Per Beane: bills still in on Ansah

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Sorry, Eric.

 

Unnecessary commitments of cap space to try to buy the locker room are so "old Billsy".    Beane also added incentives to McCoy's contract at the same time he extended Wood.    As if he wasn't already double dipping on his Eagles contract.   How accommodating!

 

Fortunately McBeane inherited a franchise with few cap commitments for 2018 and beyond.   That allowed Beane to murder a mountain of Pegula bucks and play the martyr when a big chunk of that dead money was due to things like signing AJ McCarron and Corey Coleman and EWoods unnecessary contract extension etc..  

 

 

 

Dude, it was an extension.  That contract is given out dozens of times every year in the NFL.  But you act like it is so novel.  I just don't get it. 

[thebandit27]

38 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

That one's easy.    

 

Pass.

 

If he goes off and turns into a DE that's worth $10M+ just franchise him and work out a longer term deal.

 

Let the free agency carrot bring out the best in him.........he's had some self-admitted motivation issues.

 

Not worth the risk of Eric Wood-ing yourself for the difference between cap and option figures when you are as cap flush as the Bills are next season.

 

 

The only place that I disagree with you is that I believe you can pull the option year prior to the start of the league year and get off scot-free.  Is that right?

 

EDIT: apparently yes...

 

https://frontofficenfl.com/2017/03/27/nfl-rookie-contracts-explained-fifth-year-option/

 

"When a team exercises the option, it becomes guaranteed for injury only. If the player is on the team’s roster at the start of the League Year in his option season, his salary becomes fully guaranteed for skill, cap and injury."

 

Now I agree that I would not pick up his option and use it to motivate him to get the best out of him.  If, however, you had a player for which motivation wasn't the reason to not pick up the option, then I would definitely pick it up with the intention of pulling it prior to the start of the next league year if you aren't happy with the player.

Edited April 29, 2019 by thebandit27

[JM57]

57 minutes ago, WRONG JOSH said:

Two things to keep in mind: Bad shoulder and it's very likely he is older than they are saying. He's probably early 30's. Multiple reports saying they listed him as 2 years younger to help his draft position.

 

I'd much prefer a trade for Clowney if it made financial sense to do so

I don't care about either of these things if they are bringing him in on a one year, bet on yourself deal. He would be motivated to prove his health and produce to cash in when he hits free agency again next year.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, thebandit27 said:

 

The only place that I disagree with you is that I believe you can pull the option year prior to the start of the league year and get off scot-free.  Is that right?

 

Only guaranteed for injury..........which for a guy who has missed games every season is enough reason for me to pass on $10M+ for a rotational DE.

 

I also think the motivation factor of looming free agency is HUGE for Shaq.

 

This is a dude who still hustles to the airport after home games to spend his off day being Wooderson at Clemson.........I think he has another level of commitment in him.

 

I think he's a good dude at heart but needs to find that next level of commitment...........and if he does we will know because he's not talented enough to just turn it on for a season like an Albert Haynesworth.   

 

Once he realizes what it takes..........I think the chances are good that he can sustain whatever he builds.

[cba fan]

2 hours ago, DallasMac said:

I'll wait and see what Dr House has to say about his shoulder

based on Dr House's use of ambulatory aids I would predict he would put the shoulder-wrap/harness on Ansah's wrong shoulder.

Edited April 29, 2019 by cba fan

[Formerly Allan in MD]

54 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Makes no sense nobody has taken a flyer on him.  

It makes plenty of sense if his shoulder remains a problem, unless he's willing to sign for peanuts.

[BuffaloRebound]

10 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

The only place that I disagree with you is that I believe you can pull the option year prior to the start of the league year and get off scot-free.  Is that right?

 

EDIT: apparently yes...

 

https://frontofficenfl.com/2017/03/27/nfl-rookie-contracts-explained-fifth-year-option/

 

"When a team exercises the option, it becomes guaranteed for injury only. If the player is on the team’s roster at the start of the League Year in his option season, his salary becomes fully guaranteed for skill, cap and injury."

 

Now I agree that I would not pick up his option and use it to motivate him to get the best out of him.  If, however, you had a player for which motivation wasn't the reason to not pick up the option, then I would definitely pick it up with the intention of pulling it prior to the start of the next league year if you aren't happy with the player.

 

Lawson would still be motivated if they exercised the 5th year option.  It’s only guaranteed for injury, so Bills could always pull it.  I don’t see much downside in exercising the option.  If he gets hurt, Bills have more than enough cap space to absorb the $10m.  If he doesn’t raise his game, you pull the option.  If he raises his game, you control him another year for $10m. 

