It May Be Time To Think Big With The Bills

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

3 hours ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

The Bills record the last 4 years is 33-31. People act like we are a laughing stock. If the Bills ever get a QB to play at a decently high level, who knows what could happen..

Watching the Bills choke on almost every primetime game the last 15 years could have something to do with it...  But yeah, I'm with you.  Its a whole new era so to speak.  Starts with ownership and works its way down.  I think 8-8 minimum, likely 9-7 or better and possibly wildcard again.

[BuffaloBaumer]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

If thinking big means believing the Bills will win more than 4 games, then yes, I've been thinking big all along.

 

I see 7-9 or 8-8.

 

I am not limiting the "thinking big" to this season alone, I am talking about the future of this organization...

1 hour ago, RevWarRifleman said:

Ahhhh, these threads. They always spring up this time of year, don't they?

 

Oh yeah, so many times the Bills have made the playoffs over the last 20 years......same old threads and same old team huh

[Shaw66]

5 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Well, most people who follow the sport closely and are not Buffalo Bills fans think we will win about 4 games this year.  So there's that. 

 

 

 

 

 

The over under on the Bills is 6.5.  So who are these "most people"?

[Richard Noggin]

2 hours ago, Avisan said:

Oof.

 

Prima donna, fam

He meant "Before Madonna(s)," obviously. Like, circa Chuck Knox--and earlier--era players. 

[Zac]

one thing i like is the amount of money being dumped on the under for our win total in Vegas.

[BruceVilanch]

4 hours ago, Avisan said:

Oof.

 

Prima donna, fam

Maybe he was talking about when Madonna went by "Madonna Ciccone" you know before she was just "Madonna" Pre-Madonna"

[Domdab99]

Wins would be nice this season, but I'm not expecting much. What I want to see is a long-term plan being enacted. I want to see growth. 

[The Firebaugh Kid]

The D will be good/great. 

Its all about the offense. 

An average offense gets this this 9-10 wins. 

[prissythecat]

15 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Well, most people who follow the sport closely and are not Buffalo Bills fans think we will win about 4 games this year.  So there's that. 

 

If Allen defies the odds and is a hit, we could be on the brink of something special.

If he is a miss as anticipated by most, we're in no different position than usual.

 

The organization, as a whole, is definitely more sound right now than it has been in a long time.  I've been saying that since the beginning with McBeane on board.

 

The franchise has been flushed clean, finally, and I do think the arrow, writ large, is pointing up.

 

 

 

 

 

How do you know it will be Allen who will lead the Bills to promised land?   There is a 50 page thread on another QB who apparently has upped his velocity such that he may now be something special.

[blacklabel]

I think this team is too well-coached and has too many "prove it" type players to fall down the ladder to a 3-13 or 4-12 record, so when I see those predictions I gotta laugh a bit. While I think a return trip to the playoffs is in doubt, I don't see double digit losses. Middle of the road, probably 8-8 at best. But yeah, as a few others have pointed out, this defense has a chance to be pretty special and there's a chance they keep them in games and allow them to steal a few they otherwise probably wouldn't win.

[SCBills]

35 minutes ago, The Alpha Fire said:

The D will be good/great. 

Its all about the offense. 

An average offense gets this this 9-10 wins. 

Which is why I'm optimistic.  The schedule, on paper, is tough, but in the NFL you never know how the season plays out for teams not named New England.

 

Our defense will keep us in every game.   If our offense is better than last year, we are playoff contenders..  doesn't mean we make it, but will at least be in the race.

 

The only area we downgraded on offense, imo, is OL, and even that could change with guys like Miller emerging in the new scheme.

 

I'll take the unknown of Daboll over the dumpster fire that was Dennison.

I'll take the unknown of Allen or McCarron over the 160 yards of passing and 40 yards of scrambling from Tyrod.

I'll take Ivory as RB2 over Tolbert.

 

[SWATeam]

13 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Zay and Streater are pretty fast but the only real “speed” guy is Foster 

And Clay

[BuffaloRush]

If you listen to the recent Bills Beat podcast Joe B goes into greater detail on AW.  He says he has not had a memorable camp and has only flashed in maybe 1 out of every 10 plays during drills... not good.

