NFL Could Change Defensive Pass Interference to a 15-yard Penalty - Unlikely to be Adopted

[Kwai San]

2 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

What if they do a quick calculation and penalize them the difference between the spot of the foul and 15 yards?

 

Frankly I do not trust the NFL braintrust to do ANYTHING quick - ESPECIALLY during a game!!!  More commercial revenue for them - no way.

[ddaryl]

2 hours ago, co_springs_billsfan said:

Pats* received the most yards gained via pass interference in the league in 2017: http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-pass-interference?year=2017

 

If a rule change hurts them more than the Bills I am in favor of it.  :-)

 

it only hurts us because Brady is an accurate passer, and CB's are desperate to not get burnt.

 

but once Brady is gone that is going to change for the Pats.. Little late to wish this upon Brady and his career.

 

 

I am not in the favor of the PI rule change idea.... the reason it was spot foul is to make a CB think hard about not interfering because its a drastic penalty. If you implement this rule you will see CB's gang raping WR's that have a step on them because its only a 15 yd penalty and not a 25 ++++ penalty. It will become worth it to interfere.. Especially if you have a solid D that can afford to cough up a few 15yd PI penalties

[JohnBonhamRocks]

Agree with the notion that DBs will just take down WRs who have a step. 

 

If this rule is implemented, then I cannot wait to see the reaction of the first fanbase that is the victim of their WR about to haul in an 80 yard TD only to get 1st and 10 on their own 35 yard line. 

 

9 minutes ago, Kwai San said:

 

Frankly I do not trust the NFL braintrust to do ANYTHING quick - ESPECIALLY during a game!!!  More commercial revenue for them - no way.

 

That's generous of you. I do not trust they have a full human brain between them all. 

Edited February 27, 2018 by JohnBonhamRocks

[BillsFan130]

1 hour ago, Jay_Fixit said:

Hopefully the defensive holding calls resulting in an automatic first down is on the table. Horrible rule.

If it’s 3rd and long and a defender is even somewhat beat, he would just pull the receiver down because it would still be 3rd down after the foul. He wouldn’t risk giving up the yards for the first down

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

One rule that needs to change is the holding of a WR on a pass play.  If it's a 5 yard penalty, why is it an automatic 1st down if the distance was more than 5 yards?

Why should a 5 yard penalty on a 3rd and 13 be an automatic 1st down?  It should be 3rd and 8.

They would just pull the receivers down on 3rd and long if they were even somewhat beat. It would just result in more flags and less big plays 

Edited February 27, 2018 by billsfan11

[Royale with Cheese]

16 minutes ago, billsfan11 said:

If it’s 3rd and long and a defender is even somewhat beat, he would just pull the receiver down because it would still be 3rd down after the foul. He wouldn’t risk giving up the yards for the first down

They would just pull the receivers down on 3rd and long if they were even somewhat beat. It would just result in more flags and less big plays 

 

The samething happens now with this rule in place.  Offsides doesn’t give a automatic 1st if the down and distance is greater than 5 yards.  IMO, it should be the same with defensive holding.

[TheFunPolice]

maybe the issue isn't the rule itself but the way it's called?

 

I don't seem to recall constant PI flags and defensive holding 15 years ago. Just make it a foul that is only called when it is egregious. So many ticky tack BS calls of all kinds are ruining the games at times.

 

Which is why suddenly in the Super Bowls the flags go away and we get better games to watch.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

About time. Also stop with trying to have penalties reviewed. They can't handle reviews now. We need less reviews not more. 

[LA Grant]

2 hours ago, cage said:

 

Couldn't they do it the same way they've modified "roughing the kicker"?  There's a 5 yd version and a 15 yd automatic first down version.  A close, aggressive play where there was some contact could be a 15 yard penalty (hand on the back, hands on should or arm as ball is arriving...).  However blatant PI, obvious mugging, not even turning to play the ball is a spot foul.  Also gives referees some latitude on late "hail mary" passes.  Those heaves always make me nervous that the offense will get a cheap PI penalty,... not sure how much that actually happens.  Anyway, penalty could be at the discretion of referee.

 

This seems like the obvious solution.

 

15 yards for non-intentional, run-of-the-mill, grabby but not violent Pass Interference.

 

Spot foul for "tackling the guy because he beat you" or other such flagrant violations. Personally I'd also add on an ejection to that kind of cheap shot, too.

