Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Does this mean I can get out of Terry and Kim's bushes? Thank you, you done good! (pics?) $12 mil a year for this guy over the next two years? Seems like a lot, doesn't it? When looked at in a vacuum, yes, it is. Why, they sound just like Bills fans once a former player signs/gets traded elsewhere. ***ding***ding***ding***ding....we have a winnah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 50 pages here we come Haha; maybe for just day 1 too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 i say miami matches, they have enough/ plenty of cap space. Â Â if the roles were reversed.....wouldn't you want buffalo to match miami's offer ? Â Â miami has about 5 players worth keeping and projected $30 mil under the cap for 2016 ...they can cut whats needed to keep clay. Â Â i also say miami waits 4 days & 23 hours before matching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 So the deal is cap heavy next season so as to attack Miami's cap next year. We have about 109 mil not counting dareus next year. We also have the ability to restructure mario next year opening up a ton of room. This gives us close to 50-55 mil of room. We have a lot of room but still have to sign, dareus, gilmore and cordy glenn and I don't know if I'm leaving anyone out. We could push some of that money until 2017 to give us more room next year just in case....cough philip rivers....or some free agent comes available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Gilmore likely has an option we can pick up for next year. We can easily afford to keep all three, its not a big deal. We are in fantastic shape cap wise...one of the best things about having to be so cap saavy all those years, is it teaches you how to maximize every dollar spent. These guys can really use that talent to maximum effect now that they can actually spend the money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 That seems like a lot for a tight end. But then again, we haven't had a really good TE since.......Remiersma? Nope. Metzelaars? Not really. Tony Hunter? Didn't stick around. Keith McKellars? Biggest contribution was his initial for the K Gun. Â Over 50 years and we're getting the best guy at this position we've ever had, unless I just can't remember who else might have been better. Should we let the guy play here for a year or two before we hold the anointing ceremony? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Should we let the guy play here for a year or two before we hold the anointing ceremony? No,just give him the key to the city already... Edited March 18, 2015 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 @ByTimGraham: Those indignant Dolphins fans are awful quiet tonight. Troll. Â (not you Punch) I bet EJ/Cassel/Tuel/Taylor are nervous... there's no one to blame but themselves if the Bills don't get to the playoffs AND go deep, with this roster. You make very good points. The team is potentially very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 But I bet the Suh signing was brilliant, eh Rodak? Â Â Still...we just paid $40 million for a tight end who literally has feet of clay. why does this make wish Eric moulds was still on the team.....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Still...we just paid $40 million for a tight end who literally has feet of clay. two bit hack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Rex knows the teams in our division as well as anyone and knows how difficult it is to defend this guy because he has had to do it. He was also credited with Tannehill's development from 2013-14 and was his security blanket. This is amazing IMO. Not only do you give EJ (or Cassel) that same security blanket, you take away the guy Tannehill least wanted to lose.  Dude just realized this? #notsorandom  @JamesWalkerNFL: Random thought: The #Dolphins could face Richie Incognito AND Charles Clay twice next season as members of the rival #Bills. #Interesting Edited March 18, 2015 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigdaddyinOrlando Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Was curious if signing clay will count for/against free agent signings towards compensatory picks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 No,just give him the key to the city already... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Was curious if signing clay will count for/against free agent signings towards compensatory picks? yes, it will.....he is considered a FA signing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 yes, it will.....he is considered a FA signing Against us, but if it means anything the Dolphins get squat for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 #ClayWatch    CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Gilmore likely has an option we can pick up for next year. We can easily afford to keep all three, its not a big deal. We are in fantastic shape cap wise...one of the best things about having to be so cap saavy all those years, is it teaches you how to maximize every dollar spent. These guys can really use that talent to maximum effect now that they can actually spend the money...minus the fact that we didnt do a great job at maximizing every dollar and rarely were doing things considered "cap savvy"Â thats no to knock the current off season, just seems revisionist at best. I will agree that i have little to no concern about next years cap yet - as it appears we have been very calculated in each move and have a ton of flexibility still considering the action weve taken. Edited March 18, 2015 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Troll. Â (not you Punch) Ha, yeah he was pretty clearly goading Dolphin fans into responding, and it looks like he got the response he was after. He's like an addict that needs a fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Why, they sound just like Bills fans once a former player signs/gets traded elsewhere. Â I think it has more to do with players going to division rivals. The vast majority here wishes players well when they sign to teams in the NFC or our of the AFC East (Spiller, Stevie, etc). But when they sign with a division rival, I can understand the "hate". Just like I said Scott Chandler is dead to me, I dont hate the guy, but I cant wish him well as a Patriot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 yes, it will.....he is considered a FA signing According to this there is no pick. