BuffalothruMyVeins Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 I have been reading some of the posts around here about drafting a mid-rounder QB this year, and if EJ fails this season, maybe we're in position to draft a top QB next year. So that's 2 picks spent o. What are ultimately question marks. I have also heard that we have a roster that, other than developing a QB (who may already be on the team), is playoff-worthy... And I generally agree with that. Maybe not quite Super Bowl worthy yet, but with above average QB play I think we are a problem for teams. So my idea is: what if we take a WIN RIGHT NOW track, and trade this year's first round pick plus next year's, for an above average QB, to help us take a run at this for the next 3 years, before our veteran player's talent begins to ebb. Mario, Kyle, McKelvin, Fred, Stevie, Chandler, and maybe even Wood and CJ could be at their peaks right now, with only down to go in the next couple years, and we're looking for improvement at core positions again. If we trade the two firsts, yes, it takes 2 valuable picks we could have used to replace these guys, and could further accelerate our downhill slide if we trade them away for a veteran QB. However, that high price is basically the cost of doing business to get out of this 18-24th best team range we have been in for 2 or 3 years now. Yes, this idea is aggressive, bold, and risky, but I would rather be too bold, than too conservative. I would rather be caught being too Pettine than too Jauron. With all of that said, let's take a look and see who could conceivably be pried loose for 2 first rounders. Carson Palmer Matt Ryan Joe Flacco Cam Newton Jay Cutler Andy Dalton Tony Romo Peyton Manning Matt Stafford Aaron Rogers Matt Schaub Andrew Luck Chad Henne Alex Smith Ryan Tannehill Christian Ponder Matt Cassell Josh Freeman Tom Brady Drew Brees Eli Manning Geno Smith Terrell Pryor Nick Foles Ben Roethlisberger Phillip Rivers Colin Kaepernick Russell Wilson Sam Bradford Mike Glennon Ryan Fitzpatrick Jake Locker Robert Griffin Kirk Cousins Obviously some of these guys cannot be pried lose from their teams for anything...: Peyton Manning Tom Brady Aaron Rogers Andrew Luck and probably Matt Ryan Cam Newton Joe Flacco Russell Wilson and Eli Manning Also, obviously, I wouldn't give up two first rounders to put us over the top for...: Carson Palmer Andy Dalton Matt Schaub Chad Henne Christian Ponder Matt Cassell Josh Freeman Geno Smith Terrell Pryor Mike Glennon Ryan Fitzpatrick Jake Locker and Kirk Cousins So that leaves... Jay Cutler Matt Stafford Ryan Tannehill Alex Smith Nick Foles Ben Roethlisberger Phillip Rivers Colin Kaepernick Sam Bradford Robert Griffin I'm not a fan of Tannehill, Foles has only done it one year, and Griffin's knee scares me (plus Washington gave up so much to move up in the draft to get him, I think if they sold on him after 2 years for "only" 2 firsts, it would be admitting defeat, even though they could pin it on a previous regime. They will live or die by him). The remaining ones would provide us enough production with minimal growing pains while our team makes a run. My personal favorite would be Phillip Rivers, but he probably wouldn't be available for the 2 picks, but who knows. Maybe if we packaged Manuel, it would have a chance. My second would be: Romo, then Roethlisberger, Cutler, Stafford, Kaepernick, Bradford, Smith. Where in this list would you think we could get the best return for the 2 picks, maybe giving up Manuel plus the 2 firsts for Kaepernick? Who do you guys think we could get, and who would you want? Would say 3 years of going for it be a good gamble to then not be as good right after the run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 None. Of your list Andrew Luck is the only one. I personally think Sam Bradford is worth a High first the kid has been screwed by crappy lines and no WR's since he has been there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffalothruMyVeins Posted March 22, 2014 Author Share Posted March 22, 2014 None. Of your list Andrew Luck is the only one. I personally think Sam Bradford is worth a High first the kid has been screwed by crappy lines and no WR's since he has been there. You really don't think 3 years of Roethlisberger, Cutler, Romo, or Rivers are worth the playoff runs that would go with it, not even to mention Manning, Brady, Rogers, Ryan, or Brees?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 (edited) Luck Rogers Cam Edited March 22, 2014 by filthymcnasty08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Jameis Winston next yr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt. Dan's Revenge Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 There is ZERO chance that the Colts would trade Andrew Luck for 2 first rounders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Rogers Luck Brees That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Aaron Rodgers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 in order, with a heavy bias on age. Luck - 24 Rodgers - 30 Brady - 36 Manning - 37 Rivers - 32 Newton - 24 Ryan - 28 Foles - 25 Cutler - 30 Wilson - 25 Kaepernick - 26 Brees - 35 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Another thing to point out is that if we DO give up a couple first rounders to get an above average QB, I bet that Spiller will actually look like 1st round talent and can be traded for a 1st. I'm not on the team Trade Spiller squad. Just pointing out that a great QB makes other players look good and raise their value. The "building through the draft" idea didn't work for the Bills because of who was drafting for us so I wouldn't have minded the whole giving up two 1st round picks idea when Nix and Donahue was at the steering wheel. But I gotta say, I like what Whaley did last year and I'm hoping that if he's consistent in finding talent, we will eventually have an amazing team. QB is the topic at hand though. We all know we