Status of AFC: Should Bills Go All In For 2019?

[Happy]

1 minute ago, reddogblitz said:

 

yeah, and next year we play the AFC West, ie KC and an improved Raiders team and the Chargers and the NFC West, ie Seattle, Rams, and 49ers.  This year we got a slumping AFC North and except for maybe Dallas and Philly, a bad NFC East.

 

Timing is everything  

 

I get it.  How are the Raiders, KC, Rams, 49ers, etc going to be next year?  No one knows that until September, including how good the Bills will be.

My point is that you can't rush what isn't ready.  Yes, the timing may be near perfect as far as the schedule goes, but the team isn't quite there yet.  I'll say this - it hinges on Josh; if the light turns on and he becomes Mahomes-like, then the SB is not out of the question.  I don't think that will happen.

[Rocket94]

Going all in could become incidental if the Bills continue to play disciplined and smart football. The way they are going, it may just take care of itself.

[Chandler#81]

7 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

 

Next year we have brutal schedule, like the complete opposite of this year. I know many things will change between now and then, but now it is quite safe to say that if we dominate THAT schedule we are top SB contenders.

 

To save your time guys:

 

Home: Kansas, LA Chargers, Seattle, LA Rams, Cleveland/Baltimore instead of Cincinnati, Baltimore, Washington, Philadelphia, Denver 

Away: Oakland, Denver, SF, Arizona, Houston/Indy instead of Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Dallas, NY Giants and Tennessee.

 

Road games look similar, but home games are like day and night, if we get Ravens both times all 4 games next year may be tougher than Philly this year. Miami can only get better, Jets probably too. We have like 7-8 relatively easy games this year, and there might be 3-4 like that next year.

 

Anyway, to the OP, I am against any short term moves for costly resources at all. Just keep building team through draft, sign our own do reasonable contracts and try to add quality in FA.

No way in Hell are we playing Dallas & NYG in back to back seasons. Wherever are you getting your information, cut it off. Ergo, your post is just wrong.

[RochesterRob]

49 minutes ago, Magox said:

Beane has shown that he is not afraid to roll the dice.  He's had some moves that have worked and others not so much, thankfully the good have been more plentiful than the bad.   

 

The moves they make should be made all within the construct of what they believe fits in their mid to long-term views.    

 

Beane will look at all positions, even the positions that we believe are rock solid because they are constantly looking to upgrade every roster spot, even if that means for higher quality depth.  The Bates trade is a perfect example of that, this was an under the radar trade that helped contribute to the victory vs. the Titans.

 

But if we are talking about splashy sort of moves, the areas of most need are:

 

D - Lineman -  Pass rushing specialist

Offensive tackle - At this stage I am not convinced Ford is a tackle and is better suited as a guard.  Nseke is pretty good but he's getting up there in age.

Wide Receiver - If Foster can regain his form and Duke Williams can continue his ascent then we may be set at the WR spot.  But those are two big IF's that won't be fully answered for at least another month or two.

 

 

  Honestly, I believe that McDermott and Frazier are here long term.  Daboll most likely has another year before teams get really hot to go after him.  I get the sentiment but agree with those that Beane/McD are going for a long term build that will provide more windows than 2019 or 2020.  I still think that the front office will surprise us during the bye with a signing of somebody else's practice squad player that will come in to help the O.

[Big Blitz]

I've been all in on this team since May.  My DC friends thought it was typical homerism.  

 

I believe in McD.  There is something about him and I thought during the whole "kneeling" controversy it solidified it for me. 

 

Jerry Hughes kind of took exception to something Jim Kelly had said...and I'm not getting into that whole mess again....but Hughes response told me that the locker room "had it" and a kind of "stay out of this, this is our team and we got it."  

 

Absolutely nothing against Kelly, but I thought at a time when coaches all over the league could have and likely did lose locker rooms, he did not.  This team to this day plays every play like its their last.  And I attribute that to McD and his staff.  

 

McD.  A leader of men.  And women.  

 

I'm all freaking in.  Go get Trent Williams!

