Rewatched the Jets game, not good for Edmunds.

[Nextmanup]

2 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically.  Edmunds was really bad. 

 

Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. 

 

His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. 

Lots of folks mention his inability to get off blocks.  That's not some sort of myth; just watch this guy play.

 

He really has trouble shedding blocks.  Maybe he's too tall.  Not sure what it is.

 

He belongs in a different scheme. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[vincec]

2 hours ago, BillsfaninSB said:

If he is truly hurt they should consider calling it a season for Edmunds and have him get the surgery if needed.  Sounds like just about anybody is a wash or even an upgrade. 

This would make a lot more sense if there was anyone remotely decent available to play MLB in his absence.

[Victory Formation]

2 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically.  Edmunds was really bad. 

 

Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. 

 

His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. 

Yeah, dude.. I agree.. but there are those type of people out there who fight me on this.. I wonder, how can they not see what I’m seeing? I think that Edmunds has also had a hard time getting the defense lined up in the right spots.. Just seems like a really dumb football player.. lacks physicality and toughness as well.. I want my MLB to send off vibes like he is going to murder people... well not literally (Ray Lewis)... but you know what I mean.. I’ve seen him completely bounce off of little 5’8 205lbs RBs before.. Clyde Edwards-Helaire ran over him like a freaking mack truck.. little 205lbs RBs and he’s like a gnat on a windshield.. 

[Nextmanup]

2 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

Yeah, dude.. I agree.. but there are those type of people out there who fight me on this.. I wonder, how can they not see what I’m seeing? I think that Edmunds has also had a hard time getting the defense lined up in the right spots.. Just seems like a really dumb football player.. lacks physicality and toughness as well.. I want my MLB to send off vibes like he is going to murder people... well not literally (Ray Lewis)... but you know what I mean.. I’ve seen him completely bounce off of little 5’8 205lbs RBs before.. Clyde Edwards-Helaire ran over him like a freaking mack truck.. little 205lbs RBs and he’s like a gnat on a windshield.. 

Most here are reluctant to cast criticism at any current Bill.  It's just how it is.

I still remember the comments about Zay Jones, with folks reassuring us he was going to work out just fine.  Why? Because he was a Bill and they wanted him to be a good player, nothing more than that.

 

It's the same now with Edmunds.  Or Allen multiplied by 10,000.

 

 

 

 

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Lots of folks mention his inability to get off blocks.  That's not some sort of myth; just watch this guy play.

 

He really has trouble shedding blocks.  Maybe he's too tall.  Not sure what it is.

 

He belongs in a different scheme. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[wvbillsfan]

19 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

This is a highlight reel of the 9 worst plays from Tremaine this past Sunday.  While there were others, it was hard to say if they were on him or not.  Plays were there for him to make on the those plays but I chose not to add them because they were't "blatant."  These plays are plays that show his misdiagnosis of plays, being bullied out of plays, not capitalizing on opportunities and over running plays.

 

For the record, I'm not anti-edmunds, just becoming increasingly concerned about his play on the field moving forward.  All players have bad games and I'm trying to keep things in perspective because of the season he had last year.  I just really feel a first round talent should be making much more of an impact especially in year 3.

 

 

 

If those are his “bad plays” I’ll take it all day long. If Taron Johnson does his job and turns Perine back inside Edmunds makes the tackle. 
 

some of those bad plays the rb gained like 3 yards. 
 

Worst play I saw he got fooled and thought it was a pass. 

[JGMcD2]

3 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically.  Edmunds was really bad. 

 

Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. 

 

His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. 

 

Update:  I made a quick video of the 9 most blatantly bad play from Edmunds on Sunday-

 

 

 

Appreciate the video.

 

It would be cool to see some more bad plays from the second half... I think the only one you had there was the dropped interception, which I definitely thought he should have caught. The one at the end of the 1st half was a tough play... he was playing deeper in order to avoid a big play with time expiring.. Darnold made a nice play escaping the pocket and pitched it forward to his RB and it popped off the RBs hands... IMO that's a stretch to say it's a "blatantly bad play by Edmunds."

 

Other than that 2nd half dropped interception, everything you showed was from the first half... does that mean things improved in the second half and he played much better as the whole Bills defense did? Or was that just a coincidence? 

[KCNC]

He needs to be an OLB.  Folks have been saying that on here since he was drafted.  It's pretty obvious.

[Victory Formation]

Just now, Nextmanup said:

Most here are reluctant to cast criticism at any current Bill.  It's just how it is.

I still remember the comments about Zay Jones, with folks reassuring us he was going to work out just fine.  Why? Because he was a Bill and they wanted him to be a good player, nothing more than that.

