T master Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 This may not be the place for this thread and if it isn't feel free to move it. St. Louis, Oakland and San Diego are all in jeopardy of losing their teams. No one can relate to those threats better than us. I just started thinking is there anything that we can do to help support these fan bases? I have no idea what that means but I know that I always appreciated the support from others. We should return the favor in whatever ways we can. If anyone has any suggestions feel free to post them. I'm not sure that we can make much (if any) of a difference but we should do what we can nonetheless. We were able to do a lot (thanks to Chevy) with Talley. Social media is a powerful platform. I think that if a fan base supports a team & the team has been in a city for most or all of the life of the franchise like San diego , the owner should not be able to hold a city hostage by saying they need a new stadium . St. Louis being one of those owners ! The stadium in St. Louis is a very nice stadium & the owner is driven by greed ! Not that he isn't making money already but he or they want MO MONEY MO MONEY ! It's just nuts the entire league like most sports now are getting way out of hand in a lot of ways , which i think will bring the leagues down fall in some ways !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Buffalo Joe Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 I think that if a fan base supports a team & the team has been in a city for most or all of the life of the franchise like San diego , the owner should not be able to hold a city hostage by saying they need a new stadium . St. Louis being one of those owners ! The stadium in St. Louis is a very nice stadium & the owner is driven by greed ! Not that he isn't making money already but he or they want MO MONEY MO MONEY ! It's just nuts the entire league like most sports now are getting way out of hand in a lot of ways , which i think will bring the leagues down fall in some ways !! I've actually heard quite the opposite. That it's really dark in there other than the field. Granted I've never actually been there. Not that I'm advocating they move, but a new stadium, or atleast an upgrade would be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah John Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) Having lived in the Bay Area, I can tell you that the 49ers and the Raiders are the yin and yang of football. Although it's true the 49ers have had tough physical teams and the Raiders have had excellent skill players, the core attitude that persists in both teams is that the 49ers are the glitzy glamour team and the Raiders are the maniacal crazed killers. That attitude largely comes from the fans. The Bay Area is very diverse, with tough, low income areas, nice middle class areas, really fancy areas, and people who worked in tough industries as fishermen, longshoremen, construction etc and the less physical jobs like writing, software work, factories, etc. The combination of the two teams energizes the two poles of the community. Losing the Raiders for the time they were gone was a bad thing for Oakland but also the entire Bay Area. Only one facet of the area's personality was left. When the Raiders came back there was rejoicing but also the team required Personal Seat Licenses which were too expensive for the average Raiders fan. (By the way, if the team leaves, will PSL holders be refunded? Hahahahaha silly question.) The best suggestion I've seen is for the Raiders to play in the 49ers new stadium, which isn't in SF by the way. If the Jets can play in Giants Stadium, why can't the Raiders do the similar thing? This would let more of the spirit of the Bay Area be brought out to play, more often. Edited April 9, 2015 by Utah John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 I've actually heard quite the opposite. That it's really dark in there other than the field. Granted I've never actually been there. Not that I'm advocating they move, but a new stadium, or atleast an upgrade would be nice. I was there the last time the Bills played in St. Louis (2008) -- and I was largely unimpressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 TBH I never thought the Bills would ever really move. That's because Ralph deep down never wanted to move them. And while he asked for things from the County, like all owners have, he didn't ask for anything exorbitant, and kept prices among the lowest in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) That's because Ralph deep down never wanted to move them. And while he asked for things from the County, like all owners have, he didn't ask for anything exorbitant, and kept prices among the lowest in the NFL.He negotiated a million road blocks into the lease that made it virtually impossible for the next buyer to move the team. If Ralph would have passed closer to 2019 then the chances of them being relocated were much greater. No one was going to sit on a lame duck franchise for 6 or 7 seasons (whatever it was). They were pretty much stuck in WNY. That is what Ralph wanted and he did his best to make sure that it happened. Unfortunately these teams don't have that same level of commitment from ownership (especially St. Louis). Edited April 9, 2015 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) Bills were never moving though. It's always been those same 3 teams. We don't believe good can happen to Buffalo teams so we worry. Edited April 9, 2015 by TheTruthHurts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Did they do anything for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 He negotiated a million road blocks into the lease that made it virtually impossible for the next buyer to move the team. If Ralph would have passed closer to 2019 then the chances of them being relocated were much greater. No one was going to sit on a lame duck franchise for 6 or 7 seasons (whatever it was). They were pretty much stuck in WNY. That is what Ralph wanted and he did his best to make sure that it happened. Unfortunately these teams don't have that same level of commitment from ownership (especially St. Louis). Saddest part is Kroenke is FROM St. Louis!