Can Lee Smith just go already?

[JGMcD2]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Have you ever been involved in high level meetings?

In what context?

[TH3]

2 hours ago, Ramza86 said:

Watching that fat idiot keep running while Josh was waiting for him to sit on 4th down is just.....so sick of him.

Lee Smith on HOTSEAT!!

[bigK14094]

2 hours ago, MJS said:

Dude, he is a blocker who occasionally runs a route. What's your problem? He's basically an olineman.

Use Bates....lets see if he can catch!

[Fixxxer]

2 hours ago, Motorin' said:

Our running game is more effective with Lee Smith blocking. 

 

I agree, but the running game doesn't suffer too much with Kroft starting. What's the deal with Kroft? Is his absence COVID related?

[Johnny Hammersticks]

Why do we hate Lee Smith now?

[billsbackto81]

2 hours ago, Motorin' said:

Our running game is more effective with Lee Smith blocking. 

Are you telling us it would actually be worse without Smith? Oy vey!!

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

That's great.  But no one is disagreeing that Josh REALLY likes Lee Smith, nor is anyone arguing that Lee Smith hasn't made an impact on Josh as a pro.  None of that is pertinent to whether he brings real football value to the roster.  That's what is being discussed here...

 

See above post.  They can still FaceTime.

 

If Smith was cut today, Josh knows Josh would be absolutely fine/unharmed by Lee's departure.  You know this.

See everyone, Weo knows what’s best for Josh and the Bills locker room.  I’m honestly amazed that Beane and McDermott didn’t think about FaceTime.  They cut have saved a lot of money.

[ndirish1978]

Flex those keyboard muscles OP

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

Why do we hate Lee Smith now?

I don’t know.  You don’t need good locker room people because there’s FaceTime.

[BillsfaninSB]

1 hour ago, HOUSE said:

This thread can only mean one thing, Lee Smith will catch the winning TD against Pittsburgh.

 

Then the thread will be bumped for 3 weeks.....

I thought the same thing when I saw the title of this thread. 

I wonder who will be the bad guy next week. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, Ramza86 said:

Watching that fat idiot keep running while Josh was waiting for him to sit on 4th down is just.....so sick of him.

 

I assume you're talking about the 4th and 1 pass on the first drive, where Bates was at the front of the endzone and possibly open, Lee Smith had more space around him and Josh  actually seemed to be motioning him back, but he kept running right to L?  And the announcer said gleefully "threw behind him"?

 

It's a point that Kroft, Knox or Gilliam likely haul that in.  But Smith is by far the better blocker for the run.  And he's caught passes before, just rusty.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

31 minutes ago, billsbackto81 said:

Are you telling us it would actually be worse without Smith? Oy vey!!

 

Well....it kinda was? 

Rush yards in games where Smith took >5 snaps (NWE, ARI, LAC, SFO): 129 ypg

Rush yards in games where Smith was inactive or took <5 snaps: 89 ypg

 

Now of course there's the counterpoint "correlation is not causation"

 

46 minutes ago, bigK14094 said:

Use Bates....lets see if he can catch!

 

FWIW Bates looked to me as though he were open on the play where Josh threw to Smith, but he was probably running his route just a tad shallow, and he wasn't *very* open.

 

[BillsfaninSB]

Send a lumbering, blocking tightend to catch a 4th down pass in the small confines of the end zone at your own peril. 

[clayboy54]

3 hours ago, thenorthremembers said:

Oh man, I would love to see you say this to his face.  That would be an incredible reality show.   Normal people telling 6'6 270 football players what they wrote about them behind a keyboard to their face.

I’ll hold him while Lee hits him.

[msw2112]

The play in question was a trick play.  It was a tackle eligible to the left side.  Usually, those plays fool the defense and the tackle is wide open and it's an easy toss for the score.  In this case, the SF defender read the play and actually covered the tackle.  Allen wisely didn't throw it to the covered tackle and instead started scanning the field for another target.  Smith was his best chance, but the pass didn't connect with the receiver.  It's highly unlikely that Allen was expecting to throw to Smith, and that Smith was intending to be a target for the pass.  Not every play is going to work.  Fortunately for the Bills, they played a great game and MOST of their plays DID work. 

