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Will the Bills save $5.5M and take a risk?


KRT88

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After watching the race for QB, I think Tyrod Taylor has clear won the job. He moves the team consistently. I personally am worried about the red zone but Tyrod has that added benefit of his willingness to use his feet.

 

EJ Manuel has looked good and he is far more willing to throw the ball up the field and try to make plays than Cassel. I can't see getting released after the way he played. Yes his one incompletion was a terrible throw but he threw some really great ball last, plus he bring great athleticism to the table.

 

The big question becomes, is this coaching staff willing to take a risk and save $5.5 million of cap space and let Matt Cassel go?I don't know what they gain from that move and likewise I am not sure what they lose in having a veteran work with Taylor and Manuel. The NFL is cold and when teams can make a move to save money they almost always do so.

 

Whatever, they do, I think it is safe to say that with all the offensive available, if this offense can't produce 20+ points per game, we will all be disappointed.

 

What do you think, is Cassel going to have a job in two weeks?

Edited by KRT88
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Yes his one incompletion was a terrible throw but he threw some really great ball last, plus he bring great athleticism to the table.

 

His incompletion was tipped at the line taking the pace off it and slightly redirecting it which is why it looked like he had just thrown it at the receivers feet.

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I think people are way overreacting to a handful of preseason throws. I strongly believe Taylor should be the starter, but we really don't know what we have in Taylor or Manuel, as they are both young and still developing. It would be crazy to throw away the one guy with an established record. Mediocre though that record might be, mediocre is better than terrible. And there is still a chance that TT and EJ might be terrible when all is said and done. I don't think so, and I certainly don't hope so, but it's worth a roster spot and a few million dollars to have some decent floor insurance.

 

Two other reasons Cassel might be worth a lot more than his preseason appearances would suggest:

 

1) These game defenses are vanilla. In practice, however, all the QBs have been seeing the full range of NFL formations, blitz packages, etc. So if Cassel is handling the real defenses in practice better than the other guys, that has to weigh more than a handful of throws against cardboard preseason defenses. Only the coaches know for sure.

 

2) We don't know what effect Cassel has on the young guys and on the QB room in general. Maybe he is a great mentor? Maybe he is a great teacher? Who knows? (The coaches, maybe, but not us.) I wouldn't be so quick to assume that TT's and EJ's development has nothing to do with Cassel. Maybe he is a critical factor even when he is not on the field. Then again, maybe not.

 

The point is that the coaches are working with a LOT more information than the fans or the media. And a lot more goes into the decision of who to start and who to keep on the roster than preseason stats. The stats aren't meaningless, but they are just a small piece of the picture.

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2015 contract details

Manuel - 1.2M - guaranteed

Cassel - 4.65M - includes 500K roster bonus

Taylor (as starter) - 3.15M - assuming playoff birth

Taylor (as backup) - 1.3M

Simms - 585K

 

2016 contract details

Manuel - 1.6M - guaranteed

Taylor (as starter) - 4.13M - assuming playoff birth

Taylor (as package qb) - ~2.3M

Taylor (as backup) - 1.3M

2017 contract details

Taylor (as starter in either 2015 or 2016) - UFA

Taylor (as backup in 2015 and 2016 and starter in 2017) - 1.2M

 

Tough decisions for the front office.
Should TT's contract affect the decision as to how much he plays? In Kapernick's rookie year GR limited him to about 8 plays per game.

 

I am a big EJ fan, but I think TT has earned the job. So the nod should go to him with Manuel as the #2 and Simms as the #3. The 4M savings from using Simms instead of Cassel can be used to extend Incognito or to help extend other players such as Darius. #3 QBs rarely play. When they do, it rarely changes the outcome of the game. We would likely be the first team in NFL history to have a 4.65M #3 QB. Those resources are better spent elsewhere.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tyrod-taylor/

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/bills-news-notes/2015/3/18/8236345/tyrod-taylor-contract-details-buffalo-bills-qb-nfl-free-agency-2015

 

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Cut Cassel and then re-sign him after the season starts for half of what he's making. And you only have to pay him on a per-game basis.

None of the QB's should be cut, at least until after the NE game. With Brady out, I am sure the Pats will sign the QB we release.

 

If you cut Cassel now, Belichek will scoop him up fast, and learn Romans offense. It would save money if he's gone but why not keep all 3? Lots of insurance!

