

 

Damn shame he wasn't even anywhere as good as a player like Mohammed Sanu. Like Coach said it brings in to question Beane's ability to evaluate offensive talent. This team will need top receivers, top O linemen and tight ends. Looks like he made another mistake with Nick O' Leary over Logan Thomas. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Seen on facebook:

 

Mcdermott: "Kelvin, we're releasing you."

 

Benjamin: "Sorry, I didn't catch that."
 

 

[teef]

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

 

LOL, that's what I was thinking!!  Aunt Boo Boo Foot is on the sidelines again and only has 500 yards/3 TDs this season.

zay jones may very well likely end up with better numbers than watkins.  wrap your head around that!

[ndirish1978]

Saw this in an article. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, dneveu said:

.

 

a 7th round pick for coleman isn't really worth anything... it was training camp and they knew our WR room was bad.  Try and improve it

 

As for Watkins - 40 for 500 and 3 isn't exactly a high level (hes a top 10 paid WR).  He's also been having foot issues all season, and his cap hit triples in 2019.  They can't even dump him on this deal because they guaranteed so much.  The only way to lessen the cap hit would be to extend him, and no one would do that when he missed time every year with a foot soreness issue.  If the foot issue continues it could be one of the worst contracts in football.  

It’s not the late pick for Coleman.  They took on $3.5 or $4M salary.  This in a time I kept hearing we couldn’t do more at WR or on OL cuz, cap.  

 

Point being, with the WR we signed and cut we had >$5M that could have gone towards signing Pouncy or retaining Woods, who I keep hearing we couldn’t afford.  

 

It’s not the $$ per se or the draft pick, it’s the player e v a l judgement they represent.  I sometimes feel Beane is like “former 1st round pick, Get Er done” with just about that depth of scouting.

[IDBillzFan]

9 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

 But to pretend like they haven’t been failures on offense, especially at receiver, is just lying to yourself.  This offense sucked.

 

Last time...I have no problem faulting them for bad choices. Truth is, life never comes down to bad choices so much as how you react to the bad choices you've made.

 

The difference here is I try to look for the up side. You are focused on the down side. That's really the only difference in what we're discussing. Neither matter until such a time that the team KEEPS people like KB on the roster, at which point we'd be in total agreement.

[eball]

Just now, LABillzFan said:

 

Last time...I have no problem faulting them for bad choices. Truth is, life never comes down to bad choices so much as how you react to the bad choices you've made.

 

The difference here is I try to look for the up side. You are focused on the down side. That's really the only difference in what we're discussing. Neither matter until such a time that the team KEEPS people like KB on the roster, at which point we'd be in total agreement.

 

Great post, my man.  Kudos.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, SWATeam said:

Don't look at the stats!  He is a master decoy that opens up that entire offense!  He is the engine that makes it go!  I mean look at the Chiefs offensive production last year (no Watkins) vs. this year (with Watkins). 

 

He was also the key to the Rams offensive resurgence last year that has even carried over into this year.  He's incredible.

He's been playing very well when healthy, but the feet may just be a chronic issue with him. I will not be surprised if he has the same injury as the one he had with the other foot. It's correctable, but he probably won't be 100 percent until around September of next year if he has the surgery.

[Shaw66]

I love watching McDermott and Beane operate.   They have no fear.   In particular, they have no fear of mistakes.   They make decisions, like acquiring Benjamin, and they are not afraid to admit that it didn't work.  

 

I also love how they don't waste time.   They want a young team, they want to build through the draft.   They don't want old players around unless they are really, really good players or leaders.   If you're old and not a leader or a star, you're occupying space that, in McBeane's mind, is better occupied by a young guy.   Get the old guy out of here NOW, so we can get a young guy in and see what he can do.  

 

They're going to keep changing the mix of players every chance they get.  As they've said many times, they're all about getting better at every position, all the time.  

 

McBeane's mindset changed when the game ended Sunday.   The Bills have four preseason games left in 2018.   These games are the opportunity to see and evaluate players, and the Bills have seen and evaluated Benjamin and Holmes as much as they needed.  

[C.Biscuit97]

59 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

He’s playing very well and he’d instantly be the best receiver on the Bills and his skill set is perfect for Josh Allen.  Jason Peters, Sammy Watkins - Bills fans never tire of misevaluating players who ask to be paid.

