I realize that ppl don’t want to hear this but the plan looks like....

[Wayne Arnold]

Just now, Ray Finkel said:

That is what happens when you neglect the offense.

 

Right. Which was expected.

 

Not sure where people are having difficulty following.

[buffalobillswin]

Honestly this isn't a lost season if Josh Allen can get back on the field and make some plays. It'll be even sweeter since he's doing it with these losers on offense

[Success]

Just gotta ride this one out and hope they know what they’re doing. 

[Ray Finkel]

7 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Right. Which was expected.

 

Not sure where people are having difficulty following.

Not to the extent of having one of the worst offenses in NFL history!

[The Frankish Reich]

3 hours ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

Right. Ask the Browns how that working out.

It is working out for the Browns now. I'm not sure what you've been watching, or if you've been watching at all, but the Browns are a competitive team now. So far, they appear to have the best pick of 2018 QB class -- a class I think will ultimately be considered a very, very good one. They have tons of young talent and even more cap space, and suddenly they've become an attractive landing spot for a highly regarded coach.

[Nihilarian]

5 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

the ole positive spin on ???

Why tank when you just drafted the franchise QB and the 2019 draft looks to be very deep with defensive talent. What's the point? 

 

The OP has deluded himself into thinking that this was a tank season on purpose. He wants others to believe that this FO planned this season out to be 2-7 after 9 games or finish the season 2-14 / 4-12. He thinks this regime will still be employed after that kind of fail. Yet, these owners fired the guy they loved at 7-8 season before the final game.

 

These men planned nothing of the sort and it was simply a complete screw up in many ways with the thinking that Nathanial Peterman would be a viable starter. That the offensive line would be just fine after losing Eric Wood and Richie Incognito mostly because Groy did okay in replacing Wood for a bit and Richie looked to have lost a step.  They thought that the receiver corps would be okay in getting separation, getting open and catching the ball. 

They also thought that the ex Patriots assistant coach would make a great OC. That a WR coach who had never been a QB coach would make a fine QB coach.

 

It's crystal clear to me that is GM and head coach have no clue what's happening with the offense. It would not surprise me at all to see McD fired at some point during the season along with changes to the offensive coaching staff. Going to be interesting to hear what these owners think of what's been going on with their team. 

 

[Fadingpain]

5 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, this topic was brought up by a caller in the WGR-550 post game show, and Schopp and Bulldog entertained it for a while, both dismissing any thought of the team as formally "tanking" as being ridiculous.

 

I.E., there was no planned component of this season being bad in this manner.  In their opinions, of course. 

 

[Cue the haters mentioning that they hate gr-55, the show is unlistenable, and Mike Schopp knows nothing about anything; throw in something about Jerry Sullivan too; and TBN, even though Sullivan no longer work there; why not]

 

 

 

 

[Jrb1979]

4 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Right. Which was expected.

 

Not sure where people are having difficulty following.

Unlike you and your brethren they expected competitive games. Too many of you have blind faith when it comes to DEM BILLS. 

[KD in CA]

6 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

90 million and a top 5 pick isnt going to turn around this team anytime soon. 

 

Why not?   How do teams get turned around?

[Jrb1979]

1 minute ago, KD in CA said:

 

Why not?   How do teams get turned around?

Keep the talent they have and add to it. Not try and win with defense and field position. 

[row_33]

6 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

I'm pretty sure it was a clear rebuild.  Two huge offensive line pieces retired and another traded.  A new QB, MLB and other significant roles for 1st and second year players...that has development year written all over it.

 

That was wrong as well, this is a death spiral 

[Thurman#1]

8 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

I very very much agree that we need to be patient.

 

But we aren't tanking. We just aren't. It's a hockey word, first of all. But if we were doing what is correctly called a complete rebuild, we'd've traded Shady and Tyrod before the 2016 season and probably Hughes, Kyle Williams and Incognito as well. Some of which would've worked out a lot better than what we did. If we'd completely rebuilt, it wouldn't have been that difficult to avoid the playoffs last year and maximize that draft pick in this last year's draft, which is the time when getting a high pick was absolutely necessary to get a QB. They're not trying to lose. McDermott is working as hard as he can, but yeah, they knew it would be tough sledding this year.

