Bills/Commanders Postgame Thread

[BearNorth]

Just noticed that pending tonight's games, James Cook is #2 in the NFL, #1 in the AFC in rushing.  Averaging 89 yards per game. Swift from the Iggles could pass him with a 90+ yard game.

 

[nucci]

29 minutes ago, BearNorth said:

Just noticed that pending tonight's games, James Cook is #2 in the NFL, #1 in the AFC in rushing.  Averaging 89 yards per game. Swift from the Iggles could pass him with a 90+ yard game.

 

upgrades at G position are making a huge difference

[NewEra]

39 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said:

The offensive game plan/calling in my opinion wasn’t good and I was critical during the game day threads

 

To your point, not enough Kincaid.

 

Way too many 2nd and long runs.

 

And that 4th and inches pass.

 

But really, just hours after a 37-3 win we are going to complain?

 

So ya, they are legit points. But given the circumstances after a blow out win, it’s “mind boggling” to me that’s what some people are “most” focused on

Idk…. I’m discussing the good and the bad.  What I liked and what I disliked.
 

 I loved pretty much everything about the defense.  The DL was unstoppable.  The LBs were everywhere.  The DBs took advantage our DLs dominance.  I loved the pass blocking.  Josh and Diggs played great.  

 

I didn’t like kincaids usage (especially compared to Harty).  I question Dorsey’s ability to use either of those guys atm.   I didn’t like a handful of Dorsey’s calls.  I didn’t think the OL was getting much movement in the run game in the first half.  2 offensive TDs to 3 FGs- should the the other way around

 

If you’ve been on this board awhile you should know that the people that are focusing “most” on the bad, do the same thing every week…… it’s who they are.  Common knowledge and expected imo. 

[SoTier]

11 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

 

 

He's in good company.  Only Brian Urlacher and James Harrison have achieved what Bernard did today.  Pretty impressive.

 

11 hours ago, balln said:

Am I happy they stomped wash. Of course

 

for the most part they looked great

 

but this herky jerky offense. And all the things I have outlined have permeated far too many games over the last 2 seasons- For me to Cheerlead this. It’s Super Bowl or bust fellas

 

gabe Davis can’t be our #2 targets player. He CAnT. We don’t have that WR. Fine. Has to be Kincaid TE and rbs - cook looks nasty. I don’t think they’re using him in passing game well enough. He needs the ball QUICK on the run in stride. Not last second dumpoffs

 

Did it ever occur to you that the reason the offense was "herky jerky" was because the Commanders defense aren't pushovers?   They have a good defense lead by their very stout DL with Chase Young and friends.

 

 

10 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Just really bugs me when a professional OC for an NFL team didn’t have the common sense of a 12 year old playing Madden. 

 

Yes, Madden is certainly is the standard measure of reality.   Maybe when you finish with middle school you'll realize that.

 

 

 

[BillsFan130]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Idk…. I’m discussing the good and the bad.  What I liked and what I disliked.
 

 I loved pretty much everything about the defense.  The DL was unstoppable.  The LBs were everywhere.  The DBs took advantage our DLs dominance.  I loved the pass blocking.  Josh and Diggs played great.  

 

I didn’t like kincaids usage (especially compared to Harty).  I question Dorsey’s ability to use either of those guys atm.   I didn’t like a handful of Dorsey’s calls.  I didn’t think the OL was getting much movement in the run game in the first half.  2 offensive TDs to 3 FGs- should the the other way around

 

If you’ve been on this board awhile you should know that the people that are focusing “most” on the bad, do the same thing every week…… it’s who they are.  Common knowledge and expected imo. 

That’s fair and I’m not saying that’s you as you always bring good insights 

 

Your points are definitely reasonable with the offence as there are concerns.

 

I was more saying for the ones that “just” hammer home the negatives after a 37-3

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, Since1981 said:

Doesn’t this heavily skew your input to team strategy discussion on this board?   It’s interesting that fandom in places has in 2023 morphed some tone into fantasy/bet/$$ mindset but we here don’t always know the motives. 

Sure it may.  This is the post game thread
 

are you happy with Kincaid getting 2 targets on the first series and then zero the rest of the game, while Harty is touching the ball 5 times within the offense?  Do you think that’s good strategy?

 

and I was one of the guys that really liked the Harty addition. 
 

Kincaid deserves more targets…..and not only on 1 yard passes and screens.

1 minute ago, BillsFan130 said:

That’s fair and I’m not saying that’s you as you always bring good insights 

 

Your points are definitely reasonable with the offence as there are concerns.