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000477889/article/bills-preparing-offer-sheet-for-charles-clay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt in KC Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I like how the timing of the offer sheet makes the 5 day period end Sunday evening. Let them work the weekend or make a quicker decision! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 From Dolphins board: "What I do like is the fact that by doing nothing but tagging him, the Dolphins force the Bills to overpay him. Will it prevent them from from getting any particular player? Who knows! But it will limit their ability to acquire talent, including a decent QB (that might make that team somewhat dangerous...). With the stroke of a pen, the Dolphins were able to hinder a rival. That I like. Â The vindictive !@#$ in me would love to keep Clay just to keep him off the Bills, but I know this is really the best move for the Dolphins." Â LMAO!! They think they screwed us over and hurt us from signing players...hahahaha sorry Fin fans, we actually know how to manage the cap...had no other choice for 20 years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 From Dolphins board: "What I do like is the fact that by doing nothing but tagging him, the Dolphins force the Bills to overpay him. Will it prevent them from from getting any particular player? Who knows! But it will limit their ability to acquire talent, including a decent QB (that might make that team somewhat dangerous...). With the stroke of a pen, the Dolphins were able to hinder a rival. That I like. Â The vindictive !@#$ in me would love to keep Clay just to keep him off the Bills, but I know this is really the best move for the Dolphins." Â LMAO!! They think they screwed us over and hurt us from signing players...hahahaha sorry Fin fans, we actually know how to manage the cap...had no other choice for 20 years... limit ability to acquire talent? Like who? What decent QB is out there? Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 limit ability to acquire talent? Like who? What decent QB is out there? Lol Resorting to grasping at straws at this point apparently... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 a restructuring next off season could fix problem . I think it's a certainty that they restructure next year. Â They could give him a little more guaranteed as an inducement (say $15 million over four years, on top of the $12 million paid out in 2015) and cut his cap number down to a more manageable $5-$6 million range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 According to this there is no pick. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000477889/article/bills-preparing-offer-sheet-for-charles-clay I think he meant does this affect our chances for a compensatory pick next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) From Dolphins board: "What I do like is the fact that by doing nothing but tagging him, the Dolphins force the Bills to overpay him. Will it prevent them from from getting any particular player? Who knows! But it will limit their ability to acquire talent, including a decent QB (that might make that team somewhat dangerous...). With the stroke of a pen, the Dolphins were able to hinder a rival. That I like. Â The vindictive !@#$ in me would love to keep Clay just to keep him off the Bills, but I know this is really the best move for the Dolphins." Â LMAO!! They think they screwed us over and hurt us from signing players...hahahaha sorry Fin fans, we actually know how to manage the cap...had no other choice for 20 years... Â We all know, of course, that many Bills fans would be saying the exact same thing if the situations were reversed. It's the nature of fandom. Â That said -- if I try to look at this through non-Bills-tainted glasses, I might come to the conclusion that while Clay may be receiving more money than he appears to be worth, the contract is not particularly damaging to the Bills' cap and has not prevented them from doing anything else they want to do. Â Edit: as Whaley has said, you have a lot more flexibility with the cap when you're not paying an elite QB. I think we'd all prefer that QB, but in the absence of one I don't know how anyone could complain about what they've done. Edited March 18, 2015 by eball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Â We all know, of course, that many Bills fans would be saying the exact same thing if the situations were reversed. It's the nature of fandom. Â That said -- if I try to look at this through non-Bills-tainted glasses, I might come to the conclusion that while Clay may be receiving more money than he appears to be worth, the contract is not particularly damaging to the Bills' cap and has not prevented them from doing anything else they want to do. Â Edit: as Whaley has said, you have a lot more flexibility with the cap when you're not paying an elite QB. I think we'd all prefer that QB, but in the absence of one I don't know how anyone could complain about what they've done. i started to write similar - but i think you got it covered. well we did probably overpay, we do have a little more flexibility in that than other teams do. if we werent bills fans wed probably look at the deal as too much, but i dont think its ABSURD either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 i started to write similar - but i think you got it covered. well we did probably overpay, we do have a little more flexibility in that than other teams do. if we werent bills fans wed probably look at the deal as too much, but i dont think its ABSURD either. Â Right. Value is in the eye of the beholder, and in this case it's not just adding Clay to the Bills, but also taking him away from a division rival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills Fan in MD Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 From Dolphins board: "What I do like is the fact that by doing nothing but tagging him, the Dolphins force the Bills to overpay him. Will it prevent them from from getting any particular player? Who knows! But it will limit their ability to acquire talent, including a decent QB (that might make that team somewhat dangerous...). With the stroke of a pen, the Dolphins were able to hinder a rival. That I like. Â The vindictive !