Is Brady coaching for his job?

[whorlnut]

After the eagles game, many (including myself) were satisfied enough to declare Brady the OC next year if McD stays. I think after what we saw under Dorsey, any semblance of an nfl offense was a welcome sight so we may have jumped the gun in what Brady was capable of. Now?  Well…this offense is a mess. Allen and the receivers are way off…Diggs is a non factor since Brady took over…we are running Murray up the guy on third and 1 instead of letting our hulking qb dive over the top to move the chains, etc. 

 

Could Joe Brady be coaching for his job today this week? I’m not saying he won’t be the guy next year either way, but the job might come open if we lose and miss the playoffs. We have way too much in a franchise qb to be wasting him with ineffective coaching. I’d rather open up the HC position in favor of an offensive mind, but we all know that’s not likely to happen. 
 

What say you?

[ShakAttack]

Considering the Bills have always been effective on offense against Miami no matter the year or coordinator, and considering Miami does not have Jaelen Phillips or Bradley Chubb, I would probably agree with this. If the Bills offense is sputtering against Miami, and especially if we end up losing, I can’t imagine Brady is back next season as OC.

 

I personally think our offense will come to play though.  The thing is too, a lot of this falls on Josh Allen and his receivers.  There is a combination of bad drops by receivers  and bad misses by Allen lately, and that can’t happen on Sunday night.  Especially in a game where we may HAVE to get off to a fast start like the last time we faced Miami.

 

that is where I am mostly concerned. This offense is back to getting off to slow starts which cannot happen this week.

[QLBillsFan]

At some point the players have to execute. JA with multiple in accurate throws, several drops, poor OL play. Not all on the OC with either guy. I would be surprised if Brady is not back win or lose. 

[whorlnut]

4 minutes ago, BobBelcher said:

Considering the Bills have always been effective on offense against Miami no matter the year or coordinator, and considering Miami does not have Jaelen Phillips or Bradley Chubb, I would probably agree with this. If the Bills offense is sputtering against Miami, and especially if we end up losing, I can’t imagine Brady is back next season as OC.

 

I personally think our offense will come to play though.  The thing is too, a lot of this falls on Josh Allen and his receivers.  There is a combination of bad drops by receivers  and bad misses by Allen lately, and that can’t happen on Sunday night.  Especially in a game where we may HAVE to get off to a fast start like the last time we faced Miami.

 

that is where I am mostly concerned. This offense is back to getting off to slow starts which cannot happen this week.

But here’s the argument…Allen was having a really good statistical year with Dorsey and Diggs was on fire. Allen may have had some turnovers, but his completion % was tops in the league. Now it looks like he is back to rookie year Josh. The common denominator seems to be the ocs. 

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I would take a look at bienemy if he's let go by the commanders or frank Reich as OC

[Aussie Joe]

Yes … he is.

 

 

[TBBills Fan]

With millions of dollars  on the line, every coach and player is playing for their job each and every week.  

 

Just imagine, millions to play a game. How serious would you take each and every one?  

[mrags]

15 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

After the eagles game, many (including myself) were satisfied enough to declare Brady the OC next year if McD stays. I think after what we saw under Dorsey, any semblance of an nfl offense was a welcome sight so we may have jumped the gun in what Brady was capable of. Now?  Well…this offense is a mess. Allen and the receivers are way off…Diggs is a non factor since Brady took over…we are running Murray up the guy on third and 1 instead of letting our hulking qb dive over the top to move the chains, etc. 

 

Could Joe Brady be coaching for his job today this week? I’m not saying he won’t be the guy next year either way, but the job might come open if we lose and miss the playoffs. We have way too much in a franchise qb to be wasting him with ineffective coaching. I’d rather open up the HC position in favor of an offensive mind, but we all know that’s not likely to happen. 
 

What say you?

You know that saying about wishing in one hand and crapping in the other and seeing which fills up first. Well….

[Bferra13]

Schopp brought up an interesting point yesterday on post-game. He said that this is exactly what McDermott wants. A run heavy offense that can control the clock and keep the d fresh. If this is the ultimate goal, i hate it. We had it really good with Dabol and I didn't appreciate that at the time like I should have.