[Jobot]

So many terrible "rules".... Every "rule" is a judgment call in this league.  This sport is F'd

 

I now understand why other sports are always super stubborn to change a thing.

 

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, LA Grant said:

 

This seems like the obvious solution.

 

15 yards for non-intentional, run-of-the-mill, grabby but not violent Pass Interference.

 

Spot foul for "tackling the guy because he beat you" or other such flagrant violations. Personally I'd also add on an ejection to that kind of cheap shot, too.

 

Yeah similar to NBA flagrant fouls.

Good idea.

[Foxx]

3 hours ago, K-9 said:

Agree it’s not a good idea. Gonna be open season on every receiver who beats his man deep. 

why not have it weighted? if the D gets something like 3 PI penalties then it automatically becomes a spot foul?

spitballin' here.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 hours ago, billsfan11 said:

I can see both sides.

 

1. A long pass interference call can seriously impact the game. And a lot of the time those calls are very ticky tack.

 

2. On the other side, players will just tackle the player if they are beat on a deep throw. They would be more than happy to concede the 15 yards.

 

It’s a lose lose either way in my opinion.

 

Overall I would slightly prefer them to keep the rule as is, but let the players play more and don’t call it PI unless it really impacts the play.

 

 

 

...perhaps (another rule) would be two types as in running into the kicker and roughing the kicker....Pass Interference is the new 15 yarder....Intentional Pass Interference (your example of tackling WR) is the spot foul.......and Hoculi can take 10 minutes to explain it..........

[The Wiz]

I'm curious about the wording of "up to a 15 yard penalty".  Does that mean it is a spot foul up to 15 yards?

 

I get the overall consensus that if a receiver beats a guy then they are going to just tackle them to save a possible TD for a 15 yard DPI.  Something like this is what the Pats live for(DPI at the spot of the foul) but I'm sure other teams have benefited from late game DPI and won games.  I honestly think it puts the game more on the offense to be better and score without the refs help. 

 

Anything the NFL can do to keep the refs from determining the outcome of a game (intentional or not) is a good thing IMO.

Edited February 27, 2018 by The Wiz

[BillsFan130]

34 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

The samething happens now with this rule in place.  Offsides doesn’t give a automatic 1st if the down and distance is greater than 5 yards.  IMO, it should be the same with defensive holding.

Offsides are incidental penalties though.

 

No one purposely goes offside.

 

Players  would intentionally hall people down if they were beat

[dulles]

3 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

In college guys run around wide open without a DB in sight. That's why it's OK for college football.

That is exactly what I was thinking.  How many highlight-reel touchdowns are thrown without a defender within a country mile of the WR?  That's why evaluating QB play at the college level is so difficult.  
Gotta say that I don't like the idea of the 15 yard penalty.  Just imagine how aggressive the Seahawks or similar teams would be with that type of arrangement.

[stevewin]

4 hours ago, co_springs_billsfan said:

Pats* received the most yards gained via pass interference in the league in 2017: http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-pass-interference?year=2017

 

If a rule change hurts them more than the Bills I am in favor of it.  :-)

My first thought was that this would mitigate the Pats** bread and butter play.  No doubt though with rule change they would just then get two or three in a drive instead of the single ones today which put them in scoring position.  

[Fadingpain]

Needs to be a double foul type thing like with roughing the kicker/running into the kicker.

 

If blatant, it's a spot foul.

 

If more 50/50 play, 15 yard penalty.

 

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

They are also considering a targeting rule for the upcoming season that I hope will not be implemented. 

[MrEpsYtown]

1 hour ago, LA Grant said:

 

This seems like the obvious solution.

 

15 yards for non-intentional, run-of-the-mill, grabby but not violent Pass Interference.

 

Spot foul for "tackling the guy because he beat you" or other such flagrant violations. Personally I'd also add on an ejection to that kind of cheap shot, too.

 

Good idea, but I just think that this is putting too much interpretation out there for the few again, so you have the same problem as in the refs are dumb and make weird, corrupt decisions. 

 

This is rule change might just ruin the game. I coach high school football and we train our corners to commit PI when beat because they are preventing a touchdown and it's 15 yards. 

[DCOrange]

I’d like to see pass interference implemented like clear path fouls in the NBA. Basically, if you’re not the last line of defense, it’s 15 yards. If you’re beat and there’s no help over the top, it’s a spot foul.