 

The failure of this one play would not be a reason to remove Lee Smith from the team.  He's on the roster to help with run blocking and veteran leadership.  He seems to have reduced his penalties and quietly plays his role.  If the coaches feel it's time to move on from Lee, I'll be OK with it, but if they feel he has value to the team, then he should remain on the roster.

[Just in Atlanta]

Things I'm sick of:

• Salad kits with an improper ratio of dressing to lettuce that leave you with a pound of dry lettuce.
• Grocery produce bags that don't separate without licking your Covid-y fingers.
• Iceberg lettuce.

And that's just produce.

 

Things I'm not sick of:

• Lee Smith. 

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

See everyone, Weo knows what’s best for Josh and the Bills locker room.  I’m honestly amazed that Beane and McDermott didn’t think about FaceTime.  They cut have saved a lot of money.

When Lee Smith is gone, there will be no effect on Josh's development or performance.  Why pretend otherwise?  It's silly.

 

I'm sure he and Lee will stay in touch, just like Josh and Anderson.  

[hondo in seattle]

I get the fan frustration.

 

But if I was a Bills RB, I'm pretty sure I'd rather have Smith blocking for me than Knox.

[Royale with Cheese]

10 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

When Lee Smith is gone, there will be no effect on Josh's development or performance.  Why pretend otherwise?  It's silly.

 

I'm sure he and Lee will stay in touch, just like Josh and Anderson.  

You don’t know the locker room.  You don’t know the relationship between them.  What’s actually is silly is you think you do.  You know what’s valuable in the Bills locker room....you really deep down believe that.
 

Since I don’t either, I’m taking the words of the guy who is...that’s Allen.  He specifically says he has helped him so he’s added value.

In fact, the average NFL career is probably 3 years.  Smith is in his 9th so obviously he’s been valuable enough to last this long.  
 

Yes he will be gone one day but that doesn’t take away what he did when he was here.  You basically think he’s a waste.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The play works a lot.  

That was 4th and more than 1. No one expected a regular run there.

[Mr. WEO]

10 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

You don’t know the locker room.  You don’t know the relationship between them.  What’s actually is silly is you think you do.  You know what’s valuable in the Bills locker room....you really deep down believe that.
 

Since I don’t either, I’m taking the words of the guy who is...that’s Allen.  He specifically says he has helped him so he’s added value.

In fact, the average NFL career is probably 3 years.  Smith is in his 9th so obviously he’s been valuable enough to last this long.  
 

Yes he will be gone one day but that doesn’t take away what he did when he was here.  You basically think he’s a waste.

“NFL careers” includes anyone who ever got 

a single check from a single team.  It’s a meaningless stat.

 

Josh is a great guy.  Says only nice things about everyone.  Lee can stick around the locker room forever as a coaching staff member if that’s his value.  It’s clearly not on the field—you aren’t even arguing that.  
 

He’s a rarely  used player.  DiMarco was a legendary “locker room leader” until McD woke up last year and realized he added nothing in Sundays.  Same thing will happen soon with Smith and it will have no negative impact on Josh.  

Edited December 9, 2020 by Mr. WEO

[JGMcD2]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

“NFL careers” includes anyone who ever got 

a single check from a single team.  It’s a meaningless stat.

 

Josh is a great guy.  Says only nice things about everyone.  Lee can stick around the locker room forever as a coaching staff member if that’s his value.  It’s clearly not on the field—you aren’t even arguing that.  
 

He’s a rarely  used player.  DiMarco was a legendary “locker room leader” until McD woke up last year and realized he added nothing in Sundays.  Same thing will happen soon with Smith and it will have no negative impact on Josh. 

