Where Did NFL Coaches & Evaluators Place Josh Allen Among QB Tiers?

[JohnNord]

The annual QB Rankings were released in an article from The Athletic.   For the rankings 50 NFL coaches and execs place starting QB’s into 5 different tiers.  
 

Josh Allen was their 6th highest rated QB and the highest member of Tier 2.  He fell just out of Tier 1 with the biggest knock on him being sustainability and fumbles.  He actually received 20 Tier 1 votes which puts him just outside of that level.  Overall he received 20 Tier 1 votes and 30 Tier 2 votes.  The next closest was DeShaun Watson who edged him with 26 Tier 1 votes, 23 Tier 2 votes, and 1 Tier 3 vote!.  
 

You can read the full analysis in the links below:

2021 NFL Quarterback Tiers: 50 coaches and evaluators rank the league’s starters 

https://theathletic.com/2727336/2021/07/28/2021-nfl-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-leagues-starters/?source=user_shared_article

 

A lot of positive comments on Allen.  Here’s what the skeptical GM and Coaches had to say: 

 

Quote

Skeptical takes on Allen note that he still makes mistakes unbecoming of top-tier quarterbacks, including an 18-yard sack/fumble with the game on the line at Indianapolis in the wild-card round. The Bills barely won that game, scored 10 points on offense against Baltimore the next week and then lost by two touchdowns at Kansas City.

 

“He still has to keep getting better, and I think he will, as a passer in the tight situations,” a former head coach said. “The gotta-have-it type plays. You gotta drop back, sit in the pocket and make throws. He reverted back in the playoff game, took a 30-yard sack (18 yards) spinning around with the ball and doing *****. That is what happens. Now, he needs to take the next step.”

 

A defensive coordinator who placed Brady and Wilson in Tier 2 said Allen isn’t nearly advanced enough as a pure pocket passer or reader of defenses to belong in Tier 1.

“He perplexes me because in my career I have not seen someone go from as inaccurate as he was in college to making this kind of transition,” a personnel director said. “I need to see some sustainability before placing him in the top tier.”

 

For those interested, the Tier 1 QB’s along with the vote count were:

 

1. Aaron Rogers (50)

2. Patrick Mahomes (50)

3. Tom Brady (41,9)

4. Russell Wilson (40,10)

5. DeShaun Watson (26,23,1)

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by JohnNord

[ProcessAccepted]

Thanks for posting. Good read even if I know these rankings do not really mean anything.

 

What I always find perplexing is how some of these guys place so much emphasis on one play for one player (JA's "30-yard sack (18 yards)") and nothing about Wilson's red zone interception against the Bills. JA is a guy who takes risks and granted some don't work out but the "wow plays" are far more plentiful.

 

 

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, ProcessAccepted said:

Thanks for posting. Good read even if I know these rankings do not really mean anything.

 

What I always find perplexing is how some of these guys place so much emphasis on one play for one player (JA's "30-yard sack (18 yards)") and nothing about Wilson's red zone interception against the Bills. JA is a guy who takes risks and granted some don't work out but the "wow plays" are far more plentiful.

 

 

 

Allen makes plays other QBs wouldn't even make in their wildest fantasies in their dreams at night because they didn't even know those type of plays were humanly possible.

[Boxcar]

Didn't Mahomes set a record for lost yardage on a sack last season?

 

Boy, the selective memory is interesting. Who is taking Brady, Wilson or Watson over Allen next year? Did it not matter that Brady threw three interceptions in the second half against GB with the game on the line?

 

I don't care much about the rankings but the thought process is interesting.

 

Lol yup. Maybe this is the "30 yard sack" that guy was thinking of: https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2020/12/14/chiefs-dolphins-patrick-mahomes-sack-video

Edited July 28, 2021 by Boxcar

[JohnNord]

18 minutes ago, ProcessAccepted said:

Thanks for posting. Good read even if I know these rankings do not really mean anything.

 

What I always find perplexing is how some of these guys place so much emphasis on one play for one player (JA's "30-yard sack (18 yards)") and nothing about Wilson's red zone interception against the Bills. JA is a guy who takes risks and granted some don't work out but the "wow plays" are far more plentiful.

