For those of you missing Levitre

[Delete This Account]

From what I understand in my conversations with my contacts around the league, it's pretty widely accepted that Wood is the better lineman than Levitre.

 

 

 

Regarding Glenn, when a young LT is up for a new deal, he's going to look for top 10 money; he'd be crazy not to. As for the 49ers, both Iupati and Davis are still on their rookie deals, so it's not an apples-to-apples comparison. You can be sure that when both of them come up for free agency next year, they won't both be getting long-term contracts.

 

It's not about top-10 money, that was merely a line in the sand drawn for comparison. It's about not investing 25% of your salary cap space in the offensive line. It's not a prudent approach, which is why no successful team does that. The only team that comes close is Tampa Bay, and they're horrible.

 

I think the issue that's arisen here is that folks view Levitre as one of the team's top players. To me, that says more about the low overall talent level on the team than it does about Levitre. He's a good guard, maybe top 10 in the league. Worth $8M/year? Not even close. He's getting more than guys like Chris Snee, Ben Grubbs, Marshall Yanda, Justin Blalock, and Josh Sitton. These are all former pro bowlers and better players. Overpaying at low-impact positions is how a team sets itself up for disaster.

 

 

 

Good player, yes. With regard to your statement about locking him up sooner, do you know--since you report on the team and may know something I don't--if Levitre or his agent showed any desire in signing a long-term deal sooner? From the comments I remember, he seemed pretty excited about the chance to test the market.

 

Levitre was eager to bolt once a deal wasn't reached before the start of his final season. Most players fall into that category.

 

jw

[K-9]

Levitre was eager to bolt once a deal wasn't reached before the start of his final season. Most players fall into that category.

 

jw

 

Are you at liberty to share any details about what was offered and subsequently turned down, if anything, before the 2012 season began?

 

GO BILLS!!!

[TC in St. Louis]

I was sad when he signed, and unless I'm wrong, he signed the first day of free agency. The fact that they were able to slap together a deal within hours tells me they already had cut the deal.

 

He was out the door.

 

Legursky may be fine.

[GG]

 

 

Yeah, well that PROVES it then. He's worth $20 million per year!!!

This is a common thread across multiple personnel decisions by the front office. It's not the question of whether Levitre was worth $20 million, it's how the situation got to that point.

 

It's the poor preparation for the impending free agency, and more importantly the failure to address the position after his departure.

 

There's a reason this franchise is stuck in a tail spin.

Edited October 9, 2013 by GG

[transient]

 

 

Nope. I used to spend lot's of time doing that sort of thing, but it's silly unless someone is paying one to do that.

 

My point is that those who simply make that argument, that this year right now we are x dollars under the cap, and therefore we should sign every free agent to a huge crazy contract because the numbers work out THIS season are doing so out their butts.

 

Whether a team commits that sort of money (including the guaranteed money) to any player has to be evaluated with a view down the road, probably 3-5 years out. Teams routinely got themselves in cap hell on a regular basis by writing contracts for the now, and only thinking about what can I fit under this year's cap, without consideration of what happens when the cap hits keep escalating down the road. Then you're stuck cutting guys you want to keep to get under the cap, and crippling yourself with dead cap money into the future by doing so.

 

You have to have a working 3-5 year plan of what you think the overall allowable cap increase will be each year, what the escalators are for each guy as the years pass, which guys contracts are going to expire and do you want to extend them. What market contracts look like for those guys in the future. Then you have to also prioritize importance of the position because no matter what you do, you won't be able to keep everybody.

 

The issue is just way more complex than, "Hey man, we're $20 million under the cap this year, so what's the problem?

Well stated. The one thing I would add is it makes even less sense to blow that cap space in year one of a complete overhaul, when the new coaches aren't even sure what positions they'll need to shore up on the roster in order to make a legitimate post-season run. I'd rather see them break the bank when we're 1-2 players away then overpay for a replaceable part.

Edited October 10, 2013 by transient

[BillnutinHouston]

You mean the one we already broke down? The one when we didn't have a lead until the closing seconds of the third quarter?

Yup, and the ones Carey Bender mentioned. When evaluating arguments here, I favor smarts over snark any day of the week.

[John from Riverside]

All I know is I wish he was still on the team.....Levitre and Cordy Glenn would look very good on that side....

 

but such is the life in the NFL....would not suprise me to see that position be our 1st section in next years draft.....after a trade down that netted us more picks like we did this year.

