Bills 13, Eagles 31 postgame thread

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

2 minutes ago, SouthernBills said:

How about when we were gifted a miffed punt? 

...and Dabol called two horrific screen plays after Gore gained a first on two good runs.  This team, for some reason, cannot execute and effective screen game.

Edited October 28, 2019 by Lieutenant Aldo Raine

[Boatdrinks]

1 minute ago, SouthernBills said:

How about when we were gifted a miffed punt? 

To me, that’s where it unraveled. The offense did nothing with the short field and the D began to fade quickly after. Turnover on downs was the turning point. 

[LSHMEAB]

47 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

That's why I don't think the brain trust saw this as "the year".  These guys are aren't dumb and they knew they were thin at RB - both in number & talent. 

 

I could live with throwing the money at WR & OT but they still have to upgrade RB. 

I agree, but what's the deal with Singletary? I know he's been productive when given the opportunity, but a lot of those stats came on plays where he had a ton of room to run.

 

He was a third round pick and you generally want to see relatively big production when you make that kind of investment. PLENTY of other rookie RB's are out there doing work.

 

I don't really see the elusiveness or the kind of electric playmaking ability I'd like to see from a player who's role is to make splash plays. Maybe it's on Daboll. Maybe not. Either way, the offense desperately needs a player LIKE Singletary. Whether or not that player IS Singletary is a question mark.

[SouthernBills]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

To me, that’s where it unraveled. The offense did nothing with the short field and the D began to fade quickly after. Turnover on downs was the turning point. 

I absolutely agree. That's when I personally deflated on my couch and resorted to dark spirits. I can't imagine what it did to the defense. 

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, SouthernBills said:

How about when we were gifted a miffed punt? 

 

We ran the ball twice and got a first down.  We then got pass happy and on the 4th down throw Allen was late making the read and throw to Brown.  That was a big opportunity that the offense did not take advantage of.  But where you apparently see the QB as the main problem in that drive I see a lack of offensive play makers and an O-line that did not protect the QB very well as the main problem.

 

But for me the game was lost after we had cut the Eagles lead to 17 - 13 with a nice 75 yard TD drive and our Defense allowed them to march the length of the field and go up 24 - 13.  I's not a secret that the strength of this team is the Defense.  Our offense, including our QB, are a work in progress.  I would have loved to have gotten the ball back after 3 and outing the Eagles with the chance to take the lead, not just cut into the lead.

 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

41 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Yes I do.  Regresses up if below the mean and down if above.  Why do you ask?  

 

Oh, by the way, since you love QBR, can you tell us how the formula works?   Or why it has been the subject of criticism?

 

As for sample size, has Allen had a big enough sample size?  What are you sampling?  Have you done a power analysis?

 

You sure you want to start down this road?

 

 

 

[longtimebillsfan]

6 hours ago, vincec said:

Gailey ran it a lot more than that.

The thing I do not understand with the "Allen sucks" crowd is, what do you expect.  Many young qbs take 4-5 years to develop.  Allen was drafted as a project with a high ceiling.  He has played 18 games.  Many of those starts were behind a poor oline and limited receiver options.

 

While this project QB is learning,  he has brought this team to a 5-2 start to the year.

 

He is finding a way to win while he makes his young QB mistakes.

 

Complaining about Josh at thus point in his career makes as much sense as those that complained about Tyrod winning the wrong way when he lead us to the playoffs.

 

Those of you that want to declare Allen a bust should hope he is not.  If Allen does not become our QB of the future, it will set our franchise back 5 years.  It will most likely mean that McDermott and Beane will be gone as well .  Then restart the whole process over again.

 

Let's stop this silly arguing about Allen's short comings and focus on his strengths.  He is showing improvement.

Edited October 28, 2019 by longtimebillsfan

[CincyBillsFan]

3 minutes ago, SouthernBills said:

I absolutely agree. That's when I personally deflated on my couch and resorted to dark spirits. I can't imagine what it did to the defense. 

 

You mean the defense that allowed a 70 yard TD run right out of the halftime locker room?  Or do you mean the defense that after the Bills had a great drive to cut the lead to 17 - 13 gave up a long TD drive to go up 24 - 13? 

[DuckyBoys]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

We ran the ball twice and got a first down.  We then got pass happy and on the 4th down throw Allen was late making the read and throw to Brown.  That was a big opportunity that the offense did not take advantage of.  But where you apparently see the QB as the main problem in that drive I see a lack of offensive play makers and an O-line that did not protect the QB very well as the main problem.