 

He also isnt sold on where he can play in the 4-3.  He said he was not good in the “1” technique last year and he hasn’t been impressive at “3” technique this year.  Someone like a Ricky Hatley might be more what they are looking for in the defense.

 

I think there’s a great chance Adolphus doesn’t make the 53 man roster - either as a cut or trade

[kevnallen]

17 hours ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

Maybe the offensive line is not as bad as people thought.

Maybe the receivers could turn into something (sounded pretty good today).

Maybe Buffalo really HAS found their next franchise QB

Did Buffalo really just steal the possible rookie of the year in Edmunds?

 

There are still a lot of ifs here but looking into next year with no cap issues, tons to spend, and another draft to bolster the O, I am starting to think that the Bills could be on a roll as the Patriots eventually drop back down to Earth. I could not be happier with our coach and GM and contrary to past years when it was nothing but garbage as far as the eye could see, this team seems like it finally has an eye on building a champion. I'm fired up

 

There is also a decent possibility that the Bills could pickup a WR or OL before the start of the season that could improve these areas

[dollars 2 donuts]

15 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Are you saying we no longer need a fomentor?

 

Well, I am at least willing to foment for a moment for a mentor, but that's it.

[leonbus23]

9 hours ago, Jeetz1231 said:

Maybe he was talking about when Madonna went by "Madonna Ciccone" you know before she was just "Madonna" Pre-Madonna"

 

I think he taking it way back to paintings of the Virgin Mary before (or pre) the Italian "Madonna" paintings of the 5th century. 

[T master]

It definitely looks a lot better than it has in years the owners are hiring people they trust & letting them do the job they were hired to do with little or no interference which didn't happen with the prior ownership, not bashing I'm just saying ! 

 

This new team is definitely a breath of fresh air i think we are possibly 1 yr away from being really good & that is only because of the new pieces put in place this year . I think this year could have some bumps & bruises but the experiences of the season will be utilized to the fullest to make the team better .

 

McBean & company have a clear cut plan & the players are buying into all that they are selling which is something that needs to happen in order for it to be a success !! 

 

GO BILLS !! 

[ricojes]

On 7/31/2018 at 6:55 PM, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

could be about 64.7% of TBD members.....at least................

And the other half pretty damn close...

[YoloinOhio]

23 hours ago, SWATeam said:

And Clay

Kaelin?

[KD in CA]

On 7/31/2018 at 3:14 PM, DC Tom said:

 

It rather amazes me that in the past few weeks I've seen the word "foment" used and spelled properly multiple times on a board that collectively can't discern between "your" and "you're."

 

You shouldn't insult Bill's fans.

[SWATeam]

16 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Kaelin?

Yeah, he's a speed guy.  I feel like the role will be filled by either him or Foster.

[Putin]

On 7/31/2018 at 6:09 PM, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

....you do realize that "fermentation" is yet another PROCESS, right?.....all trusting......

Yes I REALLY like this fermentation process your talking about   ? ?  !! In the old country every household goes through the same process at least once few times a year!

?to process!!!

[DC Tom]

On 7/31/2018 at 7:09 PM, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

....you do realize that "fermentation" is yet another PROCESS, right?.....all trusting......

 

Now there's a process I trust...

[boater]

Another reason for optimism: the team President is competent and in control. Way to go K-Pegs!

[RevWarRifleman]

On 7/31/2018 at 11:11 PM, BuffaloBaumer said:

 

I am not limiting the "thinking big" to this season alone, I am talking about the future of this organization...

 

Oh yeah, so many times the Bills have made the playoffs over the last 20 years......same old threads and same old team huh

Nope, not the same old team. But some very key positions to fill ie: starting over at. 

[wagon127]

On ‎7‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 5:39 PM, BuffaloBaumer said:

Maybe the offensive line is not as bad as people thought.

Maybe the receivers could turn into something (sounded pretty good today).

Maybe Buffalo really HAS found their next franchise QB

Did Buffalo really just steal the possible rookie of the year in Edmunds?