Again, you’re totally not comprehending what is value is. What I’ve been trying to explain to you over and over again is that there’s value in a PLAYER who can be an intermediary between the coaching staff and the players. If he were a coach, that value goes away. He doesn’t have the same pulse on things with the players... why? Because he’s no longer a player... he’s staff... they don’t mix like that... it 100% does not work that way. 
 

Again, Josh didn’t just “say nice things about Lee Smith” he wasn’t asked about Lee Smith... he was asked WHO HAS BEEN MOST INFLUENTIAL FOR HIM... to which he responded Lee Smith. He didn’t have to talk about Lee Smith... he chose to talk about Lee Smith and the VALUE he brings to the team. WATCH THE 2 MINUTE CLIP and stop being overwhelmingly ignorant. 

5 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said:

Well in fairness I’m sure Allen is not going to say that lee smith sucks and they are better without him in front of the media haha.

 

Maybe that statement is true by Allen, maybe it’s not. 

 

Regardless, He said the right thing which is what you want from your leader.

 

 

Dude, it wasn’t a random press conference where they asked about Lee Smith specifically...

It was on a podcast where Mark Sanchez (paraphrasing because people can’t spend 2 MINUTES to watch themselves) made the comment that the Bills have the most talented roster in the AFC East. Josh said yeah, I think so, but what’s even better about our team is the camaraderie. We have such good relationships. There are so many great veterans that he’s learned from and do a good job of keeping the locker room together. Sanchez said “What guys do you love the most, or who’s influenced you the most?” 
 

To which Josh without hesitation responded Lee Smith... and the went on to talk about him on his own... then when Josh explained the value he brought Sanchez said “You need a guy like that on every team.” 

[BillsFan130]

4 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

Again, you’re totally not comprehending what is value is. What I’ve been trying to explain to you over and over again is that there’s value in a PLAYER who can be an intermediary between the coaching staff and the players. If he were a coach, that value goes away. He doesn’t have the same pulse on things with the players... why? Because he’s no longer a player... he’s staff... they don’t mix like that... it 100% does not work that way. 
 

Again, Josh didn’t just “say nice things about Lee Smith” he wasn’t asked about Lee Smith... he was asked WHO HAS BEEN MOST INFLUENTIAL FOR HIM... to which he responded Lee Smith. He didn’t have to talk about Lee Smith... he chose to talk about Lee Smith and the VALUE he brings to the team. WATCH THE 2 MINUTE CLIP and stop being overwhelmingly ignorant. 

Dude, it wasn’t a random press conference where they asked about Lee Smith specifically...

It was on a podcast where Mark Sanchez (paraphrasing because people can’t spend 2 MINUTES to watch themselves) made the comment that the Bills have the most talented roster in the AFC East. Josh said yeah, I think so, but what’s even better about our team is the camaraderie. We have such good relationships. There are so many great veterans that he’s learned from and do a good job of keeping the locker room together. Sanchez said “What guys do you love the most, or who’s influenced you the most?” 
 

To which Josh without hesitation responded Lee Smith... and the went on to talk about him on his own... then when Josh explained the value he brought Sanchez said “You need a guy like that on every team.” 

Ohh ok Gotcha. I didn’t know that and I stand corrected.

I appreciate the explanation. 

 

Edited December 9, 2020 by BillsFan130

[Royale with Cheese]

21 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

That was 4th and more than 1. No one expected a regular run there.

Then the play would never work...but it does.

[SirAndrew]

It hasn’t been since we had a certain duo of twin brothers where I saw the words “fat idiot” used on this board. 

[Mr. WEO]

11 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

Again, you’re totally not comprehending what is value is. What I’ve been trying to explain to you over and over again is that there’s value in a PLAYER who can be an intermediary between the coaching staff and the players. If he were a coach, that value goes away. He doesn’t have the same pulse on things with the players... why? Because he’s no longer a player... he’s staff... they don’t mix like that... it 100% does not work that way. 
 

