Bills Press and Fans...It’s Time to Move On With Pat Mahomes

[nedboy7]

Twitter sucks. 

[NoHuddleKelly12]

39 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Not the least bit unfair.........at least the Bears took a shot.

 

What's unfair is comparing the franchises.

 

The Chicago Bears have won 9 NFL championships.........including a SB team which is considered among the most dominant of all time.......... and have the second highest winning % in the history of the league.

 

The Bills are a laughingstock organization......a hard earned distinction....... who didn't have the balls to even pick a QB even though they were desperate for one............and then GAVE a great QB to a team in their own conference.    

 

Wrt the hard earned part..........keep in mind that at the time they passed on Mahomes they had never picked a QB with their original first #1 pick in ANY draft. 

 

It was a colossal mistake...........accept it and use it as motivation.

It was never my intention to compare the lifetimes of the franchises—I was merely pointing out that in the moment of the draft 3 years ago wherein you painted the Bills as singularly awful in passing the pick to the Chiefs, the Bears under your logic committed an even more grievous offense, in that they had an uncontested shot at grabbing Mahomes and instead flopped with Trubisky (even trading up to get him!), together with the next group of teams leading to #10 pick. To imply the Bills were on some kind of island in terms of their ‘mistake,’ is again, unfair. In any other year, the Bills arguably won that year’s draft with the sheer number of quality starters gained from same. 

[blacklabel]

They knew Whaley was out after the draft. They weren't going to upend all the work he and his staff had done throughout the year. You're going to royally sh*t in the boat as a first-time head coach if you clean out your entire scouting department three months before the draft. 

 

And they've said it numerous times, they did not want to pick their franchise guy until they had the front office completely settled. McDermott wasn't going to make one of the most important decisions of his career with a GM that was on his way out. They weren't going to onboard Beane in January and try to reorganize the whole front office that close to free agency and the draft. 

 

They've talked about being on the same page and having a streamlined process since the day McDermott got here. They simply wanted to wait until they had everything lined up the way they wanted before making big time decisions like unloading a bunch of bad contracts and acquiring picks they could use to trade up and get their guy.

 

Shoulda, woulda, coulda, blah blah blah, we hear it every year. Hey, they could've had Russell Wilson too. Or OBJ, or JJ Watt, etc. We can play that game all day. What's done is done. It's an exercise in futility (and stupidity if you're Jerry Sullivan or whichever media jackwagon gets your jimmies rustled) to try and discredit a team for who they didn't take. It's a stupid practice that can be applied to every team. 

 

Would Mahomes have had the success he's had anywhere else but KC? Maybe. But he walked into a pretty good situation. Sat behind an experienced vet (who played pretty well) for a year and then has a QB guru head coach and a roster full of weapons. And not to discredit Mahomes, he's great, but did y'all see how much time he had yesterday? Mustache Mike screwed the pooch with a game plan that called for a simple three-man pass rush for most of the game. Give almost any QB that kinda time and they're gonna make some plays. 

 

And as others have mentioned, they flipped those picks into an All-Pro corner and a Pro Bowl MLB, who, I feel, has just begun to scratch the surface of his potential. 

 

Just like Joe Pesci states in The Irishman (three and a half hours spread over two evenings that I'm never getting back) "It's what it is."

[BADOLBILZ]

28 minutes ago, Meatloaf63 said:

A colossal mistake? 

 

 

Yes.

 

Passing on Mahomes was a colossal mistake.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

Not sure why any relatively happy person would even visit this thread.  Be miserable if you like, I can’t indulge is such lunacy.  What’s done is done. Get the f over it and move on

 

So what does that say about you, Bright Eyes?

[goldenboy81]

Go niners. Don't wanna here that anymore and next year bills are gonna dominate

[Golden*Wheels]

"I almost dated this chick in high school....."

[zow2]

I recall some rumblings leading up to the draft about DeShaun Watson...that maybe he was in play.  There was not one radio interview or lead up draft rumor of Buffalo being interested in Pat Mahomes.  There was nada, zippo!  So how can anyone possibly be mad about trading w/ KC?  If anyone wants to be fake outraged, then do it over Watson because he was actually mentioned as a possibility.  Give credit to Andy Reid.  Because everyone who drafted in front of Buffalo would've taken Mahomes with 20/20 hindsight.  