 

It's the same now with Edmunds.  Or Allen multiplied by 10,000.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, yeah.. Until they get traded or cut, then of course that player sucks! I try not to dig my heels in when I’m wrong.. nobody likes humiliation but of course pride can get in the way.. Personally I think Edmunds needs to go outside! I’ve seen him blitz very well off the edge with his speed and he has very nice bend too.. very hard for tackles to even lay a finger on him.. Would be a great coverage guy to put on some of these freaky TE guys around the league... Not a bad guy to backup that MLB spot in the process.. He’s very young and I understand that, but sometimes that lack of experience works against you.. A “project” player can take years to come along and some of them never do.. 

 

 

 

[TwistofFate]

2 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

Appreciate the video.

 

It would be cool to see some more bad plays from the second half... I think the only one you had there was the dropped interception, which I definitely thought he should have caught. The one at the end of the 1st half was a tough play... he was playing deeper in order to avoid a big play with time expiring.. Darnold made a nice play escaping the pocket and pitched it forward to his RB and it popped off the RBs hands... IMO that's a stretch to say it's a "blatantly bad play by Edmunds."

 

Other than that 2nd half dropped interception, everything you showed was from the first half... does that mean things improved in the second half and he played much better as the whole Bills defense did? Or was that just a coincidence? 

Things definitely improved in the second half for the unit as a whole, including Edmunds. 

 

They didn't run much in the second half though, it's like they completely abandoned it, which put us in more coverage schemes along with pressure. 

 

We were much more aggressive on D and the front 7 played way better. 

 

They plays I chose were stand out plays to me which showed a spotlight on Edmunds where he had opportunities to make some impact plays.  There were others plays that didn't look good from him but I chose to not include because they looked like it was a break down of multiple assignments which put him in awkward situations that he probably shouldn't have been in. 

[JohnNord]

3 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically.  Edmunds was really bad. 

 

Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. 

 

His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. 

 

Update:  I made a quick video of the 9 most blatantly bad play from Edmunds on Sunday-

 

 

 

Im sorry but this is season 3....he’s just not playing good enough.  I’m almost certain the Bills pick up his option because they seem to love his potential and character, but how many games like this are we going to have to endure?  I say if he doesn’t pick it up by the end of the season, it’s time to move on?

[GoBills808]

7 minutes ago, wvbillsfan said:

If those are his “bad plays” I’ll take it all day long. If Taron Johnson does his job and turns Perine back inside Edmunds makes the tackle. 
 

some of those bad plays the rb gained like 3 yards. 
 

Worst play I saw he got fooled and thought it was a pass. 

Correct, the Perine TD Edmunds played his responsibilities.

 

Not sure how the Berrios dig is somehow 'bad'

 

Perine run fit immediately after is actually Milano's gap

 

bad analysis OP

 

[BananaB]

The whole defense is having a bad year. I’m not believing our problems have been solved after 30 minutes of solid play against the Jets. To me the only player that is playing consistent football is Poyer. Until the unit is back to its old play, singling guys out who have produced in the past is pointless. It’s the most team oriented sport on the face of the earth. It’s true, he’s not playing his best football. At the same time, our DLine is not as strong as it once was, Milano has rarely played his replacements are terrible. Our  DBs (some also out with injuries) have not been strong at all. 
 

On top of that he’s injured. We know this, it’s been talked about for weeks now. When your injured you confidence drops, you hesitate more, you give up a little extra so you  don’t get burned for a huge play. 

Edited October 27, 2020 by BananaB

[JGMcD2]

 

2 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

Things definitely improved in the second half for the unit as a whole, including Edmunds. 

 

They didn't run much in the second half though, it's like they completely abandoned it, which put us in more coverage schemes along with pressure. 

 

We were much more aggressive on D and the front 7 played way better. 

 

They plays I chose were stand out plays to me which showed a spotlight on Edmunds where he had opportunities to make some impact plays.  There were others plays that didn't look good from him but I chose to not include because they looked like it was a break down of multiple assignments which put him in awkward situations that he probably shouldn't have been in. 

Awesome, thanks. I figured there was some improvement there as a whole.

 

It looks like they tightened it up in the 2nd half... I wouldn't say the Jets abandoned the run... they just couldn't do anything at all. They had the ball 5 times in the 2nd half and had 2 first downs... the first play of their first drive in the Q3 was a 13 yard run by Gore and then they went 3 and out. 3 and out on the next 3 drives.... the 2nd first down was because of the Hyde penalty.

 

They ran 17 plays and ran the ball 5 times. 

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

Things definitely improved in the second half for the unit as a whole, including Edmunds. 

 

They didn't run much in the second half though, it's like they completely abandoned it, which put us in more coverage schemes along with pressure. 

 

We were much more aggressive on D and the front 7 played way better. 