[Coach Tuesday]

Someone on talk radio has an opinion about Levitre after 5 games? Well that settles it.

[frogger]

 

 

Yes, our brilliant front office that went into the season with Brown as the replacement (not to mention an undrafted free agent as our backup QB). I'd take Levitre back in a heartbeat, contract and all.

 

I have a feeling Brown wasn't the original idea at LG, something tells me Pugh was. But the giants ruined that idea and Woods fell to us. The Draft is a gamble, in some areas we made out, but we didn't get the replacement.

[CSBill]

The mistake was not getting a deal done with Rhienhart when they realized there was no hope with Levitre. He was not far behind Levitre or Urbik, and is much better then what we have now, and most importantly, could have been had at a far better price then Levitre--not a ceap price, but more realistic and affordable. And most important, he could play!

[Mark Vader]

Living here in Banjo land, I get to listen to sports talk every morning about teams I could care less about in all honesty, but it's better than nothing, so I tune in, really just to see what other sports radio shows sound like, compared to ours. So, short story long, the big topic as of late is how Chris Johnson has been struggling, and not able to break runs on the inside this year, and guess whose name came up in conversation? nope.... guess again... yes, they were talking about Andy Levitre, and they were not raving about the guy in any way. In fact, they feel like they may have overpaid for what is being perceived as middling talent. They were concerned about his run blocking mostly, and other names along the offensive line as well, it wasn't a Levitre bash fest, but I was surprised to hear that he wasn't the second coming of Jesus Christ in guard form. From all the comments around here, you's think we let the "all mighty" walk(on water to tennessee at that), and bashed the front office for doing so.

 

Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team.

 

 

Take this for what it's worth, just thought it would be nice to show a different side to what was perceived as a mistake in not keeping a guy.

The thing is, it's bigger than not keeping "a guy". It was not keeping a guy who was one of the better players on the O-Line.

 

Not only did they lose Levitre, they also failed to re-sign Chad Reinhardt, the back-up LG.

 

So the Bills ended up losing TWO players from one position. Making that position a gaping hole to fill.

 

The front office was unable to find a viable replacement at LG in free agency and they did not draft an OG either.

 

Instead the Bills chose to roll the dice with an open competition which ended up with Colin Brown as the starter.

 

The result has been awful.

[Bronc24]

 

 

Final score of that game was 34-35. All 5 TD's given up by the defense. Still blaming that one on the quarterback?

 

Loaded question, then. Of course Fitz didn't play defense. However it was his ill-timed and poorly thrown interception that put the defense on the field so yes, I blame that on the QB as well.

 

 

 

They were in scoring position from their own 48? Wow.

 

If you have to lie to make your point, it's probably not a point worth making.

 

As opposed to Buffalo having the ball and killing the last 2 mins? Which would you prefer?

 

Fitz sucks. Period. It was proven time and time again and now the Titans' fans get to feel our pain. Insisting on apologizing for him, still, makes you look rather comical.

[Bronc24]

 

 

You mean the one we already broke down? The one when we didn't have a lead until the closing seconds of the third quarter?

 

Explain what you have "broken down"? You called Carey Bender a "liar" and stated that game was not Fitz's fault because he doesn't play defense. Awesome breakdown and scintillating analysis.

 

Who cares when we took the lead? We had the lead with just over three minutes left when Fitz threw a horrible interception. That is fact. Our terrible defense would not have been on the field in that field position had that pick not been thrown. Also fact.

 

Here is the official play call from nfl.com:

 

3-7-BUF 39 (3:03) (Shotgun) R.Fitzpatrick pass short right intended for D.Jones INTERCEPTED by J.McCourty (D.Morgan) at TEN 48. J.McCourty to TEN 48 for no gain (D.Jones). D.Jones underthrown along sideline.

 

Underthrown. Shocking.

 

Could Tennessee, with one timeout left (they surely would have taken a timeout if that pass was completed), have driven the length of the field after the punt? Conceivably. Perhaps if Fitz completes that pass, it's a first down and a moot point. However, he threw a pick, setting up Tennessee for the win. How can he not be blamed?

 

I will leave you with an article about the game itself. Note that while you refuse to blame Fitz for the loss, he certainly blames himself. Who are we to listen to more in this situation?

