Tremaine Edmunds will test free agency

[Buffalo_Stampede]

8 hours ago, SCBills said:

Maybe our Defensive HC should work his magic and scheme up an adequate defense that doesn’t rely on being loaded at every position.  

We’re definitely not loaded. We have a lot of players that play well within the scheme.

[Manther]

On 2/18/2023 at 7:01 PM, KzooMike said:

Maybe it forces Frazier to not have to depend on a freak athlete to make his defense sort of work. 

I hit the laugh emoji because it is true.  Frazier relies on some players being ok, good and excellent.  Fraizer does nothing himself, he just waits and hopes.  Hope dies last and hope is not a game plan.

[SCBills]

17 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

We’re definitely not loaded. We have a lot of players that play well within the scheme.

We have the following players:

 

EDGE - Von Miller

DT - Daquan Jones

DT - Ed Oliver 

EDGE - Greg Rousseau

LB - Matt Milano

MLB - ???

CB - Taron Johnson

CB - Tre’Davious White

CB - Kaiir Elam

S - Micah Hyde

S - ???

 

If McDermott can’t figure out how to put forth an adequate defense without needing to invest big money and/or a RD1/RD2 pick, then there is literally no reason for him to remain our HC. 
 

We should honestly move Ed Oliver for late round pick swap/salary dump as well.  Whatever it takes to get his 11M off the books. 
 

We’d be able to sign 2 of the top FA’s on the OL and a WR.   Imagine heading into the Draft with a new interior OL, along with say… OBJ.   Draft a RT in RD1 and another WR in RD2.  Then let McDermott find his MLB in RD3.  Draft a CB/Safety, DT and RB on Day 3 and let’s go.  

That’s how you flip this thing on it’s head and make some waves.  Do you think KC would pay Oliver 11M?  Re-sign Poyer or Edmunds?   Or would they build an elite OL for Mahomes?   FYI… we know the answer, because they already did that. 
 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2023 by SCBills

[Ramza86]

Hes going to make a lot of money and if he goes to place where a defensive coordinator can maximize his physical gifts he will end up with a great career.

 

Feels like London Fletcher all over again.

[T master]

20 minutes ago, nucci said:

does this bother you? If I was an NFL player I'd try to get as much money as I can. Not many players get a chance at a big 2nd contract and those that do need to take advantage. This could be his only chance

 

No that is not what bugs me it's that there is no longer any loyalty at all to a team that has helped you develop into a really good player I understand making as much as you can but when you can make 10 Million a year from where we sit or 13 over 4 years ??

[nucci]

22 minutes ago, T master said:

 

No that is not what bugs me it's that there is no longer any loyalty at all to a team that has helped you develop into a really good player I understand making as much as you can but when you can make 10 Million a year from where we sit or 13 over 4 years ??

Loyalty works both ways. Teams can cut players at any time even though they are under contract. Where's the loyalty to Singletary? He won't even be offered a contract. 

[biggerdaddynj]

Too bad he never developed into the player we thought he’d be.  I think the scheme didn’t fit his skill set and he seemed to lack the instinctual skills that separate the good players from the best.

[Brand J]

As a fan, I would have zero concerns going against a team that has Edmunds as their MLB. Let him stay in the AFCE! I wouldn’t worry about him wrecking plays in the run or pass game one bit.

[skibum]

I have always wondered what Edmunds could do with a different role in a different scheme. Leslie Fraser's defense requires him to patrol the backfield, which means he is going to be pursuing plays rather than disrupting them. The argument is that his very presence shuts off the middle of the field to the opposing offense. It is very, very difficult to judge if this is true or not, if he is exceptional in this regard, and if he could be more impactful in a more aggressive role.

 

I'm willing to let McDermott and Beane figure it out, but it does seem telling that they would let such a high draft pick and long-time QB of the defense just walk. 

[Manther]

7 hours ago, SCBills said:

We have the following players:

 

EDGE - Von Miller

DT - Daquan Jones

DT - Ed Oliver 

EDGE - Greg Rousseau

LB - Matt Milano

MLB - ???

CB - Taron Johnson

CB - Tre’Davious White

CB - Kaiir Elam

S - Micah Hyde

S - ???

 

If McDermott can’t figure out how to put forth an adequate defense without needing to invest big money and/or a RD1/RD2 pick, then there is literally no reason for him to remain our HC. 
 

We should honestly move Ed Oliver for late round pick swap/salary dump as well.  Whatever it takes to get his 11M off the books. 
 