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 He negotiated a million road blocks into the lease that made it virtually impossible for the next buyer to move the team. If Ralph would have passed closer to 2019 then the chances of them being relocated were much greater. No one was going to sit on a lame duck franchise for 6 or 7 seasons (whatever it was). They were pretty much stuck in WNY. That is what Ralph wanted and he did his best to make sure that it happened. Unfortunately these teams don't have that same level of commitment from ownership (especially St. Louis). Well, to be fair, we are lucky that Pegs was there. But Ralph didn't have to keep the team in Buffalo all these years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 10, 2015 Author Share Posted April 10, 2015 Well, to be fair, we are lucky that Pegs was there. But Ralph didn't have to keep the team in Buffalo all these years.Absolutely, but the other potential people were stuck. The roadblocks scared off a LOT of buyers that were interested in relocating the team. Even the JBJ group was going to be in WNY until 2019 or whatever. It wasn't ideal for anyone other than people that wanted WNY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanners Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Did they do anything for us? Exactly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Having lived in the Bay Area, I can tell you that the 49ers and the Raiders are the yin and yang of football. Although it's true the 49ers have had tough physical teams and the Raiders have had excellent skill players, the core attitude that persists in both teams is that the 49ers are the glitzy glamour team and the Raiders are the maniacal crazed killers. That attitude largely comes from the fans. The Bay Area is very diverse, with tough, low income areas, nice middle class areas, really fancy areas, and people who worked in tough industries as fishermen, longshoremen, construction etc and the less physical jobs like writing, software work, factories, etc. The combination of the two teams energizes the two poles of the community. Losing the Raiders for the time they were gone was a bad thing for Oakland but also the entire Bay Area. Only one facet of the area's personality was left. When the Raiders came back there was rejoicing but also the team required Personal Seat Licenses which were too expensive for the average Raiders fan. (By the way, if the team leaves, will PSL holders be refunded? Hahahahaha silly question.) The best suggestion I've seen is for the Raiders to play in the 49ers new stadium, which isn't in SF by the way. If the Jets can play in Giants Stadium, why can't the Raiders do the similar thing? This would let more of the spirit of the Bay Area be brought out to play, more often. i think the Chargers and Raiders are prepared to share a new stadium in Carson. They will each have their own practice facility. It will be similar to Jets and Giants. It can be used to host a SB. It will have a ton of corporate sponsorship. I do think they should move one out of the AFC west though if they do that. It won't be easy for either fan base. They will be both be losing their teams. even if it's in the same state, it's not the same. But I think we will find out in May about SD. The city is supposed to propose their plan to the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExWNYer Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 San Diego is the one that really jumps out to me. The franchise has been there a long time and has some tradition. St. Louis and Oakland are both kind of transient in that they have had teams, lost them and got them again. I guess that I just empathize with the people that do care because we went through about 20 years of relocation threats. The Chargers did originate in LA so there is that, although I think that they are now synonymous with San Diego and should remain there. I'd hate to see any fan base lose their team...except for maybe Miami & Atlanta, the two worst sports cities in America. Yep the Rams are stolen property from LA going back to the 50's. But the Chargers used to be in LA too and there was little support. LA stole them from Cleveland first in 1946 after winning the NFL Championship the previous year. They were "re-gifted" to St. Louis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 10, 2015 Author Share Posted April 10, 2015 The Chargers did originate in LA so there is that, although I think that they are now synonymous with San Diego and should remain there. I'd hate to see any fan base lose their team...except for maybe Miami & Atlanta, the two worst sports cities in America. LA stole them from Cleveland first in 1946 after winning the NFL Championship the previous year. They were "re-gifted" to St. Louis. The Chargers spent 1 season in LA 55 years ago. It isn't like they have any roots there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Can we get a copy of those instructions? At least until we re bed how to win? You asked, you shall receive: http://deadspin.com/5839778/st-louis-rams-release-adorable-video-to-help-teach-their-fans-how-to-cheer I've actually heard quite the opposite. That it's really dark in there other than the field. Granted I've never actually been there. Not that I'm advocating they move, but a new stadium, or atleast an upgrade would be nice. Dude, they built the guy a stadium to bring the team here. It's 20 years old, how often is a community supposed to spring for a new stadium? The Ralph is what, 42? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UticaBill Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 (edited) Owners can do whatever they want and we the fans always get screwed.... we pay for their stadium and they profit from them...I don't care so much about how much players make (too much IMHO) nearly as much as I care about how little the source of all those dollars has a say in anything.I would LOVE to see a "farm" league where the teams are owned by the fans (like stock in corporations) and the teams own their own stadiums (and fund/build them from a league revenue system) heck, NFL players might even want to buy in.... with the way today's NFL burns through players some type of developmental league is becoming more and more a necessity...In actuality this is how the NFL should be operated but the rich owner's have their way.... why should a Baltimore Cardinal represent Arizona? Its a bit like #stolenvalor http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/animals/birding/baltimore-oriole/ Edited April 10, 2015 by UticaBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Chargers update: http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-chargers-stadium-san-diego-20150609-story.html http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/jun/08/chargers-city-special-election-gambit-acee/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Well said YOLO!! I kept thinking of the Buffalo/Toronto comparison. I had that thought also, but Toronto is in a different country. If the Bills moved to Rochester or Syracuse, I think that would have caused less consternation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 9, 2015 Author Share Posted June 9, 2015 I had that thought also, but Toronto is in a different country. If the Bills moved to Rochester or Syracuse, I think that would have caused less consternation. Maybe so, but that does not have the same "big guy swallowing up little guy" that LA/SD or BUF/TOR would have had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I can tell you that the Chargers employees believe that they will be moving to LA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Chargers update: http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-chargers-stadium-san-diego-20150609-story.html http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/jun/08/chargers-city-special-election-gambit-acee/ thanks for the updates. According to the first article, there would be 3 teams in LA.? I can't see LA supporting 3 NFL teams. Maybe so, but that does not have the same "big guy swallowing up little guy" that LA/SD or BUF/TOR would have had. good point also. Although it's funny to think of SD as a "small guy," but compared to LA it def is. Any update on the impact on Rivers if the franchise moves to LA? If he wouldn't go, should we want SD to move in long-shot hopes that we land Rivers? !? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 9, 2015 Author Share Posted June 9, 2015 thanks for the updates. According to the first article, there would be 3 teams in LA.? I can't see LA supporting 3 NFL teams. good point also. Although it's funny to think of SD as a "small guy," but compared to LA it def is. Any update on the impact on Rivers if the franchise moves to LA? If he wouldn't go, should we want SD to move in long-shot hopes that we land Rivers? !? That is an interesting thought. I have no idea if there is any update on that. it sounds as if some progress is being made. Our best bet on that is for the Chargers to not sign him before the year and go like 6-10. At that point they may try to tag and trade him if they don't believe that their team is very good. What is the reason to tie up $20+M a year in a QB in his mid 30's if you are not going to be competitive? They could potentially add 1-2 more 1sts to go with what is probably a top 7-8 pick in that scenario. That would be a nice way to start the rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I can tell you that the Chargers employees believe that they will be moving to LA. You've hinted at having a family member in the front office of an NFL team. I guess we now know which team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 yeah not sure NFL will succeed in L.A. but the stadium could be used for a million different things. really crappy part of town though. good luck getting in an out of there. Lakers games at the Forum bad enough. how about 4x the number of people. yikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Once LA has a team what is the NFL going to do without having the power to threaten a local municipality with no team unless they give in to their demands? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vorpma Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Saint Louis is a stolen team to begin with, I could care less about them. yeah not sure NFL will succeed in L.A. but the stadium could be used for a million different things. really crappy part of town though. good luck getting in an out of there. Lakers games at the Forum bad enough. how about 4x the number of people. yikes. If LA is such a great NFL market, why no team for all these years. Truth is it is not a great NFL market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 If LA is such a great NFL market, why no team for all these years. Truth is it is not a great NFL market. This kinda gets thrown around a lot - I'm not sure I would say "LA is a bad NFL market" as much as "LA is a complicated political market". I spend a lot of time in SoCal and I know PLENTY of football fans out there that would definitely support a team (especially in a nice spanking new stadium)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 If LA is such a great NFL market, why no team for all these years. Truth is it is not a great NFL market. It's the 2nd largest TV market in the country. That's what the NFL cares about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KollegeStudnet Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) If the Warriors win: Oaktown should riot across the street, burning the Oakland Colliseum to the ground, making the city rebuild a new crib for the Raiders. If