[Aussie Joe]

3 minutes ago, Bferra13 said:

Schopp brought up an interesting point yesterday on post-game. He said that this is exactly what McDermott wants. A run heavy offense that can control the clock and keep the d fresh. If this is the ultimate goal, i hate it. We had it really good with Dabol and I didn't appreciate that at the time like I should have.

Schopp just dirty that he has got Gabe and Diggs in his fantasy teams …

[FireChans]

3 minutes ago, Bferra13 said:

Schopp brought up an interesting point yesterday on post-game. He said that this is exactly what McDermott wants. A run heavy offense that can control the clock and keep the d fresh. If this is the ultimate goal, i hate it. We had it really good with Dabol and I didn't appreciate that at the time like I should have.

We used to have a passing offense that struggled without a running game.

 

At least the running game works now. 
 

I don’t buy this is what McD wants. McD wants a 21 point lead lol.

[Aussie Joe]

At least McD is smart enough to know that you don’t go out of the Shotgun to get 1 yard 

[PBF81]

It was definitely a rash judgement to have annointed him our next OC.  

 

It always takes a bunch of games for a steady-state of play to emerge, during that time opposing coaches and coordinators contribute to defining that.  

 

Unfortunately for McD, that's going to impact him as well, perhaps not in immediate job security, but at minimum in terms of future expectations.  

 

We'll see.  First things first, gotta beat Miami.  Hoping that Tennessee beats the Jags with their division and playoffs on the line isn't wise.  Whether Pittsburgh with Rudolph can beat the Ravens' second teamers remains to be seen, as it even does that they don't play Jackson.  

 

Then of course if we do make the playoffs, if we get ousted by a worse team, which is pretty much every team in the AFC with the possible exception of Baltimore, then that will factor in as well.  

 

 

1 minute ago, Aussie Joe said:

At least McD is smart enough to know that you don’t go out of the Shotgun to get 1 yard 

 

Is he?  

 

 

[Rubes]

25 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

After the eagles game, many (including myself) were satisfied enough to declare Brady the OC next year if McD stays. I think after what we saw under Dorsey, any semblance of an nfl offense was a welcome sight so we may have jumped the gun in what Brady was capable of. Now?  Well…this offense is a mess. Allen and the receivers are way off…Diggs is a non factor since Brady took over…we are running Murray up the guy on third and 1 instead of letting our hulking qb dive over the top to move the chains, etc. 

 

Could Joe Brady be coaching for his job today this week? I’m not saying he won’t be the guy next year either way, but the job might come open if we lose and miss the playoffs. We have way too much in a franchise qb to be wasting him with ineffective coaching. I’d rather open up the HC position in favor of an offensive mind, but we all know that’s not likely to happen. 
 

What say you?

 

Brady has always been coaching for his job. He's interim, its not like he's assured the spot for next year. He knows he has to produce every week.

 

 

8 minutes ago, Bferra13 said:

Schopp brought up an interesting point yesterday on post-game. He said that this is exactly what McDermott wants. A run heavy offense that can control the clock and keep the d fresh. If this is the ultimate goal, i hate it. We had it really good with Dabol and I didn't appreciate that at the time like I should have.

 

I can say with confidence that this is NOT exactly what McDermott wants. I'm sure he would like a run-heavy offense like we saw against Dallas, but not what we've seen the last couple of weeks. If he wants a run-heavy offense, it's to take the pressure off of Allen and allow him to use play action better and to be more productive with the receivers when he does throw. We're not seeing that, at least not yet. I can't imagine this is what McDermott wants...he wants this, but with a better, more opportunistic passing game.

 

[PBF81]

7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

We used to have a passing offense that struggled without a running game.

 

At least the running game works now. 

 

A lot of that is narrative based upon aggregate stats which are skewed by that Dallas game.  Cook's our primary ball carrier and apart from the Dallas game, he's averaged an incredibly pedestrian 3.7 YPC otherwise in five games under Brady.  He has no rushing TDs in any of those games.  