 

 

Yeah it means nothing.  Some players have risen and dropped drastically.  I think it does show that the majority of NFL evaluators have a favorable opinion of Allen (for now) and I feel it bodes well for the future.

[Stank_Nasty]

I don’t have a huge issue with him being number 6 on the list. But I have a LARGE issue with him being categorized with Qb’s that don’t regularly carry their team. 
 

It’s been argued by plenty in the media that no team in the NFL relied more on one player than the Bills did. And relying on that player got them to 13-3 and in a title game. 

[Inigo Montoya]

I think Allen belongs in the 1st Tier, but if someone wants to make the argument that he's had a single great season and needs to do it again before he is considered elite, I can understand that line of thinking. 

 

Personally, I don't think last year was lightning in a bottle for Josh, I think it was the first gusts of a hurricane.

 

 

[YattaOkasan]

3 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

I don’t have a huge issue with him being number 6 on the list. But I have a LARGE issue with him being categorized with Qb’s that don’t regularly carry their team. 
 

It’s been argued by plenty in the media that no team in the NFL relied more on one player than the Bills did. And relying on that player got them to 13-3 and in a title game. 

To that point I found the focus on the negative play of the colts game very interesting.  Yes that one play was bad, but they are not in the game let alone winning it if he doesn't play  outstanding the rest of the game.  I honestly thought the game was over when we went up 2TDs (!) in the 4th quarter.  Our defense really struggled.

[Stank_Nasty]

I think it’s worth mentioning that Allen got 20 tier 1 votes and the next closest qb in his same tier was 4. 
 

they noted the gap between him and Watson(tier 1), is much smaller than the gap between him and the next tier 2 qb(jackson) 

[unbillievable]

Allen won't reach tier 1 until he gets the Bills to the Superbowl.

or

Improves on his stats from last year. 80% completions. 60 TDs, and 6000 yards.

 

...because he has to fight against the media continuing to cling to their Draft analysis.

Edited July 28, 2021 by unbillievable

[mushypeaches]

 

There's no way that Wilson should be ranked above Allen.  Yes, there's the sustained success element that Allen doesn't have, but I watched the Bills-Seahawks game last year, and I'm pretty sure who the better QB was that day, and will be this season

 

[No_Matter_What]

2 minutes ago, unbillievable said:

Allen won't reach tier 1 until he gets the Bills to the Superbowl.

or

Improves on his stats from last year. 80% completions. 60 TDs, and 6000 yards.

 

Allen will reach Tier 1 in almost everybody's mind if he can replicate last season imo. People who don't put him there don't believe he will sustain that level of play for more seasons imo.

[Boxcar]

1 minute ago, mushypeaches said:

 

There's no way that Wilson should be ranked above Allen.  Yes, there's the sustained success element that Allen doesn't have, but I watched the Bills-Seahawks game last year, and I'm pretty sure who the better QB was that day, and will be this season

 

Just wait for the narrative over the first 6 weeks where people exclaim how they simply can't believe that Wilson has never received an MVP vote before the Seahawks' offense falls off a cliff.

[Doc]

Dumb. He’s clearly near the top of tier 1. 

[BillsFan619]

59 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

I think Allen belongs in the 1st Tier, but if someone wants to make the argument that he's had a single great season and needs to do it again before he is considered elite, I can understand that line of thinking. 

 

Personally, I don't think last year was lightning in a bottle for Josh, I think it was the first gusts of a hurricane.

 

 

“I think it was the first gusts of a hurricane”. Very well said, Inigo. Love that thought.

 

Thanks for sharing. Go Bills!

[Big Turk]

Apparently it's OK that Wilson disappears for huge chunks of games and parts of seasons as well...

8 minutes ago, Doc said:

Dumb. He’s clearly near the top of tier 1. 

 

I don't think some people are convinced that was real...they want to see it again before they buy in.

[BillsFan619]

59 minutes ago, unbillievable said:

Allen won't reach tier 1 until he gets the Bills to the Superbowl.

or

Improves on his stats from last year. 80% completions. 60 TDs, and 6000 yards.

 

...because he has to fight against the media continuing to cling to their Draft analysis.

I definitely see what you’re saying. Analysts often cling to their draft analysis way too long. And, I thought that many held on to their narratives about Allen for too long for awhile.

 

That said, I don’t think that’s the case with Allen anymore. I think most have warmed to him. I believe he should be in tier one but most just want to see sustained success.