 

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2012/10/21/buffalo-bills-squander-late-lead-in-35-34-loss-to-tennessee-titans/

Edited October 10, 2013 by Marauder24

[Dibs]

A lot of people talk about the "$20 million" in cap that we have as if it only applies to this season.....and that not spending it is somehow "cheap" behaviour on behalf of the FO.

 

Paying Levitre 8M a year(for 6 years) would impact the following 5 caps......most importantly the 2014 cap.

Due to the rollover rules, Levitre sucking up $8M/year would suck $16M out of next years cap(2014).....$8m in salary & the loss of $8M rollover money that would occur for not signing him.

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M.

The 2014 cap is slated to be around $125M.

At the moment we are committed to $110M.

 

Assuming no changes, we start the 2014 year with $15M in cap space plus rollover money.

Byrd's money($8M) needs to be included in the plans leaving $7M of cap money in 2014.

 

We will also have players hitting FA that we may well want to re-sign in Carrington, Moats, Chandler, Legursky, Branch, Leonhard.....and Punter, FB, backup QB & Kicker......plus monies for the 2014 rookie class. On top of that we have Dareus and A.Williams who hit FA in 2015 whom we might want to lock up mid 2014.

 

We also have very few players who are in the position to renegotiate their contracts to create space. Mario being the only one that really would be viable.

 

 

Going back to the 2014 numbers....

Had we signed Levitre for $8M/year, we would be $1M over the 2014 cap.....AND have to do all of those things listed above.

 

There is still the rollover monies to factor in....

(As I still don't have definitive information about re-rollover I will cover both scenarios)....

 

Assuming we can re-roll rollover money.....we can take that $18.4M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $10.4M.....effectively leaving us with $9.4M in cap space to achieve all of the above things listed.

 

Assuming we can't re-roll rollover money(which I'm fairly sure is the case).....we can take $8.6M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $0.6M.....effectively leaving us being $0.4M over the cap & still having to achieve all of the above.

 

 

There is bond to be some juggling etc of monies......but the end position really is that in the particular cap situation the Bills are in through 2013/2014, re-signing Levitre(particularly over-paying for him) was never going to be considered a wise decision unless he was a STAR player.

Edited October 10, 2013 by Dibs

[thebandit27]

A lot of people talk about the "$20 million" in cap that we have as if it only applies to this season.....and that not spending it is somehow "cheap" behaviour on behalf of the FO.

 

Paying Levitre 8M a year(for 6 years) would impact the following 5 caps......most importantly the 2014 cap.

Due to the rollover rules, Levitre sucking up $8M/year would suck $16M out of next years cap(2014).....$8m in salary & the loss of $8M rollover money that would occur for not signing him.

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M.

The 2014 cap is slated to be around $125M.

At the moment we are committed to $110M.

 

Assuming no changes, we start the 2014 year with $15M in cap space plus rollover money.

Byrd's money($8M) needs to be included in the plans leaving $7M of cap money in 2014.

 

We will also have players hitting FA that we may well want to re-sign in Carrington, Moats, Chandler, Legursky, Branch, Leonhard.....and Punter, FB, backup QB & Kicker......plus monies for the 2014 rookie class. On top of that we have Dareus and A.Williams who hit FA in 2015 whom we might want to lock up mid 2014.

 

We also have very few players who are in the position to renegotiate their contracts to create space. Mario being the only one that really would be viable.

 

 

Going back to the 2014 numbers....

Had we signed Levitre for $8M/year, we would be $1M over the 2014 cap.....AND have to do all of those things listed above.

 

There is still the rollover monies to factor in....

(As I still don't have definitive information about re-rollover I will cover both scenarios)....

 

Assuming we can re-roll rollover money.....we can take that $18.4M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $10.4M.....effectively leaving us with $9.4M in cap space to achieve all of the above things listed.

 

Assuming we can't re-roll rollover money(which I'm fairly sure is the case).....we can take $8.6M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $0.6M.....effectively leaving us being $0.4M over the cap & still having to achieve all of the above.

 

 

There is bond to be some juggling etc of monies......but the end position really is that in the particular cap situation the Bills are in through 2013/2014, re-signing Levitre(particularly over-paying for him) was never going to be considered a wise decision unless he was a STAR player.

 

Thanks for the facts and figures...great post

[Tintonfallsbillsfan]

It is not where the cap is today it is where it is going. Darius, glenn , spiller , a williams are all coming up . Mario is 18.5 against the cap next year, (they probably have to redo it somehow because the cap hit is equally large.). Next years second round pick will be the starting guard for the next 5 years.