 

 

[SirAndrew]

If the offense looks good in the playoffs, keep Brady. If we fall short with the offense still looking average, maybe it’s time for a fresh prospective. He’s done a lot of good things, but this offense struggles mightily without Diggs being elite every game. The Dallas game where Cook went crazy was the exception with someone unexpected stepping up. I don’t think you can replace the elite version of Diggs, but I’m not fully satisfied with how Brady makes use of the roster. I have yet to see Brady or Dorsey use Shakir and Kincaid the way they should be utilized. Allen is elite, we need to put him and his teammates in better positions to succeed. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

I hope so.

 

He needs to compete for that role.

 

He’s 34 with a fairly thin resume. 

[Scott7975]

He's been coaching for the job since he became interim. 

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

A lot of that is narrative based upon aggregate stats which are skewed by that Dallas game.  Cook's our primary ball carrier and apart from the Dallas game, he's averaged an incredibly pedestrian 3.7 YPC otherwise in five games under Brady.  He has no rushing TDs in any of those games.  

 

 

Not really.

 

James Cook has had one game with less than 16 carries since Brady took over.

 

He had 5 such games under Dorsey.

[whorlnut]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

He's been coaching for the job since he became interim. 

Not really my point but I get what you’re saying. Many level headed folks (including Joe Marino) were saying just make him the OC going into next year and move on. They were happy to see the offensive improvements in the run game and Allen looked really good against the eagles. The run game continues to look decent, but the qb and receivers are totally off. Diggs is a non factor. This team goes as Josh Allen goes…I think we can all agree with that. It just hasn’t been effective for a month now. 

[PBF81]

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Not really.

 

James Cook has had one game with less than 16 carries since Brady took over.

 

He had 5 such games under Dorsey.

 

I think you missed the point.  

 

3.7 YPC sucks.  

 

So yeah, more carries, but to what effect generally.  

 

Personally I'd rather see Diggs with 6-8 catches and 100 +/- yards.  

 

 

[PBF81]

12 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Not really.

 

James Cook has had one game with less than 16 carries since Brady took over.

 

He had 5 such games under Dorsey.

 

BTW, our offense in general has not been significantly different in terms of points or yards on average than it was before Brady, and the trend is not favorable.  

 

We'll obviously see how it shakes out on Sunday.  

 

 

[FireChans]

9 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

I think you missed the point.  

 

3.7 YPC sucks.  

 

So yeah, more carries, but to what effect generally.  

 

Personally I'd rather see Diggs with 6-8 catches and 100 +/- yards.  

 

 

To the effect that the Bills have one loss under Brady. In the “hard” part of our schedule.

 

Diggs fell off before Dorsey got canned so I don’t think that’s a Brady thing, personally.

[MJS]

If Brady can't untether the passing offense, he doesn't get the job next year. Simple as that. It's a passing league. We have Josh Allen and Stef Diggs, two premier passing game weapons. Figure it out.

 

But good job on the run game.

[Nihilarian]

It wasn't Brady who dropped 3 passes that would have been first downs in that NE game...and instead, they were forced to punt. All the drops by the Bills offensive players started to look like the #1 drop team again.  It wasn't Brady that was off-target for a lot of that game.

 

It wasn't Brady who was manhandled at the LoS for the offense, one NE player was double-teamed by the Bills and he STILL got to Allen for the sack. Let's face it the Patriots D line was in Allen's face most of the game.

 

Players need to do their jobs and when they face an underachieving opponent they need to step up and not play down to them. Buffalo could have lost this game, could have lost the Chargers game, could have lost so many games this season. Bucs, Giants, Chiefs. 

 

 

 

 

[Scott7975]

21 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Not really my point but I get what you’re saying. Many level headed folks (including Joe Marino) were saying just make him the OC going into next year and move on. They were happy to see the offensive improvements in the run game and Allen looked really good against the eagles. The run game continues to look decent, but the qb and receivers are totally off. Diggs is a non factor. This team goes as Josh Allen goes…I think we can all agree with that. It just hasn’t been effective for a month now. 

 

Still crossed on it myself.  I need to see more.  Its not a good look when your head coach who is also DC takes over an offensive play call at the end of the game though.  Some of this is also execution error.  Diggs I think is injured.  Dude has been a 50-60% snap count for the last 3 games.  No chance that is scheme.

[TheWeatherMan]

38 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

At least McD is smart enough to know that you don’t go out of the Shotgun to get 1 yard 

When McD is a Breyer OC than your OC it’s time to look externally for help.  Enough of this promote from within cronyism crap. 