 

But for me the game was lost after we had cut the Eagles lead to 17 - 13 with a nice 75 yard TD drive and our Defense allowed them to march the length of the field and go up 24 - 13.  I's not a secret that the strength of this team is the Defense.  Our offense, including our QB, are a work in progress.  I would have loved to have gotten the ball back after 3 and outing the Eagles with the chance to take the lead, not just cut into the lead.

 

 

 

Agreed, that drive seemed to deflate the Bills  Defense allowed the Eagles to dictate which is inexcusable given the Eagles lack of any explosive players on the outside and all of their injuries coming in. Also  Eagles looked they didnt want to even be in Buffalo till the Allen fumble

[vincec]

1 minute ago, longtimebillsfan said:

The thing I do not understand with the "Allen sucks" crowd is, what do you expect.  Many young tbs take 4-5 years to develop.  Allen handcrafted as a project with a high ceiling.  He has played 18 games.  Many of those starts were behind a poor oline and limited receiver options.

 

While this project QB is learning,  he has brought this team to a 5-2 start to the year.

 

He is finding a way to win while he makes his young QB mistakes.

 

Complaining about Josh at thus point in his career makes as much sense as those that complained about Tyrod winning the wrong way when he lead us to the playoffs.

 

Those of you that want to declare Allen a bust should hope he is not.  If Allen does not become our QB of the future, it will set our franchise back 5 years.  It will most likely mean that McDermott and Beane will be gone as well .  Then restart the whole process over again.

 

Let stop this silly arguing about Allen's short comings and focus on his strengths.  He is showing improvement.

He's doing great to this point, IMO. He was very raw coming out of college and was totally thrown to the wolves with this pass happy offense where he is a major running back too. But if he can survive it I think he will prosper.

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

1 minute ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

You mean the defense that allowed a 70 yard TD run right out of the halftime locker room?  Or do you mean the defense that after the Bills had a great drive to cut the lead to 17 - 13 gave up a long TD drive to go up 24 - 13? 

 

Who orchestrated that 75 yd Buffalo TD???

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

You mean the defense that allowed a 70 yard TD run right out of the halftime locker room?  Or do you mean the defense that after the Bills had a great drive to cut the lead to 17 - 13 gave up a long TD drive to go up 24 - 13? 

I think he means the defense that has given up over 300 on the ground last two games.

[Boatdrinks]

5 minutes ago, SouthernBills said:

I absolutely agree. That's when I personally deflated on my couch and resorted to dark spirits. I can't imagine what it did to the defense. 

I’m not sure what the stats were from that point on, but it seems like the fight went out of the dog around then. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

48 minutes ago, SouthernBills said:

You must not care as much as I do. Am I going to B word and complain when I think fixable things are not being fixed, yes. Will I allow it to influence my day to day life? Of course not. I thought message boards were for this sort of thing. Maybe I'm in the wrong place. 

 

I don’t think the implication that caring is linked to or signaled by unbridled complaints would prove out

[DuckyBoys]

8 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I agree, but what's the deal with Singletary? I know he's been productive when given the opportunity, but a lot of those stats came on plays where he had a ton of room to run.

 

He was a third round pick and you generally want to see relatively big production when you make that kind of investment. PLENTY of other rookie RB's are out there doing work.

 

I don't really see the elusiveness or the kind of electric playmaking ability I'd like to see from a player who's role is to make splash plays. Maybe it's on Daboll. Maybe not. Either way, the offense desperately needs a player LIKE Singletary. Whether or not that player IS Singletary is a question mark.

he's probably a really good third down back  Darren Sproles is probably his ceiling

[LSHMEAB]

2 minutes ago, longtimebillsfan said:

 

 

Those of you that want to declare Allen a bust should hope he is not.  If Allen does not become our QB of the future, it will set our franchise back 5 years.  It will most likely mean that McDermott and Beane will be gone as well .  Then restart the whole process over again.

 

 

I think Allen does enough things well that he's going to stick for a while. If he doesn't take a leap, then he's in the dreaded Tannehill/Marriota territory. No real Bills fans wants to see that. Expressing concerns DOES NOT=hoping those concerns continue or worsen.

 

And I think we all know what's at stake with the Allen pick. 

[row_33]

7 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

 

Who orchestrated that 75 yd Buffalo TD???

2 personal fouls?

Edited October 28, 2019 by row_33

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Allen certainly has his struggles, but he is improving and slowly learning from his mistakes (hero ball and sliding).  This offensive roster is not there yet.  Brown is not a real #1, he is a great #2.  Beasley is a good #3 and the rest are good role players.  We are lacking a true #1 opposite Brown who will win 50/50 balls.  Knox is not there yet, and Kroft has shown me nothing.  We are lacking a great TE also.  The line is still in the works.  The starting RB is playing well but he's close to drawing social security and is still getting outrushed by the QB.  Not sure what to make of Singletary.  Is he a lead back or more of a Sproles type?  The overall offensive roster is below average at best, yet are 5-2.  The roster can get better, but it probably won't happen this year.  And if the Bills make the Playoffs, to me that's a successful season.

