Nathaniel Hacket - Payton's comments..

[eball]

5 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yes it did change in Jacksonville because he took a guy who's not in the NFL and helped him throw 35 touchdowns which would have been a record in Buffalo

 

He's had success in the NFL and success with Aaron Rodgers.. 

 

He has wayyy more clout and respect in the NFL than Dorsey who got fired as QB coach of Carolina...

Hackett earned promotions as QB coach of the jaguars ... Became OC and QB coach with Blake bortles 

 

Got a job working with Rodgers as OC.   Excelled again ..   then a HC where he failed with a QB who gave up

 

He has successful stops at Jacksonville and GB as a OC and QB coach ... That's more than Dorsey who was fired and outta football after Carolina and Dorsey needs allen

 

Yours is literally the first hard-on for Nate Hackett I’ve ever witnessed.  The guy is a walking example of nepotism.

 

If “Dorsey needs Allen” then most certainly “Nate needs Rodgers.”  One blip of a season with Blake Bortles didn’t make Nate a genius.

 

[CSBill]

I just hope Nate Hackett sucks as a play caller on September 11, 2023!

[Doc Brown]

48 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

And probably a bit of all 3.... plus Rodgers's general level of interest which was low to middling last season. That is my biggest thing on the whole Jets hype train. Their schedule is a tough start with an easier home stretch. If they are 2-5 or something Aaron Rodgers isn't gonna be a Tom Brady that goes around that locker room and fires guys up to get better. He will sit in a corner, sulk, and become disengaged. Because that is who he is. 

To play devil's advocate though, Rodgers seems to be a vindictive person and may want to show Green Bay management that if they treated him better he'd have been the model quarterback we're seeing so far with the Jets.  He's shown up to OTA's, he's taken a massive pay cut, and he's at least pretended to show interest in bonding with his younger WR's.  All things he refused to do with the Packers.  Even if the Jets start 2-5, Rodgers has shown the ability in the past to dig his team out of a hole including that famous "Relax" quote.  It's going to be a very interesting season with them no matter what.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

To play devil's advocate though, Rodgers seems to be a vindictive person and may want to show Green Bay management that if they treated him better he'd have been the model quarterback we're seeing so far with the Jets.  He's shown up to OTA's, he's taken a massive pay cut, and he's at least pretended to show interest in bonding with his younger WR's.  All things he refused to do with the Packers.  Even if the Jets start 2-5, Rodgers has shown the ability in the past to dig his team out of a hole including that famous "Relax" quote.  It's going to be a very interesting season with them no matter what.

 

True, but I think that is all superficial and face value. When the going gets tough Aaron Rodgers isn't the guy I'd want. Despite his all-worldly talent. They were only 1-2 when he did the whole R-E-L-A-X thing. 

 

And whether he took a pay cut or not depends how long he plays. If he plays the entire contract he didn't take a paycut. I don't expect he will so in practice he probably will have left $35m on the table. But he took a guarantee cut not an overall value of the contract cut. 

[PBF81]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Orton was NOT one of the worst two QBs we have had in decades. That is a crazy take. 2013 where they had EJ Manuel, Thad Lewis and Jeff Tuel that might be legit the worst QB room of any team in my 20 plus years watching the NFL. But Orton in 2014 was a serviceable NFL starter. Not a superstar, by any means, but a serviceable starter. And to be fair with zero run game to speak of Hackett managed to get production out of that offense. Behind Fitz, Tyrod and half a season of Bledsoe he was the 4th best of the drought era.

 

My main issue with Hackett when he was here was his total unwillingness to pass on first down. 

 

Now that I think about it, I forgot about Holcomb and Edwards, who were both bad, worse.  

 

Very fair points.  I should have thought that through a bit more.  

 

 

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, PBF81 said:

 

Now that I think about it, I forgot about Holcomb and Edwards, who were both bad, worse.  

 

Very fair points.  I should have thought that through a bit more.  

 

And Losman, and Peterman, and Brohm. No one was confusing Orton with a long term answer but as a stopgap on a team that otherwise around him had enough talent to make the playoffs - ferocious pass rush, decent secondary, weapons at receiver... he at least gave that team a shot. Had theystuck with EJ they wouldn't have had that shot. Had the started Orton week 1 they likely make the playoffs. 

