All-22 Grades for Bills/Colts (The Athletic)

[PetermansRedemption]

I’m not familiar with this years draft class yet, but I wouldn’t mind going DT, OL, RB or DT, RB, OL. A young DT that can actually

play is sorely needed. 

[dave mcbride]

26 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Phillips is going to join Ford as one of our draft misses.  Part of it, of course, is lack of playing experience.  He's a 4th year player, with the experience of a guy just starting his 3rd year.  But still, you expect more from him at this point.

 

That's how it goes - a GM who hits on half his draft picks, even in the first 3 rounds, is doing pretty well. 

 

 

He had 6 receptions on 10 targets.  I don't have the stomach to go back and find all 4 of the incompletions to see if I feel they were all balls he should have caught.  I know I felt at least 2 of them were "c'mon Dawson you gotta catch those"

 

Can you tell me where you are finding this info?  Not doubting you, just interested.

 

The thing about adjusted stats is, all QB have drops.

Mark Gaughan wrote the following yesterday, btw. I thought it looked a bit short too, although maybe it could have been caught. Regardless, the ball wasn't where it needed to be if he was going to make a play: 

 

"Running backs (2.5): Too bad the Bills couldn’t have stayed within 10 points of the Colts and employed the running game more. Matt Breida had two more runs of 10-plus yards (they went for 28 and 16). He needs to stay in the active lineup. The Bills had a few nice pin-and-pull run plays. Maybe going to that more often, using the mobility of the line in space, can help take some pressure off Allen moving forward. After further review, Zach Moss didn’t drop the pass late in the second quarter. The throw was short."

 

PS - Happy Days posted this. SIS is what the WSJ was using for their piece on the struggles of Mahomes and Allen this season: 

 

Edited November 24, 2021 by dave mcbride

[HappyDays]

29 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

If you rewatch the game Allen had a really good first half his int was the result of forcing a 3-18 throw to Gabe Davis and Gabe was interfered with anyway.

 

It wasn't a forced throw. It was the correct read based on the leverage of the safety.

 

 

I don't know how Joe graded this play, but Allen threw the ball where it needed to go. Davis did not get separation and both DBs made good plays (arguably PI on the CB though).

[BarleyNY]

41 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I didn't post the full snippet but Joe actually says the same thing, that Phillips kept fighting even when the game was out of reach. You can see why the staff loves his character. Unfortunately that isn't enough in the pros. He is too limited athletically to hold up in the trenches.

 

Most people on this board missed how important Star was to this run defense. The narrative that he was overpaid and invisible in 2019 was wrong. Last year our run defense was awful all year long. That wasn't a coincidence. 

The thing is - Star wasn’t playing the run very well this season.  He didn’t play it well two years ago either.  Or really since he’s been here.  And he didn’t take up many double teams in the run game either.  But he was good rushing the passer this season.  And two seasons ago he did not get much pass pressure but he was double teamed when offenses pass protect a lot.  Like a surprisingly high percentage of the time.

 

Still, he’s our best option at 1 tech this season.  I have not been a fan of his contract, though the restructure helped some.  He’s not going to fix our run defense woes, but he is better than Phillips and he may actually be an asset rushing the passer.  I can’t believe I just wrote that last part, but it’s true.  Maybe losing some weight was the best thing he could’ve done for himself.  Of course I have no idea how he is doing health wise with Covid.  If it hits him hard, then he won’t be back to 100% this season.  Here’s hoping he gets lucky with that. 

[Freddie's Dead]

51 minutes ago, finn said:

He gave Knox a B+, despite four drops that I saw. What's up with that? 

 

No way Dropsome should have gotten a B+.  He did have 4 drops, so even though he led the Bills in receiving, I wouldn't give him better than a C-.

[Jay_Fixit]

2 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

Gross.  Phillips needs to go

So does Moss.

[GoBills808]

27 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

The thing is - Star wasn’t playing the run very well this season.  He didn’t play it well two years ago either.  Or really since he’s been here.  And he didn’t take up many double teams in the run game either.  But he was good rushing the passer this season.  And two seasons ago he did not get much pass pressure but he was double teamed when offenses pass protect a lot.  Like a surprisingly high percentage of the time.

 

Still, he’s our best option at 1 tech this season.  I have not been a fan of his contract, though the restructure helped some.  He’s not going to fix our run defense woes, but he is better than Phillips and he may actually be an asset rushing the passer.  I can’t believe I just wrote that last part, but it’s true.  Maybe losing some weight was the best thing he could’ve done for himself.  Of course I have no idea how he is doing health wise with Covid.  If it hits him hard, then he won’t be back to 100% this season.  Here’s hoping he gets lucky with that. 

Simply wrong. 