 

Four out of the five top tier one QBs do have Super Bowl titles. So, it could be that they want their tier one QBs to at least have been to a Super Bowl but I don’t think it has anything to do with narratives anymore. There may be a few that still feel that way, but overall, I believe he’s beyond that now.

[BuffaloBill]

4 hours ago, JohnNord said:

The annual QB Rankings were released in an article from The Athletic.   For the rankings 50 NFL coaches and execs place starting QB’s into 5 different tiers.  
 

Josh Allen was their 6th highest rated QB and the highest member of Tier 2.  He fell just out of Tier 1 with the biggest knock on him being sustainability and fumbles.  He actually received 20 Tier 1 votes which puts him just outside of that level.  Overall he received 20 Tier 1 votes and 30 Tier 2 votes.  The next closest was DeShaun Watson who edged him with 26 Tier 1 votes, 23 Tier 2 votes, and 1 Tier 3 vote!.  
 

You can read the full analysis in the links below:

2021 NFL Quarterback Tiers: 50 coaches and evaluators rank the league’s starters 

https://theathletic.com/2727336/2021/07/28/2021-nfl-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-leagues-starters/?source=user_shared_article

 

A lot of positive comments on Allen.  Here’s what the skeptical GM and Coaches had to say: 

 

 

For those interested, the Tier 1 QB’s along with the vote count were:

 

1. Aaron Rogers (50)

2. Patrick Mahomes (50)

3. Tom Brady (41,9)

4. Russell Wilson (40,10)

5. DeShaun Watson (26,23,1)

 

Interesting take. I said in a different thread a few days ago that JA did need to take a step forward in the post season. He was not at his best in those games and the comments here reflect that. (BTW this is not a criticism of JA on my part.  I look forward to him taking steps forward - he will continue to do so.)

[Freddie's Dead]

What bull####.  They're just pissed that they didn't pick him and now he beats the ***** outta them.  Josh Allen is the best QB in the NFL. We just need to get better around him.

[JohnNord]

3 hours ago, Stank_Nasty said:

I think it’s worth mentioning that Allen got 20 tier 1 votes and the next closest qb in his same tier was 4. 
 

they noted the gap between him and Watson(tier 1), is much smaller than the gap between him and the next tier 2 qb(jackson) 

That was the exact quote in the article. He’s very close to Tier 1

[Doc]

3 hours ago, Big Turk said:

I don't think some people are convinced that was real...they want to see it again before they buy in.

No other non-established QB had close to as good of a season.  If it were a result of the pandemic, many other QBs would have look really good. 

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

Who the hell gave Jimmy Garoppolo the tier 1 vote???

Edited July 28, 2021 by HereComesTheReignAgain

[colin]

honestly, for the way they do these things, i think it's fair.  they remember allen falling apart in his first playoff game (obv not the whole story, and his roster did worse than he did, but that's what it is), and his bad stats out the gate, and use that to think well his third year might be a fluke and he still makes mistakes (obviously pure bias, given that everyone makes mistakes, the 3 awful picks brady threw against GB was just a chance to show his great leadership).

 

the bottom line, he played as well or better than any qb last season w the exceptions of a aron, and will show exactly what he's made of this season (gold, he's made of solid gold by the way).

 

 

[LeGOATski]

41 minutes ago, HereComesTheReignAgain said:

Who the hell gave Jimmy Garoppolo the tier 1 vote???

So, he was basically voted as a tier 1. There just weren't enough pre-established slots.

[billsrul120]

5 hours ago, mushypeaches said:

 

There's no way that Wilson should be ranked above Allen.  Yes, there's the sustained success element that Allen doesn't have, but I watched the Bills-Seahawks game last year, and I'm pretty sure who the better QB was that day, and will be this season

 

Yea, looking at the stats as well, Wilson has never had a year as good as Allen had last year in terms of total touchdowns, total yards or completion percentage.  If he's placed above Allen it's not because of recent performance but holding on to old narratives. 

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, HereComesTheReignAgain said:

Who the hell gave Jimmy Garoppolo the tier 1 vote???

 

Billicheat who wanted to keep him but Krafty would not allow him.