[Not at the table Karlos]

10 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Sorry the talk of him here acts like he should be a high school coach or division 3 coach

 

The dude since he was 20 something years old has been super highly regarded by most in the game of football

 

And as accomplished more in the game than every single person here

 

The same way people trashed David culley here.. who also became a head coach

 

And I've spent time around both of them in the last 15 years and they know more about the game of football than every person here

 

People trash them like he's their kids pop warner coach

 

He coached Blake bortles to what would have been Buffalo bills records.. he's not a ***** bum .. which is why he keeps getting job

 

At worst he has a much better resume than our own quarterback coach and OC and is a better quarterback coach than both

 

I certainly think Hackett would do as good as Dorsey if not better as the offensive coordinator

 

 

 

Serious question, are you related to Hackett?

[Billsatlastin2018]

Paton is 100% correct! Hackett was beyond abysmal as HC.

 

However, in HIS role, keep your inner voice restrained!

[Beast]

13 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

I honestly don’t know who would win in a fight between Hackett and Payton.

 

Im leaning Hackett because of age…and that’s it.  

I don’t like either one so I would just root that both would land some haymakers.

[DCofNC]

15 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Considered Bust blake bortles had his best career years with Hackett as his QB coach and OC

 

Went to a pro bowl and threw for over 4000 yards and 35 tds

 

Bills fans would've went nuts for that before Allen emerged 

That’s because,

1) they had weapons.

2) Bortles for all his faults, was a gun slinger and caused trouble with his legs to open things up.  
3) Played against pitiful defenses.

4) Hacket runs a college scheme, which fit Bortles limitations. 

 

What happened the next season?

[DCofNC]

3 hours ago, eball said:

 

Yours is literally the first hard-on for Nate Hackett I’ve ever witnessed.  The guy is a walking example of nepotism.

 

If “Dorsey needs Allen” then most certainly “Nate needs Rodgers.”  One blip of a season with Blake Bortles didn’t make Nate a genius.

 

Nailed it.  If it wasn’t for Daddy’s name, he wouldn’t even have made college ranks.  He got a job at Cuse with a buddy, Buffalo dragged them up to a league they didn’t belong in.  Most Bills fans couldn’t wait to get rid of them and then the dumpster fire of Florida signed them, more good ole boys club BS (yay for us), they had a singular good season before all the weapons left.  They then ran that team into the ground.   Hacket managed to fail his way up and become buddies with Rodgers, so much so, that he became a prerequisite for Rodgers to sign.. until money talked.. then he ruined Russ and the Broncos, now he’s back to Rodgers.  
 

The guy may “know” football, but that doesn’t mean he is NFL material, which it’s blatantly obvious, he is not.  His schemes are high level HS ball, mid-tier college at best.  Without the perfect storm, they fail miserably in the NFL and it’s because it’s plans predicated on 1970s football.

[78thealltimegreat]

Somehow Sean Payton who signed the most lucrative contract a coach has ever signed in the NFL and was literally suspended for putting bounties on players is now throwing other coaches under the bus.
Since it is Nate Hackett who literally couldn’t coordinate a 7th grade field trip to the zoo I guess it’s ok. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by 78thealltimegreat

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

Hacket was terrible in Buffalo and the passing of time will not change that.  Payton's comments were spot on but they were not in good taste.

[The Jokeman]

17 hours ago, Spiderweb said:

During Hacket's time as the Bills OC, many posters here felt that he was a pitiful OC .. l

 

Would this still be true today or has our animosity for him waned?

The problem is Marrone was a first year HC with a first year OC. I felt Hackett would have been better served as QB coach alone with a more seasoned OC help out. Ultimately it was a bad choice for OC, now he has been in the league longer and had some relative success but hard to fail when Rodgers is your QB. Honestly I wouldn't want him here as think Dorsey did better than most here feel all things considered. 

[PBF81]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

And Losman, and Peterman, and Brohm. No one was confusing Orton with a long term answer but as a stopgap on a team that otherwise around him had enough talent to make the playoffs - ferocious pass rush, decent secondary, weapons at receiver... he at least gave that team a shot. Had theystuck with EJ they wouldn't have had that shot. Had the started Orton week 1 they likely make the playoffs. 

 

Ah yes, I forgot about Losman as well.  That four year stretch with those guys ...   I wouldn't count Peterman or Brohm as I was primarily thinking of QBs  that only started most or all of a season.  

 

As to the team, sounds like you are saying that the D carried the team however.  

 

Orton was OK, but even then an average QB at best.  BTW, that was his last season and he hadn't started for several years prior to then.   

 

 

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Ah yes, I forgot about Losman as well.  That four year stretch with those guys ...   I wouldn't count Peterman or Brohm as I was primarily thinking of QBs  that only started most or all of a season.  

