Homey D. Clown Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 (edited) Living here in Banjo land, I get to listen to sports talk every morning about teams I could care less about in all honesty, but it's better than nothing, so I tune in, really just to see what other sports radio shows sound like, compared to ours. So, short story long, the big topic as of late is how Chris Johnson has been struggling, and not able to break runs on the inside this year, and guess whose name came up in conversation? nope.... guess again... yes, they were talking about Andy Levitre, and they were not raving about the guy in any way. In fact, they feel like they may have overpaid for what is being perceived as middling talent. They were concerned about his run blocking mostly, and other names along the offensive line as well, it wasn't a Levitre bash fest, but I was surprised to hear that he wasn't the second coming of Jesus Christ in guard form. From all the comments around here, you's think we let the "all mighty" walk(on water to tennessee at that), and bashed the front office for doing so. Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team. Take this for what it's worth, just thought it would be nice to show a different side to what was perceived as a mistake in not keeping a guy. Edited October 9, 2013 by Homey D. Clown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatloaf Sandwich Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Titans were screwed the second Fitz stepped on the field. Doesn't matter who is blocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homey D. Clown Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 Titans were screwed the second Fitz stepped on the field. Doesn't matter who is blocking. They actually raved about how fitz came in and brought the team back... all I saw were the crippling interceptions... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Yea I call it Fitz's magic. Make the people that don't know better root for you then when the 4th quarter comes show them how wrong they were. Lol If he would have restructured, he would be our backup. If he was our backup, he would have led us to a win over Cleveland. I have no doubts about this. Fitz never gave up games. Plenty of times he failed to bring the team back, but lest we forget he had plenty of games where he did lead them from behind, they fell short in a bunch of those, but that's not the point. Can anyone here recall a game in which Fitz relinquished a lead late in the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarkLessWagMore Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team. Yes, our brilliant front office that went into the season with Brown as the replacement (not to mention an undrafted free agent as our backup QB). I'd take Levitre back in a heartbeat, contract and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Living here in Banjo land, I get to listen to sports talk every morning about teams I could care less about in all honesty, but it's better than nothing, so I tune in, really just to see what other sports radio shows sound like, compared to ours. So, short story long, the big topic as of late is how Chris Johnson has been struggling, and not able to break runs on the inside this year, and guess whose name came up in conversation? nope.... guess again... yes, they were talking about Andy Levitre, and they were not raving about the guy in any way. In fact, they feel like they may have overpaid for what is being perceived as middling talent. They were concerned about his run blocking mostly, and other names along the offensive line as well, it wasn't a Levitre bash fest, but I was surprised to hear that he wasn't the second coming of Jesus Christ in guard form. From all the comments around here, you's think we let the "all mighty" walk(on water to tennessee at that), and bashed the front office for doing so. Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team. Take this for what it's worth, just thought it would be nice to show a different side to what was perceived as a mistake in not keeping a guy. Great post. In my opinion, our FO made the perfect non-move. You don't pay a "good" guard that kind of money. No team's success is made or broken by the play of an OG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Yes, our brilliant front office that went into the season with Brown as the replacement (not to mention an undrafted free agent as our backup QB). I'd take Levitre back in a heartbeat, contract and all. Great post. In my opinion, our FO made the perfect non-move. You don't pay a "good" guard that kind of money. No team's success is made or broken by the play of an OG. I agree With Gugny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. The Bills have pending FA's who might be more worth the money than Levitre was CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 It takes a lot of time together for a OL to click .Glenn , Levitre and Wood with Joe D' coaching clicked here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 (edited) The Bills have pending FA's who might be more worth the money than Levitre was CBF there are ZERO pending 