Are people really that unhappy with our 4-2 Bills?

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, ngbills said:

Much of his success has been due to his off script and improvisation. As he becomes less mobile much of that goes away. Josh is a good QB but it has not been due to playing traditional QB.

Except of course the three blowouts this year when he was making good reads, getting the ball out quick, and spreading it around.  Right?

[Joe Ferguson]

I expect another playoff elimination. Same as the past 5 years.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Some people aren't happy unless they're miserable.

 

I'll take wins, even if they're ugly.

 

[boco357]

I mentioned this in Jags game thread, this team never seems to grind out a game.  Roll up sleeves and win ugly which they did Sunday. I knew with the bad blood between McDermott and Daboll, Giants would be ready to play. Told anyone who bet to take the points.  Winning is hard.

Edited October 18, 2023 by boco357

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, Joe Ferguson said:

I expect another playoff elimination. Same as the past 5 years.

Unfortunately I do as well because I think it will be hard to overcome the loss of Tre, Matt, and DaQuan.

[Beck Water]

I have a friend who is a Patriots fan (don't judge me.  he can't help it, he was born and bred in NE and he pre-dates the Brady years).

 

When the Pats were perennially winning, but losing in the playoffs or AFCCG - say, 2009 to 2013 - he told me you could not believe the fans and media.  Sooo whiny and "Chicken Little"

[TheyCallMeAndy]

I’ll say this: I don’t know any IRL fans who share some of the extreme viewpoints on this MB, or constantly complain as much. 
 

The MB Bills fans are just a weird sub section of the fan base with their own, unique opinions. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

I have a friend who is a Patriots fan (don't judge me.  he can't help it, he was born and bred in NE and he pre-dates the Brady years).

 

When the Pats were perennially winning, but losing in the playoffs or AFCCG - say, 2009 to 2013 - he told me you could not believe the fans and media.  Sooo whiny and "Chicken Little"

 

I said it earlier in the week:

 

Some portion of the bills fanbase here and elsewhere have become Patriots fans

 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, eball said:

I just don't know what to make of this board and our fans these days.  To the uninformed observer, if you just looked at the threads on the first page you'd assume this was a bottom-feeding squad.  The Bills are #3 in scoring offense and scoring defense, +4 in takeaways, and are right in the position most expected them to be when the season began.

 

Nobody ever won the Super Bowl in October, and history is replete with scads of teams that looked "unbeatable" at this juncture and didn't lift the Lombardi.

 

Lately, the issue is with <yawn> Dorsey again...bad gameplan, can't get the ball to anyone other than Diggs, yada, yada, yada.  What I saw Sunday night was a slow start on offense fueled by an untimely fumble, a drop, and a fantastic tip/interception by the Giants on a pass headed to Knox for a big gainer.  When the team returned from halftime they marched down the field twice for TDs and were a fingertip catch away from icing the game.

 

Is everything perfect?  Of course not!  But it never is, and crucifying Dorsey on October 18 -- two weeks after he was called brilliant for his gameplan vs. Miami -- is the perfect lens through which to view Bills fans.

 

Maybe a lot of you really have nothing else to do but sit around and dream up wild conspiracy theories about how Josh could force his way out of Buffalo, psychoanalyze whether Brian Daboll and Sean McDermott have a blood feud, or criticize the Bills for using Diggs as their first option in the passing game.

 

They lost two games by a total of 11 points!

 

The ONLY thing that matters is that the Bills grind out wins so they put themselves into decent playoff position, and that they are playing their best football in DECEMBER.

 

"But it's a fan message board.  That's what we do."

 

Ok.  You be you.  I'll continue to look at what is going right, share my opinions in an upbeat way, and show some faith in the players and coaches to work on what they need to work on.  This can still be a very special season; the league is wide open.

 

Go Bills!

18-2, Babyyyyyy!!!

 

 

This is TBD.

 

People would be complaining if we were 6-0.

[BaaadThingsMan]

Nah. Just want them peaking by the end of the season.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

It is also completely ok to not be playing your best football in September and October. 

[GoBills!]

There has been only like 13 different Superbowl champs since Pats won in 2002. Pats, Giants, Chiefs,Steelers, Bucs won more than once. I could care less if we only have 11 wins and go to the playoffs. If you are hot and healthy when the playoffs come around nothing else matters for those next few games. Many times we talked about how its wasn't the Pats year and boom playoffs come and they turn it up a few levels.

We have a great team and we grind out an ugly win. This is the NFL things happen this isn't a video game and winning 38-10 isn't the norm.

[Success]

55 minutes ago, jahnyc said:

I am certainly unhappy about the injuries.  Hard to have Milano, Jones and White all out for the season, particularly since they are three of my favorite players on the team.  Wish the offense would show some consistency, and I am concerned that we saw similar issues with the offense at different points last season.  Team should be 5-1 given the strength of the teams that they have played so far, so 4-2 is a bit disappointing.