 

There are still a lot of ifs here but looking into next year with no cap issues, tons to spend, and another draft to bolster the O, I am starting to think that the Bills could be on a roll as the Patriots eventually drop back down to Earth. I could not be happier with our coach and GM and contrary to past years when it was nothing but garbage as far as the eye could see, this team seems like it finally has an eye on building a champion. I'm fired up

I usually wait until we are 4 weeks after the first game, not 4 weeks before the first game, until I trust myself to start really thinking "BIG" for the bills.

[BuffaloBaumer]

33 minutes ago, wagon127 said:

I usually wait until we are 4 weeks after the first game, not 4 weeks before the first game, until I trust myself to start really thinking "BIG" for the bills.

 

Welp, I'm choosing to think this right now because I see a change over there.......

[Radar]

Bills will probably win 4-6 games in my opinion. I think last year's record was built early and went down. I also feel their talent level is actually inferior to last year. Now, having said that, I'm more optimistic about who's running g things now than in past years.

[Thurman#1]

On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 6:39 AM, BuffaloBaumer said:

Maybe the offensive line is not as bad as people thought.

Maybe the receivers could turn into something (sounded pretty good today).

Maybe Buffalo really HAS found their next franchise QB

Did Buffalo really just steal the possible rookie of the year in Edmunds?

 

There are still a lot of ifs here but looking into next year with no cap issues, tons to spend, and another draft to bolster the O, I am starting to think that the Bills could be on a roll as the Patriots eventually drop back down to Earth. I could not be happier with our coach and GM and contrary to past years when it was nothing but garbage as far as the eye could see, this team seems like it finally has an eye on building a champion. I'm fired up

 

 

Over the next few years, you're saying? Yeah, I agree. Not convinced yet, but the indications are really good, as good as I've seen since the Kelly-Polian-Rusty Jones era.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

9 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Over the next few years, you're saying? Yeah, I agree. Not convinced yet, but the indications are really good, as good as I've seen since the Kelly-Polian-Rusty Jones era.

 

...ABSOLUTELY agree......yet some of the TBD pundnuts have McBeane (1st draft just concluded) and McD on a short two year leash.....go figure.......I'm partial to the Steelers "turnstile mentality"....Colbert GM since 2000, 3 HC's in 48 years and SIX Lombardis......

Edited August 3, 2018 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[BuffaloBaumer]

Some of these ifs just might be going our way....so far so good.

[Shaw66]

On 7/31/2018 at 5:39 PM, BuffaloBaumer said:

Maybe the offensive line is not as bad as people thought.

Maybe the receivers could turn into something (sounded pretty good today).

Maybe Buffalo really HAS found their next franchise QB

Did Buffalo really just steal the possible rookie of the year in Edmunds?

 

There are still a lot of ifs here but looking into next year with no cap issues, tons to spend, and another draft to bolster the O, I am starting to think that the Bills could be on a roll as the Patriots eventually drop back down to Earth. I could not be happier with our coach and GM and contrary to past years when it was nothing but garbage as far as the eye could see, this team seems like it finally has an eye on building a champion. I'm fired up

I didn't read the thread, but I'm completely on board with this.   

 

We're talking about the future here, and none of us can predict the future.    There are dozens and dozens of things that could go wrong that would derail the Bills on the way to NFL prominence (dare we say dominance?), and only a couple of them would be enough to stop the ascent to greatness.   But the ascent to greatness is possible.   Here's how (filling in some the blanks you left and repeating points you've made):

 

1.  McDermott looks like he's special.   He's a leader.  He covers all the details.   He's a tireless worker.   He admits his mistakes and works to correct them.

 

2.  Beane looks like a rising star in the GM world.  Fearless, detail oriented, shrewd.   On the same page with his coach.

 

3.  Allen looks like he could be great.   Obvious, almost other-worldly physical tools.  Smart, dedicated, hard working.  

 

Stop there.   Those are the three most important positions on the team.   The Bills have not combined such bright, talented people at those three positions since Kelly, Polian and Levy.   They are the nucleus.  