[Alphadawg7]

19 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

Yeah man, if Allen is an All-Pro next year it all worked out. The odds of that are super low.

 

And why is that?  29 TD's where he had no continuity at WR and most the year his top 3 guys were 5'11, 5'8, 5'8...and his TE was a raw rookie and his RB was a 5'8" rookie and a 36 year old guy at end of his career.

 

Bills led the NFL in drops. 

 

Our OL was all new guys but one, and had a rotation at one of the starting spots (RT).  

 

I would say the odds are quite a bit better than you think. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Passing on Mahomes was a colossal mistake.

 

OK, Bet!

[HOUSE]

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 minutes ago, goldenboy81 said:

Go niners. Don't wanna here that anymore and next year bills are gonna dominate

 

 

Well there is the Shanahan/Lynch vs. McDermott/Beane comparison.........McDermott inherited a lot more in 2017 than Shanahan and now Shanny has the best roster in football and is in the SB.    

 

The matchup is actually very reminiscent of that Dolphins/Niners SB...........Mahomes is Marino carrying a high octane/no run game offense and vulnerable defense to the SB against the much more well rounded Niners team lead by a less flashy but ridiculously successful young veteran QB.

 

Hopefully the Mahomes/Allen dynamic works out for Bills fans like the Marino/Kelly did.    It sucks that Kelly isn't mentioned as a top 5 all-time kinda' QB like Marino but it's about the hardware and the Bills got more.  

[muppy]

26 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The NFL is a business.........in business it's dumb not to remember your mistakes and learn from them and use them as motivation.

 

"Dwelling" is for those with nothing else to do.........which certainly isn't the case for people running an NFL organization.

 

Now if you are......let's say........ a secretary at OBD.......and the biggest decision you make that day is what to have for lunch............yeah it's probably not productive to think too much.

I buy this enboldened actually...Motivate them how exactly...... to try to scout better, evaluate better, choose better. Okay I would think everyone would be on board for that..in other words continuing betterment of their evaluation skills in hopes of drafting better players. Fine. Having said that there is NO Way a person or organization is going to be successful 100% every time pick the player whose skills will be have been PROVEN to not be a bust at the next level.....show me One organization who nails every one of their picks every time there is none. I'll say it again it isn't an exact science if it were then no team would draft busts. But all do. To want to do and be better should be a given but WITHOUT the fans whining and weeping gnashing of teeth about every unchosen pick or opportunity I tend to think the folks in charge already want to do and be better especially because for they unlike us their jobs are on the line based on those decisions,. 

[K-9]

17 minutes ago, zow2 said:

I recall some rumblings leading up to the draft about DeShaun Watson...that maybe he was in play.  There was not one radio interview or lead up draft rumor of Buffalo being interested in Pat Mahomes.  There was nada, zippo!  So how can anyone possibly be mad about trading w/ KC?  If anyone wants to be fake outraged, then do it over Watson because he was actually mentioned as a possibility.  Give credit to Andy Reid.  Because everyone who drafted in front of Buffalo would've taken Mahomes with 20/20 hindsight.  

And everyone who drafted behind Buffalo would have tried to trade up to get him. 

[BillsFan4]

https://theathletic.com/1478914/2019/12/21/pompei-mahomes-or-mitch-here-is-what-nfl-execs-said-about-them-before-the-2017-draft/

Mahomes or Mitch? Here is what NFL execs said about them before the 2017 draft (Athletic sub. required)

 

Quote

The first thing to establish is there was no consensus on the top three quarterbacks — Mahomes, Trubisky, and Deshaun Watson, who was selected 12th by the Texans. Three of the front office men said Watson was their highest-rated quarterback. One said Trubisky was his favorite, but noted that his team had Watson ranked first. The fifth said Mahomes was his top-rated. Mahomes was ranked third by three of my sources; Trubisky was ranked third by two of them.

 

Quote

The next thing to establish is these scouts didn’t consider any of the three to be can’t-miss prospects. All five pointed out issues with each that concerned them.

“None of them should go in the first round,” front office man 1 said.