[Scott7975]

4 hours ago, jmc12290 said:

Yep. College is unwatchable now because everytime someone gets beat deep, they get mugged. There aren't even big plays anymore. Just a flag fest. Yesiree.

On the flipside Brady isn't flipping the field anymore with some ticky tack bs. 

[/dev/null]

Not a fan of this idea

 

Unless maybe they change the rule to have two types of DPI.  A minor DPI (bumping the receiver, arm barring, etc) would draw a penalty of spot of the foul up to 15 yards max.  A flagrant DPI would be be spot of the foul or a minimum of 15 yards

Edited February 27, 2018 by /dev/null

[BringBackOrton]

4 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

In college guys run around wide open without a DB in sight. That's why it's OK for college football.

You're saying DPI isn't called in college?

4 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

On the flipside Brady isn't flipping the field anymore with some ticky tack bs. 

Sarcasm alert.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

there are few things more irritating to me than hearing an announcer say "that was a good no-call", especially after watching another game where every incidental contact is called.  it seems some games officials toss flags like crazy, others they "let them play".

 

I'm  for simplicity. Anything that increases the time I have to watch 3 geezers discussing the Summer of Love at Haight-Ashbury while pretending to talk about a penalty...consider me against.  

[Mr. WEO]

4 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

In college guys run around wide open without a DB in sight. That's why it's OK for college football.

 

Huh?

 

No but seriously, when was the last time anyone saw DBs intentionally knocking down a WR before the ball arrives when he's "beat"?

 

I think this is a great idea--seems like what everyone here has been asking for for a while.

[QCity]

I would love this change, and it's been long overdue. If you truly have your man beat deep, and the pass is accurate, there is nothing a DB can do to stop it.

 

Over the past 20 years it's devolved into: Gain 1 foot of separation, crappy QB underthrows pass, WR acts like he's been raped, flag, 50+ yds of offense, outcome of game is changed. That's not football.

[BringBackOrton]

20 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Huh?

 

No but seriously, when was the last time anyone saw DBs intentionally knocking down a WR before the ball arrives when he's "beat"?

 

I think this is a great idea--seems like what everyone here has been asking for for a while.

Duke Williams did it in the EZ three years ago.

 

I didn't see anyone say that play ruined the integrity of the game.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

How about just let the guys play defense again and stop calling every incompletion a penalty. The defenders are already at such a disadvantage, give them a chance.

[26CornerBlitz]

Exactly why this is 100% an awful idea.

 

Edited February 28, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Patrick Duffy]

Would rather them leave it how it is but not call as much of the ticky tack calls. And would also prefer to make it where you could challenge P.I calls.

Edited February 28, 2018 by Patrick_Duffy

[Norcalbillsfan]

5 hours ago, billsfan11 said:

I can see both sides.

 

1. A long pass interference call can seriously impact the game. And a lot of the time those calls are very ticky tack.

 

2. On the other side, players will just tackle the player if they are beat on a deep throw. They would be more than happy to concede the 15 yards.

 

It’s a lose lose either way in my opinion.

 

Overall I would slightly prefer them to keep the rule as is, but let the players play more and don’t call it PI unless it really impacts the play.

 

 

Totally agree, I see both sides. Me personally I think it's the worst ending to games. The defense plays tough D, then an offense with nothing to lose Chuck's it up and the D gets the call that hasn't been called all game and loses because a WR is a great actor. I hate seeing the receiver sell the PI more than he actually tried for the ball ( cough gronk cough). But at the same time you can't blame the receiver, do what you gotta do to win. I agree, they could change it. But it's pick your poison, dbs would rather tackle and take the 15 then get torched on national TV.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

This is exactly why this is 100% an awful idea.

 

No they wouldn't. 15 yards is a lot to just hand out,especially if you don't even know the ball is coming. 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, TheTruthHurts said:

No they wouldn't. 15 yards is a lot to just hand out,especially if you don't even know the ball is coming. 

 

Why wouldn't they? 15 yards is better than giving up a big play or a TD. Not following your logic. 

[LA Grant]

54 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Good idea, but I just think that this is putting too much interpretation out there for the few again, so you have the same problem as in the refs are dumb and make weird, corrupt decisions. 

 

This is rule change might just ruin the game. I coach high school football and we train our corners to commit PI when beat because they are preventing a touchdown and it's 15 yards. 