 

4.  Cap space.

 

5.  The offensive line.   Once you get past the quarterback, coaching is more important than talent.   All teams have more or less the same amount of talent at the other 21 positions, in the aggregate, and it's what the coaches do with the talent that matters.  Daboll is a huge question mark, to be sure, but after one game it already seems like the Bills have moved their offense into the 21st century.   Most teams struggle to have five very good guys across the front; the teams that succeed are the ones with coaches who figure out how to get good offensive line play out of what they have.   I don't think the line, as a whole, will be the liability that a lot of people think.

 

6.  Receivers are fine.   People seem to think Benjamin is not a number 1 guy.   They seem to base it on his play last year, when he was clearly limited.   Benjamin is a serious threat.  Jones is the question.   If he becomes what he should be, he and Benjamin will be a good tandem.   Kerley and Coleman will do damage as the three and four guys.   Like most other positions, receiver is a position where coaches use a rotation.   We'll see a lot of different looks and combinations, and the Bills have enough talent to make plays.  

 

7.  Shady.

 

8.  Defense was good last year and upgraded.   Davis may be the biggest question mark.   People are expressing doubts about Edmunds, justifiably.   He's young.   What I think people are missing is that although Davis may have some weaknesses in the running game - making his reads, maintaining gap discipline and hitting (things that should improve over time), simply his physical skills (size and speed) should make him a big upgrade over Brown in the passing game.   It was tough to pass against the Bills last season, and with Edmunds patrolling the middle, it's going to be that much tougher.   And the pass rush should be better. 

 

You can respond with "yes, but" in the case of every one of these points, but that doesn't change the fact that none of this is far-fetched.   

 

I think the people who are saying this is a four-win team don't get it.   I don't think McDermott is a four-win guy, as we saw last season.  I think it's a top-10 defense, which alone is worth more than four wins.   If Daboll knows what he's doing, the offense will be good, regardless of who wins the QB job.   If Daboll knows what he's doing AND Allen emerges as a viable starter, watch out - the Bills will be the surprise team of the league.    

[Shaw66]

On 8/2/2018 at 4:30 PM, BuffaloBaumer said:

 

Welp, I'm choosing to think this right now because I see a change over there.......

I'm excited about the possibilities, but I'm prepared for less.   As I said, there are plenty of things that could go wrong, and some of them will.   If Daboll simply is not good, the Bills will be mired in mediocrity or worse.   

[richardb1952]

The Bills were probably lucky to have made the playoffs last year.  They might get lucky again this year if a lot of things fall into place.  I do billieve (any belief about the Bills future success) that after this year the foundation will be set for the Bills to be a solid contender for years to come.   Looking forward to this season as a season of growth and identity with the Bills getting better and better as the season progresses. 

[BillsGuru4]

4 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I didn't read the thread, but I'm completely on board with this.   

 

We're talking about the future here, and none of us can predict the future.    There are dozens and dozens of things that could go wrong that would derail the Bills on the way to NFL prominence (dare we say dominance?), and only a couple of them would be enough to stop the ascent to greatness.   But the ascent to greatness is possible.   Here's how (filling in some the blanks you left and repeating points you've made):

 

1.  McDermott looks like he's special.   He's a leader.  He covers all the details.   He's a tireless worker.   He admits his mistakes and works to correct them.

 

2.  Beane looks like a rising star in the GM world.  Fearless, detail oriented, shrewd.   On the same page with his coach.

 

3.  Allen looks like he could be great.   Obvious, almost other-worldly physical tools.  Smart, dedicated, hard working.  

 

Stop there.   Those are the three most important positions on the team.   The Bills have not combined such bright, talented people at those three positions since Kelly, Polian and Levy.   They are the nucleus.  

 

4.  Cap space.

 

5.  The offensive line.   Once you get past the quarterback, coaching is more important than talent.   All teams have more or less the same amount of talent at the other 21 positions, in the aggregate, and it's what the coaches do with the talent that matters.  Daboll is a huge question mark, to be sure, but after one game it already seems like the Bills have moved their offense into the 21st century.   Most teams struggle to have five very good guys across the front; the teams that succeed are the ones with coaches who figure out how to get good offensive line play out of what they have.   I don't think the line, as a whole, will be the liability that a lot of people think.