 

They plays I chose were stand out plays to me which showed a spotlight on Edmunds where he had opportunities to make some impact plays.  There were others plays that didn't look good from him but I chose to not include because they looked like it was a break down of multiple assignments which put him in awkward situations that he probably shouldn't have been in. 

I realize you are just using broadcast footage but your analysis of Perine first down run from the 45 @00:58 is almost comically wrong

 

Edmunds fits for run and Milano just doesn't scrape...that's what happened with that play. Very basic concept

[TwistofFate]

3 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Correct, the Perine TD Edmunds played his responsibilities.

 

Not sure how the Berrios dig is somehow 'bad'

 

Perine run fit immediately after is actually Milano's gap

 

bad analysis OP

 

Pro Bowl caliber linebacker should make that play.  I appreciate the effort, but he had a B line. 

 

Missed open field tackle in space along with slow closing speed.  If there wasn't help over the top it could have gone for much more. 

 

He over shot the play. 

 

Thanks for the input. 

 

 

[BillsShredder83]

3 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically.  Edmunds was really bad. 

 

Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. 

 

His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. 

 

Update:  I made a quick video of the 9 most blatantly bad play from Edmunds on Sunday-

 

 

 

I did the exact same thing and it was disgusting. If he wasn't the signal caller on D, he'd be on the bench by now. It was every third play at most. He needs to be replaced. He doesn't play smart, and he uses that man sized body like an oversized toddler. I get McDs defense likes the tall guys to disrupt passing lanes but he's so out of position, that his frame can't even do that.

[GoBills808]

Just now, TwistofFate said:

Pro Bowl caliber linebacker should make that play.  I appreciate the effort, but he had a B line. 

 

Missed open field tackle in space along with slow closing speed.  If there wasn't help over the top it could have gone for much more. 

 

He over shot the play. 

 

Thanks for the input. 

 

 

I am telling you that you don't understand what you're watching

[JGMcD2]

7 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

Im sorry but this is season 3....he’s just not playing good enough.  I’m almost certain the Bills pick up his option because they seem to love his potential and character, but how many games like this are we going to have to endure?  I say if he doesn’t pick it up by the end of the season, it’s time to move on?

I would say no, it's not time to move on. He had improved steadily up until this year, he will be 23 for all of next season...

 

What everyone is suffering from is prospect fatigue... it happens a lot in baseball. Guy is hyped up in the system for a long time, so people get their hopes up.. he doesn't perform right away and because they've known about him for a long time they just think he's a bust and want to cut bait. I promise you it's a mistake with this type of player... he is still learning on the job. 

 

Say we were to replace him in the draft... Dylan Moses would be a popular option. Tremaine is only 23 days older than Moses and has 3 years in the NFL... as much as people don't think that's a big deal... it is. Chazz Surratt, Errol Thompson, Charles Snowden, Gabriel Cox are some of the other top LB prospects and they're all older than Tremaine.

 

I don't think people realize we have a unicorn here.

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

3 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

DT, LB, CB....in the first 3 rounds of next years draft...👍

Man, more capital thrown at the defense, we have to go all in on Allen.

 

 

[BuffaloRebound]

7 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I am telling you that you don't understand what you're watching

Back again Mrs Edmunds?  We all want him to do well, but at some point he’s gotta start making some plays.  It’s apparently never his fault.  

[BringBackFlutie]

19 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I realize you are just using broadcast footage but your analysis of Perine first down run from the 45 @00:58 is almost comically wrong

 

Edmunds fits for run and Milano just doesn't scrape...that's what happened with that play. Very basic concept

 

This is correct.  Edmunds takes away the outside lane, as that is the flow and fit of the run.  Milano got stood up by the Guard, who snuck straight to the second level.  I bet he doesn't get there if Star is in the middle.

 

...Anyway.  Why is this hard?

[TwistofFate]

If you really want to see what a 1st round LB looks like, watch Devin White from Tampa Bay....all the kid does is make plays...impact plays....since his rookie year last year.  That is the expectation I have for Tremaine.  I hope he gets it together and gets it together quickly.

[kkim0904]

this video sums up how bad he is playing. He gets few good plays here and there but this is Realty.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

He is a gifted athlete, but lacks instincts. 

 

Strikes me like those raw big 7-footers with little b-ball experience than college Bball programs recruit and hope develop into more polished basketball players. 

[KDIGGZ]

I think Edmunds will be an all pro level player...at OLB in a 3-4 defense. If he leaves he will be a Marshawn Lynch or Steph Gilmore level star on another team. He's playing out of position and it's really tough to watch. Zero MLB instincts and next to no physicality. But he's young and athletic and could have a bright future...elsewhere.

[DasNootz]

44 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

I would say no, it's not time to move on. He had improved steadily up until this year, he will be 23 for all of next season...

