Stank_Nasty Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001063730/article/patriots-stephon-gilmore-heads-list-of-top-five-nfl-cornerbacks Good stuff coming from a high level CB in his day. I would argue we have 2 corners that could be considered top 10 this year as Wallace has been playing awesome as well! Exciting times! 3 Tre'Davious White CB Bills There has been a youth movement at the cornerback position, and White has been at the center of it since coming into the league in 2017. He is thriving under Sean McDermott in Buffalo as a more athletic version of Josh Norman, who had his best seasons with McDermott in Carolina. The Bills don't play a ton of man-to-man; rather, the defense works collectively to succeed in zone coverages. A form of zone McDermott uses is quarters/palms, which is a form of trap coverage. In simple terms, the cornerback reads the route of WR2 while keeping WR1 in his vision. If WR2 breaks out, the cornerback defends him and the safety takes WR1. Defenders must have a high football IQ to succeed in this defense, and White has all the necessary tools and then some, having forced three turnovers so far this season, including a game-sealing interception in Week 3 5 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Interesting , both the CB and safety have to make the right call or you could have a disaster. So Jalen Ramsey is not in his top 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Vontae Davis was saying the same thing, but he walked out of the interview. This just never gets old...until my comment above. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted October 9, 2019 Author Share Posted October 9, 2019 8 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: Interesting , both the CB and safety have to make the right call or you could have a disaster. So Jalen Ramsey is not in his top 5. he sorta clears that up in the beginning saying he just hasn't played enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Well-written and his rankings are spot-on. I hated Hall as a player but that article impressed me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 outsiders always pump up Bills DBs I'd prefer to hear about the LBs or linemen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bongo Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 But none of his games were prime time against his former team so this can’t be valid. His playing doesn’t count. At least that’s what I’m told. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Bout damn time someone sees tre in the shadow of overrated Marshon Lattimore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Lattimore remains in my top 5. The last two weeks he has been back to his best after a slow start to the season. He totally shut down Mike Evans on Sunday. It was hugely impressive. I called Lattimore, White, Humphrey potentially an all time corner class at draft time and so far, so good. Darius Slay and Jalen Ramsey are both still elite but have been hurt and Casey Hayward of the Chargers is another who is consistently excellent and underrated. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted October 9, 2019 Author Share Posted October 9, 2019 13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Lattimore remains in my top 5. The last two weeks he has been back to his best after a slow start to the season. He totally shut down Mike Evans on Sunday. It was hugely impressive. I called Lattimore, White, Humphrey potentially an all time corner class at draft time and so far, so good. Darius Slay and Jalen Ramsey are both still elite but have been hurt and Casey Hayward of the Chargers is another who is consistently excellent and underrated. where would you put tre? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: where would you put tre? Right there in that top 5 or 6 too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Always hated Hall. He was the first domino to fall in the sequence of events that cost the Bills Ben Roethlisberger in the 04 draft. Shortly after he was picked, HOU got nervous that they wouldn’t get their CB with the Bills pick and cancelled their trade with the Bills. Ugh ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Am I crazy to think Levi Wallace has been better this year? That's no slight against Tre either. I think they are both top 10 in the NFL. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 IMO, Deangelo Hall, knows more about the intricacies of gambling and missing than almost anyone in the history of football. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 12 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said: IMO, Deangelo Hall, knows more about the intricacies of gambling and missing than almost anyone in the history of football. CB is a risky position, good thing they are off the screen 1.2 seconds after the ball is snapped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Just now, row_33 said: CB is a risky position, good thing they are off the screen 1.2 seconds after the ball is snapped Yup. But so risky that you don't do it so often. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Tre' is another Josh Norman. Great in his system, but very much limited to that zone system. Someone else will almost certainly overpay for him thinking he's a lock-down man cover guy. The Bills should and probably will know better. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Stank_Nasty said: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001063730/article/patriots-stephon-gilmore-heads-list-of-top-five-nfl-cornerbacks Good stuff coming from a high level CB in his day. I would argue we have 2 corners that could be considered top 10 this year as Wallace has been playing awesome as well! Exciting times! 