@#$ in me would love to keep Clay just to keep him off the Bills, but I know this is really the best move for the Dolphins." Â LMAO!! They think they screwed us over and hurt us from signing players...hahahaha sorry Fin fans, we actually know how to manage the cap...had no other choice for 20 years... Wait, what? You're telling me that the 18 year search for a QB (absent a few false glimmers of hope over the years) was for nothing, and all they had to do was to clear out some cap room and "want" to acquire a decent QB???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Â Right. Value is in the eye of the beholder, and in this case it's not just adding Clay to the Bills, but also taking him away from a division rival. And adding another mismatch to all the other mismatches we have on offense...what a nightmare to defend this team is gonna be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Â Right. Value is in the eye of the beholder, and in this case it's not just adding Clay to the Bills, but also taking him away from a division rival. but just like we said all week "if they match atleast we hurt them," they are bound to say the same thing now when they look like they arent going to match. essentially what happens when the goal is to create a contract the other team wont want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) And adding another mismatch to all the other mismatches we have on offense...what a nightmare to defend this team is gonna be...looking ahead to next year's QB draft class... Cardale Jones would be filthy in this offense. Not even being a homer there because my guy is and will always be Connor Cook... But in this offense.... Woooo Cardale Edited March 18, 2015 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBills Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Can't they just restructure those deals? I don't think you can turn a roster bonus into a signing bonus. The 10 mil roster bonus for 2016 is as close to a poison pill as we can get today. I'm under the impression that you can only turn base salary into a signing bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I don't think you can turn a roster bonus into a signing bonus. The 10 mil roster bonus for 2016 is as close to a poison pill as we can get today. I'm under the impression that you can only turn base salary into a signing bonus. Â Kudos to "mad genius" Overdorf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I like how the timing of the offer sheet makes the 5 day period end Sunday evening. Let them work the weekend or make a quicker decision! Â I know the prevailing opinion is Dolphins will wait until the last minute. I wonder if the franchise tag doesn't get lifted before then as Clay is tying up 7 million in cap space, and perhaps hindering other moves. Just a thought. IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Â Right. Value is in the eye of the beholder It's also relative. Â I keep seeing these "the Patriots don't overpay, so they win" stories. Well, the Pats are lucky enough to have a HOF QB (maybe the best of the last 20 years) who's still got gas in the tank and who makes everyone on the roster (and even the ball boys) much better than virtually every other team. A HOF head coach doesn't hurt, either. Â Take Brady away and then see if underpaying would work for New England...I suspect they'd be just another good-but-not-great team, like the Steelers or Green Bay (who also get quite a lift from their franchise QBs). Â IMO, the Bills are taking a very bold approach to the problem of not having a franchise QB. It's a gamble, but its not a stretch to think they can be like the Giants in 2012 or Ravens in 2013 if they stay healthy and have a bit of luck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) I don't think you can turn a roster bonus into a signing bonus. The 10 mil roster bonus for 2016 is as close to a poison pill as we can get today. I'm under the impression that you can only turn base salary into a signing bonus. you can - but then it pushes cap hit into future years, nearly guaranteeing that he ends up playing the whole deal at a average salary they werent comfortable with. frankly, its exactly what they will be doing with suh, and what the saints just did with byrd. common structure these days for the second year of big deals. Edited March 18, 2015 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I don't think you can turn a roster bonus into a signing bonus. The 10 mil roster bonus for 2016 is as close to a poison pill as we can get today. I'm under the impression that you can only turn base salary into a signing bonus. They would have to convince Clay to take the guarenteed money further down the line, such as 2017 or 2018 if they restructure it...good luck with that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 They would have to convince Clay to take the guarenteed money further down the line, such as 2017 or 2018 if they restructure it...good luck with that... ive seen that comment before and i dont get where its coming from unless theres something structurally im unaware of. is it just a game of telephone where the details got a bit twisted and its simply a case of it spreading out cap hits down the line which they are guaranteed to have to account for if cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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