 

I saw that Milano & Jones were "out for the season" on another Bills site this morning.  Do you know if that's really fact at this point?

 

I was under the impression that the Bills had NOT ruled either out for the whole season yet.

 

[ngbills]

3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Except of course the three blowouts this year when he was making good reads, getting the ball out quick, and spreading it around.  Right?

So you really believe if Josh did not have the elite physical skills that he would be just as good? I am not saying he cant be a pocket passer. I am saying he is most effective and dangerous when he can utilize his athleticism, not only to run the ball but also avoid sacks and do the highlight reel stuff that we see. It creates a big issue for defenses trying to defend him. If not lets just go with a more traditional offense and see how it goes. Oh yeah, we just kind of saw that vs the Giants. 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, GoBills! said:

There has been only like 13 different Superbowl champs since Pats won in 2002. Pats, Giants, Chiefs,Steelers, Bucs won more than once. I could care less if we only have 11 wins and go to the playoffs. If you are hot and healthy when the playoffs come around nothing else matters for those next few games. Many times we talked about how its wasn't the Pats year and boom playoffs come and they turn it up a few levels.

We have a great team and we grind out an ugly win. This is the NFL things happen this isn't a video game and winning 38-10 isn't the norm.

its true lol

 

everybody said 'the bills cant win close games!'

 

*Bills win close game 14-9

 

"Not like that!'

[juno999]

I'm gonna wait and see how these next 2 games go against the Pats and Bucs.  Bills receiving threats are pretty much the same as last year with Kincaid out.  He doesn't have many catches, but Kincaid opens things up for other receivers.  I thought Dorsey waited too long to switch things up. 

 

Davis' fumble was a killer.  It killed a drive at Giants 44 and led to Giants FG.  Bills were moving the ball and it's inexcusable for him to fumble.

[eball]

42 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Its about expectations. Are you happy with a playoff contender or do you want a championship. The question is - will it be easier or harder to win next year, the next, etc. With Josh Allen's age and contract plus other players age the time is now to win. So when the team is on track to "only" be fighting for a playoff spot it leads to disappointment. 

 

That's really what you think this season is?

 

Gotta enjoy the journey, man...if you go into a season as a fan saying "Super Bowl or bust" what fun will you ever have?

 

[Logic]

I have always followed a similar pattern with regard to this forum or other Bills forums:

I post a ton in the offseason. I find roster building, scouting rookies, the draft, free agency, and coaching hires all to be super interesting and fun to talk about.

Once the season starts, though? I do a lot less posting here, and a lot less visiting the forums in general. Why? Because everybody is too wildly reactionary after every game. If the Bills play well and win the game, people are booking hotel rooms near the Super Bowl site. If the Bills lose or even win in a way that is not "stylistically appealing", it's like a funeral march around here, with all sorts of posters you've never seen or heard from before crawling out of the woodworks with "Fire Dorsey!" and "bench Poyer!" threads. It's exhausting.

Reasoned analysis and dissection of the game after a loss or an ugly win are necessary -- that's what a forum like this is for. But the over-the-top exaggeration, doom and gloom, and hyperbole that one often finds here are just laughable. 

 

[ngbills]

3 minutes ago, eball said:

 

That's really what you think this season is?

 

Gotta enjoy the journey, man...if you go into a season as a fan saying "Super Bowl or bust" what fun will you ever have?

 

I would not call it Super Bowl or bust. But at this point we are past just competing for a playoff spot and possibly losing the division to MIA. 

[Gunsgoodtime]

2 minutes ago, Logic said:

I have always followed a similar pattern with regard to this forum or other Bills forums:

I post a ton in the offseason. I find roster building, scouting rookies, the draft, free agency, and coaching hires all to be super interesting and fun to talk about.

Once the season starts, though? I do a lot less posting here, and a lot less visiting the forums in general. Why? Because everybody is too wildly reactionary after every game. If the Bills play well and win the game, people are booking hotel rooms near the Super Bowl site. If the Bills lose or even win in a way that is not "stylistically appealing", it's like a funeral march around here, with all sorts of posters you've never seen or heard from before crawling out of the woodworks with "Fire Dorsey!" and "bench Poyer!" threads. It's exhausting.

Reasoned analysis and dissection of the game after a loss or an ugly win are necessary -- that's what a forum like this is for. But the over-the-top exaggeration, doom and gloom, and hyperbole that one often finds here are just laughable. 

 

It's time to clean house!

[zow2]

Gotta win some ugly games along the way but you want to be playing your best football in December/Jan.  The Bills squeaker over the NYG counts the same as Miami's 70-20 win over Denver.  You get style points in college but not in the NFL.  People should chill, let this season play out.