Again, Josh didn’t just “say nice things about Lee Smith” he wasn’t asked about Lee Smith... he was asked WHO HAS BEEN MOST INFLUENTIAL FOR HIM... to which he responded Lee Smith. He didn’t have to talk about Lee Smith... he chose to talk about Lee Smith and the VALUE he brings to the team. WATCH THE 2 MINUTE CLIP and stop being overwhelmingly ignorant. 

Dude, it wasn’t a random press conference where they asked about Lee Smith specifically...

It was on a podcast where Mark Sanchez (paraphrasing because people can’t spend 2 MINUTES to watch themselves) made the comment that the Bills have the most talented roster in the AFC East. Josh said yeah, I think so, but what’s even better about our team is the camaraderie. We have such good relationships. There are so many great veterans that he’s learned from and do a good job of keeping the locker room together. Sanchez said “What guys do you love the most, or who’s influenced you the most?” 
 

To which Josh without hesitation responded Lee Smith... and the went on to talk about him on his own... then when Josh explained the value he brought Sanchez said “You need a guy like that on every team.” 

 
No one is arguing that Lee Smith is not a big influence in Josh (if he says so). 
 

So what?  Should they bring back Derek Anderson for the same “value”?

 

Josh doesn’t require a nice old vet who can’t play any more (Daboll sure hasn’t found much for him to do this year) to be his “liason” to Daboll and McD.

[Kelly the Dog]

4 hours ago, NoSaint said:

Should just have our 6th lineman report eligible in that package 

Didn’t we? I thought the only two receivers on that play were Smith and Ryan Bates. 
 

imo that was a terrible call on fourth after not being able to run it in first. The D would almost be expecting a pass. You run that on first or second. Plus you have freaking Josh Allen. You roll him out on a run pass option. 

[ogham26]

he clearly has value. solid enough run blocker and a great guy to have in the locker room.  i wont be surprised if hes back on a vet min deal in the future

[Buffalo_Stampede]

14 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Then the play would never work...but it does.

In different situations. It was like 1.5 yards, at least seemed that way. 

Edited December 9, 2020 by Buffalo_Stampede

[JGMcD2]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 
No one is arguing that Lee Smith is not a big influence in Josh (if he says so). 
 

So what?  Should they bring back Derek Anderson for the same “value”?

 

Josh doesn’t require a nice old vet who can’t play any more (Daboll sure hasn’t found much for him to do this year) to be his “liason” to Daboll and McD.

It’s not Josh’s liaison... Josh said he learned things from him leadership wise... and he’s a guy that acts as a liaison for ALL OF THE PLAYERS. I really don’t understand how you created this idea that Josh needs someone to talk to McDermott and Daboll about everything for him. 
 

That’s not what it is. Do you understand there are conversations that players have with other players that they won’t necessarily bring up to the coaching staff? 

 

I don’t understand why you continue to push back on this when I’ve literally witnessed these things put in place and happen. Coaching staff and players aren’t friends, they have to work together. Staff members are seen as management by players... players are an entirely different party.  They don’t always freely discuss everything... but it’s valuable to have guys that build good relationships and are able to bridge the gap between the two parties. 

[Royale with Cheese]

20 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

“NFL careers” includes anyone who ever got 

a single check from a single team.  It’s a meaningless stat.

 

Josh is a great guy.  Says only nice things about everyone.  Lee can stick around the locker room forever as a coaching staff member if that’s his value.  It’s clearly not on the field—you aren’t even arguing that.  
 

He’s a rarely  used player.  DiMarco was a legendary “locker room leader” until McD woke up last year and realized he added nothing in Sundays.  Same thing will happen soon with Smith and it will have no negative impact on Josh.  

If they are deactivating Kroft for Smith then he’s adding more value than you want to admit.  But let me guess, you know the roster better than McDermott.  I honestly think you really believe that and I’m not lying.  

 

Its meaningless stat?  9 seasons means nothing?  He was kept around for 9 seasons without providing anything?  Smith is a magician.
 

The level you will go to argue lol.  You don’t know anything that goes inside that locker room or the team but you argue as if you do.  Geezus.