[Marcus Aurelius]

 

Either that or he'll be couching  ...

[RunTheBall]

I want to scrap this whole EP system. It’s too complex yet looks vanilla and is too hard for players to pick it up quickly. Why should it take a RB (Hines, Lenny) a half a season to get up to speed from a simple position. Imagine what the WRs have to absorb in order to even start to get on the field. I think a lot of our offensive problems stem from Josh and the WRs not being on the same page post snap.

 

IDK if Brady is the guy to do it. If he has an offensive system of his own that is pass first yet still incorporates the running game, decreases the amount of post-snap processing Josh and the WRs need to do, and incorporates some basic effective plays like RB screens, slants, TE down the seams, I wouldn’t be against it.

 

 

[LarryMadman]

4 minutes ago, MJS said:

If Brady can't untether the passing offense, he doesn't get the job next year. Simple as that. It's a passing league. We have Josh Allen and Stef Diggs, two premier passing game weapons. Figure it out.

 

But good job on the run game.

So rate Brady based on his effectiveness of calling Dorseys offense, no.

 

I think the only way Brady doesn't stick next year is if he goes totally rogue against what McD wants or shows utter incompetence. He's done neither so I think he returns with his offense and they are better next year.

[Alphadawg7]

52 minutes ago, QLBillsFan said:

At some point the players have to execute. JA with multiple in accurate throws, several drops, poor OL play. Not all on the OC with either guy. I would be surprised if Brady is not back win or lose. 

 

This.

 

Previous 6 games before Dorsey was fired, the offense averaged 20 PPG and went 2-4 most of which was against bad teams and weak defenses.  First 6 games under Brady, offense is avg 28 PPG and is 5-1 and should be 6-0 if not for some gaffs unrelated to Brady and his job.  

 

Against NE, the offense sputtered, but honestly, it was mostly on Josh Allen and the other players.  Josh had one of his least accurate games I can recall him having since his first year in throwing the football.  Can't fault Brady when Allen couldn't deliver the ball accurately most of the game.  It happens, some games even the best QB's just are off for whatever reason, even the great Mahomes has had games like that.  

 

And THIS is actually the massive difference between Dorsey and Brady.  When the offense isn't executing on the field, Brady adjusts and gets other things going like Allen and his legs, the run game, etc to find ways to get points.  Hence why a down game under Brady is still in the mid 20's compared to 14 to 17 points under Dorsey.  The offenses floor under Brady is way higher than Dorsey, and that has literally been the difference in winning some of these closer games and losing them under Dorsey.  

 

Unless the offense just gets completely out coached like Dorsey did on the regular, then I highly doubt Brady's role here as OC is in any real jeopardy right now.  

 

 

[Buffalo03]

1 hour ago, whorlnut said:

After the eagles game, many (including myself) were satisfied enough to declare Brady the OC next year if McD stays. I think after what we saw under Dorsey, any semblance of an nfl offense was a welcome sight so we may have jumped the gun in what Brady was capable of. Now?  Well…this offense is a mess. Allen and the receivers are way off…Diggs is a non factor since Brady took over…we are running Murray up the guy on third and 1 instead of letting our hulking qb dive over the top to move the chains, etc. 

 

Could Joe Brady be coaching for his job today this week? I’m not saying he won’t be the guy next year either way, but the job might come open if we lose and miss the playoffs. We have way too much in a franchise qb to be wasting him with ineffective coaching. I’d rather open up the HC position in favor of an offensive mind, but we all know that’s not likely to happen. 
 

What say you?

What guy? 

[KingBoots8]

He has been since day one. McD also knows his seat will be in flames if we miss the post season. Everyone needs to perform/coach to their absolute best going forward,

 

Brady is capable, but he may not be the best answer out there. He has 5 more games this year to show he deserves to keep his job. He needs to make sure he actually gets 5 games to keep what he has. I won’t judge him until we see how he does under some bright lights. They were bright when he took the job, but we need to pull of some major wins, and our opponents are gonna feel that pressure and motivation too.

[Big Blitz]

Yea my fear now is defenses have figured out what he’s doing.  
 

The Chargers and now Patriots.  
 