 

I wish they had done it. I wish they had rebuilt completely and stripped the team of all older talent before last year. But they didn't and they have brought in a lot of talent, especially on that defense.

 

But yeah, the rebuild isn't a complete one, but it's a serious rebuild. And yeah, this year was always going to suck. And you're exactly right that they made getting the cap problems completely taken care of a major priority this year, as they had promised the Pegulas they would. That prevented bringing in talent and mandated getting rid of a lot of young guys they maybe could otherwise have kept some of.

[row_33]

5 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I very very much agree that we need to be patient.

 

But we aren't tanking. We just aren't. It's a hockey word, first of all. But if we were doing what is correctly called a complete rebuild, we'd've traded Shady and Tyrod before the 2016 season and probably Hughes, Kyle Williams and Incognito as well. Some of which would've worked out a lot better than what we did. If we'd completely rebuilt, it wouldn't have been that difficult to avoid the playoffs last year and maximize that draft pick in this last year's draft, which is the time when getting a high pick was absolutely necessary to get a QB. They're not trying to lose. McDermott is working as hard as he can, but yeah, they knew it would be tough sledding this year.

 

I wish they had done it. I wish they had rebuilt completely and stripped the team of all older talent before last year. But they didn't and they have brought in a lot of talent, especially on that defense.

 

But yeah, the rebuild isn't a complete one, but it's a serious rebuild. And yeah, this year was always going to suck. And you're exactly right that they made getting the cap problems completely taken care of a major priority this year, as they had promised the Pegulas they would. That prevented bringing in talent and mandated getting rid of a lot of young guys they maybe could otherwise have kept some of.

 

And basketball, Spurs tanked to draft Robinson and then Duncan 

 

[#34fan]

Nonsense.

 

If that was McBeane's plan, -why not get it done in season 1 when it would have at least been forgivable?

 

If they planned this out, why drag Anderson off the coach in week 6 to "mentor" Josh Allen all of a sudden?

 

At best, you can say McBeane underestimated the size of the rebuild they're attempting.... At worst, you can accuse these two of being dangerously out of touch with reality.

 

Personally, I think it's a little of both...

 

 

[Thurman#1]

7 hours ago, Ray Finkel said:

That is what happens when you neglect the offense.

 

 

So, using the 12th, 53rd and 56th picks on the offense is neglecting it?

 

'Cause those three picks and Cordy Glenn besides were all traded for the pick we used on Josh Allen.

 

We didn't neglect the offense at all. Getting your franchise QB (we hope) is pretty much the opposite of neglect. But apart from that, yeah, they spent most of the rest of their draft and cap resources on the defense.

 

This early in a rebuild, especially a rebuild that starts with cap trouble, you aren't going to be able to fill all the holes. That's just the way it works. People get all pissed that we didn't spend more resources on the offense. If we had, the defense would be a lot worse. Would it really have been that much more satisfying to have a poor offense and a poor defense, both? Not for me. At least I can see good football when the D is on the field.

[Thurman#1]

5 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

And basketball, Spurs tanked to draft Robinson and then Duncan 

 

 

 

Fair enough. But not football. Coaches and players can't afford to tank here. It can destroy their job prospects more or less completely.

[ALF]

It's next to impossible to develop and evaluate a QB with the present O and coaching.

 

Would Aaron Rogers have a better record here and still be in one piece?

 

The D is on the right track , but building  a OL takes time and a good coach. 

[mannc]

10 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

After Khalil Mack was traded, it was reported that one team said they wanted Mack but couldn't let go two first-round picks considering this year's would be a Top 10 pick.

 

Is there any question at all that that team/GM was Buffalo/Beane?

Nope, and thank god they didn’t do that trade.  The next coach is gonna want those picks.

[cd1]

11 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

the ole positive spin on ???

 

That "positive spin on *****" is what causes that cute little twirl at the top! ?  