[78thealltimegreat]

54 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

It wasn't a forced throw. It was the correct read based on the leverage of the safety.

 

 

I don't know how Joe graded this play, but Allen threw the ball where it needed to go. Davis did not get separation and both DBs made good plays (arguably PI on the CB though).

Yeh of the receivers in the route only Davis had any kind of inkling to be open and it seems he did absolutely nothing to try to gain separation 

[GoBills808]

2 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

Yeh of the receivers in the route only Davis had any kind of inkling to be open and it seems he did absolutely nothing to try to gain separation 

It’s part of his game that needs some work

 

He’s still pretty green

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

1 hour ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

I wanted to avoid using "confirmation bias" to explain Joe B's score, but I'm running out of alternatives.

He always loves him some Jerry Hughes . But, according to some  numbers I saw he and Addison were just Giant liabilities against the run especially.

[Solomon Grundy]

3 hours ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

I don't have the Athletic, so I can't read Joe B's review, but I don't get it.  Unless Joe knows the plays and somehow Ford blew his assignments, I can only go by what I saw, and I did not see Ford getting beat on run or pass blocks.  The guys he was blocking did not make the tackles or exert pressures. I only counted two pressures, how many did Joe B have?  What specifically did Joe B say Ford had problems with? 

 

I don't get it.  I had two pressures for Ford.  I didn't see what Joe B saw.

I think Joe might be relative of Mr Magoo

[ticketssince61]

2 hours ago, TC in St. Louis said:

They should move up and draft that monster DT from Georgia.  Davis.  

 

So we should use our 1st and 2nd round picks on one player?

[TC in St. Louis]

I don't know how much it would cost, or how high we'd have to move.  But that guy is an immovable object, and is a beast.  Plug and play for years.  Just have to see how the draft plays out.  We could be picking anywhere from 19 to 32.

[FilthyBeast]

It's just amazing that the film analysis continues to show the same worthless players costing this team yet they refuse to release, bench, etc.

 

Why wait until the season is officially toast before you give guys like Jamil Douglas, Ryan Bates, Brandin Bryant, etc more playing time? Yes we joke about this coaching staff being clueless but if they are realizing the same things as fans and media, again what do they have to lose at this point and it sends a message to the rest of the team by making examples out of poor performing veterans/players.

[Reader]

40 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

It's just amazing that the film analysis continues to show the same worthless players costing this team yet they refuse to release, bench, etc.

 

Why wait until the season is officially toast before you give guys like Jamil Douglas, Ryan Bates, Brandin Bryant, etc more playing time? Yes we joke about this coaching staff being clueless but if they are realizing the same things as fans and media, again what do they have to lose at this point and it sends a message to the rest of the team by making examples out of poor performing veterans/players.

 

We're 6-4 in contention for the playoffs. If we were 2-8 this would have merit.

[Chaos]

4 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Interesting take on Tremaine vs. Klein. I usually think of Tremaine as a guy who moves effortlessly sideline to sideline and in pass coverage, not as a "run stopper." But Klein getting faked out and lacking the athleticism to recover and get back into the play is something I hadn't thought of. Yes, we really missed Star and Tremaine last week. (Probably Zimmer too, if only because he would've kept Butler off the field.)

Edmunds would have held some of the 14 yard runs to like 11 yards. 

[LABILLBACKER]

5 hours ago, BuffaloRebound said:

So our run game has been bad all year, but for some reason Breida has been glued to the bench until the last 2 games.  Kind of says it all about the offensive coaching staff.  

I think the offensive staff struggles more making personnel decisions. Of course the Peterman debacle is well documented. They took forever dumping him. Players like Breida, Davis and Bates see minimal snaps? Is Kumerow and Gilliam's roster spot really necessary? We all know we probably can't fix the OL issue this year. But there are ways to salvage this season. Stop force feeding the same underperforming players into the lineup. Give others a look. You might be pleasantly surprised. 

[Utah John]

So two of the biggest liabilities on the team -- Philips and Ford -- were on the field because two starters -- Star and Brown -- refused to be vaccinated.  

 

The fact that Klein played because Edmunds was hurt is a normal aspect of football -- a good starter goes down with an injury, and his replacement isn't as good.

 

The fact that Star and Brown weren't there just speaks to ignorance and selfishness.

[Utah John]

21 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I think the offensive staff struggles more making personnel decisions. Of course the Peterman debacle is well documented. They took forever dumping him. Players like Breida, Davis and Bates see minimal snaps? Is Kumerow and Gilliam's roster spot really necessary? We all know we probably can't fix the OL issue this year. But there are ways to salvage this season. Stop force feeding the same underperforming players into the lineup. Give others a look. You might be pleasantly surprised. 