 

I was more saying for the ones that “just” hammer home the negatives after a 37-3

Yeah I hear ya. I’m usually battling with you on this one…..I just don’t find it mind boggling anymore.  I just expect it

[Ralonzo]

12 hours ago, AlfaBill said:

Perhaps but the refs were definitely one sided today. They stunk 

 

"One-sided" is the best way to put it. The most aggravating sort, where they'll allow flagrant stuff for one side (LB accosting Knox all the downfield with illegal contact) and call a ticky-tack the other way (the illegal contact on third down). The massive, obvious holding being let slide (i.e. huge one on Phillips in the red zone) while making the weird "tripping without using your leg" - never seen that before. And I still don't know how that McLaurin fumble was complete with forward progress, that was another huge outlier of a call which like almost all of them fell the way of the home team. In a fair game they might have run them out like Miami did to Denver.

[SoTier]

10 hours ago, Meatloaf63 said:

Absolutely the outcome is most important , but making mistakes a high school coach shouldn’t make is not acceptable at this level. You accept and are happy with a poor performance as long as they win, I expect improvement and learning from his mistakes, I also know he doesn’t get this slack next week against Miami, or against KC, Dallas, etc…

 

Maybe you should watch more NFL games rather than concentrating on high school contests.   In the Steelers win over the Raiders, Garappollo hit Davante Adams for a long TD on a 3 or 4th and less than a yard.

 

10 hours ago, Airseven said:

Howell is a scrub.

 

He's played all of 4 NFL games, Nostradamus.

[Ralonzo]

16 minutes ago, SoTier said:

Did it ever occur to you that the reason the offense was "herky jerky" was because the Commanders defense aren't pushovers?   They have a good defense lead by their very stout DL with Chase Young and friends.

 

The Comanches games I've seen this year, the effectiveness of their D line has been led mainly by the excellent tackles Jonathan Allen (7.5 sacks last year) and Daron Payne (11.5 sack last year) disrupting the interior. There probably isn't a better pair in the league. I don't recall them flashing at all and barely heard their names. Young and Sweat had a moment or two but the drivers of that defense got nothing at all, totally dominated by the Bills guards which was the Aaron Rodgers Heel (too soon?) of the Bills offense last year. This... this is what's new this year that has been missing for a while for Buffalo. This might just be an upper-third OL in the league which it hasn't been close to that in the Allen era.

 

This might be the game to review the tape play-by-play just watching the OL.

[Franco_92]

33 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

He's in good company.  Only Brian Urlacher and James Harrison have achieved what Bernard did today.  Pretty impressive.

 

 

Did it ever occur to you that the reason the offense was "herky jerky" was because the Commanders defense aren't pushovers?   They have a good defense lead by their very stout DL with Chase Young and friends.

 

 

 

Yes, Madden is certainly is the standard measure of reality.   Maybe when you finish with middle school you'll realize that.

 

 

 

Chase young is actually the worst of the 4 DL they start

[BillsUberAlles]

Terrel Bernard was the best player on the field on either side of the ball yesterday.

 

I am not sure I could have ever imagined myself saying that, and I don't think we ever said that in all the years Tremaine Edmunds was here.

 

Bernard had an INT, 2 sacks, 2 TFLs, another TFL that was nullified by a defensive penalty, led the team in tackles and was pretty much everywhere yesterday.

 

I am honestly stunned that we may have another Milano playing next to Milano.

 

 

[Franco_92]

I would prefer a QB sneak on the 4th down as well but when you get Diggs matched up on a linebacker it's not the craziest thing in the world to throw that way. 9/10 times the pass isn't knocked down. Torrence has been great but that's one of the nuances he still has to fine-tune, locking up the defenders arms

[finn]

9 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

The guy is an absolute revelation 

But he's small and slow!

[Beck Water]

16 hours ago, Playoffs? said:

If I need to be nitpicky, I didn’t love his 4th and 1 pass play.  Just push the pile. Get 1 yard. 

 

Same. 

26 minutes ago, BillsUberAlles said:

Terrel Bernard was the best player on the field on either side of the ball yesterday.

 

I am not sure I could have ever imagined myself saying that, and I don't think we ever said that in all the years Tremaine Edmunds was here.

 

Bernard had an INT, 2 sacks, 2 TFLs, another TFL that was nullified by a defensive penalty, led the team in tackles and was pretty much everywhere yesterday.

 

I am honestly stunned that we may have another Milano playing next to Milano.

 

 

 

Same.