[Inigo Montoya]

2 hours ago, billsrul120 said:

Yea, looking at the stats as well, Wilson has never had a year as good as Allen had last year in terms of total touchdowns, total yards or completion percentage.  If he's placed above Allen it's not because of recent performance but holding on to old narratives. 

 

Can you imagine the narrative if Allen threw a Super Bowl losing interception at the goal line?

 

 

[billsrul120]

19 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

Can you imagine the narrative if Allen threw a Super Bowl losing interception at the goal line?

 

 

Dont come at me like that he better run it in himself if we are ever there

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, mushypeaches said:

 

There's no way that Wilson should be ranked above Allen.  Yes, there's the sustained success element that Allen doesn't have, but I watched the Bills-Seahawks game last year, and I'm pretty sure who the better QB was that day, and will be this season

 

I would rank Josh 4 behind Mahomes, Rodgers & Brady. I would slide Wilson and Watson to 5/6 based on Russell's age and Watson's pending legal issues/availability. Josh has been incrementally improving every year and I see nothing stopping that trend. He'll throw 40+ with at least 5-6 rushing tds thrown in for good measure. And with a 17 game season, 5000 is very attainable. Josh won't be #2 until Brady & Rodgers retire. And by the time that happens Herbert will be #3.

[Solomon Grundy]

10 hours ago, JohnNord said:

The annual QB Rankings were released in an article from The Athletic.   For the rankings 50 NFL coaches and execs place starting QB’s into 5 different tiers.  
 

Josh Allen was their 6th highest rated QB and the highest member of Tier 2.  He fell just out of Tier 1 with the biggest knock on him being sustainability and fumbles.  He actually received 20 Tier 1 votes which puts him just outside of that level.  Overall he received 20 Tier 1 votes and 30 Tier 2 votes.  The next closest was DeShaun Watson who edged him with 26 Tier 1 votes, 23 Tier 2 votes, and 1 Tier 3 vote!.  
 

You can read the full analysis in the links below:

2021 NFL Quarterback Tiers: 50 coaches and evaluators rank the league’s starters 

https://theathletic.com/2727336/2021/07/28/2021-nfl-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-leagues-starters/?source=user_shared_article

 

A lot of positive comments on Allen.  Here’s what the skeptical GM and Coaches had to say: 

 

 

For those interested, the Tier 1 QB’s along with the vote count were:

 

1. Aaron Rogers (50)

2. Patrick Mahomes (50)

3. Tom Brady (41,9)

4. Russell Wilson (40,10)

5. DeShaun Watson (26,23,1)

 

Beane can use this in contract negotiations 😎

[GoBills808]

I have no idea how someone could hold the Colts playoff game against Allen. He singlehandedly won that game.

[ganesh]

11 hours ago, Boxcar said:

Didn't Mahomes set a record for lost yardage on a sack last season?

 

Boy, the selective memory is interesting. Who is taking Brady, Wilson or Watson over Allen next year? Did it not matter that Brady threw three interceptions in the second half against GB with the game on the line?

 

I don't care much about the rankings but the thought process is interesting.

 

Lol yup. Maybe this is the "30 yard sack" that guy was thinking of: https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2020/12/14/chiefs-dolphins-patrick-mahomes-sack-video

I think the Exec is saying - I want to see this repeated and sustainable.   I think it is a fair ask.   The folks in Tier 1 list are all repeat performers.

 

Allen will silence all his critics with a similar performance this season

39 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I have no idea how someone could hold the Colts playoff game against Allen. He singlehandedly won that game.

+1

 

The drive he had right before half time is of stuff that legends make

[Hapless Bills Fan]

13 hours ago, Boxcar said:

Didn't Mahomes set a record for lost yardage on a sack last season?

 

Yes.  And Brady threw 3 picks against GB in the NFCCG

 

I’m like “whatever, I don’t care”

 

 

 

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

I have no idea how someone could hold the Colts playoff game against Allen. He singlehandedly won that game.

 

I can’t quite go there.  Our D had a couple epic stands.  But of course, if they didn’t get frogmarched backwards down the field they wouldn’t need to be so epic.

 

But yes, even if I don’t agree that he singlehandedly won that game, Allen is the primary reason we won and went on.

[machine gun kelly]

As mentioned cherry picking mistakes on one play ball. Another is not as significant as consistency.