Edited October 18, 2023 by zow2

[Gregg]

1 minute ago, ngbills said:

I would not call it Super Bowl or bust. But at this point we are past just competing for a playoff spot and possibly losing the division to MIA. 

 

The Dolphins are a paper tiger. Their 5 wins have come against teams with a combined record of 5-24. They played one good team (Bills) and got their asses kicked. If they get killed again vs the Eagles, then Fins fans will probably be questioning how good their team is.

[Success]

I saw enough bad, meaningless football during the drought - which was lengthy.

 

We're now the favorite in the vast majority of our games, and we have a team that can still win even if they're down a few scores going into the 4th quarter. The offense can be explosive, and the defense is stingy and one of the better D's in the league.  We have a QB who is also among the best, and is always fun to watch.

 

There isn't a single opposing fanbase who has us as a "W" on their schedule.  No one wants to play this team.  If you read other boards, opposing fans can only hope to get "bad Josh," or take advantage of some of our injuries.

 

I'm happy.

 

[nedboy7]

48 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Is this type of thinking that creates acceptance to medicity. 

It was more about the Bills poor play than those being good teams. The Bills are better than both of those teams. 

 

30 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson said:

I expect another playoff elimination. Same as the past 5 years.

 

 

Chances statistically are Bills dont win the SB.  Its a 97% probability with all parameters being even, which they are obviously not.  But still. 

Is going to the playoffs every year, but coming up short since we all know how difficult it is to win in the playoffs,  a reflection of mediocrity? 

Or was mediocrity where we lived in for 17 years before these guys. 

There is a little Facebook mentality here.  We watch every single play from the Bills and then compare it to the highlights of other teams. 

Eagles lost to the Jets. 

49ers lost to Dorian. 

KC is scraping by. 

Are these teams regressing? 

I am not very happy with our OC this season.  But I am not into starting weekly threads about one of the top coaches being fired cause we are in mediocrity. 

[The Red King]

50 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

So you want them to score a couple games in the 36-21 range for what exactly?

 

To be able to do it.  Again, since you obviously didn't read my post, when the offense clicks they're on fire.  When an opposing D finds a way to shut it down, as has happened in half the games, Dorsey will not or cannot make adjustments.  That is the point of concern.  We were one uncalled defensive hold away from 3-3.

 

Or does scoring 20 or less points in a full half their games not concern you?

Edited October 18, 2023 by The Red King

[coloradobillsfan]

I'm upset that the NFL's insistence on cramming the NFL down the throats of a European country that does not like or want our version of football has compromised the Bills chance at winning a championship this season.

[oldmanfan]

23 minutes ago, ngbills said:

So you really believe if Josh did not have the elite physical skills that he would be just as good? I am not saying he cant be a pocket passer. I am saying he is most effective and dangerous when he can utilize his athleticism, not only to run the ball but also avoid sacks and do the highlight reel stuff that we see. It creates a big issue for defenses trying to defend him. If not lets just go with a more traditional offense and see how it goes. Oh yeah, we just kind of saw that vs the Giants. 

I’m saying he’s an excellent passer now and will only improve as he gains more experience reading defenses and such.  So his window to win a Lombardi is pretty long in contrast to your view.

[GoBills808]

2 minutes ago, The Red King said:

 

To be able to do it.  Again, since you obviously didn't read my post, when the offense clicks they're on fire.  When an opposing D finds a way to shut it down, as has happened in half the games, Dorsey will not or cannot make adjustments.  That is the point of concern.  We were one uncalled defensive hold away from 3-3.

 

Or does scoring 20 or less points in a full half their games not concern you?

I read it

 

you are laboring under the impression that our offense is somehow uniquely inconsistent in their production

 

rest assured that is not the case

[Bruffalo]

I can understand having anxiety about the team. 

 

They are so close to being something historically great. We've seen what happens when everything is firing on all cylinders.  They're not just great, they are practically unstoppable. We just need the consistency now, and I think that's where most of the teeth gnashing is coming from. 

[Buffalo ill]

The lifeless blowout loss to the Bengals in Buffalo broke me.  I don't have to explain the number of gut punches a Bills fan since the late 80s has taken. You all know the moments. Last season's finale was the tipping point for me.

 

Anymore I feel like the Bills are a mostly entertaining tv series that will have a bad ending, leaving the fans disappointed overall.  The Bills are my new Game of Thrones.

[newcam2012]

23 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

 

 

 

Chances statistically are Bills dont win the SB.  Its a 97% probability with all parameters being even, which they are obviously not.  But still. 

Is going to the playoffs every year, but coming up short since we all know how difficult it is to win in the playoffs,  a reflection of mediocrity? 

Or was mediocrity where we lived in for 17 years before these guys. 