don't have that QB right now, but let's just see what EJ can do at least one more year before we have the QB discussion again. We have other needs. QB is important but average QB play can get you to the playoffs (which is all I care about). With a stout defense and average QB we can get to the playoffs once again. Once we get to the playoffs we can whine about not getting to the Superbowl. Til then, let's just worry about getting to the playoffs and I think EJ can get us there if we had other pieces in place (and if he can stay healthy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Andrew Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Why would we trade two first rounders? I thought we were supposed to draft a first round QB every year until one becomes a probowl/superbowl all star hall of fame world series champion the first season they play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Johnny Unitas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) Why would we trade two first rounders? I thought we were supposed to draft a first round QB every year until one becomes a probowl/superbowl all star hall of fame world series champion the first season they play? that way you only have to waste 2 first rounders on a sure thing. Edited March 23, 2014 by papazoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLEN1QB Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Fitzpatrick i hear hes good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 None. None may work in our system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 None, because the only people who might be worth it are on the downside of their careers. It always seems like a great idea until you are left with no QB and no 1st round picks. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) I would give up 4 first round picks for luck. If we are a good team they would be low first round picks anyway and if you have a good qb and are winning its easy to bring in quality free agents. Since we won't and I value qb so highly I would be satisfied if we draft a qb every year until we find our guy that we can win with. Is it EJ? I dont know yet but I hope it is.... Edited March 23, 2014 by drinkTHEkoolaid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Drew Brees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalover4life Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I would trade 2 drafts for luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGUNBILLS Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 With how hard it has become to find an elite franchise QB, I don't believe anyone would dance with us for two first rounders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estro Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I like Marcus Mariota in next years draft. I think he would've been the 1st QB taken in this years draft when it all shook out had he thrown his hat in the ring. I think next season will really solidify his stock as the probable #1 overall pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) I would trade 2 firsts for Rivers tomorrow. The guy literally turned back the clock last season playing with only one competent WR and an aging Gates. SD defense was horrible and they made it to the second round. Rivers on this Bills roster goes 11-5. We're basically like the 2009 Chargers without a QB anyway. And we don't have Kaeding, who singlehandedly choked a playoff game away. Edited March 23, 2014 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 You really don't think 3 years of Roethlisberger, Cutler, Romo, or Rivers are worth the playoff runs that would go with it, not even to mention Manning, Brady, Rogers, Ryan, or Brees?? Roethlisberger and Rivers yes, cutler and (are you serious) Romo no. Of course I give that for the greats but as the OP said their teams aren't parting with them for any thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Aaron Rogers! It's a fantasy as none of the top guys will ever go anywhere even if you gave your entire draft away. These teams are not dumb. Once you get a franchise QB, you don't ever give him up for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 This whole thread makes me hate Indy. They are fortunate enough for an entire decade of kicking ass with Peyton. They suffer through one crappy season and win the lottery for another decade for kick ass with luck. Why? I hate the football gods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffalothruMyVeins Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 Aaron Rogers! It's a fantasy as none of the top guys will ever go anywhere even if you gave your entire draft away. These teams are not dumb. Once you get a franchise QB, you don't ever give him up for anything. That's true, and I know that, that's why that wasn't the stated premise of the thread in my OP. I know top QBs can't be pryed loose for anything short of a majority stake in team ownership, that's why the thread was which ABOVE AVERAGE QB could we get for 2 first rounders. They're not top 5 QBs, probably not top 10, but can play well enough for us to make a 3 year run with them. See: Roethlisberger, Romo, Cutler, Stafford, or best case scenario, Rivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloFan68 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Kaepernick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Aaron Rodgers is the ONLY QB in the league I would give two 1st round picks for at the moment. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Kaepernick Kaepernick has a near-perfect situation with an outstanding OL with 2 1st round OTs and a 1st round OG, a pro-bowl TE, WRs Michael Crabtree and Anquan Boldin and RB Frank Gore. Yet, he hasn't been all that great, so I think he is too unproven to give up 2 1st round PICKS for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffalothruMyVeins Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 Aaron Rodgers is the ONLY QB in the league I would give two 1st round picks for at the moment. GO BILLS!!! Can you explain why, though? Do you think our next 2 first rounders would contribute more than, hypothetically, Andrew Luck? If our next 2 first rounders are, say, a RT this year and a safety next year, we could just draft a RT in the 2nd round this year and get a safety elsewhere next off season, and be in almost the exact same place at those positions, but have QB fixed for the next 10 years. First rounders are not some untouchable, direly necessary asset, unless you're in the NBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 probably just Luck, I don't get the Brees answers he will 36 next season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 None, because the only people who might be worth it are on the downside of their careers. It always seems like a great idea until you are left with no QB and no 1st round picks. PTR So we can't take an OT or a DB for 2 years in the first round? Big deal. To the OP, if we are just (pseudorealistically) choosing from the "so that leaves these" list--it has to be Kaeperninck. Youngest and most talented of that group. No brainer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 So we can't take an OT or a DB for 2 years in the first round? Big deal. To the OP, if we are just (pseudorealistically) choosing from the "so that leaves these" list--it has to be Kaeperninck. Youngest and most talented of that group. No brainer. I'm a Kaep fan but you did realize he had a low completion % than EJ right? And the only answer to this for me is Aaron Rodgers. But this also goes to why you need to be patient when developing young Qbs. Brees was a 2nd rounder. Rodgers was a late 1st. Kaep was a 2nd rounder. Maybe we should give our own guy more than a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Here's the problem I see with your logic. So why not just use one of those 1st round picks and draft that sure fire franchise QB? Answer is because we or anyone else really have no good way of predicting who that guy will be. So if we don't know who he'll be, why would another team who also doesn't know who that franchise guy will be make the trade and give up on a sure thing? Second problem is as you've eluded to we're just a QB away from being real good. You could draft that next star QB, but again the issue is first figuring out who he is, then you still may likely need to wait a couple of years for him to develop into that star. Well that's the same problem these teams you mention as trading partners, for the most part, they are also either close to or already winning teams, so they'd be taking a step back in time to make that trade, so again why would they. The only way I could see a team even consider making the deal would be if they were a team with a very good QB, but the team was complexly on the down side of winning. Looking at your list, there really aren't any teams in the category with a good QB on a terrible team. Likely the reason is the good QB elevates the entire team around him. I'd als obe scared to death of any team willing to make that trade as likely the QB we'd be getting must not be nearly as good as we think, else why would the team have given him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 What is this I don't even Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Can you explain why, though? Do you think our next 2 first rounders would contribute more than, hypothetically, Andrew Luck? If our next 2 first rounders are, say, a RT this year and a safety next year, we could just draft a RT in the 2nd round this year and get a safety elsewhere next off season, and be in almost the exact same place at those positions, but have QB fixed for the next 10 years. First rounders are not some untouchable, direly necessary asset, unless you're in the NBA. I understand the value of two #1 picks moving forward. I also understand the value of an HOF QB with the most shelf-life left in him. We would get much more out of Rodgers, who's played behind some of the worst lines in the league, than Andrew Luck in the short term. When Andrew Luck reaches Rodgers-like status in a couple years, we'll still have a future HOF QB not yet close to the end, so I like AR for the long term as well. Luck would be my next choice, though. And no, you're not gonna get nearly as much out of ANY 1st round pick than you would out of an HOF QB. Simply by virtue of the position itself. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealityCheck Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The teams that would give up their QB for 2 first round picks probably don't have a QB worth taking if a Super Bowl victory is the goal. The teams that do have a QB that I would be willing to give 2 first rounders for would not give their guys up at that price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The teams that would give up their QB for 2 first round picks probably don't have a QB worth taking if a Super Bowl victory is the goal. The teams that do have a QB that I would be willing to give 2 first rounders for would not give their guys up at that price. This is true, too. Just an interesting exercise in hypothetical transactions. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 So we can't take an OT or a DB for 2 years in the first round? Big deal. To the OP, if we are just (pseudorealistically) choosing from the "so that leaves these" list--it has to be Kaeperninck. Youngest and most talented of that group. No brainer. A miss. but close Weo. Its Luck . He is The One for the next decade. I would trade my left shoe and walk crooked for Andrew to be the Buffalo Bill " Leading the Charge " There is ZERO chance that the Colts would trade Andrew Luck for 2 first rounders. okay how about 3 ? Johnny Unitas but only with Earl Morrall in a package deal ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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