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Cut ties with Cassel and be done with it. TT #1, EJ #2. The advantage of this starter back up duo is if TT has to come out or gets hurt, the offensive mindset of the coashes and preparation for the players doesnt change because EJ is more plug n play with TT than MC is with TT.

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Keep looking around for a place to trade Cassel for a 3rd or 4th round pick. You have to take some risk somewhere. We would also like to use the roster spot for a WR, TE, or safety, where we have quality backups.

 

That was one of the funniest things I've ever heard. What team in their right mind is gonna give up a 3rd or 4th round pick on an overraged and mediocre veteran QB? LOL.

 

Maybe then we can trade Fred Jackson for a 1st round pick...

Edited by QuoteTheRaven83
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That was one of the funniest things I've ever heard. What team in their right mind is gonna give up a 3rd or 4th round pick on an overraged and mediocre veteran QB? LOL.

 

Who has just lost out to a guy most of the league considers a bust and a guy who has ridden the pine for 4 years.

 

The only way someone trades for Cassel is a team who like Pittsburgh last week lose their vet back up and have no other guy on the roster capable of taking NFL snaps. Then you might get a 7th.

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...

 

The point is that the coaches are working with a LOT more information than the fans or the media. And a lot more goes into the decision of who to start and who to keep on the roster than preseason stats. The stats aren't meaningless, but they are just a small piece of the picture.

That's the point I hope everyone understands. No one knows these guys better than the coaches do. Whichever QB is chosen to start week #1, I have 100% confidence in the decision the coaches arrvie at. It's great to know we have 3 capable starters if a guy goes down.

Edited by ChasBB
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Cut the cord on Matt C

 

The Bills have 2 capable QB's in EJ and TT one of which had a perfect passer rating of 158.3.

 

Manuel was 7 of 8 for 170 yards and 2 TDs;

Taylor was 12 of 13 for 122 yards and a rushing TD;

Cassel was 6 of 7 for 38 yards; and not to be left out,

Simms was 5 of 5 for 65 yards and a TD

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Cut Cassel and then re-sign him after the season starts for half of what he's making. And you only have to pay him on a per-game basis

 

Look around the league at what McCown, Moore, etc are making

Cassel is getting the "going rate" for a vet backup

No way he takes less. Injury bug will bite somewhere and he'd be sitting pretty

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Look around the league at what McCown, Moore, etc are making

Cassel is getting the "going rate" for a vet backup

No way he takes less. Injury bug will bite somewhere and he'd be sitting pretty

Moore is only getting $2.6M and McCown is going to be their starter.

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Look around the league at what McCown, Moore, etc are making

Cassel is getting the "going rate" for a vet backup

No way he takes less. Injury bug will bite somewhere and he'd be sitting pretty

I disagree. McCown is a terrible comparison as he's looked a lot better* than Cassel this preseason and is going to start for a team. If Cassel is going to sit 3rd string and mentor he is in a very different situation. A pay cut to hold a clipboard might be very preferable to a roster cut for him - especially if the reworked deal includes escalators based on playing time.

 

* Okay, "a lot better" is an overstatement. McCown has shown the ability to throw deep while Cassel has only dink-and-dunked. Keeping defenses honest with the threat of vertical passing is necessary for success in the NFL today.

Edited by BarleyNY
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Based on what's been seen on the field, Taylor should start EJ is #2, Simms #3, and I'd be fine with either trade or cut Cassel.

 

However as was pointed out earlier in this thread, what we've seen in the games is all against vanilla defense. How will either Taylor or Manual look against a normal defense. It's quite possible in practices Rex has had the defense show much more regular season game looks and in the process Taylor and EJ have both looked very shaky. Alot of the reports from training camp stated that particularly against EJ. Conversely maybe they deliberately held back what they wanted Cassell to do so all were saw were check downs.

 

No idea what the decision will be, but could understand if it's not Taylor as the starter, it may be due to how they've looked playing against more complex looks and Cassell has looked better there.

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2 schools of thought; Yes, $4.something million added to the reported Dareus offer would move it out of 'dime a dozen' level, but, Arizona was on their way to being the best team in the League last year claiming a playoff spot earlier than any other team, when their QBs dropped like flies late in the season and quietly exited the playoffs. Do you think they wish they had Matt Cassel then?