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by Big Blitz

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

13 hours ago, rayray808 said:

if itʻs a steal deal... yes, make moves

 

but we are not desperate...

 

moves I would make if we are talking about dangling a first round pick:

 

1) Von Miller - would make our defense LIGHTS OUT

2) Stephon Diggs - a true WR1... brown goes to 2, beasley at slot, Duke at the 3

3) Melvin Gordon - yes we have Singletary but this dude would be the perfect compliment to Gore

I think Melvin Gordon would be a huge addition. With this defense and a dominant RB it would take a ton of pressure off Allen. 

 

Diggs would be the main WR i would try and trade for. But not at the cost of a 1st rd pick with a very deep WR draft coming up.

 

Von Miller would be a great add but I’m guessing it would be for two 1st rd picks. Elite Pass rushers are worth this price.

 

If this defense somehow added Von Miller your now taking about a defense that will be remembered thought history.

Edited October 7, 2019 by Call_Of_Ktulu

[No_Matter_What]

17 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

No way in Hell are we playing Dallas & NYG in back to back seasons. Wherever are you getting your information, cut it off. Ergo, your post is just wrong.

 

Huh, did you even bother reading? 

 

Granted, I am not a native speaker, but I am pretty sure that it should be clear that I named our next year's opponents first and compared them with this year's.

 

Ergo, I've never wrote that we play Dallas and Giants next year. 

Edited October 7, 2019 by No_Matter_What

[Magox]

13 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  Honestly, I believe that McDermott and Frazier are here long term.  Daboll most likely has another year before teams get really hot to go after him.  I get the sentiment but agree with those that Beane/McD are going for a long term build that will provide more windows than 2019 or 2020.  I still think that the front office will surprise us during the bye with a signing of somebody else's practice squad player that will come in to help the O.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with this.  I have been saying for quite some time, unless the Bills completely fall apart and lose the locker room which I find highly implausible, no matter what the Bills performance this year or for that matter the next, they aren't going anywhere.  It's clear as day that they have a much better well-thought out construct of an organization than we've had in decades.   For those Whaley defenders who think that Whaley was nearly as good or better than Beane are wholly delusional and clearly have little to no feel of what a true proper organization look like.

 

This is what it looks like, methodical, structured, process oriented with lots of high end talent surrounding them.   The sheer number of guys that are GM candidates is a very telling sign and this organization has a lot of guys in the front office that will be receiving promotions.  

[Hebert19]

Yes.  This has been my point in the aj green thread.  Especially if you can do it with players like that in the last year or without a huge cap number.  

 

Rent AJ green trade for von Miller and go for it all. 

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

9 minutes ago, Hebert19 said:

Yes.  This has been my point in the aj green thread.  Especially if you can do it with players like that in the last year or without a huge cap number.  

 

Rent AJ green trade for von Miller and go for it all. 

9 minutes ago, Hebert19 said:

Yes.  This has been my point in the aj green thread.  Especially if you can do it with players like that in the last year or without a huge cap number.  

 

Rent AJ green trade for von Miller and go for it all. 

 

[CodeMonkey]

No.  The offense is far too weak still.  Making great progress.  Stay the course. No point ***** everything up by being impatient at this point.

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

Von Miller for 2 1st rd picks is a no brainer.

 

If the Bears could go back in time they would make the Mack trade 100 out of 100 times.

 

I would like to see some one put up a vote.

 

Would you trade two 1st rd picks for Von Miller and a 2nd and 5th for Diggs.

 

Yes or No

Edited October 7, 2019 by Call_Of_Ktulu

[BADOLBILZ]

11 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Guys whose bodies are failing like Williams and Green don't even help short term.

 

 

Mitch Morse body is in worse shape than Green.....does anyone expect him to last more than a couple seasons?    But he's helping in the short term........amirite?

 

This regime doesn't seem to shy away from injured players so your logic doesn't match up with how they've approached roster building.

 

They have a pile of cap room and sorely need for a big play option in the passing game...........and Green is a career 14.8 ypr WR.........exactly what they need.