 

As to the team, sounds like you are saying that the D carried the team however.  

 

Orton was OK, but even then an average QB at best.  BTW, that was his last season and he hadn't started for several years prior to then.   

 

 

Yea he was just serviceable. He had become the go to gun for hire when teams had an urgent need.... started a few games for KC in their year of multiple QBs, started for Dallas during one of Romo's injuries and then came here to start when they realised in camp that EJ was all over the place. There is always at any time a guy like that in the league. It is probably Baker Mayfield at the moment.

[Nextmanup]

19 hours ago, Blank Stare said:

Yes, would still be true today. He was a terrible OC. He was a terrible HC. Without Rodgers, he’s nothing. If Rodgers is washed (which I’m not sure he is), look out. 

Rodgers is not washed.

 

Hackett is terrible.

 

It will take FOREVER for this guy to be flushed out of the league, however.

He's in the club now and these guys stay in the club forever, regardless of performance.

 

 

[dpberr]

Nate Hackett is by all measure, a smart man but a bad coach.  The greater NFL fraternity also really likes and respects his dad.  

 

Nate Hackett has an air of Luis Castillo coaching invincibility.  No matter how bad he is at his job, do not fear, he *will* be hired for another one.  

 

You can almost hear Hugo Weaving - You hear that Mr. Anderson?  That is the sound of inevitability."

[Rocky Landing]

19 hours ago, wppete said:

When Hacket was here the offense was basically this.

 

1st Down - Run

2nd Down - Run

3rd Down - Pass

4th Down - Punt

 

it was bad. No creativity or aggressiveness. Very predictable. 

Yes. I used to refer to this as the "RRPP Offense."

[PBF81]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea he was just serviceable. He had become the go to gun for hire when teams had an urgent need.... started a few games for KC in their year of multiple QBs, started for Dallas during one of Romo's injuries and then came here to start when they realised in camp that EJ was all over the place. There is always at any time a guy like that in the league. It is probably Baker Mayfield at the moment.

 

9-7 on the merits of the D then?  

 

 

[GunnerBill]

16 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

9-7 on the merits of the D then?  

 

I think the D was a bigger factor than the O, yes. Orton moved the ball just enough and didn't commit stupid turnovers. 

[RoyBatty is alive]

21 hours ago, 947 said:

Nothing Payton said about Hackett was wrong. Was it in poor taste to air it publicly like that? Absolutely, but it isn't like he made the stuff up, everyone could see the Broncos were the pinnacle of dysfunction in 2022.

 

I imagine it came from a place of frustration after seeing just how bad things were at Mile High when Payton arrived. I'd be surprised if Hackett is employed by an NFL team once Rodgers retires.

 

 

Agree.

 

It is refreshing to hear honest non-coach speak every once in a while.  This is an example of WHY you dont hear it very often.

 

I think Payton mad a massive mistake on 2 front.  Fust he broke the insider rule about criticizing head coaches, now he is more then open game.  Second, what did he gin from this?  Nothing as far as I can tell unless this was done because the Broncos players were so demoralized they needed someone "to blame".  Now Payton has raised the bar as Bronco HC.  He sure better improve over last years record or he will be out the door with no excuse.

[Buffalo716]

6 hours ago, DCofNC said:

That’s because,

1) they had weapons.

2) Bortles for all his faults, was a gun slinger and caused trouble with his legs to open things up.  
3) Played against pitiful defenses.

4) Hacket runs a college scheme, which fit Bortles limitations. 

 

What happened the next season?

He had 23 touchdowns and 16 picks... Those are like Fitzpatrick numbers ..

more TDs than Tyrod Taylor ... And he's not in the league anymore 

 

Next Season 21 touchdowns and 13 picks ..  

 

As bills fans we know there are way worse numbers to put up at quarterbacks than that lol 

 

That quarterback is out of the league and those numbers are not horrible... Because Hackett was able design an offense for him

 

Literally people are making it out like I'm saying he's Vince Lombardi... I'm saying he's not the bum like half the board makes him out

 

He knows more about football than everyone here

7 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

Serious question, are you related to Hackett?

No as a coach I stick up for coaches 

 

Because I know how hard it is and I can guarantee you Hackett isn't as bad as what the people make him out

 

He has success in the NFL on his resume 

 

I also got crucified when I had David Culley back and called him a future head coach and nobody believed me 

 

But I have the pulse on the coaching in the league .. I know who's respected and not

Edited August 2, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Buffalo716]

9 hours ago, eball said:

 

Yours is literally the first hard-on for Nate Hackett I’ve ever witnessed.  The guy is a walking example of nepotism.