[JGMcD2]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

If they are deactivating Kroft for Smith then he’s adding more value than you want to admit.  But let me guess, you know the roster better than McDermott.  I honestly think you really believe that and I’m not lying.  

 

Its meaningless stat?  9 seasons means nothing?  He was kept around for 9 seasons without providing anything?  Smith is a magician.
 

The level you will go to argue lol.  You don’t know anything that goes inside that locker room or the team but you argue as if you do.  Geezus.

Correct, he’s literally arguing with someone who’s been in a locker room and witnessed these things... but he’s right and I am wrong. 

[NoSaint]

6 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Didn’t we? I thought the only two receivers on that play were Smith and Ryan Bates. 
 

imo that was a terrible call on fourth after not being able to run it in first. The D would almost be expecting a pass. You run that on first or second. Plus you have freaking Josh Allen. You roll him out on a run pass option. 

honestly have no idea on that specific play. Was more of a global commentary on Lee smith. 
 

bates is a great example of a better blocker that could benefit from consistent live fore reps. Something along the lines of Zach streif starting out on the saints in that role then kicking in as full time tackle after a couple seasons.

 

if the blocking tight end is no threat downfield, may as well just maximize the blocking, no?

7 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

If they are deactivating Kroft for Smith then he’s adding more value than you want to admit.  But let me guess, you know the roster better than McDermott.  I honestly think you really believe that and I’m not lying.  

 

Its meaningless stat?  9 seasons means nothing?  He was kept around for 9 seasons without providing anything?  Smith is a magician.
 

The level you will go to argue lol.  You don’t know anything that goes inside that locker room or the team but you argue as if you do.  Geezus.

just because a successful coach does something doesn’t mean he is always correct

[Buffalo_Stampede]

They ran a similar play on 4th and less than 1 vs the Rams. Rams weren't fooled but Lee just had to use his big body to shield the defense. 

[Mr. WEO]

22 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

If they are deactivating Kroft for Smith then he’s adding more value than you want to admit.  But let me guess, you know the roster better than McDermott.  I honestly think you really believe that and I’m not lying.  

 

Its meaningless stat?  9 seasons means nothing?  He was kept around for 9 seasons without providing anything?  Smith is a magician.
 

The level you will go to argue lol.  You don’t know anything that goes inside that locker room or the team but you argue as if you do.  Geezus.

Countless posters here said DiMarco was a waste of a roster spot at least a year before McBeane decided the same.

 

Same for Nate Peterman.  Why? Because we could see what happened on Sunday.  NPwas awful, but then he “won” a bogus preason “QB competition” because McD didn’t have the nerve to start his #7 pick week 1.  The folley of this decision was overwhelmingly obvious by halftime of week 1 and McD then did the obvious and the rest is history.
 

Coaches and FOs make mistakes ALL THE TIME.  How can you argue otherwise credibly? You can’t.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Mr. WEO

[BruceVilanch]

Did Lee Smith diddle you or something when you were little?

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

just because a successful coach does something doesn’t mean he is always correct

And we as fans are informed  enough determine whether McDermott is making a mistake with the active roster?

[Mr. WEO]

5 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

honestly have no idea on that specific play. Was more of a global commentary on Lee smith. 
 

bates is a great example of a better blocker that could benefit from consistent live fore reps. Something along the lines of Zach streif starting out on the saints in that role then kicking in as full time tackle after a couple seasons.

 

if the blocking tight end is no threat downfield, may as well just maximize the blocking, no?

just because a successful coach does something doesn’t mean he is always correct

The obviousness of this escapes many here.  It’s mind blowing. 

2 minutes ago, BruceVilanch said:

Did Lee Smith diddle you or something when you were little?

Show me the doll 

[BruceVilanch]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

Show me the doll 

Maybe the doll is his avatar picture.

[Mr. WEO]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

And we as fans are informed  enough determine whether McDermott is making a mistake with the active roster?

Is this a real question?