 

It's not unheard of for a traded player to come in and greatly change the fortune of a contending team on that side of the ball...............see Dareus with the Jags.........they went from worst to first in run defense and had a lead in NE in the AFCCG.     Key adds can make a big difference.   

[Alphadawg7]

Here is what we know:

 

Beane is pretty good at drafting and is also a trade wizard.  

 

So tough call...I dont think the Bills should go all in for anyone unless they believe they are the missing player to get us over the top.  This regime has proven they are good with those draft picks, so would be foolish to say over pay for anyone right now.

 

That being said, Beane is also a trade wizard, so if he does make a trade I have faith he won't over pay and will get a good deal.

Edited October 8, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Mitch Morse body is in worse shape than Green.....does anyone expect him to last more than a couple seasons?    But he's helping in the short term........amirite?

 

This regime doesn't seem to shy away from injured players so your logic doesn't match up with how they've approached roster building.

 

They have a pile of cap room and sorely need for a big play option in the passing game...........and Green is a career 14.8 ypr WR.........exactly what they need.

 

It's not unheard of for a traded player to come in and greatly change the fortune of a contending team on that side of the ball...............see Dareus with the Jags.........they went from worst to first in run defense and had a lead in NE in the AFCCG.     Key adds can make a big difference.   

 

Green isn't healthy. He hasn't even returned to light practice yet. This isn't trading for a guy who is nicked up it would be trading for a guy who right at this moment is injured. 

[CSBill]

16 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

If you could get him for a 3rd, would it be worth it, worst case he's a rental for the year, let him go then, wouldn't the Bills get a 3rd back for him as a comp pick?  Unless they signed another 1st rounder FA, then it offsets??

 

yeah, maybe a 3rd, I would go with that

[Mountain Man]

On 10/7/2019 at 8:01 AM, rayray808 said:

if itʻs a steal deal... yes, make moves

 

but we are not desperate...

 

moves I would make if we are talking about dangling a first round pick:

 

1) Von Miller - would make our defense LIGHTS OUT

2) Stephon Diggs - a true WR1... brown goes to 2, beasley at slot, Duke at the 3

3) Melvin Gordon - yes we have Singletary but this dude would be the perfect compliment to Gore

Diggs isn't a number 1. He is a number 2. For the Vikings he plays a very clear WR2 role complimenting Thielen. 

 

Gordon would be a waste of money now we have Singletary 

 

Real life isnt the same as Madden 

Edited October 8, 2019 by Mountain Man

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Bills don’t need another WR. They need a pass rusher. Probably an OT too but the bigger need is an edge rusher.

[BADOLBILZ]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Green isn't healthy. He hasn't even returned to light practice yet. This isn't trading for a guy who is nicked up it would be trading for a guy who right at this moment is injured. 

 

 

OBVIOUSLY it's presumed that he will return very soon and that his ankle injury isn't career ending.  

 

The Bengals are being very cautious with Green because their season is lost and they still have several weeks until the trade deadline.

 

It doesn't make much sense for a team to trade a player 3 weeks in advance of the deadline unless the market is flooded or someone is willing to pay a premium.     It's not and I doubt anyone will.   Trade deadline deals are only recently prevalent in the NFL but have long been common in all north american sports and the trades almost always happen in the final days before the deadline.   

 

He will likely come back in two weeks.........play one game.........and be traded to a contender for a will-be late 3rd round pick or later.    

 

To me the people sweating about it being a first or even a second round pick are worrying about nothing.........that's not happening for a 31 year old 8-game rental even if he's a superstar when healthy.     And for people who think the Bengals will wait for a comp pick instead of anything later than a 2nd they neglect to recognize the chance that the Bengals might not be on the plus side of a formula for a comp pick(new HC will want to shop for his guys) or that they don't want to save the pro-rated money on AJG's deal this season.   The Brown family is like Ralph.........a penny saved is a penny earned.   They save upwards of $8M out of pocket by moving him at the deadline.

 

 I think it's at least 50% chance he is dealt and not at a prohibitive cost. 

 

The Bills could really use a player like him in the fold ahead the Eagles game...........that's the one on the immediate schedule that looks like they are going to need to score some points or risk being upset at home. 