The other thing to remeber is hairston got hurt, he has guard ex from college , by now he surly would be in the mix if not startng

[Mike in Syracuse]

Going into the Cleveland game the Bills owned the NUMBER TWO ranked rushing attack in the entire NFL. Someone please explain to me why we're so decimated by not grossly overpaying a mediocre guard?

 

Levitre was not and is not worth $8M per year, not be any stretch of the imagination nor by any rational breakdown of his onfield performance. He was a good pass blocker but a barely average run blocker. He also happens be someone who got turned into a perennial all pro in the mind of some Bills fans.

 

The Bills front office is absolutely responsible for not bringing in an adequate replacement for him. They should have been able to do that for half of what Levitre got paid.

Edited October 10, 2013 by Mike in Syracuse

[Gugny]

Levitre was eager to bolt once a deal wasn't reached before the start of his final season. Most players fall into that category.

 

jw

To me, it's really this simple. The average NFL player gets one big payday. That was Levitre's shot at getting his. He was pretty transparent with his intention to go to the highest bidder. I can't fault him for that. I won't say his name because it'll just make this thread take a turn ... but Levitre's situation last year is not unlike a current Bill's situation this year. Chasing the big pay day. Difference is, Levitre didn't !@#$ his teammates over in the process.

[Gabe Northern]

Maybe.... Juuuuuust maybe.... our front office was very smart in not over paying for a guard, even if we didn't have a better alternative to replace him. sometimes you have to let a guy walk, especially one who isn't blowing it up on his new team.

 

This sentiment is totally idiotic. If you decide not to pay someone, you better sure as sh*t figure out a Plan B.

 

They literally replaced Levitre with the worst player in the NFL (Profootballfocus). How could anyone describe this as a smart move?

[thebandit27]

This sentiment is totally idiotic. If you decide not to pay someone, you better sure as sh*t figure out a Plan B.

 

I agree that their backup plan was poor

 

They literally replaced Levitre with the worst player in the NFL (Profootballfocus). How could anyone describe this as a smart move?

 

Citing PFF doesn't help your case here...do you know where they have Levitre ranked as a guard? Brown hasn't been good, no question. He's not the worst player in the NFL, no matter what the "advanced stats" say. I mean come on, have you seen any Jaguars' games? Brown could be one of their best offensive players.

[papazoid]

A lot of people talk about the "$20 million" in cap that we have as if it only applies to this season.....and that not spending it is somehow "cheap" behaviour on behalf of the FO.

 

Paying Levitre 8M a year(for 6 years) would impact the following 5 caps......most importantly the 2014 cap.

Due to the rollover rules, Levitre sucking up $8M/year would suck $16M out of next years cap(2014).....$8m in salary & the loss of $8M rollover money that would occur for not signing him.

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M.

The 2014 cap is slated to be around $125M.

At the moment we are committed to $110M.

 

Assuming no changes, we start the 2014 year with $15M in cap space plus rollover money.

Byrd's money($8M) needs to be included in the plans leaving $7M of cap money in 2014.

 

We will also have players hitting FA that we may well want to re-sign in Carrington, Moats, Chandler, Legursky, Branch, Leonhard.....and Punter, FB, backup QB & Kicker......plus monies for the 2014 rookie class. On top of that we have Dareus and A.Williams who hit FA in 2015 whom we might want to lock up mid 2014.

 

We also have very few players who are in the position to renegotiate their contracts to create space. Mario being the only one that really would be viable.

 

 

Going back to the 2014 numbers....

Had we signed Levitre for $8M/year, we would be $1M over the 2014 cap.....AND have to do all of those things listed above.

 

There is still the rollover monies to factor in....

(As I still don't have definitive information about re-rollover I will cover both scenarios)....

 

Assuming we can re-roll rollover money.....we can take that $18.4M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $10.4M.....effectively leaving us with $9.4M in cap space to achieve all of the above things listed.

 

Assuming we can't re-roll rollover money(which I'm fairly sure is the case).....we can take $8.6M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $0.6M.....effectively leaving us being $0.4M over the cap & still having to achieve all of the above.

 

 

There is bond to be some juggling etc of monies......but the end position really is that in the particular cap situation the Bills are in through 2013/2014, re-signing Levitre(particularly over-paying for him) was never going to be considered a wise decision unless he was a STAR player.