 

If “Dorsey needs Allen” then most certainly “Nate needs Rodgers.”  One blip of a season with Blake Bortles didn’t make Nate a genius.

 

Don't have a hard on for him ..  it's been my MO at the old message board and here to stick up for coaches as I still coach 

 

Coaches are a fraternity and we don't throw each other under the bus usually 

 

And I never said Nate was a genius... Never not once.. I said he's not as incompetent as half of this board makes him out to be

 

And He knows more about football than everybody here

 

That's it and that's all... He has success in the NFL on his resume he's not as bad as what people  make him to be

 

And he has a better resume than dorsey

 

 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Buffalo716

[buffalostu2]

I live in Colorado and I told everyone it was the worst head coaching hire in NFL history.   I'm certainly not right all the time but I think I was spot on there.

 

If you look at his track record, minus Green Bay, the hire made no sense at all if he couldn't deliver Rodgers.  

 

 

[Gregg]

Week 5 is the first week games can be flexed to SNF. Jets and Broncos play week 5 but I can't see the Cowboys-49ers being flexed out of SNF.

 

Adam Schefter on Twitter: "The first time Sunday night games can be flexed this season is Week 5, which just happens to be when the Jets play at the Broncos. Hard to imagine NBC would drop the Week 5 Cowboys-49ers matchup for it, but as usual, the NFL schedule makers/script writers nailed it." / X

[Not at the table Karlos]

24 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Don't have a hard on for him ..  it's been my MO at the old message board and here to stick up for coaches as I still coach 

 

Coaches are a fraternity and we don't throw each other under the bus usually 

 

And I never said Nate was a genius... Never not once.. I said he's not as incompetent as half of this board makes him out to be

 

And He knows more about football than everybody here

 

That's it and that's all... He has success in the NFL on his resume he's not as bad as what people  make him to be

 

And he has a better resume than dorsey

 

 

This means that your opinion on him is to be taken with a grain of salt because it's biased.  A coach that knows way more than you agreed with pretty much everyone else that Hackett was a joke as HC

 

The Culley as HC thing was scraping the bottom of the barrel after they were turned down by a bunch of other coaches and a last ditch effort to try and make Watson happy.  Yes he was HC but it's prob the worst example other than Hackett being an HC. Everyone knew they wouldn't be good. 

 

Idk why you keep acting like Dorsey hasn't done anything. He has an MVP and QB that reached Superbowl under him. He lost his job after that QB hurt his shoulder and it never got better.  Allen's jump to an elite QB happened under him as well. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Not at the table Karlos

[Buffalo716]

26 minutes ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

This means that your opinion on him is to be taken with a grain of salt because it's biased.  A coach that knows way more than you agreed with pretty much everyone else that Hackett was a joke as HC

 

The Culley as HC thing was scraping the bottom of the barrel after they were turned down by a bunch of other coaches and a last ditch effort to try and make Watson happy.  Yes he was HC but it's prob the worst example other than Hackett being an HC. Everyone knew they wouldn't be good. 

 

Idk why you keep acting like Dorsey hasn't done anything. He has an MVP and QB that reached Superbowl under him. He lost his job after that QB hurt his shoulder and it never got better.  Allen's jump to an elite QB happened under him as well. 

You also have to take what that coach said about Hackett with a grain of salt

 

If coaches ever bad mouth another coach in public it's because there's bad blood... Because 98% of coaches will never say anything publicly

 

Dorsey and Hackett are probably the same level ... Not a future star HC but can be a solid QB coach or OC

 

I don't think Hackett is as bad as people make him out to be that's my only point... He literally worked with the bum EJ manual... And he made the offense run with the ghost of Kyle Orton... 250 ypg

 

Then he helped Bortles , and did a good job with Rogers

 

I think he's gotten a lot of flack for stuff that wasn't his fault here ... Marrone quit on us

 

And yes for the last time I don't think Hackett is cut out to be an NFL head coach... But I do think he's a very good quarterback coach and a competent OC

 

I like Dorsey I don't think he's bad... But I don't think he's head and shoulders above Hackett as a quarterback coach or offensive coordinator..  I think they're probably equals and Hackett has more experience 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Buffalo716

[eball]

49 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Don't have a hard on for him ..  it's been my MO at the old message board and here to stick up for coaches as I still coach 

 

Coaches are a fraternity and we don't throw each other under the bus usually 

 

And I never said Nate was a genius... Never not once.. I said he's not as incompetent as half of this board makes him out to be

 

And He knows more about football than everybody here

 

That's it and that's all... He has success in the NFL on his resume he's not as bad as what people  make him to be

 

And he has a better resume than dorsey

 

 

 

Thank you for clarifying your obvious bias.  Now I know I don't need to argue the point further.