[GunnerBill]

13 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

OBVIOUSLY it's presumed that he will return very soon and that his ankle injury isn't career ending.  

 

The Bengals are being very cautious with Green because their season is lost and they still have several weeks until the trade deadline.

 

It doesn't make much sense for a team to trade a player 3 weeks in advance of the deadline unless the market is flooded or someone is willing to pay a premium.     It's not and I doubt anyone will.   Trade deadline deals are only recently prevalent in the NFL but have long been common in all north american sports and the trades almost always happen in the final days before the deadline.   

 

He will likely come back in two weeks.........play one game.........and be traded to a contender for a will-be late 3rd round pick or later.    

 

To me the people sweating about it being a first or even a second round pick are worrying about nothing.........that's not happening for a 31 year old 8-game rental even if he's a superstar when healthy.     And for people who think the Bengals will wait for a comp pick instead of anything later than a 2nd they neglect to recognize the chance that the Bengals might not be on the plus side of a formula for a comp pick(new HC will want to shop for his guys) or that they don't want to save the pro-rated money on AJG's deal this season.   The Brown family is like Ralph.........a penny saved is a penny earned.   They save upwards of $8M out of pocket by moving him at the deadline.

 

 I think it's at least 50% chance he is dealt and not at a prohibitive cost. 

 

The Bills could really use a player like him in the fold ahead the Eagles game...........that's the one on the immediate schedule that looks like they are going to need to score some points or risk being upset at home. 

 

I am not willing to trade for a guy who hasn't been cleared for practice. I don't buy that they are just trying to protect his trade value. If he was healthy enough to practice he would be practicing because that helps them trade him. I don't think teams will be lining up to trade for a guy who hasn't even been out there in the week yet this season. 

[BADOLBILZ]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not willing to trade for a guy who hasn't been cleared for practice. I don't buy that they are just trying to protect his trade value. If he was healthy enough to practice he would be practicing because that helps them trade him. I don't think teams will be lining up to trade for a guy who hasn't even been out there in the week yet this season. 

 

 

You're in luck.........you can't trade for an injured player in the NFL so don't even get exercised by the thought.    When he's traded he will be ready to play and have to be cleared by the acquiring team.    Remember.......it's not a today problem.  

[whatdrought]

I don't believe in "going for it all" as an excuse to overpay or make silly trades. Last year is a great example of that. The rams became the hip team by blowing the doors off and going for broke. It worked, for sure, but they get to the superbowl and get humiliated by the team that never does anything other than build football teams their way. We're young, we have a ton of cap space going forward, we've got a ton of draft capital, and we've got a FO with a great track record. We're opening a SB door, not a window. If Allen is the guy, we'll be in the conversation for the next 10 years at this rate. I wouldn't mind adding pieces, but don't ever overpay.

[BADOLBILZ]

4 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

I don't believe in "going for it all" as an excuse to overpay or make silly trades. Last year is a great example of that. The rams became the hip team by blowing the doors off and going for broke. It worked, for sure, but they get to the superbowl and get humiliated by the team that never does anything other than build football teams their way. We're young, we have a ton of cap space going forward, we've got a ton of draft capital, and we've got a FO with a great track record. We're opening a SB door, not a window. If Allen is the guy, we'll be in the conversation for the next 10 years at this rate. I wouldn't mind adding pieces, but don't ever overpay.

 

The best window to hyper-stock your roster are between years 1-3 of your rookie QB's deal.

 

They are right in the middle of that.

 

The days of getting 5 years until you extend your high quality QB are over..........if they play well enough to be considered franchise you extend them after year 3.

 

As for what they are building............keep in mind that they are the 6th oldest team in the NFL.

 

The Seahawks were the youngest team in the NFL when they won their SB with defense and a young QB.......and just 3 seasons later that team was mostly blown up except for the QB.

 

This team has a few young studs but it's mostly players in their prime...........it's not a wait til next year situation...........the team will change a lot from year to year and sustaining top defense is very difficult.

[whatdrought]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

The best window to hyper-stock your roster are between years 1-3 of your rookie QB's deal.