 

BAD NEWS....most of it ($17 mil) is going to be used up next year with the players we already have.

 

NAME - 2013 Cap - projected 2014 CAP

 

Mario - $12.4 - $18.4

Stevie - $5.6 - $8.5

Kyle - $5.9 - $5.8

Marcell - $5.5 - $6.5

Eric Wood - $5.0 - $5.3

CJ - $3.7 - $4.2

Freddy - $3.7 - $3.7

Leodis - $3.0 - $4.2

Pears - $2.8 - $3.5

Urbik - $2.8 - $3.3

Fitz - $3.0 - $7.0 (dead money)

 

TOTAL - $53.4 - $70.4

[Dibs]

This sentiment is totally idiotic. If you decide not to pay someone, you better sure as sh*t figure out a Plan B.

 

They literally replaced Levitre with the worst player in the NFL (Profootballfocus). How could anyone describe this as a smart move?

 

You are confusing results with intent.

 

Considering the recent success the Bills have had at evaluating the talent of players on the OL, it is not unreasonable to assume that they believed the LG position was going to be minimally stable. The fact that their Plan A(using the players that are currently there) has not turned out as expected is definitely a mistake.....but not a mistake on planning. It was a mistake on talent assessment.

[eball]

Can anyone here recall a game in which Fitz relinquished a lead late in the game?

 

Last year against Tennessee. Awful pick late. They took the ball and scored to take the lead, then Fitz's last drive sputtered.

[Dibs]

BAD NEWS....most of it ($17 mil) is going to be used up next year with the players we already have.

 

NAME - 2013 Cap - projected 2014 CAP

 

Mario - $12.4 - $18.4

Stevie - $5.6 - $8.5

Kyle - $5.9 - $5.8

Marcell - $5.5 - $6.5

Eric Wood - $5.0 - $5.3

CJ - $3.7 - $4.2

Freddy - $3.7 - $3.7

Leodis - $3.0 - $4.2

Pears - $2.8 - $3.5

Urbik - $2.8 - $3.3

Fitz - $3.0 - $7.0 (dead money)

 

TOTAL - $53.4 - $70.4

 

The figures I listed for the 2014 cap included all current contracts. All of those numbers were used in the figures I gave.

[papazoid]

 

 

The figures I listed for the 2014 cap included all current contracts. All of those numbers were used in the figures I gave.

 

where is the list or link of your players and salaries that make up your "2014 At the moment we are committed to $110M."

[Dibs]

where is the list or link of your players and salaries that make up your "2014 At the moment we are committed to $110M."

$109,887,839

 

At the very bottom of the page....

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap-hit/2014/

[K-9]

...Citing PFF doesn't help your case here...do you know where they have Levitre ranked as a guard? Brown hasn't been good, no question. He's not the worst player in the NFL, no matter what the "advanced stats" say. I mean come on, have you seen any Jaguars' games? Brown could be one of their best offensive players.

 

Got that right. Going into free agency, they had Levitre as the 2nd best G on the market behind Brandon Albert. But they had him rated as the best pass blocking G in football.

 

They also had him ranked as the 39th best run blocking G in the game. 39th. Has that ranking gone up, down, or remained the same at PFF? I honestly don't know.

 

Bottom line is that as poor as Colin Brown has played, and poor doesn't begin to describe his play, our running game has been decent, if not dominant at times. I don't see how we can just imagine how as low rated a run blocker as Levitre is, that they could run the ball that much better.

 

It's more of a case of missing on his replacement than missing Levitre at this point.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[papazoid]

 

$109,887,839

 

At the very bottom of the page....

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap-hit/2014/

 

ok thanks...

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M (we can assume ALL of it will be rolled over to 2014)

The 2014 cap is slated to be around $125M.

Bills total adjusted 2014 team cap should be around $143.4

At the moment we are committed to $110M.

 

that leaves $33.4 mil of cap space.

 

I don't think the bills have the stomach to go through another year of Byrd and will trade him before the draft.

 

factor in the usual roster turnover (Kolb $3.6, B Smith $2.3, Colin Brown $0.8 and a host of min wage players for a total of $10 mil).