We’d be able to sign 2 of the top FA’s on the OL and a WR.   Imagine heading into the Draft with a new interior OL, along with say… OBJ.   Draft a RT in RD1 and another WR in RD2.  Then let McDermott find his MLB in RD3.  Draft a CB/Safety, DT and RB on Day 3 and let’s go.  

That’s how you flip this thing on it’s head and make some waves.  Do you think KC would pay Oliver 11M?  Re-sign Poyer or Edmunds?   Or would they build an elite OL for Mahomes?   FYI… we know the answer, because they already did that. 
 

 

 

I like it.  They can totally get this done.  I just don't think they will do it.

[starrymessenger]

7 hours ago, Ramza86 said:

Hes going to make a lot of money and if he goes to place where a defensive coordinator can maximize his physical gifts he will end up with a great career.

 

Feels like London Fletcher all over again.

I actually want to see him in another system. 

7 hours ago, nucci said:

Loyalty works both ways. Teams can cut players at any time even though they are under contract. Where's the loyalty to Singletary? He won't even be offered a contract. 

Nor should they. He's a good back but the draft is very strong for RBs. Beane should be able to find another in the later rounds who will be just as good and cheaper.

[Eastport bills]

If we slap the franchise tag on Edmunds he’ll explore FA in his dreams. Let’s try it on for size.

[SoCal Deek]

27 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

If we slap the franchise tag on Edmunds he’ll explore FA in his dreams. Let’s try it on for size.

How does that help the Bills? Doesn’t it just force them to pay him the boatload of money they probably don’t want to pay him? 

[H2o]

35 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

If we slap the franchise tag on Edmunds he’ll explore FA in his dreams. Let’s try it on for size.

[BillsFan130]

8 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

How does that help the Bills? Doesn’t it just force them to pay him the boatload of money they probably don’t want to pay him? 

Ya they won’t tag Edmunds.

 

He’s a LB and “technically “ guys like TJ watt are LBS but they get paid as Elite pass rushers which jacks up the tag for LBs.

 

I think the tag for Edmunds would be like 22 mil, no way the bills can do that.

[Eastport bills]

37 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

How does that help the Bills? Doesn’t it just force them to pay him the boatload of money they probably don’t want to pay him? 

It gives them the best LB for the system Frazier runs. Name a replacement that can impact the run and pass defense like Edmunds. The defense was pretty formidable with Edmunds. The key is restructuring contracts that can give cap flexibility. Edmunds will command the highest yearly pay for an OLB when he hits FA because of his age. Franchising him actually gets him for a discount. With questions about adding quality O-line and weapons with our cap restraints, we better be able to stop some people. Edmunds had a great year even though some fans are still judging him on his early years.

[nucci]

1 hour ago, starrymessenger said:

 

Nor should they. He's a good back but the draft is very strong for RBs. Beane should be able to find another in the later rounds who will be just as good and cheaper.

I concur, just using him as an example

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, Eastport bills said:

It gives them the best LB for the system Frazier runs. Name a replacement that can impact the run and pass defense like Edmunds. The defense was pretty formidable with Edmunds. The key is restructuring contracts that can give cap flexibility. Edmunds will command the highest yearly pay for an OLB when he hits FA because of his age. Franchising him actually gets him for a discount. With questions about adding quality O-line and weapons with our cap restraints, we better be able to stop some people. Edmunds had a great year even though some fans are still judging him on his early years.

I’m still not sure I understand your strategy. Doesn’t the tag last for just one year? If you’re desperate to keep him, why not negotiate a long term, back loaded contract so next year’s hit would be something/anything less than the Top Five at his position?

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, skibum said:

I have always wondered what Edmunds could do with a different role in a different scheme. Leslie Fraser's defense requires him to patrol the backfield, which means he is going to be pursuing plays rather than disrupting them. The argument is that his very presence shuts off the middle of the field to the opposing offense. It is very, very difficult to judge if this is true or not, if he is exceptional in this regard, and if he could be more impactful in a more aggressive role.

 

I'm willing to let McDermott and Beane figure it out, but it does seem telling that they would let such a high draft pick and long-time QB of the defense just walk. 

Both plays with 13 seconds happened in the middle of the field.  

[Eastport bills]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m still not sure I understand your strategy. Doesn’t the tag last for just one year? If you’re desperate to keep him, why not negotiate a long term, back loaded contract so next year’s hit would be something/anything less than the Top Five at his position?