 

They are right in the middle of that.

 

The days of getting 5 years until you extend your high quality QB are over..........if they play well enough to be considered franchise you extend them after year 3.

 

As for what they are building............keep in mind that they are the 6th oldest team in the NFL.

 

The Seahawks were the youngest team in the NFL when they won their SB with defense and a young QB.......and just 3 seasons later that team was mostly blown up except for the QB.

 

This team has a few young studs but it's mostly players in their prime...........it's not a wait til next year situation...........the team will change a lot from year to year and sustaining top defense is very difficult.

 

I understand that that's the idea now, that you have to win before you pay your QB. There's two big issues with that- one, nobody has actually done it unless you count the Seahawks, but they didn't do the "go for broke" approach, they just built a great team. Second issue is that the new CBA will, in some way or another, eliminate this issue.

 

As for the age of our roster, that's exactly why we can't be overpaying for limited resources. This FO has done a great job identifying depth and talent. They're going to keep building. Teams that shoot to win quickly usually fail, whereas teams that continue to build depth and build a solid team from top to bottom are consistent contenders. Winning the superbowl is about 75% of being a great team, and 25% being lucky (from injuries, to bad calls, to every little thing that goes on in a 16 week season)- the recipe for success is sustained years of being a good team and contending each and every year. 

[reddogblitz]

37 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not willing to trade for a guy who hasn't been cleared for practice. I don't buy that they are just trying to protect his trade value. If he was healthy enough to practice he would be practicing because that helps them trade him. I don't think teams will be lining up to trade for a guy who hasn't even been out there in the week yet this season. 

 

Not scientific but on the Bengals game last week they said he was pretty much ready but he was being cautious because he wants to come back 100% for the stretch run in his contract season.  I think it's good to get a guy on his contract year because he's $uper motivated to play well and catch a lot of pa$$e$.  Go for it unless the price is too high..

[BuffaloBillsGospel]

On 10/7/2019 at 1:49 AM, jwhit34 said:

Given:

• The AFC looks very middling except for New England and KC and the Bills played NE tough and KC looked a little vulnerable vs. Indy.
• The Bills have a favorable schedule.
• The defense looks like it could be elite/championship caliber.
• They have most of their key players under contract through 2020 (Alexander probably retires, only starters not signed for '20 are Levi Wallace, Quinton Spain, Frank Gore, key subs not under contract are Shaq Lawson, Jordan Phillips)
• The team is in a favorable cap situation in '20

 

Is there enough of a chance to go for it for 2019 by giving up some future assets (draft picks) to get 2-3 players to help them contend this year or is 2020 the year to go for it? Do they have enough to get Trent Williams and a top notch WR (Diggs or Green)? 

 

Would they/you be willing to part with to get two high end players for the offense? 

 

Green would be a rental for 11 games and has a $12.1 salary component so pro-rated he would cost about $8 million on the cap. Trent Williams is $11 million salary so would count about $7.3 million on the cap.

 

Would Cincy take a 3rd and a player for Green (Foster or Zay)?

Would Washington take a 2nd and a player (Foster or Zay - whoever Cincy doesn't take)?

 

Would they be willing to trade both picks? Would the addition of both players be enough to make the offense top 10? 

 

I think 2020 roster looks great but they will play the NFC West and AFC West and the 2nd place teams from AFC North and South, so the schedule will be tougher. 

 

Getting two players like that, then getting SIngletary back from injury and maybe even Kroft is a real boost and could make a big difference. 

 

 

 

 

I say yes but not at WR, how many more WR are we going to fit on this roster? The addition of Williams now makes this group a decent unit. I want the Bills to go all in on a damn pass rusher, up until last week when our DT suddenly erupted for 3 sacks we had one of the lowest sack totals in the league despite being ranked high. If anything happens to Hughes we are in trouble as far as getting to the QB, we need someone opposite of Hughes. Get Ryan Kerrigan in here from the Redskins, he has 3 sacks on a putrid Redskins team but the DL is actually doing good, he'd be a rental for us in his last year but a major upgrade to anything we have now. Kerrigan has more sacks than both Murphy and Lawson together already.