the Warriors lose: Oaktown should riot across the street, burning the Oakland Colliseum to the ground, making the city rebuild a new crib for the Raiders. If LA is such a great NFL market, why no team for all these years. Truth is it is not a great NFL market. The sad part is it is a great market, but the teams that were there before were burned by false claims and lies on getting new stadiums they were promised by SoCal governing Edited June 9, 2015 by KollegeStudnet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearwater cadet Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Lets get real, the only thing that saved the Bills in Buffalo was Ted Rogers died before Ralph could sell him the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vorpma Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 If the Warriors win: Oaktown should riot across the street, burning the Oakland Colliseum to the ground, making the city rebuild a new crib for the Raiders. If the Warriors lose: Oaktown should riot across the street, burning the Oakland Colliseum to the ground, making the city rebuild a new crib for the Raiders. The sad part is it is a great market, but the teams that were there before were burned by false claims and lies on getting new stadiums they were promised by SoCal governing I attended NFL games in LA and it was not your typical NFL experience; boring to say the least. Many competing venues for the entertainment dollar and zero enthusiasm for the Rams or the Raiders. Not buying that previous teams were burned; why did no one in the NFL relocate to LA over the last twenty years? It's a lousy market, much like Toronto. Lets get real, the only thing that saved the Bills in Buffalo was Ted Rogers died before Ralph could sell him the team. And you have the facts to back this up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramblin' Rob Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Lets get real, the only thing that saved the Bills in Buffalo was Ted Rogers died before Ralph could sell him the team. Lets get real, is this an opinion or a fact you can substantiate? You Ralph bashers are pathetic. Disagree with how he ran the team, but the man died and left the vast majority of his money to two poor cities, in addition to having a lease and language in his will that made it difficult for the team to be moved. Substantiate your claim or get a life. Respectfully. Edited June 9, 2015 by Ramblin' Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBear Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 San Diego is as good as gone. The owner doesn't want to be there and they are doing everything in their power to encourage the city government, residents, and fans to just give up and let them go. Kudos to Mayor Faulconer for at least putting up a fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 This kinda gets thrown around a lot - I'm not sure I would say "LA is a bad NFL market" as much as "LA is a complicated political market". I spend a lot of time in SoCal and I know PLENTY of football fans out there that would definitely support a team (especially in a nice spanking new stadium)... I think you got the nail on the head there in regard to the problem. Fans: we want a NFL team! Politics: Ok, but you're gonna pay through the nose for it Fans: vote for other guy! He wants to tax us to build a stadium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 It's the 2nd largest TV market in the country. That's what the NFL cares about Actually, the LA ratings are what they are, with or without teams located there, and that's always been the case. Home team presence would barely move the ratings needle in LA. If it were strictly a matter of increasing ratings to garner more in broadcast rights from the networks, there would have been teams there long ago. TV ratings in LA are a double-edged sword for the broadcasters, especially the local affiliates. The last time the Raiders played there, it wasn't unusual for them to be beat out in the Sunday afternoon ratings by local programming. Not good when a re-run of 'Gilligan's Island' is beating out a Raiders/Chiefs game in the ratings. However, owners have other reasons for wanting a presence their now; chiefly the sheer amount of stadium revenues to be generated via the huge corporate dollars available there. That dynamic has shifted tremendously since a team was last located there. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF Bills Fan Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 The Rams are as good as gone. The Raiders have little hope at all of staying in Oakland. I think the league sincerely wants the Chargers to remain in San Diego. I don't think they care so much on the Rams and Raiders moving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I think you got the nail on the head there in regard to the problem. Fans: we want a NFL team! Politics: Ok, but you're gonna pay through the nose for it Fans: vote for other guy! He wants to tax us to build a stadium That about sums it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Lets get real, the only thing that saved the Bills in Buffalo was Ted Rogers died before Ralph could sell him the team.Nah. The only thing that saved the bills in buffalo was Terry pegula coming along. He wasn't getting outbid by anyone. He wasn't just some dude who bought the bills by default; he's the fourth richest owner in the nfl. I would agree that without him magically appearing out of thin air to buy the sabres and then the bills, it's very likely that someone from another market would've bought and moved the bills. We owe a great deal to the man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 With the 49's in self destruct , a move by Raiders to there stadium might work now. Give Oakland time to build a new stadium maybe. It looks like Rams owner is serious moving to LA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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