 

Quote

Front office man 1 said Mahomes had more upside than Trubisky. But he said many other evaluators ranked Trubisky ahead of Mahomes because Mahomes had a 13-16 record as a starter at Texas Tech. Front office man 5 saw past the record, to a degree, because Mahomes was backed by one of the worst defenses in college football. But front office man 2 pointed out Mahomes failed to beat quality opponents.

Sound familiar?

Quote

Three of the scouts mentioned that Watson showed more “it” factor than Trubisky and cited how Watson played his best in big games, the kind of contests that neither Mahomes nor Trubisky experienced. Watson was repeatedly referred to as a “gamer,” but there was trepidation about his 32 interceptions at Clemson.

 

Quote

Looking back, it’s interesting how much NFL scouts knew about Trubisky and Mahomes.

“Mahomes is the most gifted in terms of arm talent of all of them,” front office man 4 said. “He’s also the biggest wild card.”

Mahomes was the most divisive of the prospects. It might have been difficult to see past some of the traditional guideposts for quarterback evaluations with him. But those who did, loved him.

 

“I just like the way he plays the game,” front office man 5 said. “Has a moxie to him. He sees the field well. I liked him best from day one.”

 

Looking back at what these NFL talent evaluators thought in 2017 leaves us with these takeaways:

 

- The safe pick was Watson. Both Trubisky and Mahomes were risky.

- Both Trubisky and Mahomes were challenging to scout.

- Choosing Trubisky or Mahomes meant “betting on the come,” as front office man 4 said, using craps verbiage to describe a long-term bet with risk.

 

 

Thought this was was an interesting read and a good reminder that Mahomes was far from a sure thing (which is why so many QB needy teams passed on him). A lot was said about his mechanics/footwork (I remember a common thing was people saying no one had ever succeeded in the NFL with footwork/mechanics as bad as Mahomes), him struggling against quality opponents, having a losing record as starter, and that qb’s from air raid systems are a big gamble, etc.

 

Sure, it looks like the Bills screwed up passing on Mahomes, but at the time many thought it was a smart move to stack assets for what was almost universally considered a much deeper/stronger 2018 QB class. 

 

I know now I thought it was a smart move at the time. I don’t do the deep dives into college prospects that some do, so I rely on what I read and the little I watch.

 

Mahomes was the only QB I wanted but I thought pick #10 was too high to draft him (shows what I know! ?).Everyone said it was a great draft for CBs and 2018 was the year to take a QB. 

So I applauded the Bills for making what seemed like a smart move. I was worried they’d draft a QB in a weaker 2017 draft class and then pass on a QB the next year in a much stronger class (like what happened in 2013 with EJ Manuel).

 

 

 

 

Its also worth mentioning that Kansas City was a very good team even before Mahomes, with elite weapons on offense. They had 11, 9, 11, 12 and 10 win seasons in the 5 years under Andy Reid before Mahomes and made the playoffs all but 1 season. He stepped into a pretty ideal situation, especially w/Andy Reid mentoring him.

[Ramza86]

Call me delusional, but i dont see him being half as good as he currently is today. 

If we had some talent, and a talented OC id probably be pissed about it....but i just had no faith back then.

[K-9]

4 minutes ago, Margarita said:

I buy this enboldened actually...Motivate them how exactly...... to try to scout better, evaluate better, choose better. Okay I would think everyone would be on board for that..in other words continuing betterment of their evaluation skills in hopes of drafting better players. Fine. Having said that there is NO Way a person or organization is going to be successful 100% every time pick the player whose skills will be have been PROVEN to not be a bust at the next level.....show me One organization who nails every one of their picks every time there is none. I'll say it again it isn't an exact science if it were then no team would draft busts. But all do. To want to do and be better should be a given but WITHOUT the fans whining and weeping gnashing of teeth about every unchosen pick or opportunity I tend to think the folks in charge already want to do and be better especially because for they unlike us their jobs are on the line based on those decisions,. 

Nobody, NOBODY, in the NFL is NOT motivated to do their jobs better. In a business that defines the very nature of the “what have you done for me lately” mindset, EVERYBODY involved is dedicated to doing something NOW. 
 

We, as fans, just can’t believe that’s the case. And that says more about us than it does about those in charge of our favorite teams. 

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, Chemical said:

I have no problem moving on. The problem comes from fans that won’t admit Mahomes is great. Why can’t they admit that? Admit it was a mistake to draft Nathan Peterman then a project QB the following year instead of Mahomes and then move on. 