2014 free agents currently on the team worth more than $4 mil/year. carrington, chandler, branch, moats, legursky, choice, summers Edited October 9, 2013 by papazoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. The Bills have pending FA's who might be more worth the money than Levitre was CBF there are ZERO pending 2014 free agents currently on the team worth more than $4 mil/year. carrington, chandler, branch, moats, legursky, choice, summers Can somebody please clarify? I was under the impression it has nothing to do with saving for the future and everything to do with that money being 'dead.' I seem to remember something about it being $20M that's not really there. If that's the case, can we please nip these WTF ARE THEY DOING WITH THAT $20M posts once and for all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. I don't know if this will change your opinion at all; I just like to point out that the team won't have all that cap space forever, and decisions need to be made. They are currently paying Urbik $4M/year, and just extended Eric Wood for $6.5M/year. In another year and a half, they'll need to re-sign Cordy Glenn to LT money ($9M/year minimum). You can't expect to keep every free agent, and if you intend to be a good all-around team, paying $28M/year to 4 players on the OL isn't practical. Good teams don't do that. You won't find a great team paying top 10 money to more than 1 or 2 offensive linemen. According to Spotrac, here's a list of teams paying top dollar to more than 1 (with average annual salary in parenthesis): Jets - Mangold (2) and Ferguson (7) Broncos - Clady (1) and Vasquez (10) Panthers - Gross (6) and Kalil (1) Rams - Long (8) and Wells (4) Seahawks - Okung (9) and Unger (6) TB - Nicks (1), Joseph (5), and Zuttah (10) NO - Evans (3) and Grubbs (7) That's only 7 teams in the 32-team league that are paying more than 1 OL top 10 money. When Wood's contract kicks in next year, he'll be the 4th-highest paid C in the league in terms of average salary, so saving the big money for Glenn, instead of Levitre, was a wise move IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Whether you think he is overpaid or not, Levitre is a good, reliable football player and would help really any team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. I do believe that we will have $7 million cap hit next season because of Fitz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 If he would have restructured, he would be our backup. If he was our backup, he would have led us to a win over Cleveland. I have no doubts about this. Fitz never gave up games. Plenty of times he failed to bring the team back, but lest we forget he had plenty of games where he did lead them from behind, they fell short in a bunch of those, but that's not the point. Can anyone here recall a game in which Fitz relinquished a lead late in the game? Agreed. Fitz over played his hand though. The Bills did offer him a $3 million contract & he turned it down. I believe he signed something similar with Tenn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 If he would have restructured, he would be our backup. If he was our backup, he would have led us to a win over Cleveland. I have no doubts about this. Fitz never gave up games. Plenty of times he failed to bring the team back, but lest we forget he had plenty of games where he did lead them from behind, they fell short in a bunch of those, but that's not the point. Can anyone here recall a game in which Fitz relinquished a lead late in the game? the average fan will only remember he threw an INT on 3rd and 12 with 1:34 left in the 4th down 42-37. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 the average fan will only remember he threw an INT on 3rd and 12 with 1:34 left in the 4th down 42-37. Is it fair to call him Romo Lite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I don't know if this will change your opinion at all; I just like to point out that the team won't have all that cap space forever, and decisions need to be made. They are currently paying Urbik $4M/year, and just extended Eric Wood for $6.5M/year. In another year and a half, they'll need to re-sign Cordy Glenn to LT money ($9M/year minimum). You can't expect to keep every free agent, and if you intend to be a good all-around team, paying $28M/year to 4 players on the OL isn't practical. Good teams don't do that. You won't find a great team paying top 10 money to more than 1 or 2 offensive linemen. According to Spotrac, here's a list of teams paying top dollar to more than 1 (with average annual salary in parenthesis): Jets - Mangold (2) and Ferguson (7) Broncos - Clady (1) and Vasquez (10) Panthers - Gross (6) and Kalil (1) Rams - Long (8) and Wells (4) Seahawks - Okung (9) and Unger (6) TB - Nicks (1), Joseph (5), and Zuttah (10) NO - Evans (3) and Grubbs (7) That's only 7 teams in the 32-team league that are paying more than 1 OL top 10 money. When Wood's contract kicks in next year, he'll be the 4th-highest paid C in the league in terms of average salary, so saving the big money for Glenn, instead of Levitre, was a wise move IMO. Great stuff, Bandit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Is it fair to call him Romo Lite? Romo would and does blow it though. Botched field goal holds, poor passes for no reason. Romo is a starter and to be held to a different level. Fitz has never been considered a starter. But... I guess it is fair. Fitz is more of a gamer, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Is it fair to call him Romo Lite? Nice.