[thebandit27]

10 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Only guaranteed for injury..........which for a guy who has missed games every season is enough reason for me to pass on $10M+ for a rotational DE.

 

I also think the motivation factor of looming free agency is HUGE for Shaq.

 

This is a dude who still hustles to the airport after home games to spend his off day being Wooderson at Clemson.........I think he has another level of commitment in him.

 

I think he's a good dude at heart but needs to find that next level of commitment...........and if he does we will know because he's not talented enough to just turn it on for a season like an Albert Haynesworth.   

 

Once he realizes what it takes..........I think the chances are good that he can sustain whatever he builds.

 

Agreed--as I mentioned in my edit, I wouldn't pick up his option year.  I was more speaking to the idea that picking up the option doesn't tie the team into anything unless there's an injury.

 

I still think there's an Adrian Clayborn-type player in Shaq if he gets his poop in a group; this would be the year to do it too. 

[cba fan]

2 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I don’t see what he brings to the table that sets him apart from Zo, Murphy and Lawson. 

They can get the same production from their rotation that they’d get from him. I’d rather see them grab a younger guy hungry for a shot like philips last year than spend millions on Ziggy. Best chance is a one year prove it deal and he actually stays healthy and makes an impact, I would hate to see a multi year deal though 

well..........Ansah gets sacks, so we have that going for Bills if they sign him.

Edited April 29, 2019 by cba fan

[billsfan_34]

2 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I don’t see what he brings to the table that sets him apart from Zo, Murphy and Lawson. 

They can get the same production from their rotation that they’d get from him. I’d rather see them grab a younger guy hungry for a shot like philips last year than spend millions on Ziggy. Best chance is a one year prove it deal and he actually stays healthy and makes an impact, I would hate to see a multi year deal though 

Go back and watch Ziggy again. He is much better than all 3. He would be a huge upgrade if his shoulder is ok. It is a huge risk and why no one has scooped him up yet.

[MacGyver]

Didn't they sign an injured edge guy last off season that never amounted to much?  Why do that again?

[BADOLBILZ]

12 minutes ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

It makes plenty of sense if his shoulder remains a problem, unless he's willing to sign for peanuts.

 

The comment you responded to was about Shane Ray not Ansah.

 

We all know why Ziggy is unsigned.   

[MAJBobby]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

That one's easy.    

 

Pass.

 

If he goes off and turns into a DE that's worth $10M+ just franchise him and work out a longer term deal.

 

Let the free agency carrot bring out the best in him.........he's had some self-admitted motivation issues.

 

Not worth the risk of Eric Wood-ing yourself for the difference between cap and option figures when you are as cap flush as the Bills are next season.

 

 

By Picking up the 5th year option of Lawson leaves the Franchise Tag Option for Jerry Hughes. 

 

IMO it is smart for them to pick up the non guaranteed 5th year option to leave the flexibility of the tag on Hughes if an extension can’t get worked out. 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, MacGyver said:

Didn't they sign an injured edge guy last off season that never amounted to much?  Why do that again?

 

 

Because the Bills pass rush  was weak last year...........and if he is healthy he is capable of putting up sack numbers that teams are paying $20M+ per season for.

 

 

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

By Picking up the 5th year option of Lawson leaves the Franchise Tag Option for Jerry Hughes. 

 

IMO it is smart for them to pick up the non guaranteed 5th year option to leave the flexibility of the tag on Hughes if an extension can’t get worked out. 

 

That's an interesting point but has anyone ever used the franchise tag on ANY PLAYER who would be 32 years old that coming season?

 

Seems off-the-table to me.   Hard to envision a situation where Hughes wouldn't run to the table to sign that.

[MAJBobby]

8 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Because the Bills pass rush  was weak last year...........and if he is healthy he is capable of putting up sack numbers that teams are paying $20M+ per season for.

 

 

 

That's an interesting point but has anyone ever used the franchise tag on ANY PLAYER who would be 32 years old that coming season?

 

Seems off-the-table to me.   Hard to envision a situation where Hughes wouldn't run to the table to sign that.

 

Does the age matter on a 1 year Franchise Tag deal if the player is producing?

 

or is it better to lock up a 32 year old player for multiple years? 

[thurst44]

2 hours ago, I am the egg man said:

If.Bills were sold on Lawson, it's unlikely they'd be pressing for Ansah.

Totally different style of play and skillsets. I don't think it has to be one or the other. 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Does the age matter on a 1 year Franchise Tag deal if the player is producing?

 

or is it better to lock up a 32 year old player for multiple years? 