That's my main beef is the fans out there that think we made the correct decision in getting White, Edmunds, and Allen instead of Mahomes.  That Mahomes wouldn't have succeeded in Buffalo because he didn't have the pieces or coaches around him that he does in Kansas City.  I don't even think Hue Jackson could've prevented Mahomes from being a Superstar if Cleveland drafted him.

 

I'll give Pegula for firing Whaley the next day after that draft for that blunder (albeit incidentally).

[Success]

I don’t know why people get hung up on this stuff.  Draft hindsight is always 20/20 - without fail - and can drive you bananas.

 

I never think for a second “what if we had Mahomes.”  Because we don’t have him, and won’t.  We have Josh Allen.

[NewEra]

50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

So what does that say about you, Bright Eyes?

Lol.  Got me there.  I should have said “read this thread” not visit.  I haven’t read a bit of it minus your reply

 

its fixed

Edited January 20, 2020 by NewEra

[BADOLBILZ]

33 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

OK, Bet!

 

 

Ain't no half steppin' B(eane).

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

33 minutes ago, Margarita said:

I buy this enboldened actually...Motivate them how exactly...... to try to scout better, evaluate better, choose better. Okay I would think everyone would be on board for that..in other words continuing betterment of their evaluation skills in hopes of drafting better players. Fine. Having said that there is NO Way a person or organization is going to be successful 100% every time pick the player whose skills will be have been PROVEN to not be a bust at the next level.....show me One organization who nails every one of their picks every time there is none. I'll say it again it isn't an exact science if it were then no team would draft busts. But all do. To want to do and be better should be a given but WITHOUT the fans whining and weeping gnashing of teeth about every unchosen pick or opportunity I tend to think the folks in charge already want to do and be better especially because for they unlike us their jobs are on the line based on those decisions,. 

 

Here's the thing about this in business it's dumb not to remember your mistakes and learn from them and use them as motivation idea, though. 

 

Right after the 2017 draft, the Bills fired Whaley AND his entire pro personnel and scouting department.  Got a broom, swept them all out the door.

They later did hire a few of them back. 

 

Presumably Beane, his new pro personnel guy, and his new director of college scouting, provided those who did come back with their guidelines on how they wanted scouting done and their parameters for grades, not necessarily the same.

 

So what exactly is the Bills current organization supposed to learn from not having drafted Mahomes? 

The one who is really still there in a position of power is McDermott.  It seems pretty clear he did not want to pull the trigger on a critical decision he personally didn't feel qualified to call (franchise QB), based on the scouting reports of a GM and staff he was about to fire, who had whiffed a 1st round QB draft pick 4 years previously.  Is he supposed to learn "call your shot and draft a QB prospect even when you've got lame duck scouts who got it wrong previously?"  Sounds to me like that might be the wrong lesson to take.

 

The other thing it seems likely he did in that draft, is to trust the judgement of his new WR coach on drafting the ultra-productive WR that guy had coached in college, Zay Jones.  And that turned out to be a whiff, and I expect he did learn from it, and any further coaching hires he makes from the college ranks will not get their guys drafted with high picks unless thoroughly vetted by professional scouts.  (Low picks or UDFA guys like Foster, no biggie)

 

It seems a gigantic waste of angst and energy to try to figure out the grading system and parameters used by the previous staff so you can learn from their mistakes and motivate yourself, instead of focusing on the grading system and parameters you're using now, any mistakes you might make with them, and how to improve on where you are now going forward.

 

26 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

Call me delusional, but i dont see him being half as good as he currently is today. 

If we had some talent, and a talented OC id probably be pissed about it....but i just had no faith back then.

 

I think you'd be able to see him as a tremendously talented QB, but with the same OL and WR we had in 2018 he would not have been League MVP.  Not even close.

[BADOLBILZ]

20 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Nobody, NOBODY, in the NFL is NOT motivated to do their jobs better. In a business that defines the very nature of the “what have you done for me lately” mindset, EVERYBODY involved is dedicated to doing something NOW. 
 

We, as fans, just can’t believe that’s the case. And that says more about us than it does about those in charge of our favorite teams. 