Kumerow is on the roster because WRs are so important to the offense.  The Bills have been lucky in that none of the WRs has been out due to injury, and only Beasley has been hurt at all.  If any one of Diggs, Sanders, or Beasley was out, we'd be glad we have Kumerow.

 

Gilliam.  Hmmm.  If the O line is having trouble pass blocking, shouldn't a FB or blocking TE be helpful?  And yet Gilliam is never mentioned as a solution to that problem.  I think I agree with you about Gilliam.

[Utah John]

4 hours ago, PetermansRedemption said:

I’m not familiar with this years draft class yet, but I wouldn’t mind going DT, OL, RB or DT, RB, OL. A young DT that can actually

play is sorely needed. 

Let me point out that this scenario means we'd have four first-round picks on the DL:  Hughes, Oliver, new guy, and Rousseau.  That new guy had better be an unstoppable force to justify that much investment in one position.  

[BuffaloMatt]

5 hours ago, Son of a K-Gun said:

Wow, it feels like Star is closer to 43 than 33.

Covid years are like dog years.

[CincyBillsFan]

7 hours ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said:

They don't need to take a guard round 1, unless Quentin Nelson clone is available in the 20s.

Just saw Bills had 7 credited drops in the game. JA was 21/35 with the drops. 28/35 is not bad.😉

And 3 of those drops happened in the 3rd quarter on drives that the Bills either went 3 & out or didn't score on.

 

On the Cowherd show today they had Greg Cosell on for 15 minutes.  He talked about a lot of what happened over the weekend especially with respect to QBing.  His comments about Allen and the Bills were along the Ines of:

 

"The Bills have no running game and they don't try to establish one.  They are one dimensional in the worst way.  They are terrible at pass blocking. Their game plan requires Allen to be special on EVERY play in EVERY game."

 

Cowherd agreed that this was crazy and not sustainable.

 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, quinnearlysghost88 said:

So weird, John Fina loved Phillips effort and said he was one of the few guys who didn’t stop fighting. 

Oh yeah, Harrison has great effort and motor, he just never gets to anyone. He's awful, as is Butler and Addison. Jettison these guys this spring. Stop rotating bad players and put your A team in there. 

[LABILLBACKER]

9 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

And 3 of those drops happened in the 3rd quarter on drives that the Bills either went 3 & out or didn't score on.

 

On the Cowherd show today they had Greg Cosell on for 15 minutes.  He talked about a lot of what happened over the weekend especially with respect to QBing.  His comments about Allen and the Bills were along the Ines of:

 

"The Bills have no running game and they don't try to establish one.  They are one dimensional in the worst way.  They are terrible at pass blocking. Their game plan requires Allen to be special on EVERY play in EVERY game."

 

Cowherd agreed that this was crazy and not sustainable.

 

 

That's why Josh's game rated out a little higher than some thought. Knox had 4 drops which hurt and a little set back for him. Cosell and Cowherd are 100% right. What Josh did last year literally carrying this team on his back for 13 wins was herculean but it was never sustainable in the long term without a run game. And this year Dabs wasn't clever enough to adjust to the inevitable defensive changes Josh was likely to face. 

[Old Coot]

Last year the O was successful because it got many explosive plays.

 

This year teams are playing us with 2 deep safeties to limit explosive plays.

 

By taking away the deep and some intermediate throws Bills are forced to reply on short passes and the occasional run to work downfield.

 

That can take 10-12 plays to score. To do that you need to execute consistently and the Bills are not close to doing that.  On many plays there is poor execution from the OL to the WRs dropping balls forcing a punt.

[Einstein]

11 hours ago, NewEra said:

After reading @Freddie's Dead Ford write up, I was left thinking Ford wasn’t too bad…….than how does Joe B give Ford a D+?  Fina didn’t speak nicely of him either.  So which is it?  Did he play ok?  Terrible?  Likely somewhere in between…..but how far in between?
 

 

 

I give Buscaglia’s grades about as much merit as what my neighbor thinks about the game.

 

I realize that’s its hip to look at the ALL-22 (I do too) and try to analyze an NFL play, but Buscaglia has zero credentials. He never played at even the college level. Never coached. Never assisted to my knowledge. He’s just another fan giving his opinion. 

 

Long story short, I advice everyone to take every grade and analysis from every reporter with a grain of salt.

[Reader]

24 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

I give Buscaglia’s grades about as much merit as what my neighbor thinks about the game.

 

I realize that’s its hip to look at the ALL-22 (I do too) and try to analyze an NFL play, but Buscaglia has zero credentials. He never played at even the college level. Never coached. Never assisted to my knowledge. He’s just another fan giving his opinion. 