 

bills could be working with $43 mil

[Doc]

Not having a backup plan, which is a valid criticism in this case, is not a reason to sorely overpay a decent OG, especially when it would screw the team down the line WRT more important impending FA's. And keeping Rinehart would have been nice, but it's not like he lit-it-up and he was probably was looking to move to SD/re-hook-up Alessandris.

[K-9]

Not having a backup plan, which is a valid criticism in this case, is not a reason to sorely overpay a decent OG, especially when it would screw the team down the line WRT more important impending FA's. And keeping Rinehart would have been nice, but it's not like he lit-it-up and he was probably was looking to move to SD/re-hook-up Alessandris.

 

There's a difference between not having a backup plan and having a plan that fails. Even still, they are getting production out of their running game and their pass protection has been more than adequate for the most part IN SPITE of Colin Brown's ineptitude.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Doc]

There's a difference between not having a backup plan and having a plan that fails. Even still, they are getting production out of their running game and their pass protection has been more than adequate for the most part IN SPITE of Colin Brown's ineptitude.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Yes, my mistake in saying they had no backup plan instead of saying they had an inadequate backup plan. And I agree that Brown isn't the reason the Bills lost those 3 games and that Levitre wouldn't have led to them winning them. Hopefully the leeway people are giving Levitre in his first 5 underwhelming games can be extended to Brown as well.

[BADOLBILZ]

A lot of people talk about the "$20 million" in cap that we have as if it only applies to this season.....and that not spending it is somehow "cheap" behaviour on behalf of the FO.

 

Paying Levitre 8M a year(for 6 years) would impact the following 5 caps......most importantly the 2014 cap.

Due to the rollover rules, Levitre sucking up $8M/year would suck $16M out of next years cap(2014).....$8m in salary & the loss of $8M rollover money that would occur for not signing him.

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M.

The 2014 cap is slated to be around $125M.

At the moment we are committed to $110M.

 

Assuming no changes, we start the 2014 year with $15M in cap space plus rollover money.

Byrd's money($8M) needs to be included in the plans leaving $7M of cap money in 2014.

 

We will also have players hitting FA that we may well want to re-sign in Carrington, Moats, Chandler, Legursky, Branch, Leonhard.....and Punter, FB, backup QB & Kicker......plus monies for the 2014 rookie class. On top of that we have Dareus and A.Williams who hit FA in 2015 whom we might want to lock up mid 2014.

 

We also have very few players who are in the position to renegotiate their contracts to create space. Mario being the only one that really would be viable.

 

 

Going back to the 2014 numbers....

Had we signed Levitre for $8M/year, we would be $1M over the 2014 cap.....AND have to do all of those things listed above.

 

There is still the rollover monies to factor in....

(As I still don't have definitive information about re-rollover I will cover both scenarios)....

 

Assuming we can re-roll rollover money.....we can take that $18.4M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $10.4M.....effectively leaving us with $9.4M in cap space to achieve all of the above things listed.

 

Assuming we can't re-roll rollover money(which I'm fairly sure is the case).....we can take $8.6M into next season. Had we signed Levitre that would then be reduced to $0.6M.....effectively leaving us being $0.4M over the cap & still having to achieve all of the above.

 

 

There is bond to be some juggling etc of monies......but the end position really is that in the particular cap situation the Bills are in through 2013/2014, re-signing Levitre(particularly over-paying for him) was never going to be considered a wise decision unless he was a STAR player.

 

 

That would be a really swell argument if it were based on how the Bills organization is run.........but it simply is not.

 

The only thing you need to know about the Bills cap situation is that they rolled $7M of dead money from Ryan Fitzpatrick into next season when they had a wealth of space available to absorb it this year.

 

They did so because extra cap space is a burden going forward. Not a lack of cap space......EXTRA cap space is a burden.

 

Why do people have their head in the sand about this subject? The Bills aren't working under the league salary cap system as it is set up to be.

[K-9]

Yes, my mistake in saying they had no backup plan instead of saying they had an inadequate backup plan. And I agree that Brown isn't the reason the Bills lost those 3 games and that Levitre wouldn't have led to them winning them. Hopefully the leeway people are giving Levitre in his first 5 underwhelming games can be extended to Brown as well.

 

That leeway can only be given after an honest evaluation of the situation.

 

I'm not holding my breath, though. Colin Brown will never be forgiven for not being Andy Levitre.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Mike B. in VA]

Considering the recent success the Bills have had at evaluating the talent of players on the OL, it is not unreasonable to assume that they believed the LG position was going to be minimally stable. The fact that their Plan A(using the players that are currently there) has not turned out as expected is definitely a mistake.....but not a mistake on planning. It was a mistake on talent assessment.