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team. Why on earth would you, as a fan, be glad that the front office of the Buffalo Bills, a team that is $20 million under the salary cap, did not "overpay" to keep Levitre? Is Ralph mailing dividend checks to the fans with all the money he saved by starting Colin Brown, instead? And who's to say that the Titans overpaid for him? They were under the cap, too. They just decided to use their money to improve their team, instead of sticking it in a 94-year old billionaire's pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think it was an error in letting him walk, no matter how badly he's perceived to be playing in Ten. He's better than Colin Brown, no doubt. The Bills are 20 MILLION dollars under the cap. There's no excuse to let ANYONE walk when you have that much coin laying around. we have a lot of guys to pay and sign next year. Including Bryd. I think the bills were looking at that, when they decided not to pay Top tackle money to a guard who's greatest gift is not making errors. I like the guy, but he's like Leonard. His talent was not messing up. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 and yet Andy proved so valuable in Buffalo, that the BIlls are still scrambling in their search to replace him. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Why on earth would you, as a fan, be glad that the front office of the Buffalo Bills, a team that is $20 million under the salary cap, did not "overpay" to keep Levitre? Is Ralph mailing dividend checks to the fans with all the money he saved by starting Colin Brown, instead? And who's to say that the Titans overpaid for him? They were under the cap, too. They just decided to use their money to improve their team, instead of sticking it in a 94-year old billionaire's pocket. I like a lot of your points on the forum, but bashing Ralph Wilson isn't one of them. I think it is un-classy. It's Ralph's team and he can do what he wants with his money. It is his money, not yours. Be glad we have an NFL team to B word about. This whole NFL thing is a business after all. And the goal of business is to make money for its shareholders. I don't begrudge him for doing that. He is a classy guy and has enriched western NY a little bit by giving us a home team to cheer for. I hope he is around another 50 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 we have a lot of guys to pay and sign next year. Including Bryd. I don't think so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 The Bills would have went to the Superbowl this year if they had Levitre. Maybe the next 5 Superbowls - one for each year we signed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Yes, our brilliant front office that went into the season with Brown as the replacement (not to mention an undrafted free agent as our backup QB). I'd take Levitre back in a heartbeat, contract and all. Legursky was the replacement, Brown was/is the backup. But I agree about taking Levitre back in a heartbeat. There is no denying his talent, I don't care what the Tennessee radio jocks say. He was great at pulling, fast and athletic, strong run blocker, and worked very well with the Eric and Cordy. Maybe he;s not as effective because he's playing for money instead of the team he wanted to play for in Buff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 (edited) I like a lot of your points on the forum, but bashing Ralph Wilson isn't one of them. I think it is un-classy. It's Ralph's team and he can do what he wants with his money. It is his money, not yours. Be glad we have an NFL team to B word about. This whole NFL thing is a business after all. And the goal of business is to make money for its shareholders. I don't begrudge him for doing that. He is a classy guy and has enriched western NY a little bit by giving us a home team to cheer for. I hope he is around another 50 years. I agree that Ralph can do what he wants with his money. That goes without saying. But I, as a fan, don't have to be, and shouldn't be, happy when he (or the front office) choses to pocket that money instead of spending it to resign one of our best offensive linemen at a time when the team is comfortably under the salary cap and without a legitimate replacement on the roster. That was my only point. I don't consider that to be Ralph-bashing. Edited October 9, 2013 by mannc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I agree that Ralph can do what he wants with his money. That goes without saying. But I, as a fan, don't have to be, and shouldn't be, happy when he (or the front office) choses to pocket that money instead of spending it to resign one of our best offensive linemen at a time when the team is comfortably under the salary cap and