This was always the concern with this carousel of OCs.  If Brady is replaced that’s 4 OCs in the last 3 years (including Dabol).

 

 

It had become the main reason many of us were saying McD has to be replaced.  
 

In an ideal world McD is the DC and the next McVay is HC.   
 

I’m hopeful in Brady - but he clearly got it handed to him this week.  
 

Fangio, while being nowhere near what Miami hoped, I fear his big game is coming despite the injuries on that D because he is going against a novice OC and he’s at home.  

[Doc Brown]

Defensive coordinators have more tape on Brady now so we'll see what counter adjustments he makes against the Fins.  The passing game needs to be better.  If our offense lays another egg than we should absolutely be looking to upgrade.  Yesterday wasn't great but Allen played awful, the WR's were awful besides Shakir, and we had two key drops by our RB's.  There were two big plays missed (wheel route to Cook and the bomb to Diggs) that if Josh throws it better we might be having a different conversation right now.  Having said that, he needs to be more creative with his play calling.  Stop slamming your head against the wall with those WR screens.

Edited January 1 by Doc Brown

[Alphadawg7]

14 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

BTW, our offense in general has not been significantly different in terms of points or yards on average than it was before Brady, and the trend is not favorable.  

 

We'll obviously see how it shakes out on Sunday.  

 

 

 

Dorseys final 6 games and Bradys first 6 games the offense is averaging 8 points more per game.  That is a massive difference in the NFL in scoring very difficult to achieve even with an entire offseason to overhaul an offense.  To pretend like the offense isn't significantly better over what Dorsey's offense had become is laughable.  

 

Sure, Dorsey's offense SKEWED its season total because of 2 1/2 games of football (2nd half week 2, week 3, and week 4) against bad defenses...but then it fell off a cliff never to recover.  Dorsey led offense lost to BOTH Zac Wilson and Mac Jones in the same season.  Dorsey led offense was 1-2 vs the Jets (both losses to Zac Wilson) and avg 17 ppg in those 3 games while Brady's first game against the same team scored 32 and benched its starters for almost the entire 4th quarter in a blow out or we would have probably scored 48+.  

 

Dorsey over his final 6 games was 2-4 and we got lucky on final play of both wins to not be 0-6 during the weak part of our schedule because the offense only averaged a pathetic 20 ppg.  Since then, we are 5-1 and should be 6-0 (not Brady's fault) becasue even when the offense has some sputters he finds ways to still get points on the board using the run game and Allens legs...something Dorsey couldn't manage to do even when 3rd and goal from the 6" line where instead of sneaking Allen he twice ran out of shotgun to lose yards in back to back games.  

 

Dorsey was a major problem, to pretend he wasn't tells me that person is just rooted in being negative about all Bills decisions.  We went from 11th seed and out of playoffs to playing for the division title and #2 seed in 6 games of Brady taking over the offense in the hardest stretch of our schedule in the NFL against multiple legit defenses. 

[PBF81]

18 minutes ago, FireChans said:

To the effect that the Bills have one loss under Brady. In the “hard” part of our schedule.

 

Diggs fell off before Dorsey got canned so I don’t think that’s a Brady thing, personally.

 

So yesterday's win was a "Brady thing" then? 

 

In games vs. KC Love on Green Bay played a much better game than Allen did, and Zappe played at least an equally good if not better game against them in weeks before and after we did.  

 

Wins over the Jets and Chargers are hardly impressive, and Dallas is clearly in a slump, averaging not even 17 ppg over the past three weeks.  

 

The point is how well the offense has played, not wins based upon anything including five games with positive TO margins, which has little to do with Brady.  

 

 

[Gman10]

Im a newer football fan so Im curious here

 

1. Isn't Brady kinda young and doing a pretty good job? Aka has a lot of time to improve (on the job training lets say)

 

2. Wouldn't you say Allen/ the offensive just wasn't completing the passes. But the plays were kind of there?

 

3. what strategy would you like to see against the Fins?

[Big Blitz]

I’d start with more under center play action. 

[Roundybout]

1 hour ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

I would take a look at bienemy if he's let go by the commanders or frank Reich as OC

Bienemy is going to be the next Wash coach after Rivera rightfully gets the boot