Edited October 8, 2019 by BuffaloBillsGospel

[Boatdrinks]

9 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Bills will have over $80 million in cap space next offseason.... they can afford to pull the trigger on a big trade(as long as it doesn't involve a first rounder) for a guy like Green without jeopardizing their future.

 

A 2nd or 3rd round pick for a top talent WR isn't going to kill this team or any team. 

This ^^. It’s a year to year league, and if the Bills are in a good spot around the trade deadline they should be willing to make moves. Next year’s schedule appears tougher as well. Nothing is guaranteed , so they have to take shots when they have them. 

[whatdrought]

28 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Bills will have over $80 million in cap space next offseason.... they can afford to pull the trigger on a big trade(as long as it doesn't involve a first rounder) for a guy like Green without jeopardizing their future.

 

A 2nd or 3rd round pick for a top talent WR isn't going to kill this team or any team. 

 

I wouldn't hate that trade at all, I was referring to the idea of going all in. That being said, like many have said, Green is a risky business because of his history and his current injury status.

[whatdrought]

Just now, ScottLaw said:

But you aren't risking a whole hell of a lot and it's not going to kill the team going forward whatsoever. 

 

 

 

Probably the same logic we used to defend the KB trade...

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, whatdrought said:

 

I understand that that's the idea now, that you have to win before you pay your QB. There's two big issues with that- one, nobody has actually done it unless you count the Seahawks, but they didn't do the "go for broke" approach, they just built a great team. Second issue is that the new CBA will, in some way or another, eliminate this issue.

 

As for the age of our roster, that's exactly why we can't be overpaying for limited resources. This FO has done a great job identifying depth and talent. They're going to keep building. Teams that shoot to win quickly usually fail, whereas teams that continue to build depth and build a solid team from top to bottom are consistent contenders. Winning the superbowl is about 75% of being a great team, and 25% being lucky (from injuries, to bad calls, to every little thing that goes on in a 16 week season)- the recipe for success is sustained years of being a good team and contending each and every year. 

 

 

1. Just in the past 2 years teams that have ridden first contract QB's and to the SB or the brink

Eagles WON SB.........Wentz missed playoffs but they were the prohibitive favorite to win the NFC most of that season thanks to Wentz.

Rams won NFC..........and they were outstanding the year before in Goff year 2 after being woeful in Goff year 1 and loading up that offseason.

Chiefs lost in AFC Championship

And the Eagles and Rams in particular made a bunch of trades of draft picks for vets...........I don't think any of those teams would change a thing.   Draft picks are great when they work but even McD's 2017 draft only has 3 players left from it.   

 

2. Again, False.  The CBA is set to expire after the 2020 season........which is when Allen is eligible to sign a long term extension.   And even so HOW will the CBA change it?  What side wants that?   

 

As for the rest of your argument..........you gotta' be in it to win it.    The Seahawks proved that you can't really create a modern dynasty by having a team full of young players..........they were literally the NFL's youngest roster when they won the SB and they got consumed with trying to keep everyone and then it was over pretty quick.   How you handle change is the key.    The Pats turn over a ton of players every year.    The Bills signed 18 free agents this offseason and are 4-1.   It's not about clutching draft picks to stack cheese it's about getting players that fit for that team that year........even if they are rentals.   

[dous21]

at this point there are no offensive weapons out there available. unless AJ Green will be dealt for a 3rd and 5th round pick. 

 

so we should be doing whatever it takes to acquire Von Miller 

[whatdrought]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

1. Just in the past 2 years teams that have ridden first contract QB's and to the SB or the brink

Eagles WON SB.........Wentz missed playoffs but they were the prohibitive favorite to win the NFC most of that season thanks to Wentz.

Rams won NFC..........and they were outstanding the year before in Goff year 2 after being woeful in Goff year 1 and loading up that offseason.

Chiefs lost in AFC Championship

And the Eagles and Rams in particular made a bunch of trades of draft picks for vets...........I don't think any of those teams would change a thing.   Draft picks are great when they work but even McD's 2017 draft only has 3 players left from it.   