 

[Kwai San]

22 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Considered Bust blake bortles had his best career years with Hackett as his QB coach and OC

 

Went to a pro bowl and threw for over 4000 yards and 35 tds

 

Bills fans would've went nuts for that before Allen emerged 

 

 

BUT.......it didn't.

[Buffalo716]

10 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Thank you for clarifying your obvious bias.  Now I know I don't need to argue the point further.

 

To be fair you might have a anti-marrrone and hackett bias

 

Yes he was not good as a head coach... But when Denver hired him there were literally articles and reports saying how he was born to be a natural leader in the NFL 

 

Denver thought it was going to work

 

He had and still has a lot of respect in coaching circles

 

In Buffalo he worked with the bum EJ Manuel.  Actually made the offense work with the ghost of Kyle Orton

 

Helped improve Blake bortles..  and had a good stint with Aaron Rodgers

 

He's a good quarterback coach... Who has had some flashes as an offensive coordinator

 

I absolutely don't think he's head coaching material

2 minutes ago, Kwai San said:

 

 

BUT.......it didn't.

We had EJ Manuel..  the offense was clicking with the ghost of Kyle Orton

 

Who Hackett integrated into our offense in a week

Edited August 2, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Nihilarian]

He wasn't wrong!

 

Hacker took a pro-bowl-SB QB and made him look like a bum. Hope he does the same thing for Aaron Rodgers...although he said Rodgers will call his own plays. 

 

Hacker didn't call plays in GB... he is just a nice guy and what happens to those? Clearly brought in to lure Rodgers to the NY Jests.

 

EDIT:

Oh, BTW, let's not forget that the man who hired him in the first place to be an NFL OC ended up firing him in Jacksonville.  Saint Doug canned him. He stunk it up in developing Blake Bortles. They made the playoffs one year because of a stout run game and #2 overall defense. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Nihilarian

[Buffalo716]

@eball @Not at the table Karlos

 

And FYI good discussion and no hard feelings 

 

This is what discussion and debate is about 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

22 hours ago, Your Brown Eye said:

Did not need to air the dirty laundry, right or wrong.

Peyton is in Goodells 💩 list for life, you think we got poor calls with Ryan? Wait till you see Denver this season. 

[Buffalo716]

Hackett made it very evident that Payton broke the code of coaching fraternity and responded with 'I do' when asked the question. The Jets OC although said that he 'knew it (Payton's criticism) was coming.'

 

Aaron Rodgers also had Hacketts back and called Peyton's comments insecure

 

I think Nathaniel knew he didn't do a great job as the broncos head coach... Sean Payton is the classless one for disrespecting the fraternity of coaches and putting the dirty laundry in the open

 

 

[3rdand12]

In summation

I think this is now an Official rivalry !

 

I only watch Bills games. But will be checking the weekly scoreboards for Payton and Hackett's failings

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, 3rdand12 said:

In summation

I think this is now an Official rivalry !

 

I only watch Bills games. But will be checking the weekly scoreboards for Payton and Hackett's failings

Sean Payton is obviously the better coach

 

He also puts bounties on players heads

 

Nathaniel may have flamed out as a head coach but at least he has class

 

[3rdand12]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Sean Payton is obviously the better coach

 

He also puts bounties on players heads

 

Nathaniel may have flamed out as a head coach but at least he has class

 

and both have caught my interest for this season upcoming. For multiple reasons.

 One of being the recent comments.

Poor form Sean.

[snamsnoops]

3 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Don't have a hard on for him ..  it's been my MO at the old message board and here to stick up for coaches as I still coach 

 

Coaches are a fraternity and we don't throw each other under the bus usually 

 

And I never said Nate was a genius... Never not once.. I said he's not as incompetent as half of this board makes him out to be

 

And He knows more about football than everybody here

 

That's it and that's all... He has success in the NFL on his resume he's not as bad as what people  make him to be

 

And he has a better resume than dorsey

 

 

OK, Payton!

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, snamsnoops said:

OK, Payton!

That's why Sean Peyton is getting crucified for being classless

 

Even Aaron Rodgers called him insecure 

 

Coaches handle their grievances behind closed doors not in the press

Edited August 2, 2023 by Buffalo716