 

There isn't precedent for it.........but it's certainly a viable question if he has a resurgent season in his walk year.

 

I'd be stunned if they franchised him though.........even if he put up 10 sacks........which despite good pressure numbers is a long way from what he's been able to finish in recent years.

 

I think they could get Hughes done for 3 years at the same guaranteed money as a 1 year franchise deal.

 

 

[JoeF]

Not sure the 18 stats are published yet, but in 17 the Bills were 66% nickel. 

 

Some of us have been debating about depth at LB but it really doesn't matter that much on Game day.  Keeping 5 active is enough.  So how does this fit into the discussion about adding a DE...potentially three ways..

 

1) Tremaine Edmunds would be an interesting option at rush end sometimes (maybe 5-10 snaps a game) in the nickel  6'5" 250, fast....

2) Joseph, Neal and Jaquan Johnson would have to develop into a crew that the Bills trust putting at big Nickel LB

3) Put Oliver at DE in some formations--he would run circles around, under and through OTs and TEs....again this is a 5-10 snaps scenario a game max

 

Bills have a lot of parts on D...not sure Ansah is necessary but with  66% nickel, you need lots of alternatives at DE...including some unorthodox ones.  If Ansah can give you 20 snaps on a $5-7 million one year prove it deal -- I would be all for it.

Edited April 29, 2019 by JoeF

[Rc2catch]

27 minutes ago, billsfan_34 said:

Go back and watch Ziggy again. He is much better than all 3. He would be a huge upgrade if his shoulder is ok. It is a huge risk and why no one has scooped him up yet.

I have seen him play, he’s had a couple decent seasons... Just don’t want them to sign him up long term. 

28 minutes ago, cba fan said:

well..........Ansah gets sacks, so we have that going for Bills if they sign him.

So do Murphy and Zo, when healthy.

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

And what happens when Murphy and Shaq get hurt like they regularly do?  Good depth and competition matters.  It’s just been so long since we’ve had it, we view it as overkill. We NEED another pass rushing DE if we want to take that next step.  Not saying that ansah is even good, but he’s better than Yarbrough.  I’m sure of it

As I said above I just don’t want a long term deal with him. A one year prove it is ok, anything more is a waste in my opinion as they can probably match Ansahs production in the rotation 

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

There isn't precedent for it.........but it's certainly a viable question if he has a resurgent season in his walk year.

 

I'd be stunned if they franchised him though.........even if he put up 10 sacks........which despite good pressure numbers is a long way from what he's been able to finish in recent years.

 

I think they could get Hughes done for 3 years at the same guaranteed money as a 1 year franchise deal.

 

 

 

I hear you. And agree. Just pointing out is all that by using a non guaranteed 5th year option on Shaq the bill keep maximum flexibility and risk management when it comes to Hughes 

[NewEra]

13 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

I have seen him play, he’s had a couple decent seasons... Just don’t want them to sign him up long term. 

So do Murphy and Zo, when healthy.

As I said above I just don’t want a long term deal with him. A one year prove it is ok, anything more is a waste in my opinion as they can probably match Ansahs production in the rotation 

Agreed.  Wouldn’t even mind a multiyear deal as long as we can cut him following the season (with minimal dead cap) if he doesn’t perform

[BillsSbSoon]

21 minutes ago, JoeF said:

Not sure the 18 stats are published yet, but in 17 the Bills were 66% nickel. 

 

Some of us have been debating about depth at LB but it really doesn't matter that much on Game day.  Keeping 5 active is enough.  So how does this fit into the discussion about adding a DE...potentially three ways..

 

1) Tremaine Edmunds would be an interesting option at rush end sometimes (maybe 5-10 snaps a game) in the nickel  6'5" 250, fast....

2) Joseph, Neal and Jaquan Johnson would have to develop into a crew that the Bills trust putting at big Nickel LB

3) Put Oliver at DE in some formations--he would run circles around, under and through OTs and TEs....again this is a 5-10 snaps scenario a game max

 

Bills have a lot of parts on D...not sure Ansah is necessary but with  66% nickel, you need lots of alternatives at DE...including some unorthodox ones.  If Ansah can give you 20 snaps on a $5-7 million one year prove it deal -- I would be all for it.

Oliver on 3rd down in nickel pass rush is going to be a nightmare for other teams to deal with. Can put lawson next to him too in there

Edited April 29, 2019 by BillsSbSoon

[The Bills Blog]

Beane is literally quoted as saying the Bills AREN'T in or out on him, and the thread title is "Bills still in on Ansah"?

[Rocket94]

Why don't we let Beane and his accountants worry about money and value. If a player can come in and provide impact and fit in the cap...let us be concerned with winning football games.