 

I  had the impression Bieniemy had a clever plan to use his knowledge of Milano's role and our defense, to send the play somewhere else and pick on the new guy.

 

New Guy showed up.

[DrDawkinstein]

47 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Maybe you should watch more NFL games rather than concentrating on high school contests.   In the Steelers win over the Raiders, Garappollo hit Davante Adams for a long TD on a 3 or 4th and less than a yard.

 

 

We should ABSOLUTELY NOT be taking tips from the Raiders. That was an act of desperation by a loser team.

 

Truly dominant, winning teams dont need to do that stuff. Just line up and gain the 2 feet we need.

[TheWei44]

31 minutes ago, BillsUberAlles said:

Terrel Bernard was the best player on the field on either side of the ball yesterday.

 

I am not sure I could have ever imagined myself saying that, and I don't think we ever said that in all the years Tremaine Edmunds was here.

 

Bernard had an INT, 2 sacks, 2 TFLs, another TFL that was nullified by a defensive penalty, led the team in tackles and was pretty much everywhere yesterday.

 

I am honestly stunned that we may have another Milano playing next to Milano.

 

 

I said yesterday it's like having two Milano's - Never would have expected that!

[BearNorth]

31 minutes ago, TheWei44 said:

I said yesterday it's like having two Milano's - Never would have expected that!

This week will probably be the proof of this train of thought.  Fish are currently the top running team @ 6.1 ypc, Suspect this is because teams are selling out to stop the passing game.  Only team in the league with 2 backs over 200 yards this season, and their top 3 backs [Mostert, Achane, Brooks] have all broken runs of 40 or more yards. Mostert, & Achane, run sub 4.4, and Brooks is a Murray type [232#] thumper.

[Bruffalo]

Good win but I think Dorsey is keeping the offense from firing on a level that they theoretically can reach.  Some of the playcalls were baffling, first down was rough, and I still don't see the motion, the play action, or much creativity.  Allen & Diggs are still the offense, and Cook is doing well but I think we're in the same position as we were in last season (with a better offensive line).    

[starrymessenger]

I expected a closer game than the one we wound up with but the turnovers really did the Commanders in and I've got to lay that at Howell's feet. Made very poor decisions in the passing game and seems to hold on to the ball too long while reading the field. Mind you I'm not sure he was helped by EB's calling so many passing plays especially given that Wash has a good run game. Even then the score wasn't that far out of reach heading into the 4th quarter (16 points).
This was only Howell's fourth NFL start so it's perhaps not surprising that he looked a bit like "bad" Josh at times. Also the Bills are a good veteran team and WC is in the middle of a youth movement. I think they have a chance of sneaking into the post season.

[Process]

1 hour ago, arcane said:

I would prefer a QB sneak on the 4th down as well but when you get Diggs matched up on a linebacker it's not the craziest thing in the world to throw that way. 9/10 times the pass isn't knocked down. Torrence has been great but that's one of the nuances he still has to fine-tune, locking up the defenders arms

Lining up in shotgun on 4th and 6 inches should happen 0.000000% of the time

[SCBills]

2 hours ago, BillsUberAlles said:

Terrel Bernard was the best player on the field on either side of the ball yesterday.

 

I am not sure I could have ever imagined myself saying that, and I don't think we ever said that in all the years Tremaine Edmunds was here.

 

Bernard had an INT, 2 sacks, 2 TFLs, another TFL that was nullified by a defensive penalty, led the team in tackles and was pretty much everywhere yesterday.

 

I am honestly stunned that we may have another Milano playing next to Milano.

 

 

 

I'm starting to really buy in on McDermott's vision for this Defense.  

 

Spend/Invest heavily on the DL to keep the LB's clean.  Draft speed/athleticism linebackers that fall in the draft due to being undersized and just let them loose behind that DL. 

 

Milano & Bernard look like structured chaos out there with their speed, instincts, coverage ability and violent short area burst.. and we have another one being developed behind them in Dorian Williams. 

 

Edited September 25, 2023 by SCBills

[dave mcbride]

Bizarre Bills defensive stat juxtaposition:

 

2nd in points allowed, 2nd in yards allowed, 1st in turnovers forced, 3rd in passing yards allowed, 6th in net yards per passing attempt, and ... 32nd in yards per rush given up (5.9 ypc).

 

The most telling stat, however: 

Bills team passer rating: 90.3

Opponents' collective team passer rating: 54.0

 

That differential of 35.7 is massive, and passer rating differential is the best predictive stat of all with regard to aligning with winning and losing games.

 

Of course, they've faced some pretty bad quarterbacking so far ...