I understand your trepidation but he wants to hit FA and the Bills must franchise him or see him leave and the decision has to be made now. After he gets franchised you open a window to negotiate a longer deal. He represents arguably our best player on defense, and is a perfect compliment to Milano in a 2LB defense. I think Edmunds plays even better next season.

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Both plays with 13 seconds happened in the middle of the field.  

Yeah, but Edmunds was only sixteen back then. 😉

[balln]

He’s NOT worth it. He doesn’t factor AT ALL in crunch time against the elite passers. In fact he gets abused w mahomes eyes. He can’t cover kelce. He simply doesn’t make enough plays on the ball in the passing game. LET him WALK!

 

he’s really soft at stopping the RUN. Poor at point of attack. He’s so tall and plays so tall he gets DRIvEN back 7-10 yards way way way too much.  

[SoCal Deek]

4 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

I understand your trepidation but he wants to hit FA and the Bills must franchise him or see him leave and the decision has to be made now. After he gets franchised you open a window to negotiate a longer deal. He represents arguably our best player on defense, and is a perfect compliment to Milano in a 2LB defense. I think Edmunds plays even better next season.

You may know more about how this all works than me, but can’t the Bills just make him an offer? If he wants to test free agency, it seems like he’s already got one foot out the door. 
 

The franchise tag seems like the absolute wrong approach for a team up against the cap. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by SoCal Deek

[balln]

I’ll also add - and finish. If beane was absolutely on his game and cut throat he would have traded edmunds last offseason and at least gotten something back in a trade.  But I’m not gonna kill him for it bc he and - we all thought - this was a Super Bowl team so you gotta try for it. 
 

we’re at the same juncture w Oliver. Trade him NOW!

[Eastport bills]

6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

You may know more about how this all works than me, but can’t the Bills just make him an offer? If he wants to test free agency, it seems like he’s already got one foot out the door. 
 

The franchise tag seems like the absolute wrong approach for a team up against the cap. 

If he refuses the Bills offer, he’s gone. The Bills won’t get into a bidding war with all their needs. The tag is only a positive when you can retain a player that you view as at the top of his position and would be difficult to replace adequately. Remember, the Bills are paying 3 players(JA, Diggs and Miller) upwards of 90 million. If Beane is as good as the guy in KC(Beech)he restructures Josh,Diggs and Miller to free up enough cap space to retain Edmunds and add some good O-line.

[McDeerInTheHeadlights]

I may be overly pragmatic here, but any strategy that entails keeping together a team that couldn't deliver multiple times when it really mattered and neglecting, due to a shortage of resources, clear areas of weakness while also increasing the cost base is, at the very least, suspect.

 

It's like doubling-down on ricing up a Chevy Malibu and expecting to win a Le Mans race.

 

It's time for a change in the roster-building philosophy, with different asset allocation and priorities.

 

[T master]

22 hours ago, nucci said:

Loyalty works both ways. Teams can cut players at any time even though they are under contract. Where's the loyalty to Singletary? He won't even be offered a contract. 

 

Usually the Bills will make a offer to a player of what they feel that player is worth to them & if the player thinks they can get more in FA per their agent then they test FA which is what Edmunds will more than likely do & you don't know if Motor has been offered  certain amount to stay .

 

But seeing as he can & will get a certain amount of money & the fact that the Bills are some $20 mill over the cap logic would tell one that loyalty or not they would have to go in another direction such as the draft in order to get a better number to fit the cap that's called "Business" plain & simple .

 

Which is the same as Edmunds & Poyer they will be looking at what the Bills can offer which will not be what the market will bare seeing as the LB market was reset last season & the Bills have to make space just to keep those they have & cover those that have left so when you don't have the funds to resign a player that is just a tad different than having the money & just letting them walk .

[SoCal Deek]

Looking back on it and seeing where the team sits now in relation to the cap, signing Von Miller may prove to have been a HUGE mistake. 

[Ray Finkel]

13 hours ago, balln said:

He’s NOT worth it. He doesn’t factor AT ALL in crunch time against the elite passers. In fact he gets abused w mahomes eyes. He can’t cover kelce. He simply doesn’t make enough plays on the ball in the passing game. LET him WALK!

 

he’s really soft at stopping the RUN. Poor at point of attack. He’s so tall and plays so tall he gets DRIvEN back 7-10 yards way way way too much.  

Spot on.

[Deadstroke]

We know that he is a very fine LB, but top five salary in our financial dilemma?  IMO, maybe, but we have other needs which we won't get to if we pay him like $22M or so.  Draft, or trade for a bruiser as a replacement; sure, you give up coverage over the middle, but you have to put a legitimate value on Edmunds vs significantly increased abilities on the OL, and then RB, S, DL (again) and plenty of legitimate backups. 