There is a little Facebook mentality here.  We watch every single play from the Bills and then compare it to the highlights of other teams. 

Eagles lost to the Jets. 

49ers lost to Dorian. 

KC is scraping by. 

Are these teams regressing? 

I am not very happy with our OC this season.  But I am not into starting weekly threads about one of the top coaches being fired cause we are in mediocrity. 

That's fair. Don't complain if the team falls short of their goal year after year with a franchise QB. That's exactly what had had happened for at least 3 years. 

 

At some point, change might be a good thing. Like I've reiterated many times before it's not terrible difficult to make the playoffs with Allen as your QB. 

 

 

Edited October 18, 2023 by newcam2012

[ngbills]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

I’m saying he’s an excellent passer now and will only improve as he gains more experience reading defenses and such.  So his window to win a Lombardi is pretty long in contrast to your view.

I agree that the window is potentially long. My point is right now the window is bigger given the situation. As Allen ages and other players as well there is greater uncertainty about said window. We know what we have right now. We dont know who will replace Diggs, Morse, Dawkins, etc as guys age out. We replace them we are always in good shape with Allen, but he cant do it on his own especially when he is no longer superman Allen. 

[The Red King]

6 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I read it

 

you are laboring under the impression that our offense is somehow uniquely inconsistent in their production

 

rest assured that is not the case

 

Show another team with a winning record with that wide a dead zone in production right in the middle, with half the games in the high, and half in the low.

[JoshAllin]

They had 3 losses all last season and 2 already, people will be antsy

Edited October 18, 2023 by motorj

[FLFan]

1 hour ago, ngbills said:

Its about expectations. Are you happy with a playoff contender or do you want a championship. The question is - will it be easier or harder to win next year, the next, etc. With Josh Allen's age and contract plus other players age the time is now to win. So when the team is on track to "only" be fighting for a playoff spot it leads to disappointment. 

Playoff spots are not decided in October.  There are 11 more games.  Guess what?  They will be fighting for a spot all year long, as is every other team.  None are wrapped up, every team has had stumbles and will continue to do so.  If your expectation is that your team is going to play dominant football each and every week and that will then portend a championship, I think perhaps it your expectations that need adjusting.  It is a grind, for everyone, and a great deal of both positive and negative situations will happen to each team between now and then. Their track is just fine.

[Low Positive]

3 minutes ago, The Red King said:

 

Show another team with a winning record with that wide a dead zone in production right in the middle, with half the games in the high, and half in the low.

Kansas City. But they actually have only scored more than 25 points once, and that was against the Bears.

[newcam2012]

13 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I’m saying he’s an excellent passer now and will only improve as he gains more experience reading defenses and such.  So his window to win a Lombardi is pretty long in contrast to your view.

I agree about Allen's window. The QB in the modern era can play a lot longer. 

 

What I don't like is that the Bills' organization is wasting years of opportunities. Feels like they are cashing in. 

[The Red King]

Just now, FrenchConnection said:

Kansas City. But they actually have only scored more than 25 points once, and that was against the Bears.

 

That's...not a dead zone.  That's not half very high, half low.  I think you're missing the point entirely.

[GoBills808]

11 minutes ago, The Red King said:

 

Show another team with a winning record with that wide a dead zone in production right in the middle, with half the games in the high, and half in the low.

Easy

 

Dolphins best offense in the league- top 3 games scoring on average 49.33 points, bottom 3 averaging 25 points for a difference of 24.33points

 

Bills top 3 scoring games avg 41 points, bottom 3 average 16.66 for a difference of 24.34 points

 

The measure of difference in consistency as expressed in points between the Bills and the best offense in the league is .01 

Edited October 18, 2023 by GoBills808
Clumsy wording

[oldmanfan]

11 minutes ago, ngbills said:

I agree that the window is potentially long. My point is right now the window is bigger given the situation. As Allen ages and other players as well there is greater uncertainty about said window. We know what we have right now. We dont know who will replace Diggs, Morse, Dawkins, etc as guys age out. We replace them we are always in good shape with Allen, but he cant do it on his own especially when he is no longer superman Allen. 

You seem to be focused on the negative.  That Josh will fall off.  That we won’t replace guys.  But look at things objectively.  We have guys like Bernard on D; everyone thought he was a bust but look at him.  Williams looks like another.  Once Kincaid gets going another.  Torrence.  Cook.  Bates will step in for Morse.  And so on.

5 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I agree about Allen's window. The QB in the modern era can play a lot longer. 

 

What I don't like is that the Bills' organization is wasting years of opportunities. Feels like they are cashing in. 

Wasting?  Come on.  They are consistently in the playoffs.  The 13 second stupidity was just that.  Last year they ran out of gas due to injury and a teammate almost dying.