The worst part it is Sammy tried to appease stupid Bills fans and come back to early from his foot injury and it is continuing to linger.  Foot injuries are no joke (AJ Green) but stupid fans questioned his toughness.

 

still, bitter Bills fans >>>> McVay and Reid

8 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

He's been playing very well when healthy, but the feet may just be a chronic issue with him. I will not be surprised if he has the same injury as the one he had with the other foot. It's correctable, but he probably won't be 100 percent until around September of next year if he has the surgery.

Yeah, the foot injury is a killer.  AJ Green came back too early and now is hurt for the rest of the year.  But he showed Bengal fans how tough he was!

8 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I love watching McDermott and Beane operate.   They have no fear.   In particular, they have no fear of mistakes.   They make decisions, like acquiring Benjamin, and they are not afraid to admit that it didn't work.  

 

I also love how they don't waste time.   They want a young team, they want to build through the draft.   They don't want old players around unless they are really, really good players or leaders.   If you're old and not a leader or a star, you're occupying space that, in McBeane's mind, is better occupied by a young guy.   Get the old guy out of here NOW, so we can get a young guy in and see what he can do.  

 

They're going to keep changing the mix of players every chance they get.  As they've said many times, they're all about getting better at every position, all the time.  

 

McBeane's mindset changed when the game ended Sunday.   The Bills have four preseason games left in 2018.   These games are the opportunity to see and evaluate players, and the Bills have seen and evaluated Benjamin and Holmes as much as they needed.  

Man, these guys are untouchable to some fans.  It’s amazing.  They traded 2 picks for a fat guy who they had in Carolina who has gotten worse every season of his career.  Great move McBean!!!

 

and I do agree on Benjamin having the worst contract year probably. Millions of dollars couldn’t motivate him.  What a bum.

[dave mcbride]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

The worst part it is Sammy tried to appease stupid Bills fans and come back to early from his foot injury and it is continuing to linger.  Foot injuries are no joke (AJ Green) but stupid fans questioned his toughness.

 

still, bitter Bills fans >>>> McVay and Reid

Yeah, the foot injury is a killer.  AJ Green came back too early and now is hurt for the rest of the year.  But he showed Bengal fans how tough he was!

It's a different foot, however, and it looks like Watkins' season is pretty much toast (although he may be a spot player in the last couple of games; who knows). The issue might actually be that he has chronic, congenital foot problems, which might explain why teams like LA and Buffalo didn't try to retain him. There's a ton of medical info we are not privy too. 

Edited December 5, 2018 by dave mcbride

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

15 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

He's been playing very well when healthy, but the feet may just be a chronic issue with him. I will not be surprised if he has the same injury as the one he had with the other foot. It's correctable, but he probably won't be 100 percent until around September of next year if he has the surgery.

 

Just saying - they keep opening this guys feet up.  It's becoming a serious problem.  He has talent for sure, but he's the 3rd best option on that team at the moment.  2 games with over 100 yards this year, and 3 total TDs.  On an offense that is scoring an insane number of points.  I wouldn't say he's having a "good" year at all.

Edited December 5, 2018 by dneveu

[RochesterRob]

18 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I love watching McDermott and Beane operate.   They have no fear.   In particular, they have no fear of mistakes.   They make decisions, like acquiring Benjamin, and they are not afraid to admit that it didn't work.  

 

I also love how they don't waste time.   They want a young team, they want to build through the draft.   They don't want old players around unless they are really, really good players or leaders.   If you're old and not a leader or a star, you're occupying space that, in McBeane's mind, is better occupied by a young guy.   Get the old guy out of here NOW, so we can get a young guy in and see what he can do.  

 

They're going to keep changing the mix of players every chance they get.  As they've said many times, they're all about getting better at every position, all the time.  

 

McBeane's mindset changed when the game ended Sunday.   The Bills have four preseason games left in 2018.   These games are the opportunity to see and evaluate players, and the Bills have seen and evaluated Benjamin and Holmes as much as they needed.  

  If these recent promotions work out then it will have a positive impact on our 2019 draft plans.  Just the chance of these new players sticking long term (key depth or better) will allow us to focus our draft and free agent resources on other players that play different positions this coming offseason.  