 

2. Again, False.  The CBA is set to expire after the 2020 season........which is when Allen is eligible to sign a long term extension.   And even so HOW will the CBA change it?  What side wants that?   

 

As for the rest of your argument..........you gotta' be in it to win it.    The Seahawks proved that you can't really create a modern dynasty by having a team full of young players..........they were literally the NFL's youngest roster when they won the SB and they got consumed with trying to keep everyone and then it was over pretty quick.   How you handle change is the key.    The Pats turn over a ton of players every year.    The Bills signed 18 free agents this offseason and are 4-1.   It's not about clutching draft picks to stack cheese it's about getting players that fit for that team that year........even if they are rentals.   

 

The Eagles signed a bunch of talent, but the depth of their team was there before Wentz- the OL and the DL which is what made them great. The Rams are an argument for the exact opposite side- they got the SB but got spanked and now look like a much lesser team because they shot their shot and now have no depth and their rentals are all expiring. 

 

Draft picks are great, and they are important for depth all over the field, not just in starters. I'm not anti-trade, I am against the idea that teams should "go for broke" with QB's on rookie deals because all you're going to do is end up with a team with a one year window- someone goes down and that window slams shut and you're left mopping up the pieces for five years. 

 

Instead, you should seek to develop players constantly so each time you have a pricey FA leave, you have another ready to go. This can only happen by being wise with picks and money. That doesn't mean no trades, and no FA signings, but rather it means not throwing all the eggs in the basket of one season. It's sustainability. 

 

The seahawks problem wasn't that they did what you said, it's that they didn't know where to let people go and how to restructure on the fly. They are doing so now, but it's been a harsh rebound time. Some of that is unavoidable, but some of it is that they didn't want to let go of guys soon enough. Look at the falcons- they're a great example of holding on to that small window too long instead of continuing to build and develop the team year after year. 

 

Contracts signed this year are already being done so in light of the new CBA and by the time Allen is ready for a new deal, the CBA will be a huge deal with negotiation and trying to figure out how things will look. It will change it because teams cannot continue to pay QB's 30+% of their cap. There will be some measure taken to fix the disparity. Don't know what that'll be, but we can revisit this then if you'd like. 

[BADOLBILZ]

10 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

 

The Eagles signed a bunch of talent, but the depth of their team was there before Wentz- the OL and the DL which is what made them great. The Rams are an argument for the exact opposite side- they got the SB but got spanked and now look like a much lesser team because they shot their shot and now have no depth and their rentals are all expiring. 

 

Draft picks are great, and they are important for depth all over the field, not just in starters. I'm not anti-trade, I am against the idea that teams should "go for broke" with QB's on rookie deals because all you're going to do is end up with a team with a one year window- someone goes down and that window slams shut and you're left mopping up the pieces for five years. 

 

Instead, you should seek to develop players constantly so each time you have a pricey FA leave, you have another ready to go. This can only happen by being wise with picks and money. That doesn't mean no trades, and no FA signings, but rather it means not throwing all the eggs in the basket of one season. It's sustainability. 

 

The seahawks problem wasn't that they did what you said, it's that they didn't know where to let people go and how to restructure on the fly. They are doing so now, but it's been a harsh rebound time. Some of that is unavoidable, but some of it is that they didn't want to let go of guys soon enough. Look at the falcons- they're a great example of holding on to that small window too long instead of continuing to build and develop the team year after year. 

 

Contracts signed this year are already being done so in light of the new CBA and by the time Allen is ready for a new deal, the CBA will be a huge deal with negotiation and trying to figure out how things will look. It will change it because teams cannot continue to pay QB's 30+% of their cap. There will be some measure taken to fix the disparity. Don't know what that'll be, but we can revisit this then if you'd like. 

 

 

The Eagles traded draft picks for Alshon Jeffrey,  Michael Bennett and Ronald Darby.    They definitely put their chips all in and they were a team with a losing record the season before they won the SB.

 

I don't think the Rams would change the approach they took it got them to the SB.    Like Beane they went heavy on adding vets to fix the OL and age and contracts have caught up with them but they just need a little re-tooling to get back near the top.   Their biggest issue is Gurley's failing knee after they tied up a fortune in him.