 

I don’t see it unfair to place Allen 6th. When, not if Allen repeats this year, his status should go higher.  These coaches and administrators are biased as are we.

[machine gun kelly]

22 hours ago, JohnNord said:

The annual QB Rankings were released in an article from The Athletic.   For the rankings 50 NFL coaches and execs place starting QB’s into 5 different tiers.  
 

Josh Allen was their 6th highest rated QB and the highest member of Tier 2.  He fell just out of Tier 1 with the biggest knock on him being sustainability and fumbles.  He actually received 20 Tier 1 votes which puts him just outside of that level.  Overall he received 20 Tier 1 votes and 30 Tier 2 votes.  The next closest was DeShaun Watson who edged him with 26 Tier 1 votes, 23 Tier 2 votes, and 1 Tier 3 vote!.  
 

You can read the full analysis in the links below:

2021 NFL Quarterback Tiers: 50 coaches and evaluators rank the league’s starters 

https://theathletic.com/2727336/2021/07/28/2021-nfl-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-leagues-starters/?source=user_shared_article

 

A lot of positive comments on Allen.  Here’s what the skeptical GM and Coaches had to say: 

 

 

For those interested, the Tier 1 QB’s along with the vote count were:

 

1. Aaron Rogers (50)

2. Patrick Mahomes (50)

3. Tom Brady (41,9)

4. Russell Wilson (40,10)

5. DeShaun Watson (26,23,1)

 

John, thanks for sharing although I’m one if the many who don’t have a subscription.  You’ve listed 1-6 including Allen at 6.  Would you mind sharing 7-10 or farther if you feel like it.  Appreciate as always you’re thoughtful threads.

[JohnNord]

5 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

John, thanks for sharing although I’m one if the many who don’t have a subscription.  You’ve listed 1-6 including Allen at 6.  Would you mind sharing 7-10 or farther if you feel like it.  Appreciate as always you’re thoughtful threads.

sure here is the rest of Tier 2

 

7 - tie: Lamar Jackson (4, 38, 8 )

7-  tie: Matthew Stafford (4, 38, 3)

9: Dak Prescott (1, 41, 8 ) 

10: Justin Herbert (4, 37, 7, 2)

11: Matt Ryan (0, 32, 18 )

12: Kyler Murray (0, 30, 18, 2)

13: Ryan Tannehill (0, 27, 23)

14: Joe Burrow (0, 27, 17, 6)

 

[Boxcar]

9 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yes.  And Brady threw 3 picks against GB in the NFCCG

 

I’m like “whatever, I don’t care"

Sure, but the trend of inconsistent standards applied to Josh are very interesting.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

22 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

Sure, but the trend of inconsistent standards applied to Josh are very interesting.

 

I think a psychological phenomenon called  “confirmation bias” may be at work here.

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, JohnNord said:

sure here is the rest of Tier 2

 

7 - tie: Lamar Jackson (4, 38, 8 )

7-  tie: Matthew Stafford (4, 38, 3)

9: Dak Prescott (1, 41, 8 ) 

10: Justin Herbert (4, 37, 7, 2)

11: Matt Ryan (0, 32, 18 )

12: Kyler Murray (0, 30, 18, 2)

13: Ryan Tannehill (0, 27, 23)

14: Joe Burrow (0, 27, 17, 6)

 

You Da man Nordster.

[Stank_Nasty]

11 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I can’t quite go there.  Our D had a couple epic stands.  But of course, if they didn’t get frogmarched backwards down the field they wouldn’t need to be so epic.

 

But yes, even if I don’t agree that he singlehandedly won that game, Allen is the primary reason we won and went on.

As well as the primary reason they went 13-3 and earned the #2 seed in the conference. Which leads me to my one big gripe of which tier he is in. Tier 2 was defined as somebody that can occasionally carry their team and be the reason they win. Riding Josh Allen is primary reason the Bills were 15-4 and a game away from the Super Bowl. You don’t have to be an NFL exec or coach on this voting panel to have noticed that. It was extremely obvious. 
 

Think I saw a graph in which Allen accounted for a higher % of his teams years and TD’s than any other qb…. Sorry that’s not carrying the team occasionally. That’s your team occasionally helping you out on the way to a 13-3 romp. 

Edited July 29, 2021 by Stank_Nasty