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2 schools of thought; Yes, $4.something million added to the reported Dareus offer would move it out of 'dime a dozen' level, but, Arizona was on their way to being the best team in the League last year claiming a playoff spot earlier than any other team, when their QBs dropped like flies late in the season and quietly exited the playoffs. Do you think they wish they had Matt Cassel then?

Spot on!

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2 schools of thought; Yes, $4.something million added to the reported Dareus offer would move it out of 'dime a dozen' level, but, Arizona was on their way to being the best team in the League last year claiming a playoff spot earlier than any other team, when their QBs dropped like flies late in the season and quietly exited the playoffs. Do you think they wish they had Matt Cassel then?

Exactly. Injuries are the reason you keep him.

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If they're serious about making the playoffs this year you keep all 3 so you have enough depth.

They are serious and this is why they will keep him.

I've come 180 degrees on this since starting to read the thread, 4 mil is not a lot at this late stage and we may need a third QB to step in late.

This is the best QB situation we could have hoped for this year.

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Exactly. Injuries are the reason you keep him.

 

 

I agree you keep him regardless, but if you are going to cut Cassel you do not cut him until at least AFTER the Patriots game.

 

If Jimmy G gets hurt against Pittsburgh......and all it would take was a poor decision to run and a well placed hit by Shazier........then you get to face Ryan Lindley instead of a veteran like Cassel.

 

I'd like my chances either way but Lindley = an automatic W regardless of BB's gameplan.

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Moore is only getting $2.6M and McCown is going to be their starter.

 

Pish tush. Moore was making $4M + $1.5M prorated bonus last year. He took a hometown discount, it seems to stay with the Pfish, I don't think that changes the point.

McCown was in a competition to start, just like Cassel here. Looks like he won (for now), doesn't mean he'll stay starting, doesn't mean a smart team tosses the vet in the trash if he doesn't start - way to keep a motivated QB room. Fitzie's getting $3.25M, he was the backup, now he's the starter. So the league turns.

 

Cassel's getting $4.125M plus a roster and workout bonus already paid - that's really not that diff, I think the point stands that he's not getting that far off the "going rate" for a quality vet backup.

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I'm amazed that people believe that because of last night that we now have 3 capable starters. We don't know if we have 1 capable starter for the regular season. The Steelers defense has looked like hot garbage all preseason. It was their 4th preseason game and they sat their starters early plus they were missing 3 starters to begin with...

 

You keep all 3 and hope they manage through the season. Given the styles of play, it's a good bet EJ or Tyrod gets hurt if they are the starter.

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I think the question comes down to; do you want to risk playing Simms if it comes down to it or do you not trust Simms to be as meh as Cassel? If both EJ and TT go down I'd be fine with Simms tbh. Then again the dislike I have for Cassel (as a QB) is huge, the guy doesn't just reek of mediocrity he stinks, bad as in very foul.

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Pish tush. Moore was making $4M + $1.5M prorated bonus last year. He took a hometown discount, it seems to stay with the Pfish, I don't think that changes the point.

McCown was in a competition to start, just like Cassel here. Looks like he won (for now), doesn't mean he'll stay starting, doesn't mean a smart team tosses the vet in the trash if he doesn't start - way to keep a motivated QB room. Fitzie's getting $3.25M, he was the backup, now he's the starter. So the league turns.

 

Cassel's getting $4.125M plus a roster and workout bonus already paid - that's really not that diff, I think the point stands that he's not getting that far off the "going rate" for a quality vet backup.

Just because 2 teams have high-paid backups, it doesn't mean the Bills should or even need to. EJ has started and won games before and Taylor backed-up a SB-winning QB. Cassel himself had 4 years to sit and learn from Brady, which is similar to Taylor. And if we're down to the 3rd QB during a game/the season, the Bills are in trouble.

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Just because 2 teams have high-paid backups, it doesn't mean the Bills should or even need to. EJ has started and won games before and Taylor backed-up a SB-winning QB. Cassel himself had 4 years to sit and learn from Brady, which is similar to Taylor. And if we're down to the 3rd QB during a game/the season, the Bills are in trouble.

Not if our 3rd QB is Matt Cassel. We'd be in trouble if it was Matt Simms.

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