 

 

Rex Ryan?  Marcell Dareus?  Basically 50% of the roster in meaningless December games?

 

[SoTier]

6 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

I agree.  Not sure why Mahomes is any different.  And it’s not just the Bills.  It happens with EVERY franchise.  I think you have to accept that these things happen and move on.  

 

No, "these things" don't happen to "every franchise".   Teams don't pass on great QB prospects to draft a DB when they are in desperate need of a QB.  They happen to teams because the ownership and top management are either inept or not particularly interested in winning football games.  It's time for Bills fans to just own it: Terry Pegula screwed the pooch by keeping Russ Brandon on when he purchased the team in 2013.  The Bills had a .383 winning percentage and never won more than 7 games in the 8 years that Brandon ran the team through 2013 when Pegula purchased the team.  When the Bills cleaned house of the old guard, Brandon stayed.  After the Ryan fiasco, Pegula just let Brandon do whatever he wanted and even promoted him to run the Sabres, which has worked out really well, too.

 

In 2017, the Bills did what they'd always done under Wilson and Brandon: let the good young players walk away in FA -- some reputedly without ever getting an offer from the Bills -- and used the draft to fill the holes they'd created.  I don't know why Whaley was marginalized before the 2017, but putting McDermott in charge of the 2017 draft and instructing him/authorizing him to make the trade was a major blunder that will haunt the Bills for as long as Mahomes continues to dominate the NFL, and it's on Pegula.   McDermott was a neophyte HC.  He was a lamb ready to be fleeced by that experienced KC FO (and Andy Reid in particular who seems to have made the Bills his special target over the years) that know what the hell they're doing.

 

It's time to move on from this, but it will continue to resurface with regularity unless Josh Allen can rise to the level of elite NFL QB.  Alex Smith is a good NFL QB but the Niners' passing on Aaron Rodgers to take #1 over in 2005 still comes up whenever the Niners play the Packers.   Nobody laments that the Bills took Jim Kelly over Dan Marino because of Kelly's success.

 

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by SoTier

[BBills88]

This topic is so tiresome. 

Nobody had a crystal ball to know that Patrick Mahomes was going to be this good. 

In fact most gurus didn't even have him as high a 3 rd rounder if you go and look back. ( He came from a Air Raid System which dosent Translate in the NFL they said.)

If anybody should be kicking themselves it should be the "the Top 5 teams". I'm sure they wish they could do a do over for 2017 draft. 

BIlls fans and Press need to get over it as there were 9 other teams that pick ahead of us and missed.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

30 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Nobody, NOBODY, in the NFL is NOT motivated to do their jobs better. In a business that defines the very nature of the “what have you done for me lately” mindset, EVERYBODY involved is dedicated to doing something NOW. 
 

We, as fans, just can’t believe that’s the case. And that says more about us than it does about those in charge of our favorite teams. 

 

Actually.......I think that people in the NFL ARE sometimes unmotivated and that many of those people previously worked for the Bills.

 

Whaley and Marrone were said to be upset at a culture of "lifers" at One Bills Drive including people on the training and S&C staff, FO staff etc and had wanted to clean house, which had been blocked. 

 

But Whaley and Russ Brandon were said to be party boys themselves (in somewhat different ways), from what I understand. 

 

Then Rex came in and Shaq Lawson said it was a party. Stephon Gilmore said in Buffalo under Rex, the players were left to watch film of opponents (or not watch film of opponents) on their own.

 

There's a line of thought that a culture of mediocrity could have been turned around while keeping some of the best talent that was on the roster.  Maybe it could.  But another thought is that you can't effect significant cultural change by keeping most things the same, and the most talented players on the roster - the ones you need to lead - may be the hardest to get to "buy in".  When you've got a star earning 10-20x as much as his coach with a big pile of guaranteed $$ and you tell him "hey, I need you to start watching film 4 hrs a day and get to meetings early to set an example for these new Young Sahabs", you just might get the best Eye Roll you've seen.

 

 

[Rico]

1 hour ago, Real McNasty said:

Just read the article and blame Doug. Will put everyones mind at ease.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2707036-doug-whaley-passing-on-patrick-mahomes-rumored-to-be-final-straw-before-firing

If you are going to blame anyone, blame Pegs. He should’ve dumped all of Ralph’s trash the 1st offseason after he bought the team. 