 

***** still stinks and WILL be flushed sooner or later.  I'm hoping for SOONER.

[Victory Formation]

11 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

 

 

I don't think they expected it to be this bad, I think they thought it'd be an uphill battle but I do believe they expected more. With that said you give them another year out of principle. Am I optimistic? No. With that said fair is fair, McD gets 3 years before I feel comfortable with the sampling size, I think that's the honorable thing to do.

[BillsFan1988]

11 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

 

 

Stop giving these guys a excuse of a tank. This is not in anyway shape or form a tank. Not by purpose not at all.  Even if by some chance it was you shouldnt look this bad as a team. 

 

McBeane need to go.................. .

[Cripple Creek]

12 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

Gruden is doing it better. McDermott sucks at sucking. Why does he want a top 5 pick, is he afraid he'd screw up the #1 and get run out of town?

 

Your Polly Anna views have polluted this board for many years. Please, grow a set and for once in your life tell people what you really think.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

2 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Gruden is doing it better. McDermott sucks at sucking. Why does he want a top 5 pick, is he afraid he'd screw up the #1 and get run out of town?

 

Your Polly Anna views have polluted this board for many years. Please, grow a set and for once in your life tell people what you really think.

 

Can we all get together for a side hug here fellas"  

 

Yes, this season is LOST.  But to reiterate not a purposeful tank from the beginning. 

 

 

[Nihilarian]

1 hour ago, ALF said:

It's next to impossible to develop and evaluate a QB with the present O and coaching.

 

Would Aaron Rogers have a better record here and still be in one piece?

 

The D is on the right track , but building  a OL takes time and a good coach. 

This is exactly right! Where is the good coaching on the Buffalo Bills coaching staff?

 

Building an offense takes good coaching and looking at the decisions made by this team nobody on the offensive side looks to be competent enough to do that.

 

Who told the HC that Peterman would be a solid a starter for the season while the rookie watches? What on gods green earth is Josh Allen going to learn from Peterman...except on what no to do?

 

Penalties have plagued the team all year and the Bears game was no different with 10-163 yards. 2018, 70 penalties for 642 yards. 39 on offense, 19 on defense, 12 on special teams.

 

Who told the HC that the offensive line would be okay with the current players on the roster before the season started? Because they are not even close to okay and steps should have been made to upgrade that line especially going into a season with an inexperienced QB in Peterman and more importantly, a rookie in Josh Allen.

This is thorough incompetence at its best.

 

The GM and HC should have known better and even though Beane is a rookie GM he doesn't get a pass for this offensive mess. How is this any different from what Whaley did to EJ? Brining in a QB coach who has previously never been a QB coach is just about as bad as not hiring one at all. No veteran QB on the roster until almost halfway through the season.

 

Hiring an offensive coordinator who has been in the NFL for 5 years on four teams and never fielded an offense better then 23rd of of 32. Rick Dennison was a better choice as at least he didn't completely kill that #1 Bills running game and at least that 2017 offense scored 28 TDs.  In 9 games so far the 2018 Buffalo Bills have only 7 TDs and 5 of those are by Josh Allen, 2 passing, 3 rushing. What does that tell you about this years offense? 

 

Bottom line is I don't trust this regime to build top offense or develop that rookie QB and like the Bears and Rams they need to fire this HC and bring an really good offensive mind to fix this offensive mess. Shame, because I like McD. He has just made some serious mistakes that you mostly don't survive.

 

 

[MAJBobby]

13 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

 

 

 

For Who. What player do they want that they need a top 5 pick. 

[DKBills25]

You still need free agency to help ?‍♂️ You gotta make some moves , and honestly so far thru trades and draft trades it’s been a fail

[KD in CA]

6 hours ago, Jrb1979 said:

Keep the talent they have and add to it. Not try and win with defense and field position. 

 

So they should add to their talent, but doing so through high draft picks and FA won’t work.

 

Got it, brilliant.