[balln]

3 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

He's in good company.  Only Brian Urlacher and James Harrison have achieved what Bernard did today.  Pretty impressive.

 

 

Did it ever occur to you that the reason the offense was "herky jerky" was because the Commanders defense aren't pushovers?   They have a good defense lead by their very stout DL with Chase Young and friends.

 

 

 

Yes, Madden is certainly is the standard measure of reality.   Maybe when you finish with middle school you'll realize that.

 

 

 

Sure. But they lost to the jets in a woeful offensive performance. And looked herky jerky against raiders. And many many many games last year. And no showed v cincy 

[ngbills]

8 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Bizarre Bills defensive stat juxtaposition:

 

2nd in points allowed, 2nd in yards allowed, 1st in turnovers forced, 3rd in passing yards allowed, 6th in net yards per passing attempt, and ... 32nd in yards per rush given up (5.9 ypc).

 

The most telling stat, however: 

Bills team passer rating: 90.3

Opponents' collective team passer rating: 54.0

 

That differential of 35.7 is massive, and passer rating differential is the best predictive stat of all with regard to aligning with winning and losing games.

 

Of course, they've faced some pretty bad quarterbacking so far ...

Wilson had his best game of the season vs us and passer rating of 81.4

Jimmy G was a 68.9 and his game was below average.

Howell at 41.5 stunk and drives the average down a ton. Was easily his worst game of the season. 

[Warcodered]

3 hours ago, NewEra said:

Idk…. I’m discussing the good and the bad.  What I liked and what I disliked.
 

 I loved pretty much everything about the defense.  The DL was unstoppable.  The LBs were everywhere.  The DBs took advantage our DLs dominance.  I loved the pass blocking.  Josh and Diggs played great.  

 

I didn’t like kincaids usage (especially compared to Harty).  I question Dorsey’s ability to use either of those guys atm.   I didn’t like a handful of Dorsey’s calls.  I didn’t think the OL was getting much movement in the run game in the first half.  2 offensive TDs to 3 FGs- should the the other way around

 

If you’ve been on this board awhile you should know that the people that are focusing “most” on the bad, do the same thing every week…… it’s who they are.  Common knowledge and expected imo. 

The O-line did pretty good I think given the competition they were up against managing to keep Josh clean all game and managing to get the run game going eventually is pretty decent, if they'd just been able to run on them all day and protect Josh against that front it'd have been a pretty incredible performance.

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, ngbills said:

Wilson had his best game of the season vs us and passer rating of 81.4

Jimmy G was a 68.9 and his game was below average.

Howell at 41.5 stunk and drives the average down a ton. Was easily his worst game of the season. 

What collective passer rating does that individual qb ratings don't is factor in negative sack yardage into the rating (which is the way it should be). The Bills have 12 sacks for 68 negative yards. The Commanders' team passer rating was 35.1. The Jets team passer rating factor in a Rogers incompletion and 24 sack yards was 73.3. 

[HeHateMe]

Love the defense getting after it.  Not going to complain too much but I'll nitpick the offense.  First down was terrible aside from the play to Gabe.  Need to see more Kincaid and not 1 yard passes.  Less Gabe, more Sherfield also.

[NewEra]

4 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

The O-line did pretty good I think given the competition they were up against managing to keep Josh clean all game and managing to get the run game going eventually is pretty decent, if they'd just been able to run on them all day and protect Josh against that front it'd have been a pretty incredible performance.

For sure.  Our pass protection was amazing.  I don’t think Josh got touched all game.  
 

Has anyone rewatched and found out how many times we used the TEs and RBs to help?  Iirc, I think we used 6 offensive lineman on a handful of occasions as well.  Get Josh ample protection and we should roll

[ColoradoBills]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Bizarre Bills defensive stat juxtaposition:

 

2nd in points allowed, 2nd in yards allowed, 1st in turnovers forced, 3rd in passing yards allowed, 6th in net yards per passing attempt, and ... 32nd in yards per rush given up (5.9 ypc).

 

The most telling stat, however: 

Bills team passer rating: 90.3

Opponents' collective team passer rating: 54.0

 

That differential of 35.7 is massive, and passer rating differential is the best predictive stat of all with regard to aligning with winning and losing games.

 

Of course, they've faced some pretty bad quarterbacking so far ...

 

McDermott's D has given up a good number of long runs.  It's also stuffed the run a good number of times.

It's a passing league and it seems to me McDermott defends that first.  Giving up a couple of chunk running plays a game doesn't cripple the D.