[billsfan_34]

32 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

I have seen him play, he’s had a couple decent seasons... Just don’t want them to sign him up long term. 

So do Murphy and Zo, when healthy.

As I said above I just don’t want a long term deal with him. A one year prove it is ok, anything more is a waste in my opinion as they can probably match Ansahs production in the rotation 

30, off an injury- no way to a long term deal. 1 year show me deal is the safe bet here.

[BADOLBILZ]

6 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

Why don't we let Beane and his accountants worry about money and value. If a player can come in and provide impact and fit in the cap...let us be concerned with winning football games.

 

Mmmkay....

 

Past 3 Bills HC records:

McDermott 15-17

Rex 15-17

Marrone 15-17

 

I think it's probably better to talk about something else

 

 

[Rocket94]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Mmmkay....

 

Past 3 Bills HC records:

McDermott 15-17

Rex 15-17

Marrone 15-17

 

I think it's probably better to talk about something else

 

 

I can go way back! It just seems like some members on here think Beane has no clue. Let him do his job...I wouldn't want it. 

[ndirish1978]

Ansah should only come cheap on a 1 year offer. This guy reeks of someone who won't start the season, will play a game around week 3, get injured and then miss half the season rehabbing the same freaking injury he was sitting out for.

[Rocket94]

Just now, ndirish1978 said:

Ansah should only come cheap on a 1 year offer. This guy reeks of someone who won't start the season, will play a game around week 3, get injured and then miss half the season rehabbing the same freaking injury he was sitting out for.

So true...we need production and good health! There must be a good and healthy DE somewhere! 

[gobills1212]

32 minutes ago, The Bills Blog said:

Beane is literally quoted as saying the Bills AREN'T in or out on him, and the thread title is "Bills still in on Ansah"?

People like their click baity titles. Personally it drives me nuts lol. If they put half the effort in their posts as they did their titles we'd be in a golden age at tbd imo

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

45 minutes ago, The Bills Blog said:

Beane is literally quoted as saying the Bills AREN'T in or out on him, and the thread title is "Bills still in on Ansah"?

Quote

“Yeah, we are (still in on trying to sign Ansah),” Beane said to WGR-550 radio. “Nothing’s done. He traveled last week to visit a team, I think it was Baltimore. So yes, still talk, staying in touch with his agent, and so… there’s nothing to report. We’re not in on it yet, we’re not out of it yet.”

Bills still 'in' on free agent DE Ziggy Ansah

12 minutes ago, gobills1212 said:

People like their click baity titles. Personally it drives me nuts lol. If they put half the effort in their posts as they did their titles we'd be in a golden age at tbd imo

 

Edited April 29, 2019 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[HOUSE]

#1 Book flight to Buffalo

#2 Take pen, sign deal

#3 Smile for the camera

#4 Drink beer

[Chandler#81]

2 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Only guaranteed for injury..........which for a guy who has missed games every season is enough reason for me to pass on $10M+ for a rotational DE.

 

I also think the motivation factor of looming free agency is HUGE for Shaq.

 

This is a dude who still hustles to the airport after home games to spend his off day being Wooderson at Clemson.........I think he has another level of commitment in him.

 

I think he's a good dude at heart but needs to find that next level of commitment...........and if he does we will know because he's not talented enough to just turn it on for a season like an Albert Haynesworth.   

 

Once he realizes what it takes..........I think the chances are good that he can sustain whatever he builds.

I believe we’ll have a better understanding of the Shaq situation by the end of the week. Beane said as much, getting to him after the Draft. It’s a big one as it will significantly increase his cap hit to stay, just to have to pay more next offseason, should he ‘break out’ at that high paying position. For me, that’s the deal breaker. He finally was satisfactory last season. But satisfactory isn’t what gets you big buck$. We’ve had 3 years with this 1st rounder, and your point of  lack commitment in & out of the lockeroom, to me spells the end. 

 

There’s still the June 1st Cuts thing, right? If nothing else, he can be replaced with another satisfactory DE.

[Rocket94]

7 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

I believe we’ll have a better understanding of the Shaq situation by the end of the week. Beane said as much, getting to him after the Draft. It’s a big one as it will significantly increase his cap hit to stay, just to have to pay more next offseason, should he ‘break out’ at that high paying position. For me, that’s the deal breaker. He finally was satisfactory last season. But satisfactory isn’t what gets you big buck$. We’ve had 3 years with this 1st rounder, and your point of  lack commitment in & out of the lockeroom, to me spells the end. 