[PolishDave]

13 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

Sorry John.   There is no way in hell that this is playing out as they planned.    You don't plan on being epically bad.   If they wanted to tank, they would have done it last year.   So they could have their choice of quarterbacks.    They didn't because McDermott still believes attitude trumps elite talent.

 

You are witnessing a staff of employees who are failing very badly at their primary job duties.   I blame it on McBeane's misjudgement of talent - of players and coaches.   They effed up.   BAD.   This team sucks donkey balls.

 

It is absolutely laughable that people are still making excuses for a coaching staff that created this level of trainwreck.   There is no denying this coaching staff has failed miserably this year.    Becoming the NFL's new "Cleveland - a.k.a. laughing stock" was not in their plans.   During the games at the stadium they should play background music when the BIlls are on offense "the theme song from looney tunes cartoons".

[formerlyofCtown]

13 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

90 million and a top 5 pick isnt going to turn around this team anytime soon. 

If they make the right choices it will.

 

They need to hit on 2 Oline.

2 WRs

and a backup QB

 

We showed the ability to win before Allen went down.  Even with him being so raw teams have to respect his arm.

[sugashane69]

14 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Filling your team with overpaid free agents isn’t the way to build a winning football team.  

Not only that but WHO WILL BE WILLING TO COME HERE????  Yea money talks but most guys would turn us down to go to a "contender" ..... I dont know of them all but I'm sure there is a good list for us.

[BigBuff423]

I remember when the "Suck for Luck" campaign was in full force and people all over this board were talking about how lucky the Colts were with going from Peyton, to one terrible year, to Luck. Now, the Bills have one really terrible year when they've shed Cap strapping players, have a top tier Defense and will be able to Draft high and spend in FA, and people are losing their minds? I mean, really?

 

I'm all for demanding more, but within reason. For example, I demand KB to not be a disengaged, lazy, self-entitled pile of poo and for receivers to catch the ball and for players to play with passion. But, I can't ask a WR to run a 4.3 when he's 30 when he ran a 4.5 when he was 20....or to make contested catches, when he's never done that his whole career or for Shady to beat back Father Time when no one wins that race....basically, if you didn't know this was going to be an ugly year, then you deluded yourself into thinking something it wasn't. 

 

Bills need a total rebuild on Offense some key pieces on Defense. They need to show drastic improvement next year, but it probably won't be a complete picture until 2020, if we're being honest. 2019 is to get the Offensive pieces around Allen: C / RT / WR1 / WR2 / another TE and depth at G, along with CB2 and OLB. But those are big pieces that will need to be playing together to gel.....I can see them getting it done, but it will take a bit for all those pieces to come together. Plus 2020 to continue to get deeper to insulate against injuries at those positions. 

 

That said, McD needs to show he can improve the Offense drastically and at least maintain the Defense overall and I think both will occur. But if not, he gets his walking papers at the end of the 2019 season. In today's NFL culture, three full years is reasonable. Anything less is not. 

[buffaloboyinATL]

14 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

 

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

I don't necessarily believe that this is an "intentional" tank, I honestly think we are this bad.  That being said, I don't think the powers that be are too concerned with getting better this year, which makes me believe they are comfortable that their jobs are safe.  Most everyone is aware that a top 5 pick in the first round is valuable, even if we will not likely draft a QB next year, but the best part is having a top 5 pick in every round gives us so much more flexibility for trade, picks, etc...  I know we are all sick of saying "wait til next year" but unfortunately, it is all we have at this point.

[DuckyBoys]

What they should have done is spent more of what little money that had on better O Line and some speed on offense. They should have made sure they had a veteran qb in to start day 1 and not wasted valuable camp snaps by giving Allen as much work as possible so his transition would be easier. Instead they paid out money for older defensive players.  They roll out the qb behind a line that cant pass protect, cant get a push in run blocking and is not athletic enough to even run screens or any outside runs.. Beane traded away assets and put all his eggs into Josh Allen but gave him absolutely no shot at success . Beane basically sold the car for gas money  Instead they tried to shore up the defense to make McDermott look good. Murphy, Lorax, Kyle W will be gone and we'll be rebuilding the D line before they even fix the offense.  Perpetual Bills hot pile of steaming turds they keep serving up. 