 

Indeed. The Bills have a track record of success with lineman other teams think of as marginal (Jason Peters and Jonas Jennings immediately spring to mind as two guys that got big free agent deals when leaving), so the planning aspect of it had some history. Reinhardt was a no-name journeyman when he got here, and IIRC two teams had decided Pears was marginal at best.

 

I still think they should have spent a little more for depth, though the FA class was kinda meh, other that guys like Vasquez (who cost more than AL would have!) Sometimes stuff doesn't pan out in the NFL - ask the Steelers how letting Medenhall go played out when their starter went down.

[Coach Tuesday]

Indeed. The Bills have a track record of success with lineman other teams think of as marginal (Jason Peters and Jonas Jennings immediately spring to mind as two guys that got big free agent deals when leaving), so the planning aspect of it had some history. Reinhardt was a no-name journeyman when he got here, and IIRC two teams had decided Pears was marginal at best.

 

I still think they should have spent a little more for depth, though the FA class was kinda meh, other that guys like Vasquez (who cost more than AL would have!) Sometimes stuff doesn't pan out in the NFL - ask the Steelers how letting Medenhall go played out when their starter went down.

 

Well, to be fair, the Steelers at least had a viable starter who went down. The Bills don't even have a viable starter at that position.

 

Look - no one is really arguing here. There is consensus that the Bills lacked a viable plan at LG. They knew back in April that Brown was struggling. Legursky is hardly the answer (they were both called out by Marrone early in the offseason). They didn't even try to address the position in the draft (or the previous draft, when they should've seen this coming). I agree with BADOL's point about the Bills' capenomics but it's beside the point - they could've done their usual profit-taking thing and still found a decent replacement-level solution at LG. It isn't cheapness that led them to where they are, it's normal OBD incompetence.

[A Dog Named Kelso]

The biggest problem with letting Levitre walk was that we didn't have a plan for his replacement. They should have at least signed Rinehart that, I think, was the biggest issue. He is certainly not better than Levitre but he is better that what we have in there now.

Edited October 10, 2013 by cklapka

[Dibs]

ok thanks...

 

The cap space we have at the moment is $18.4M (we can assume ALL of it will be rolled over to 2014)

.....

 

There has been an ongoing discussion on the board about whether rolled over money can be re-rolled into the following year. Sources have been cited(including the CBA document) that are worded in the negative.....but several respected analysts have been cited as having opinion that it can be re-rolled.

 

If it cannot be re-rolled, we lose $9.8M in rollover for 2014.

 

 

......

I don't think the bills have the stomach to go through another year of Byrd and will trade him before the draft.

 

factor in the usual roster turnover (Kolb $3.6, B Smith $2.3, Colin Brown $0.8 and a host of min wage players for a total of $10 mil).

.....

I agree with there being a good chance we won't have Byrd's contract on the 2014 books......though personally I hope we do.

 

In regards to the "usual roster turnover"....the players you mention have dead cap hits....Kolb & Smith $0.5M each....and we will still need players brought in to replace them if they are cut. Don't get me wrong, I believe we will be in a good position to take advantage of the good FA period that next off-season looks to be.

 

 

....

The only thing you need to know about the Bills cap situation is that they rolled $7M of dead money from Ryan Fitzpatrick into next season when they had a wealth of space available to absorb it this year.

...

 

Had we placed the Fitz $7M onto this years cap we would be rolling over $7M less into the 2014 cap.......end result being exactly the same for the 2014 cap. Doing it this way enabled the Bills to have extra money available in 2013.....even though we didn't/haven't used it. Perhaps for PR reasons the Bill's FO should have just taken the hit this season to avoid the sort of unfounded negative public reaction shown in this thread.

[John from Riverside]

If Byrd comes in and plays lights out....I really do hope they get something worked out and he stays

 

remember....WINNING cures a lot of things

[mannc]

Anyone know what kind of compensatory pick we get for Levitre leaving? Or has that yet to be determined?

[Billy in 4C]

Look - PFF said Colin Brown gave up 16 pressures in the first 3 games - all tight games. Assuming Levitre gives up 1/game like the rest of the line, there's a decent chance we win one or both of those. Levitre just through week 3 might have already given us 2 additional wins.