It does "skew" the numbers in "yard per rush" but ultimately the defensive scheme is to limit the TOTAL yards against and TOTAL points against.

 

There has been a number of opponent drives that ran the ball on 1st and 2nd and were left with a 3rd and long(ish).  The 3rd resulted in a punt.

Your post is a prime example how a certain stat, while looking horrible, is not an issue when taken in context to the overall play.

 

All that said I will just have to accept all the "McDermott's D sucks against the run" in GDTs every time an opposing RB rips a 30-yard run.

It's just the price of doing business for the D, plus most of those runs can come down to a well schemed D just missing a gap or tackle.

 

 

[dave mcbride]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

McDermott's D has given up a good number of long runs.  It's also stuffed the run a good number of times.

It's a passing league and it seems to me McDermott defends that first.  Giving up a couple of chunk running plays a game doesn't cripple the D.

It does "skew" the numbers in "yard per rush" but ultimately the defensive scheme is to limit the TOTAL yards against and TOTAL points against.

 

There has been a number of opponent drives that ran the ball on 1st and 2nd and were left with a 3rd and long(ish).  The 3rd resulted in a punt.

Your post is a prime example how a certain stat, while looking horrible, is not an issue when taken in context to the overall play.

 

All that said I will just have to accept all the "McDermott's D sucks against the run" in GDTs every time an opposing RB rips a 30-yard run.

It's just the price of doing business for the D, plus most of those runs can come down to a well schemed D just missing a gap or tackle.

 

 

I don't actually disagree with you. 

[ColoradoBills]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I don't actually disagree with you. 

 

Your "most telling stat" is the bottom line!

[SoTier]

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

We should ABSOLUTELY NOT be taking tips from the Raiders. That was an act of desperation by a loser team.

 

Truly dominant, winning teams dont need to do that stuff. Just line up and gain the 2 feet we need.

 

That's nonsense.    Throwing a downfield pass on third or fourth down and short is a classic play call.  I'm sure that both Bill Belichick and Andy Reid have had it in their playbooks for decades even if Mike McDaniel doesn't.

[dave mcbride]

5 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Your "most telling stat" is the bottom line!

It's the king of all NFL stats.

[DrDawkinstein]

6 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

That's nonsense.    Throwing a downfield pass on third or fourth down and short is a classic play call.  I'm sure that both Bill Belichick and Andy Reid have had it in their playbooks for decades even if Mike McDaniel doesn't.

 

3rd down, sure. But both plays in discussion were on 4th down. 4th down you line up and push for 2 feet.

 

Especially if you want to take a deep shot on 3rd and short. You do that only if you know you are going for it on 4th with a sneak.

[Realist]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Lining up in shotgun on 4th and 6 inches should happen 0.000000% of the time

Exactly, I don't even mind the pass. It's the fact that it was out of shotgun. If you decide to run the ball, you're already 4 yards behind the first down marker.

[ColoradoBills]

12 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

It's the king of all NFL stats.

 

Other than points for and against, I agree.

[ngbills]

Someone posted the rushing yards per carry. I have no idea why Wash did not try to run the ball. You look at the first few drives or even the entire first half when the game was still close. The first drive had two runs for 7 and 5 yards, yet they threw on 6 of 8 plays. The next they go out and its run, two passes and punt. The next drive is 1 run not including he end around in 8 plays. Then 3 straight passes ending with an int. Lastly a 10 yard run to end the. So they essentially had 4 drives and gave Robinson the rock 5 times for 20 yards in what was mostly a close game. Too little too late when they come out and have more success in the second half running it 5 times for 46 yards on the first drive that still ends in an int when they go back to passing in the end zone. Next drive they run twice for 6 and 13 yards before passing it 4 straight plays again. Meanwhile its still only a 16-0 game...I have no clue why Wash thought they had Mahomes back at QB. If they just ran the ball this is likely a much closer game. 

[PromoTheRobot]

18 hours ago, kkim0904 said:

Defense did created 5 turnovers (one for touchdown) and 9 sacks.  We could not blow them out until 4Q.

 

Look at it the other way. We didn't need to blow them out so we played conservatively. We're always saying we want Josh to avoid turnovers but get mad when he does.

[Ralonzo]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

Milano & Bernard look like structured chaos out there with their speed, instincts, coverage ability and violent short area burst.. and we have another one being developed behind them in Dorian Williams. 

 

Was just thinking how Dorian looked far better this preseason as a rookie than Bernard ever did last year. Even more instinctive and violent. Figured Bernard would be the placeholder till they could get Dorian coached up, but...

[Warcodered]