[row_33]

2 hours ago, DKBills25 said:

You still need free agency to help ?‍♂️ You gotta make some moves , and honestly so far thru trades and draft trades it’s been a fail

 

correct, you need free agency, whether you can get any free agents to show up and help is another issue

 

 

[Kelly the Dog]

6 hours ago, #34fan said:

Nonsense.

 

If that was McBeane's plan, -why not get it done in season 1 when it would have at least been forgivable?

 

If they planned this out, why drag Anderson off the coach in week 6 to "mentor" Josh Allen all of a sudden?

 

At best, you can say McBeane underestimated the size of the rebuild they're attempting.... At worst, you can accuse these two of being dangerously out of touch with reality.

 

Personally, I think it's a little of both...

 

 

I've been saying this for months. You don't "plan" to "tank" in year two. You do it year one and start rebuilding as soon as you can. And if you do it in year two you don't beg Kyle Williams to come back for one more year. 

[fridge]

Just now, Kelly the Dog said:

I've been saying this for months. You don't "plan" to "tank" in year two. You do it year one and start rebuilding as soon as you can. And if you do it in year two you don't beg Kyle Williams to come back for one more year. 

 

Well said. The "they planned to do it" narrative is hilarious. Is there even evidence of an NFL team doing this wit success? The Browns are still terrible.

[jrober38]

4 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

I've been saying this for months. You don't "plan" to "tank" in year two. You do it year one and start rebuilding as soon as you can. And if you do it in year two you don't beg Kyle Williams to come back for one more year. 

 

I would bet any amount of money that McDermott and Beane expected this team to be better this year than they were a year ago.

[berg1029]

15 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The bills are doing exactly what they are trying to do get a top 5 pick in this next draft

 

i don’t like how bad they look on offense either but the fact is they are trying to avoid overpaying for free agents in the offseason to fix this mess

 

you do that by drafting high because less of a chance to screw it up

 

This season is LOST it was always going to be LOST if you can get your mind wrapped around that it will help with your sanity

 

It does not matter if you lose by 1 or 100 a loss is a loss

 

This team is tanking so it can acquire blue chip talent and not have to pay for it they are going to target specific free agents and draft at the big money positions

 

be patient

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's funny because people have been saying we need to bottom out for years.  All of a sudden, we are actually bottoming out and now people act like the sky is falling.  It's almost like people want to us to be 7-9 every year.  

 

The Bills already have half of the equation- the defense.  With a ton of money to spend, some high draft picks, and Allen having a year under his belt...the offensive turnaround should be pretty sharp when it comes

[jrober38]

2 minutes ago, berg1029 said:

 

It's funny because people have been saying we need to bottom out for years.  All of a sudden, we are actually bottoming out and now people act like the sky is falling.  It's almost like people want to us to be 7-9 every year.  

 

The Bills already have half of the equation- the defense.  With a ton of money to spend, some high draft picks, and Allen having a year under his belt...the offensive turnaround should be pretty sharp when it comes

 

Bottoming out is an NBA strategy.

 

It's not something that has much of a track record in the NFL. 

[Ray Finkel]

6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

So, using the 12th, 53rd and 56th picks on the offense is neglecting it?

 

'Cause those three picks and Cordy Glenn besides were all traded for the pick we used on Josh Allen.

 

We didn't neglect the offense at all. Getting your franchise QB (we hope) is pretty much the opposite of neglect. But apart from that, yeah, they spent most of the rest of their draft and cap resources on the defense.

 

This early in a rebuild, especially a rebuild that starts with cap trouble, you aren't going to be able to fill all the holes. That's just the way it works. People get all pissed that we didn't spend more resources on the offense. If we had, the defense would be a lot worse. Would it really have been that much more satisfying to have a poor offense and a poor defense, both? Not for me. At least I can see good football when the D is on the field.

The Bucs picked 53rd and Pats picked 56th.  No offensive picks.