 

There’s still the June 1st Cuts thing, right? If nothing else, he can be replaced with another satisfactory DE.

Exactly. How much time does he need...Murphy as well. Now many will argue that the addition of Oliver will free up opportunities for Murphy and Lawson. I just do not see it...perhaps a marginal difference. They just don't have it...sorry to say, they are not good enough plain and simple. These guys are holding up the rebuild.

Edited April 29, 2019 by Rocket94

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, Rocket94 said:

Exactly. How much time does he need...Murphy as well. Now many will argue that the addition of Oliver will free up opportunities for Murphy and Lawson. I just do not see it...perhaps a marginal difference. They just don't have it...sorry to say, they are not good enough plain and simple.

This from a top NFL defense last year

 

PPL really seem to forget this....the bills did NOT HAVE A BAD DEFENSE LAST YEAR

 

Christ

[Chandler#81]

8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

This from a top NFL defense last year

 

PPL really seem to forget this....the bills did NOT HAVE A BAD DEFENSE LAST YEAR

 

Christ

Idk what your/their criteria is, but I hope it isn’t the nfl ranking based on yards against. We were run on like we were short handed. We were passed on like a drunk hooker at a frat party. Because the offense was pathetic until Josh returned from injury, our opponents seemed to always win the T/O and field position battles ie:short drives for scores.

 

No, it wasn’t “bad” in a very broad sense, but it wasn’t Good specifically.

[BarleyNY]

4 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I don’t see what he brings to the table that sets him apart from Zo, Murphy and Lawson. 

They can get the same production from their rotation that they’d get from him. I’d rather see them grab a younger guy hungry for a shot like philips last year than spend millions on Ziggy. Best chance is a one year prove it deal and he actually stays healthy and makes an impact, I would hate to see a multi year deal though 

 

Ansah is way better than Murphy in all phases of the game.  He’s also a much, much better pass rusher than Shaq.  He would give us a better and deeper DE rotation.  It would also protect us in the event one is injured.  The rotation would certainly be much better with him in it. 

 

4 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

After this season there will be millions of options between draft and free agency. And of course there could be options before the season depending on cuts and practice squads. I wouldn’t hate the signing, unless they gave out a multi year deal. 

 

It depends on the deal.  Not sure what you are thinking, but other options will not be plentiful next year.  How many better options were out there this year?  How many were within the Bills’ reach?  With Hughes and Lawson currently set to be free agents we are looking for 3 quality DEs for 2020, including at least one difference maker and preferably two.  I’d like to retain Hughes as one, but I don’t know how likely that is.  Ansah is a productive DE who has been a very effective pass rusher.  Right now all we have is Hughes in that regard.  Ansah could really improve our anemic pass rush, especially with Oliver getting pressure up the middle.  

Edited April 29, 2019 by BarleyNY

[Turk71]

Ansah made $17,000,000 last year, I wonder what they are trying to get this year. If it is anything close to that forget about it. For their 17 mil the Lions got 11 combined tackles and 4 sacks.

[MrEpsYtown]

I am interested to see what this position brings over the next year or so. McDermott seemed to have a type in Carolina, long armed tall and heavy guys. That isn't Hughes, or Shaq, or Eddie Yarborough. He inherited a lot of what is here outside of Murphy. 

 

I don't love Ansah, but he seems to be the prototype of what coach wants. 6-5, 271, 35 inch arms and twitched up athleticism. Long limbed, tall athletic guys. Now he did have Charles Johnson for years who was solid and similar in size to Shaq. 

 

My point is, this is the last position to be overhauled. Secondary, linebackers, and interior d line have been overhauled into what coach is looking for. DE really hasn't been touched aside from the Murphy addition, and so I wonder if they even bother bringing back Shaq or Hughes, because neither of them fit and it gives him the opportunity to overhaul the position instead of tying money into guys he doesn't really love. I might be wrong as Carolina put a ton of time into scouting Shaq Lawson a few years back. But I think they might want to remake the position next. I do wonder if they are still having discussions on Clowney, but they only have 6 picks next year. 

[John from Riverside]

3 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

Idk what your/their criteria is, but I hope it isn’t the nfl ranking based on yards against. We were run on like we were short handed. We were passed on like a drunk hooker at a frat party. Because the offense was pathetic until Josh returned from injury, our opponents seemed to always win the T/O and field position battles ie:short drives for scores.

 

No, it wasn’t “bad” in a very broad sense, but it wasn’t Good specifically.

points against?  What about this?

 

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/stats-the-numbers-behind-the-bills-no-1-ranked-defense

 

Edited April 29, 2019 by John from Riverside