 

You're right in the sense that refs are unreliable, but that's inevitable unless we find a replacement for human judgment. Maybe in Whaley's all-Robot league? Like the one from the ad bumpers on Fox? haha

 

But I think a tiered-penalty rule would prevent what you're saying, right? Bc obviously corners shouldn't want to commit PI. If the corner is beat, and then he grabs the receiver down before the ball arrives to prevent the TD — well, its like a penalty shot in hockey, except instead it becomes a spot-foul instead of a 15-yarder. 

 

The more I think about it, shouldn't there be tiered-penalties for most fouls?? Holding, both on offense & defense, similar to DPI, is too often a major factor in the success of drives. It'd be nice if the penalties reflected the actual impact it had on the play instead of too often seeming entirely arbitrary. 

 

The only issue with it is the same as with any penalty, which is the human judgment factor.

 

EDIT — Part of the tier needs to include ejections, to prevent the kind of "head-hunting" strategies described in this thread. The NFL is horrible about punishing cheap shots. See: Rob Gronkowski, Jarvis Landry, Burfict, etc.

Edited February 28, 2018 by LA Grant

[Logic]

NFL won't approve this rule change. They want scoring to go UP, so a move that would curb scoring (by eliminating the huge gains in yardage that often come from DPI calls) is not likely to pass.

[Augie]

Great. Will we now have a Flagrant I And a Flagrant II? More ref agony to come? There has to be some kind of intentional tackle vs minuscule incidental contact differentiation, or this is horrific. 

[SouthNYfan]

2 hours ago, Foxx said:

why not have it weighted? if the D gets something like 3 PI penalties then it automatically becomes a spot foul?

spitballin' here.

 

Except once teams hit 3pi, it would go back to the "Chuck and aim for pi" bs the pats do again, just delayed until later in game, and it would encourage them to try for pi more often earlier in games to get into the "penalty"

 

 

1 hour ago, Fadingpain said:

Needs to be a double foul type thing like with roughing the kicker/running into the kicker.

 

If blatant, it's a spot foul.

 

If more 50/50 play, 15 yard penalty.

 

 

 

Exactly what I was thinking.

If anything, this is what it has to be, or along this line.

Otherwise, if it's just a flat 15 yard, it'll turn into the NFL version of "hack a Shaq" when they would just hard foul Shaq , taking their chance at him and his terrible sub-50% free throws instead of his 75%+ fg chance to close.

 

I can see it now in the film room with belicheat

Bb: "Okay , mccourtney and Chung, see this play? Where Gilmore gets torched on a deep post by Julio Jones? Next time you see ANYBODY gets any separation on the DB I want you heading over to smash him before the ball gets there"

 

Chung: "but coach, that's a 15 yard penalty"

 

Bb: "better than a 40 yard completion. Make sure he doesn't catch it. Lay him out"

 

 

....

 

 

Only problem with the "levels" of the penally is it's one more thing for the refs to have "judgment" calls on... We all know how well that works out...

[Buffalo_Stampede]

14 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Why wouldn't they? 15 yards is better than giving up a big play or a TD. Not following your logic. 

Why would a DB go for the 15 yards rather than play the ball? You actually have to be close to grab. 

 

Rarely does a DB get beat bad enough early in the route for this to occur. Even if it does happen there is already a lesser penalty, holding. We do see this, but rarely. A DB gets beat early and just grabs the WR. 

 

It's almost impossible to do on a deep ball because you don't even know the ball is coming your way, your back is to the QB. If CBs start getting multiple 15 yard penalties they will be on the Bench. 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, TheTruthHurts said:

Why would a DB go for the 15 yards rather than play the ball? You actually have to be close to grab. 

 

Rarely does a DB get beat bad enough early in the route for this to occur. Even if it does happen there is already a lesser penalty, holding. We do see this, but rarely. A DB gets beat early and just grabs the WR. 

 

It's almost impossible to do on a deep ball because you don't even know the ball is coming your way, your back is to the QB. If CBs start getting multiple 15 yard penalties they will be on the Bench. 

 

Not the case at all. DBs know when the ball is coming based on a receiver's reaction.  It's not a matter of multiple times with a DB committing PI every time on a deep pass. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Not the case at all. DBs know when the ball is coming based on a receiver's reaction.  It's not a matter of multiple times with a DB committing PI every time on a deep pass. 

So the DB is right there, you as a coach will tell him to just grab the WR instead of get your head around and play the ball? 

 

Are people even thinking?