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

Allen certainly has his struggles, but he is improving and slowly learning from his mistakes (hero ball and sliding).  This offensive roster is not there yet.  Brown is not a real #1, he is a great #2.  Beasley is a good #3 and the rest are good role players.  We are lacking a true #1 opposite Brown who will win 50/50 balls.  Knox is not there yet, and Kroft has shown me nothing.  We are lacking a great TE also.  The line is still in the works.  The starting RB is playing well but he's close to drawing social security and is still getting outrushed by the QB.  Not sure what to make of Singletary.  Is he a lead back or more of a Sproles type?  The overall offensive roster is below average at best, yet are 5-2.  The roster can get better, but it probably won't happen this year.  And if the Bills make the Playoffs, to me that's a successful season.

 

This is exactly right. 

 

We all need to take a chill pill and realize that with a win next week the Bills will be at 6 - 2 at the half way point of the season.  That was the best case record I had them at in August.

 

 

 

[Rocket94]

5 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

This is exactly right. 

 

We all need to take a chill pill and realize that with a win next week the Bills will be at 6 - 2 at the half way point of the season.  That was the best case record I had them at in August.

 

 

 

The Bills were exposed today, and it is good for them to find out now. They are not a finished product and they need additional talent.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

Allen certainly has his struggles, but he is improving and slowly learning from his mistakes (hero ball and sliding).  This offensive roster is not there yet.  Brown is not a real #1, he is a great #2.  Beasley is a good #3 and the rest are good role players.  We are lacking a true #1 opposite Brown who will win 50/50 balls.  Knox is not there yet, and Kroft has shown me nothing.  We are lacking a great TE also.  The line is still in the works.  The starting RB is playing well but he's close to drawing social security and is still getting outrushed by the QB.  Not sure what to make of Singletary.  Is he a lead back or more of a Sproles type?  The overall offensive roster is below average at best, yet are 5-2.  The roster can get better, but it probably won't happen this year.  And if the Bills make the Playoffs, to me that's a successful season.

 

Good assessment.  I will add that I am puzzled by Daboll.  Sometimes his play calling is appropriate, even brilliant.  Sometimes he calls good plays where we have open guys and Allen fails to see or exploit them.  But other times, his play design seems too clever or unnecessarily gimmicky.  Or, he designs and calls plays that may be effective in principle, but which our team seems unable to execute, and he seems very slow to adjust or adapt.  He seems reluctant to consistently do things that might effectively keep the defense a bit off balance.

[DuckyBoys]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Good assessment.  I will add that I am puzzled by Daboll.  Sometimes his play calling is appropriate, even brilliant.  Sometimes he calls good plays where we have open guys and Allen fails to see or exploit them.  But other times, his play design seems too clever or unnecessarily gimmicky.  Or, he designs and calls plays that may be effective in principle, but which our team seems unable to execute, and he seems very slow to adjust or adapt.  He seems reluctant to consistently do things that might effectively keep the defense a bit off balance.

think he values his play design more than the talent running it  I dont think there is room in the playbook for DiMarco to be downfield 30 yards running a streak yet Daboll thought it was  worthwhle to try it

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

2 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

think he values his play design more than the talent running it  I dont think there is room in the playbook for DiMarco to be downfield 30 yards running a streak yet Daboll thought it was  worthwhle to try it

 

To be fair; that play worked twice last year.

[LABILLBACKER]

33 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I agree, but what's the deal with Singletary? I know he's been productive when given the opportunity, but a lot of those stats came on plays where he had a ton of room to run.

 

He was a third round pick and you generally want to see relatively big production when you make that kind of investment. PLENTY of other rookie RB's are out there doing work.

 

I don't really see the elusiveness or the kind of electric playmaking ability I'd like to see from a player who's role is to make splash plays. Maybe it's on Daboll. Maybe not. Either way, the offense desperately needs a player LIKE Singletary. Whether or not that player IS Singletary is a question mark.

I too am a little skeptical on Devin. The td was nice but it was in open field. Most of his runs just didn't do anything for me.

[RyanC883]

42 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

I’ll take Allen over any other QB in the 2018 Draft.

 

same, but not a high bar at this point.   