[K-9]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Rex Ryan?  Marcell Dareus?  Basically 50% of the roster in meaningless December games?

 

There are exceptions. But nobody gets into the business trying to F things up. Lazy, just mail it in and run for the bus types generally don’t last long. 

[Xwnyer]

Agree 100000% One reason I really wanted chief to lose this insanity around here needs to stop.   We made the right moves.  We like to put this in the press and than on twitter and facebook assuming players dont see the junk about them on social media than we wonder why they dont want to hag around for Bills Mafia 

[Livinginthepast]

Cmon guys turn those Mahomes frowns upside down!! Look on the bright side we got a stud QB in the 5th round, Nathan Peterman! A full fledged member of the NFL preseason HOF!!

[K-9]

6 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Actually.......I think that people in the NFL ARE sometimes unmotivated and that many of those people previously worked for the Bills.

 

Whaley and Marrone were said to be upset at a culture of "lifers" at One Bills Drive including people on the training and S&C staff, FO staff etc and had wanted to clean house, which had been blocked. 

 

But Whaley and Russ Brandon were said to be party boys themselves (in somewhat different ways), from what I understand. 

 

Then Rex came in and Shaq Lawson said it was a party. Stephon Gilmore said in Buffalo under Rex, the players were left to watch film of opponents (or not watch film of opponents) on their own.

 

There's a line of thought that a culture of mediocrity could have been turned around while keeping some of the best talent that was on the roster.  Maybe it could.  But another thought is that you can't effect significant cultural change by keeping most things the same, and the most talented players on the roster - the ones you need to lead - may be the hardest to get to "buy in".  When you've got a star earning 10-20x as much as his coach with a big pile of guaranteed $$ and you tell him "hey, I need you to start watching film 4 hrs a day and get to meetings early to set an example for these new Young Sahabs", you just might get the best Eye Roll you've seen.

 

 

I agree that complacency can set in. But again, nobody starts out NOT trying their best to make things better. Specifically, McBeane in this case. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

57 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

Call me delusional, but i dont see him being half as good as he currently is today. 

If we had some talent, and a talented OC id probably be pissed about it....but i just had no faith back then.

 

I'm there too.

 

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I agree that complacency can set in. But again, nobody starts out NOT trying their best to make things better. Specifically, McBeane in this case. 

 

Well, and it's a point that McDermott, after his first year I believe, WAS empowered to make sweeping changes to much of the staff including training and S&C.

The entire scouting and pro personnel staff was swept out the door with Whaley and only selected few hired back.

Etc.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Real McNasty said:

Just read the article and blame Doug. Will put everyones mind at ease.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2707036-doug-whaley-passing-on-patrick-mahomes-rumored-to-be-final-straw-before-firing

 

I don't believe that article matches up with observed behavior and things that have been said by the press.

 

Whaley was a Dead Man Walking the moment McDermott was hired, and he knew it.

 

Wawrow said of Whaley's famous "not privy to" presser, that before that presser Whaley had a future at TBD; after that presser (in which, he pretty much threw Terry Pegula under the bus), he did not. 

 

You could see from Whaley's dress and demeanor when McDermott arrived at OBD that Whaley was an afterthought and knew it.  You could read between the lines of McDermott's introductory presser where he was pressed on his thoughts about working with Whaley and his response was not "I'm looking forward to working with Doug" it was the ambiguous "I'm very comfortable with the situation...the Pegulas have made sure that I'm comfortable with the situation and I appreciate that" 

 

Then there was the sight of Whaley happily playing with his toddler on the lawn after the NFL annual meeting where everyone else had long taken off to get back to scouting and pre-draft planning, as Whaley would have done.  No way he's doing that if he's still empowered to do real GM things.

 

It's long been said (in fact I believe McDermott pretty much admitted) that he made the draft selections from Whaley's board.  Anyone who thinks that a guy who was pretty clearly and visibly a total lame duck for the previous several months, made that trade down decision without buy in from McDermott and Pegula, is ready to buy a bridge.

 

 

25 minutes ago, Rico said:

If you are going to blame anyone, blame Pegs. He should’ve dumped all of Ralph’s trash the 1st offseason after he bought the team. 