 

What everyone is suffering from is prospect fatigue... it happens a lot in baseball. Guy is hyped up in the system for a long time, so people get their hopes up.. he doesn't perform right away and because they've known about him for a long time they just think he's a bust and want to cut bait. I promise you it's a mistake with this type of player... he is still learning on the job. 

 

Say we were to replace him in the draft... Dylan Moses would be a popular option. Tremaine is only 23 days older than Moses and has 3 years in the NFL... as much as people don't think that's a big deal... it is. Chazz Surratt, Errol Thompson, Charles Snowden, Gabriel Cox are some of the other top LB prospects and they're all older than Tremaine.

 

I don't think people realize we have a unicorn here.

 

 

And they would be on rookie deals.  He would be looking at his second contract.

[uticaclub]

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Pretty much everyone who analyzes Bills film this year agrees on Edmunds fwiw

 

 

This clip is from after week 4, he has regressed each game. He's a freak athlete, he's just not in a position to succeed. 

[LB48]

4 hours ago, billsbackto81 said:

I think at this point it's over as far as him being our MLB moving forward. He has the freaky athletic ability to be a great LB but he just can't man the middle.

I was never an Edmunds fan since day one despite the big hype he got from the media.  He just doesn't make plays.  He didn't last year and now has a shoulder injury.  I couldn't imagine that he was made the MLB and was calling defensive formations.  The 2020 NFL has caught up to him.

[Mike in Horseheads]

Interesting since Cover 1 has shown a different side of the story

[JGMcD2]

14 minutes ago, DasNootz said:

And they would be on rookie deals.  He would be looking at his second contract.

Well if he’s as bad as everyone says... he won’t be making all that much 🤣

[EmotionallyUnstable]

55 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

If you really want to see what a 1st round LB looks like, watch Devin White from Tampa Bay....all the kid does is make plays...impact plays....since his rookie year last year.  That is the expectation I have for Tremaine.  I hope he gets it together and gets it together quickly.

Absolutely. 
 

He also plays next to Lavante David. That matters a ton. 

[JohnNord]

1 hour ago, JGMcD2 said:

I would say no, it's not time to move on. He had improved steadily up until this year, he will be 23 for all of next season...

 

What everyone is suffering from is prospect fatigue... it happens a lot in baseball. Guy is hyped up in the system for a long time, so people get their hopes up.. he doesn't perform right away and because they've known about him for a long time they just think he's a bust and want to cut bait. I promise you it's a mistake with this type of player... he is still learning on the job. 

 

Say we were to replace him in the draft... Dylan Moses would be a popular option. Tremaine is only 23 days older than Moses and has 3 years in the NFL... as much as people don't think that's a big deal... it is. Chazz Surratt, Errol Thompson, Charles Snowden, Gabriel Cox are some of the other top LB prospects and they're all older than Tremaine.

 

I don't think people realize we have a unicorn here.

 

 

So.... how long do we wait then?  Next year is going to be year #4.  It’s nice that he’s young but rather than improving he seems to be regressing.  It’s not just the injury either, we’ve seen missed tackles, poor reads and a failure to get off blocks.  I’m not sure he miraculously bounces back. 

26 minutes ago, Mike in Horseheads said:

Interesting since Cover 1 has shown a different side of the story

What has been the takeaway?

[Hebert19]

I think Milano being back will help him get back to form.  He may have been trying to do too much.  Or not trust his eyes or his playing partners. 

[GoBills808]

18 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

Absolutely. 
 

He also plays next to Lavante David. That matters a ton. 

Tampa Bay's whole front 7 has been near best in the league for the last year+

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, TwistofFate said:

If you really want to see what a 1st round LB looks like, watch Devin White from Tampa Bay....all the kid does is make plays...impact plays....since his rookie year last year.  That is the expectation I have for Tremaine.  I hope he gets it together and gets it together quickly.

how is the video coming? 

[TwistofFate]

2 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

how is the video coming? 

Page 1...OP

[EmotionallyUnstable]

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Tampa Bay's whole front 7 has been near best in the league for the last year+

They also play a more traditional 3-4 front, which again, is like comparing apples to oranges regarding support cast/roles when you’re looking at Tremaine vs White... if that’s what his comparison was going for. 

[uticaclub]

28 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

Absolutely. 
 

He also plays next to Lavante David. That matters a ton. 

With the amount of money they spent on defense in free agency, talent around him shouldnt be an excuse. 

[dpberr]

They gave Edmunds play calling duties and he's obviously having difficulty. 

 

The over pursuit to me, is too much thinking in executing the play, too much try hard and not enough instinct in predicting and reacting to what he's seeing.  

 

I'd give the play calling responsibility to someone else and see if that helps.  

 

Injury aside, 98% of it is in his head.