3 Tre'Davious White CB Bills There has been a youth movement at the cornerback position, and White has been at the center of it since coming into the league in 2017. He is thriving under Sean McDermott in Buffalo as a more athletic version of Josh Norman, who had his best seasons with McDermott in Carolina. The Bills don't play a ton of man-to-man; rather, the defense works collectively to succeed in zone coverages. A form of zone McDermott uses is quarters/palms, which is a form of trap coverage. In simple terms, the cornerback reads the route of WR2 while keeping WR1 in his vision. If WR2 breaks out, the cornerback defends him and the safety takes WR1. Defenders must have a high football IQ to succeed in this defense, and White has all the necessary tools and then some, having forced three turnovers so far this season, including a game-sealing interception in Week 3 And yet, it's a scheme where CBs are not generally going to get a lot of INTs, which like it or not, is how the position is generally measured. It requires CBs to keep everything in front of them and isn't big on freelancing or jumping routes. Not taking away anything from 'Tre but he's unlikely to ever have big individual stats in the collectively-focused scheme the Bills play... Edited October 9, 2019 by Lurker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: Right there in that top 5 or 6 too. Funny you say top six. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Want to know where a vast amount of our cap space is going to go? Our own players 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 2 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Lattimore remains in my top 5. The last two weeks he has been back to his best after a slow start to the season. He totally shut down Mike Evans on Sunday. It was hugely impressive. I called Lattimore, White, Humphrey potentially an all time corner class at draft time and so far, so good. Darius Slay and Jalen Ramsey are both still elite but have been hurt and Casey Hayward of the Chargers is another who is consistently excellent and underrated. Should have added Pat Pete to this too. We haven't seen him yet this year for suspension reasons but when we last saw him last year he still looked pretty darn awesome to me. Pat Pete, Slay, Hayward and Gilmore..... then Ramsey and the three 2017 guys. You can argue about the order but I can't think of anyone else who deserves mention in that group. Hall has Jaire Alexander in there and he has played very well this year but he needs to do it for longer before I have him in that company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Love Tre. But if Hall is going to say Tre has been top 3, then his next line should be “And Levi Wallace has been top 2”. Because as good as Tre is, Levi has been even better this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted October 9, 2019 Author Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said: Love Tre. But if Hall is going to say Tre has been top 3, then his next line should be “And Levi Wallace has been top 2”. Because as good as Tre is, Levi has been even better this year. ya. its up for debate at least. and I said in my initial post I think we have 2 corners playing at a top ten level this year for sure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: ya. its up for debate at least. and I said in my initial post I think we have 2 corners playing at a top ten level this year for sure. Agreed. We have without question the best secondary in the NFL IMO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted October 9, 2019 Author Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: Agreed. We have without question the best secondary in the NFL IMO yup. i'm 100% with that... and its DEEP. Edited October 9, 2019 by Stank_Nasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 21 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: yup. i'm 100% with that... and its DEEP. Yes it really is deep and its awesome! For fun, I went and looked at the deep analytics of our starting secondary in Hyde, Poyer, Tre, and Levi. To no surprise, all having excellent seasons. No one is giving up a comp % rate in our starting secondary over 56%. All of them are between 52% and 55% with Levi having the lowest. Even Edmunds is in the same range as a LB. Levi has been targeted 44 times compared to Levi's 27, yet he has given up 7 less yards than Tre despite the 17 more targets he has faced. Tre is giving up 5 more yards per completion too than Levi. Levi won't get the love because he doesn't have the INT's that make people gravitate towards accolades, but he has been excellent. Tre has been quite good too, just showing how Levi is playing so well under the radar and trying to get him the well deserved attention his play deserves too. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacklabel Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, BobChalmers said: Tre' is another Josh Norman. Great in his system, but very much limited to that zone system. Someone else will almost certainly overpay for him thinking he's a lock-down man cover guy. The Bills should and probably will know better. Tre isn't just a zone corner. He played a lot of man in college and shut down guys like Amari Cooper and Calvin Ridley. Check out some of the quotes from his scouting report: "...one of the premier mirror-and-match cornerbacks in the game. Has the feet, athleticism and instincts for prolonged coverage responsibilities and his twitch will always have him near the throw. Best suited for all forms of man coverage." "Experienced island corner with slot reps over last two seasons." "Patient in press and rarely commits prematurely." He's a really versatile DB and I'm sure that versatility was one of the main reasons he was drafted by McDermott. And I'm pretty certain he's firmly in their future plans as one of their "sign our own" type of players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, BobChalmers said: Tre' is another Josh Norman. Great in his system, but very much limited to that zone system. Someone else will almost certainly overpay for him thinking he's a lock-down man cover guy. The Bills should and probably will know better. Tre plays much better than Josh Norman in man and runs a 4.45 to keep with most receivers Through 3 years Tre's numbers in man and zone have been great, and he is not a one trick pony 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bookie Man Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Tre is a beast. Levi Wallace has a been a gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 I have noticed McD and Frazier has called alot of palms coverage this season It's a very high risk high reward coverage and your secondary needs to be in perfect communication to 2 trap Having Hyde and Poyer back there is certainly a key factor in being able to do it.. now a creative OC can take advantage of palms coverage if they recognize it and call a flood play overloaded to 1 side with slight adjustments 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 The Bills rank at the top of the NFL in everything defensively, except maybe not having a top edge rusher opposite Hughes, but they get by with more than enough without one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Joe Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, njbuff said: The Bills rank at the top of the NFL in everything defensively, except maybe not having a top edge rusher opposite Hughes, but they get by with more than enough without one. Yeah true, but I think they should still try to acquire one in free agency this offseason... Hughes is coming to the end of his career and he might start looking old real quick... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Joe Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 2 hours ago, John from Riverside said: Want to know where a vast amount of our cap space is going to go? Our own players I see that Spotrac has done a Market Value estimation for Tre's upcoming contract an $70.5M for 5 years... It seems money that he will get somewhere so I hope the Bills are going to pay it.... https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tredavious-white-21768/market-value/ Does anyone know if they can pay him part of his guaranteed money for his new deal next year when he is still on the last year of his rookie deal and have that money count under next years cap? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Just now, Aussie Joe said: I see that Spotrac has done a Market Value estimation for Tre's upcoming contract an $70.5M for 5 years... It seems money that he will get somewhere so I hope the Bills are going to pay it.... https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tredavious-white-21768/market-value/ Does anyone know if they can pay him part of his guaranteed money for his new deal next year when he is still on the last year of his rookie deal and have that money count under next years cap? I of course am thrilled with the cap management Beane has done.....with even more coming next year. A lot of ppl blasted Beane for not spending it....I hope some get it now.....we have gone through a entire clean rebiuld....we had a dead cap year which sucked (last year) and now the slate is clean....we have SEVERAL players on our OWN team that are worthy of big contracts...they are young...they are improving And it also explains why we are not spending a huge chunk on one player yet......because to keep OUR good players that is where it is going to go. It is also going to be important that Beane continue his wizard ways when it comes to drafting......two EXCELLENT drafts so far 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said: Tre plays much better than Josh Norman in man and runs a 4.45 to keep with most receivers Through 3 years Tre's numbers in man and zone have been great, and he is not a one trick pony Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 Every DB gives up some yards and catches. I don't think White falls into that highest eschelon of shut down corner like Revis was. But I don't think there is another DB in the league as good as Revis was in his prime. I think White is around 4 or 5. Wallace is playing so well he may be right around 10-12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 Levi Wallace has played well but he does fall into that strictly zone only guy. Luckily I don't think the Bills will be requiring a coaching or scheme change any time soon. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeelingOnYouboty Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 Levi’s been better this year. Both are elite! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 You would be hard pressed to find a better CB duo than Wallace and White.......... and a better safety duo..........,. and a better LB trio.............. and DL depth. Get my point? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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