 

I might be an outlier, but I can never blame a new business owner for taking some time and assessing the organization before getting out a scythe and a broom.

[Mr. WEO]

Awesome thread topic....fresh!!

[BADOLBILZ]

 

30 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I agree that complacency can set in. But again, nobody starts out NOT trying their best to make things better. Specifically, McBeane in this case. 

 

 

Fortunately for people like Tom Brady there are people like you who don't believe in the great value of ADDED motivation.

 

Tom shouldn't have dwelled on being passed over by every team 6 times.

[Rico]

16 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't believe that article matches up with observed behavior and things that have been said by the press.

 

Whaley was a Dead Man Walking the moment McDermott was hired, and he knew it.

 

Wawrow said of Whaley's famous "not privy to" presser, that before that presser Whaley had a future at TBD; after that presser (in which, he pretty much threw Terry Pegula under the bus), he did not. 

 

You could see from Whaley's dress and demeanor when McDermott arrived at OBD that Whaley was an afterthought and knew it.  You could read between the lines of McDermott's introductory presser where he was pressed on his thoughts about working with Whaley and his response was not "I'm looking forward to working with Doug" it was the ambiguous "I'm very comfortable with the situation...the Pegulas have made sure that I'm comfortable with the situation and I appreciate that" 

 

Then there was the sight of Whaley happily playing with his toddler on the lawn after the NFL annual meeting where everyone else had long taken off to get back to scouting and pre-draft planning, as Whaley would have done.  No way he's doing that if he's still empowered to do real GM things.

 

It's long been said (in fact I believe McDermott pretty much admitted) that he made the draft selections from Whaley's board.  Anyone who thinks that a guy who was pretty clearly and visibly a total lame duck for the previous several months, made that trade down decision without buy in from McDermott and Pegula, is ready to buy a bridge.

 

 

 

I might be an outlier, but I can never blame a new business owner for taking some time and assessing the organization before getting out a scythe and a broom.

I would normally agree, but when you combine Brandon & Whaley’s years of proven failure with the  Marrone mess, he would’ve been better off just cleaning house.

 

That being said, I’m very happy with the current situation as-is. No guarantee that you would get a McBeane in 2015, and I don’t want anything to do with Mahomes, Josh is my QB.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I didn't realize it was the fans job to draft players.?

 

Even still, there were plenty here who loved Mahomes.... and it's really not the point. It's the Bills front office/coaches job to do their due diligence in regards to scouting the most important position in the sport. They punted on two of the best in the game currently for the next year and Josh Allen. Just have to hope he turns into at least a top 10 guy. You are going to hear the comparisons and bitching and moaning until that happens. 

 

 

....apparently you're exempt from "hindsight is a beautiful thing" based on you adept "clairvoyance".....NEVER expected a negative Bills comment from you.....next up is draft and FA.....sharpen your darts....SMH..........

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

1 hour ago, Doc Brown said:

That's my main beef is the fans out there that think we made the correct decision in getting White, Edmunds, and Allen instead of Mahomes.  That Mahomes wouldn't have succeeded in Buffalo because he didn't have the pieces or coaches around him that he does in Kansas City.  I don't even think Hue Jackson could've prevented Mahomes from being a Superstar if Cleveland drafted him.

 

I'll give Pegula for firing Whaley the next day after that draft for that blunder (albeit incidentally).

Wanna bet?

[Rico]

6 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I didn't realize it was the fans job to draft players.?

 

Even still, there were plenty here who loved Mahomes.... and it's really not the point. It's the Bills front office/coaches job to do their due diligence in regards to scouting the most important position in the sport. They punted on two of the best in the game currently for the next year and Josh Allen. Just have to hope he turns into at least a top 10 guy. You are going to hear the comparisons and bitching and moaning until that happens. 

Only if you were the GM, Tyrod Taylor would still be the QB.

[purple haze]

Patrick Mahomes is great.  The Bills decided to pass the same as 9 other teams bc there were the usual draft questions surrounding him.  I like the Bills team as it exists and they are ascending.  20/20 hindsight is worthless.  And the Bills were in the same playoff tournament Mahomes participated in.  Jokers that keep bringing up Mahomes talk like the Bills are 2-14 and getting worse.   They aren't.  They're getting better.  So, there's that.

Edited January 20, 2020 by purple haze