without a legitimate replacement on the roster. That was my only point. I don't consider that to be Ralph-bashing. Fair enough. Point taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemhoff Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I think that most here would agree with not over-paying for a LG. The issue that I have is the replacements for Andy have been so abysmal. If you are going to let him walk at least have some sort of a gameplan for a decent replacement to take his spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Titans were screwed the second Fitz stepped on the field. Doesn't matter who is blocking. While true, that has nothing to do with the fact that Johnson has been struggling all year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 My objection is that the front office often touts how they "re-sign their own draft picks" instead of going after high-priced free agents. Then they go out and sign Mario Williams, while refusing to sign long-term contracts with two of the only moderately successful draft picks we've had in the last decade. Gross simplification, I know, but still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunTheBall Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 It's a much bigger mistake to not have a legitimate replacement for your QB than it is at LG. Legursky was pegged as the starter and got hurt. Tuel was pegged as the backup and was a colossal, season crushing front office screw up. RTB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasternOHBillsFan Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Can anyone here recall a game in which Fitz relinquished a lead late in the game? I missed it after being forced to watch endless deep passes be horribly inaccurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 and yet Andy proved so valuable in Buffalo, that the BIlls are still scrambling in their search to replace him. jw Is it your opinion, John, that spending $8M/year on Levitre was a wise investment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I agree that Ralph can do what he wants with his money. That goes without saying. But I, as a fan, don't have to be, and shouldn't be, happy when he (or the front office) choses to pocket that money instead of spending it to resign one of our best offensive linemen at a time when the team is comfortably under the salary cap and without a legitimate replacement on the roster. That was my only point. I don't consider that to be Ralph-bashing. Pocket the money. Pocket the money? What if there isn't any money there to pocket? The CAP is the upper limit of what they can spend. It's not how much cash is in the drawer. The Bills have some of the cheapest fans in the NFL and its reflected in the prices they are willing to pay for their tickets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 It's a much bigger mistake to not have a legitimate replacement for your QB than it is at LG. Legursky was pegged as the starter and got hurt. Tuel was pegged as the backup and was a colossal, season crushing front office screw up. RTB Legursky was signed on June 5. He was a last minute scrap heap grab......not a calculated replacement at guard. You are right about the QB situation but the people who now want to act like Colin Brown was a replacement for Legursky are shoveling a mountain of BS into the equation. It's pretty simple......Levitre was a very good, very durable, high draft pick investment......and the Bills are a very cap rich team with no major pending deals and a crying need to turn around their fortunes. They blew their LG situation big time. I don't think anyone would argue that you want to pay a LG $8M per year to get production out of the position.......but when you are trying to change a culture of losing that has extended 13 seasons you need to make the best of your situation right now. You don't have the luxury of rolling the dice with 90% of your potential outcomes being bad. That is exactly what they did. The Bils have more cap room than they have other chips to acquire talent(draft picks, trade-able excess talent...not your starting safety for instance.... etc..)........that being the case, you use that salary cap chip to acquire an adequate replacement in free agency or simply keep the man, pay him for a couple years and re-evaluate his contract then. They have done it unapologetically with players who have warranted far less consideration at their position than Levitre. Fitz, Kelsay, Mark Anderson, Brad Smith.....these guys created dead money but the Bills are still way under the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I have no problem with letting Levitre go, given the amount and the position. However, we had another guard that played for us that was available to sign but we didn't and I am confused on why the front office let that happen. I'd mention him by name but the Board seems to get a little pissy lately whenever his name comes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Of our 3 losses, which ones were due to poor LG play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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