 

What it comes down to is the approach of propping up young QB's with talent and getting a shot at the SB in the process WORKS.

 

A new CBA isn't going to change the % of salary cap that QB's get.   The system works.........teams with big dollar QB's still make the playoffs A LOT.   The most important player on teams in all sports usually get paid crazy money.  The players association sure isn't going to concede ANYTHING to re-distribute wealth and the owners aren't going to increase the % of the pie they pay to address an issue that's not really an issue.

[Teddy KGB]

Pats interested in AJ green 

 

Time to outbid them ✊?

[LSHMEAB]

On 10/7/2019 at 5:22 AM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think the philosophy McDermott and then Beane sold to the Pegulas was to try to build a perennial contender. 

Given that philosophy, I think you can expect to see a deal or deals only if it makes sense from that perspective.

https://overthecap.com/player/ryan-kerrigan/1462/

But there was the KB trade, so I'm not so sure about this. I generally agree. I don't think they're giving up a first for a receiver and that's really the crux of the question.

[buffalo2218]

I'd try to make a trade with the Bengals, but not AJ Green, Geno Atkins would be pretty nasty on this D line. I saw this mentioned in another thread and I find that quite tempting

[LSHMEAB]

8 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

The best window to hyper-stock your roster are between years 1-3 of your rookie QB's deal.

 

They are right in the middle of that.

 

The days of getting 5 years until you extend your high quality QB are over..........if they play well enough to be considered franchise you extend them after year 3.

 

As for what they are building............keep in mind that they are the 6th oldest team in the NFL.

 

The Seahawks were the youngest team in the NFL when they won their SB with defense and a young QB.......and just 3 seasons later that team was mostly blown up except for the QB.

 

This team has a few young studs but it's mostly players in their prime...........it's not a wait til next year situation...........the team will change a lot from year to year and sustaining top defense is very difficult.

ALL OF THIS. The time to win and go bold is NOW. Maybe they'll come up short against KC or NE. Whatever. There's no reason to be content with just staying competitive. I understand that the overall philosophy of the regime is continual improvement and all that jazz. That's fine. This really all hinges on Allen. He's going to steadily improve throughout the course of the season if he's the real deal. If you've got the QB in place, on his rookie deal, you strike hard.

 

I don't think they will, but I think they should.

[Dr. Who]

I think AJ Green would accelerate Allen's progress and make the wr corps significantly more dangerous. I hope we make a run at acquiring him.

[NoSaint]

On 10/7/2019 at 3:37 AM, GunnerBill said:

No stupid short term moves - which means no to Trent Williams and no to AJ Green. If Diggs came loose at a sensible price I would do that one but the Bills just have to stay the course. We should not be building a one hit wonder. Let's build this to be good for a 5, 6, 7 year run.

If josh is the guy - he gets paid in 3-4 years and that short term piece comes off the books. We are in a cap situation where we can buy proven talent instead of hoping for unproven. It’s an incredible privilege that a lot of folks seem scared of.

9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

The best window to hyper-stock your roster are between years 1-3 of your rookie QB's deal.

 

They are right in the middle of that.

 

The days of getting 5 years until you extend your high quality QB are over..........if they play well enough to be considered franchise you extend them after year 3.

 

As for what they are building............keep in mind that they are the 6th oldest team in the NFL.

 

The Seahawks were the youngest team in the NFL when they won their SB with defense and a young QB.......and just 3 seasons later that team was mostly blown up except for the QB.

 

This team has a few young studs but it's mostly players in their prime...........it's not a wait til next year situation...........the team will change a lot from year to year and sustaining top defense is very difficult.

Can’t repeat these points enough times. It constantly amazes me how many people seem scared of ruining our shot 5 years from now. 

[ny33]

5 hours ago, whatdrought said:

 

Probably the same logic we used to defend the KB trade...

KB was a fat and lazy bastard. I have no such concerns about Green (though he could very well be a physical wreck). Diggs has some motivation concerns, sure.