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

think he values his play design more than the talent running it  I dont think there is room in the playbook for DiMarco to be downfield 30 yards running a streak yet Daboll thought it was  worthwhle to try it

 

Against Miami at one point, there was a play where Lee Smith was the checkdown option on 3rd down.  To his credit, he caught it and valiantly trucked it, but I don’t think he made those yards even as a younger player.  Kroft or Knox should have converted it.

[BananaB]

1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I too am a little skeptical on Devin. The td was nice but it was in open field. Most of his runs just didn't do anything for me.

He had 3 runs today for 20 yards and had a 10+ yarder called back because of a hold.  Seems to me we gotta feed him more.

[DuckyBoys]

2 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I too am a little skeptical on Devin. The td was nice but it was in open field. Most of his runs just didn't do anything for me.

looks like a nice change of pace back 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

To be fair; that play worked twice last year.

 

That’s part of the puzzling aspect of Daboll.  He will design these unexpected little wrinkles and gimmicks - like the touchdown pass to Lee Smith - that work.  But they work in part because of their very unexpected nature.  Once a good workaholic, thorough in preparation team gets some film on them they won’t work or at least the probability goes down.  Meanwhile, we do have some skill players, and it’s just possible that having our best players in the best position to make plays might make sense.  

[Mango]

7 hours ago, tbonehawaii said:

Lining up offside 2x today. Is there a more preventable penalty? 

 

Defense on a critical 3rd down to not had 10 guys on the field.

 

Not a penalty. But up there with preventable moments. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

Defense on a critical 3rd down to not had 10 guys on the field.

 

Not a penalty. But up there with preventable moments. 

 

Inexcuseable. - do you remember which play?

[LABILLBACKER]

12 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

think he values his play design more than the talent running it  I dont think there is room in the playbook for DiMarco to be downfield 30 yards running a streak yet Daboll thought it was  worthwhle to try it

The shere fact that Dumbell thinks DiMarco is worthy of a deep wheel route speaks volumes on how stupid he is.

[DuckyBoys]

3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That’s part of the puzzling aspect of Daboll.  He will design these unexpected little wrinkles and gimmicks - like the touchdown pass to Lee Smith - that work.  But they work in part because of their very unexpected nature.  Once a good workaholic, thorough in preparation team gets some film on them they won’t work or at least the probability goes down.  Meanwhile, we do have some skill players, and it’s just possible that having our best players in the best position to make plays might make sense.  

Bingo , I  find it hard to believe that lining up Dimarco or Frank Gore out wide is ever our best option  Or running a end around to Knox or Lee Smith running patterns  Or running your franchise qb on endless runs to try and convert third and short especially after he just came back from a concussion

[Nextmanup]

51 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

 

Just keep on posting then.    Sorry,  couldn’t resist an opening like that.  

 

To me I see more good than bad.  He leads, he wins.   Give the kid a few play makers, some better tackles, and some more experience.  

Except for the 8 games he has lost so far. 

 

Maybe he forgot how to lead and win in those games.

 

 

[BananaB]

14 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

looks like a nice change of pace back 

 
20 carries on the season and 172 yards. His 3 runs of 20+ is the same amount Gore has in over 90 carries..... We need this kid more involved in our offense.  

Edited October 28, 2019 by BananaB

[Mango]

10 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Inexcuseable. - do you remember which play?

 

I think it was the 3rd and 7 before PHI put up their final TD. Announcer mentioned it. 

[Tcali]

7 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Are you surprised?   A lot of people have been skeptical.  

people were getting very silly about this team. we still need a QB and better LBs and D linemen.

7 minutes ago, BananaB said:

 
20 carries on the season and 172 yards. His 3 runs of 20+ is the same amount Gore has in over 90 carries..... We need this kid more involved in our offense.  

so true

[Locomark]

24 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I too am a little skeptical on Devin. The td was nice but it was in open field. Most of his runs just didn't do anything for me.

I like Devin. I felt like he was running into a wall most of his runs. Our interior line was ugly and every team knows we don’t run wide right so that eliminates 1/3 of the field. We need a true right tackle. We are rotating guys there because neither are the answer. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

I think it was the 3rd and 7 before PHI put up their final TD. Announcer mentioned it. 

 

Ugh

[dave mcbride]

7 hours ago, KD in CA said:

Bills were due for a down game and Eagles are still a good team and capable of taking advantage.  This one was pretty easy to see coming.

 

Commence hysterical overreactions.

Agree almost entirely, but the late-game QB play plus the lack of a real pass rush from the RDE position vs. a quality opponent left me concerned. 

 

At home, the Bills squeaked by Cincy and Miami, but lost to the Pats and werr blown out by Philly. I hate to say it, but shades of 2008 and 2011 are at the front of my mind.

Edited October 28, 2019 by dave mcbride