Edited December 5, 2018 by RochesterRob

[dave mcbride]

24 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

Just saying - they keep opening this guys feet up.  It's becoming a serious problem.  He has talent for sure, but he's the 3rd best option on that team at the moment.  2 games with over 100 yards this year, and 3 total TDs.  On an offense that is scoring an insane number of points.  I wouldn't say he's having a "good" year at all.

It's less about the stats than watching when he plays for KC. When healthy (a MAJOR qualifier, to be sure), he's just so damn explosive, and his hands are as strong as those of any receiver in the league.  He doesn't lose hand battles (unlike a certain receiver who just departed the Bills). He has essentially played in 8 games this season (he played in two other games for 1 play because of injuries). In those 8 games, he has 515 yards on 39 catches, which prorates to 78 catches for 1,030 yards. That is a LOT in an offense that spreads the ball around so much. But the feet are of course a problem with him. 

Edited December 5, 2018 by dave mcbride

[HappyDays]

31 minutes ago, teef said:

zay jones may very well likely end up with better numbers than watkins.  wrap your head around that!

 

This season Sammy only has 17 more receptions and 165 yards more than Kelvin Benjamin. How does that happen?

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

This season Sammy only has 17 more receptions and 165 yards more than Kelvin Benjamin. How does that happen?

A little thing called a foot injury. 

[eball]

11 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

A little thing called a foot injury. 

 

And I think at this point we can give McBeane just a little bit of credit for -- luckily or otherwise -- having a sense that Sammy may never be the player everyone hoped he would be because of that foot.  Having Sammy on the roster last year or this wouldn't have made a significant difference to the Bills' W-L record, in my opinion.

[BurpleBull]

No more of Benjamin stealing Zay's targets.

 

 

[dave mcbride]

24 minutes ago, eball said:

 

And I think at this point we can give McBeane just a little bit of credit for -- luckily or otherwise -- having a sense that Sammy may never be the player everyone hoped he would be because of that foot.  Having Sammy on the roster last year or this wouldn't have made a significant difference to the Bills' W-L record, in my opinion.

Just to clarify, it's the other foot this time as I understand it.

[eball]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

Just to clarify, it's the other foot this time as I understand it.

 

Wow -- that is incredibly unlucky for Sammy.  Makes you wonder if his body type isn't suited to the rigors of the NFL.  Some guys just can't stay healthy.

[dave mcbride]

6 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Wow -- that is incredibly unlucky for Sammy.  Makes you wonder if his body type isn't suited to the rigors of the NFL.  Some guys just can't stay healthy.

I'm not 100 percent sure of that, but I do recall reading that (or hearing about it) somewhere. 

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

 

Man, these guys are untouchable to some fans.  It’s amazing.  They traded 2 picks for a fat guy who they had in Carolina who has gotten worse every season of his career.  Great move McBean!!!

 

 

It's about big picture, not individual decisions.  

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[IDBillzFan]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Man, these guys are untouchable to some fans.  It’s amazing.  They traded 2 picks for a fat guy who they had in Carolina who has gotten worse every season of his career.  Great move McBean!!!

 

You see, this is what's frustrating about reading your posts. You're qualifying other posts as something they're not to make a point that has no value.

 

Case in point...you respond to Shaw directly when you refer to fans who consider management as "untouchable" and above criticism, and yet he only last night admitted problems with McDermott, including...

 

18 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

1.    I’ve said it before, but it’s worth repeating:  McDermott is failing at his job in at least one big aspect, and that’s getting the penalties under control.  These guys are killing themselves with penalties.

 

They're not untouchable. There are things to criticize for a new coach and GM...even an old coach and GM. But again, you choose down side almost exclusively, and pretty much everyone else chooses up side, which bothers you for some reason to the extent that you misrepresent what others are trying to say.

 

We get it. You hate management. You're very clear about it. No need to misrepresent those who don't sing your lone note with you.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[GG]

49 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

A little thing called a foot injury. 

 

Don't you think that should be a larger part of the discussion? 

 

Do you think it's a coincidence that two franchises whose medical staffs had an intimate view of Watkins health declined to commit to him for the long term?

[NoHuddleKelly12]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

“When things are no longer right...we move forward...in the best interests of our football team.” —McD. I’ll go full clappy ?? to that any day of the week. 

[dave mcbride]

5 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Don't you think that should be a larger part of the discussion? 

 

Do you think it's a coincidence that two franchises whose medical staffs had an intimate view of Watkins health declined to commit to him for the long term?

See my posts above.