[JohninMinn.]

He was terrible. No football instinct. Was a danger to our defense arriving late and piling on.

[ShakAttack]

Tag and trade  an option here?    Kinda surprised we haven't done this with anyone since Peerless Price.  I would imagine we could find a trade partner willing to give us more than whatever the comp pick would be...

[nucci]

Just now, BobBelcher said:

Tag and trade  an option here?    Kinda surprised we haven't done this with anyone since Peerless Price.  I would imagine we could find a trade partner willing to give us more than whatever the comp pick would be...

not that easy. First Edmunds would have to sign the contract, then get a team to agree to give up picks for him and that team would need to able to sign him to longer contract

[Thurman#1]

On 2/18/2023 at 1:44 AM, HappyDays said:

 

Anything is possible but it sounds like we have seen the end of Edmunds' career as a Bill. Which leaves more room to build the offense.

 

 

It doesn't sound like that at all, Hap.

 

"I'm gonna let the process take shape," sounds to you like we've seen the end of his career as a Bill? He's not saying anything like that there. It only means he's not willing to commit to a return as of now. Which only makes sense, even if he'd rather return than not.

 

Sorry to bring back what I now see is an old post, though. It was new to me.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Thurman#1

[H2o]

I'm already expecting Edmunds to be gone at this point. I think Beane and Co. came up with a number they were comfortable with and Edmunds is searching for more elsewhere. He'll be donning a different jersey next season and we'll have someone new manning the middle in this defense. 

[oldmanfan]

I don't think Edmunds is as bad as many here do.  I think he fits what McD and Frazier wants in their MLB.  But I also think it's hard to justify giving him a big contract when you already have another All Pro LB in Milano.  Hard to sink so much cap dollars into one position area.  

[Thurman#1]

14 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Both plays with 13 seconds happened in the middle of the field.  

 

 

Dude, please. This says more about you than about Edmunds.

 

On the first play he was covering for in-cuts and on the second he was on the other side of the field.

 

 

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I don't think Edmunds is as bad as many here do.  I think he fits what McD and Frazier wants in their MLB.  But I also think it's hard to justify giving him a big contract when you already have another All Pro LB in Milano.  Hard to sink so much cap dollars into one position area.  

 

 

I see that, but the fact is that's their scheme and their habit. They sunk a ton of cap dollars into those exact two spots in Carolina with Kuechly and Davis.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Thurman#1

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I see that, but the fact is that's their scheme and their habit. They sunk a ton of cap dollars into those exact two spots in Carolina with Kuechly and Davis.

 

100%. They also continued to draft guys like AJ Klein and used a first round pick on Shaq Thompson. 

[Sharky7337]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

Looking back on it and seeing where the team sits now in relation to the cap, signing Von Miller may prove to have been a HUGE mistake. 

Unless with von we win a superbowl it absolutely was. 

 

Jerry Hughes had similar production to von last season and at least had availability. And we needed an upgrade for sure, but was this the right answer? In season 1 it is a no.

 

And not because I want to keep Edmunds, but because that's a good chunk of dollars that could improve the offense or defense and its tied into a aging player who, played half a season.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Sharky7337

[Thurman#1]

14 hours ago, balln said:

He’s NOT worth it. He doesn’t factor AT ALL in crunch time against the elite passers. In fact he gets abused w mahomes eyes. He can’t cover kelce. He simply doesn’t make enough plays on the ball in the passing game. LET him WALK!

 

he’s really soft at stopping the RUN. Poor at point of attack. He’s so tall and plays so tall he gets DRIvEN back 7-10 yards way way way too much.  

 

 

Yeah, did he get abused by Mahomes this year? When we had a bit of a pass rush hurrying him?

 

You know who gets abused by Mahomes's eyes in the middle of the field in zone coverage when he has time to throw? Absolutely everyone. 

 

And he doesn't get driven back all that much. He gets driven back 7 - 10 yards? Fine, name 10 plays where that happened. Should be easy since it happens so often. In the run defense, Milano is the guy given the go-ahead to go forward and freelance a bit at times. They have different roles. Tremaine is the guy who's generally supposed to stay back, fill the hole and get him if he turns the corner if necessary.

 

This decision will be made by money, as the Bills are really tightly strictured right now, but they'll do their best to get him back. This Bills D has shown that they're a ton worse without him than with him.

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by Thurman#1