 

6.  Receivers are fine.   People seem to think Benjamin is not a number 1 guy.   They seem to base it on his play last year, when he was clearly limited.   Benjamin is a serious threat.  Jones is the question.   If he becomes what he should be, he and Benjamin will be a good tandem.   Kerley and Coleman will do damage as the three and four guys.   Like most other positions, receiver is a position where coaches use a rotation.   We'll see a lot of different looks and combinations, and the Bills have enough talent to make plays.  

 

7.  Shady.

 

8.  Defense was good last year and upgraded.   Davis may be the biggest question mark.   People are expressing doubts about Edmunds, justifiably.   He's young.   What I think people are missing is that although Davis may have some weaknesses in the running game - making his reads, maintaining gap discipline and hitting (things that should improve over time), simply his physical skills (size and speed) should make him a big upgrade over Brown in the passing game.   It was tough to pass against the Bills last season, and with Edmunds patrolling the middle, it's going to be that much tougher.   And the pass rush should be better. 

 

You can respond with "yes, but" in the case of every one of these points, but that doesn't change the fact that none of this is far-fetched.   

 

I think the people who are saying this is a four-win team don't get it.   I don't think McDermott is a four-win guy, as we saw last season.  I think it's a top-10 defense, which alone is worth more than four wins.   If Daboll knows what he's doing, the offense will be good, regardless of who wins the QB job.   If Daboll knows what he's doing AND Allen emerges as a viable starter, watch out - the Bills will be the surprise team of the league.    

Amen

[T master]

It's always time to think big being a Bills fan it just to this point has materialized ?

[SoTier]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

The Bills go 9-7 and break the drought and all of a sudden Beane, McDermott and Allen are the next Levy, Polian, and Kelly? 

 

 

 

This has been my exact problem with all the cheerleaders this off-season/pre-season.  I am very skeptical about most of the personnel moves the Bills have made in 2017 and 2018, primarily because too many of them seem to be in the same short-sighted philosophy of sending proven vets packing rather than pay them that has plagued the Bills since at least John Butler and AJ Smith departed for California.  As a Bills fan for more than fifty years and a former season ticket holder, I'm no longer willing to give any HC or GM/HC combo or owner a free pass without concrete results for more than a single season.  The Bills have conned their fanbase too many times in the past, so  I'll believe that the current regime has a formula for winning regularly when double digit wins, playoff appearances, and playoff wins happen frequently rather than maybe once every two decades.

[eball]

10 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

This has been my exact problem with all the cheerleaders this off-season/pre-season.  I am very skeptical about most of the personnel moves the Bills have made in 2017 and 2018, primarily because too many of them seem to be in the same short-sighted philosophy of sending proven vets packing rather than pay them that has plagued the Bills since at least John Butler and AJ Smith departed for California.  As a Bills fan for more than fifty years and a former season ticket holder, I'm no longer willing to give any HC or GM/HC combo or owner a free pass without concrete results for more than a single season.  The Bills have conned their fanbase too many times in the past, so  I'll believe that the current regime has a formula for winning regularly when double digit wins, playoff appearances, and playoff wins happen frequently rather than maybe once every two decades.

 

Is this post satire?  I hope it's satire.

 

2 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

 

The Bills go 9-7 and break the drought and all of a sudden Beane, McDermott and Allen are the next Levy, Polian, and Kelly? 

 

 

God, I hope not.  Levy lost us four Super Bowls, Kelly partied too much, and Polian couldn't even get along with the owner!

 

Edited August 16, 2018 by eball

[SoTier]

12 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Is this post satire?  I hope it's satire.

 

 

 

I wish it was,  but it's how I feel, and it's going to take several years to determine who's right or wrong.  Certainly the Pegulas' ownership of the Sabres hasn't produced success since the team has missed the playoffs seven straight years.

[eball]

Just now, SoTier said:

 

I wish it was,  but it's how I feel, and it's going to take several years to determine who's right or wrong.  Certainly the Pegulas' ownership of the Sabres hasn't produced success since the team has missed the playoffs seven straight years.

 

The Pegulas have made a number of mistakes, and they'd admit it themselves.  It takes a an awfully dark-minded, cold perspective not to see the positive trend for both organizations at this point, however.