 

Long story short, I advice everyone to take every grade and analysis from every reporter with a grain of salt.

 

I think almost everyone who is looking at this, is already measuring how much to trust this.

 

The thing though is, even if it is a grain of salt, he is putting in effort. I trust our TBD Edmund's report more than a generic poster here because the poster of the Edmund's report is putting in time and effort which is more than what most here do.

Edited November 25, 2021 by Reader

[Doc Brown]

13 hours ago, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

Didn’t the Ford report say there was nothing to justify the hate and he played well?

He was the easy scapegoat against the Jags but he performed better than every o-lineman but Morse (which isn't saying much in that game).  He's been terrible this year though for the most part.  It's Beane's biggest draft whiff.

[Scott7975]

15 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Phillips is going to join Ford as one of our draft misses.  Part of it, of course, is lack of playing experience.  He's a 4th year player, with the experience of a guy just starting his 3rd year.  But still, you expect more from him at this point.

 

That's how it goes - a GM who hits on half his draft picks, even in the first 3 rounds, is doing pretty well. 

 

 

He had 6 receptions on 10 targets.  I don't have the stomach to go back and find all 4 of the incompletions to see if I feel they were all balls he should have caught.  I know I felt at least 2 of them were "c'mon Dawson you gotta catch those"

 

Can you tell me where you are finding this info?  Not doubting you, just interested.

 

The thing about adjusted stats is, all QB have drops.

 

I dont know if there were 7.  I remember 4 that I was pissed about and all 4 were drive killers.  Having 7, if true, is not common in one game.

[Scott7975]

5 hours ago, Old Coot said:

Last year the O was successful because it got many explosive plays.

 

This year teams are playing us with 2 deep safeties to limit explosive plays.

 

By taking away the deep and some intermediate throws Bills are forced to reply on short passes and the occasional run to work downfield.

 

That can take 10-12 plays to score. To do that you need to execute consistently and the Bills are not close to doing that.  On many plays there is poor execution from the OL to the WRs dropping balls forcing a punt.

 

dont forget the penalties

[Utah John]

13 hours ago, Utah John said:

Let me point out that this scenario means we'd have four first-round picks on the DL:  Hughes, Oliver, new guy, and Rousseau.  That new guy had better be an unstoppable force to justify that much investment in one position.  

I just realized the Bills already have four first-round picks on the DL.  Star Lotuleilei was picked by the Panthers in the first round.

 

 

[vincec]

20 hours ago, finn said:

The bummer here is that it looks like the Bills might need to draft a one-technique d-tackle with their first-round pick, leaving guard to the second round at best. They also will need at least one wide receiver. Let's hope Beane doesn't draft another Ford over another Metcalf this time. 

Depending on what happens with Sanders and Beasley, WR might be #1

[dave mcbride]

21 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Phillips is going to join Ford as one of our draft misses.  Part of it, of course, is lack of playing experience.  He's a 4th year player, with the experience of a guy just starting his 3rd year.  But still, you expect more from him at this point.

 

That's how it goes - a GM who hits on half his draft picks, even in the first 3 rounds, is doing pretty well. 

 

 

He had 6 receptions on 10 targets.  I don't have the stomach to go back and find all 4 of the incompletions to see if I feel they were all balls he should have caught.  I know I felt at least 2 of them were "c'mon Dawson you gotta catch those"

 

Can you tell me where you are finding this info?  Not doubting you, just interested.

 

The thing about adjusted stats is, all QB have drops.

Thought you might be interested in this bit from Mark Gaughan’s piece in the BN today:

 

”When is a drop not a drop? Sports Info Solutions credited the Bills with seven drops vs. the Colts. Pro Football Focus had six. The Buffalo News had four. Every ball a receiver gets his fingers on is not a drop. The pass late in the second quarter for Zack Moss was too short. The slant for Cole Beasley on a slant early in the third quarter was too high. Nevertheless, the Bills had only 10 drops the previous nine games combined.”

 

 

[SWATeam]

3 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Thought you might be interested in this bit from Mark Gaughan’s piece in the BN today:

 

”When is a drop not a drop? Sports Info Solutions credited the Bills with seven drops vs. the Colts. Pro Football Focus had six. The Buffalo News had four. Every ball a receiver gets his fingers on is not a drop. The pass late in the second quarter for Zack Moss was too short. The slant for Cole Beasley on a slant early in the third quarter was too high. Nevertheless, the Bills had only 10 drops the previous nine games combined.”

 

 

I thought the Moss pass was clearly a drop and the Beasley one was clearly not- that was a rocket where had to go above the rim to even get hands on it.

 

Josh was clearly having some issues.  Haven't seen him abandoning any touch and just throwing rockets like that in a while.