twoandfourteen Posted November 4, 2018 Author Share Posted November 4, 2018 29 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said: Funny every regime has "set this team back blah blah blah" You can get good in a single offseason if you play your cards right. All it takes is for a good draft and off season. Better make it your best this coming draft. Better hope Josh Allen is who you need him to be. That's not entirely false, so I'll give you that. What exactly has McD & Beane done so far to give you hope that they can "play their cards right" and overhaul the worst professional football offense in recorded history in one offseason? Was it hiring Rick Dennison? Maybe it was hiring Brian Daboll after Dennison was fired. Was it the addition of Jordan Matthews? Maybe it was the trade for Kelvin Benjamin. How about signing Mike Tolbert to really give the offense a spark last year? I'm sure willingly going into the season with Nathan Peterman & Josh Allen at the most important position in professional sports really earned them some serious credibility with you. If we're being honest, it's building a modern team around a solid, MANLY defense and establishing the line of scrimmage in order to win every game 17-13 that shows that THESE GUYS know what they are doing, right? 6 minutes ago, Jerome007 said: Kind of irrelevant? What? While I do agree a bad team in a small market makes it harder to get some guys and have to "overpay" compared to other teams, saying it's irrelevant is just being a pouty negative crybaby. Which after a stretch of games like this year can be easy to comprehend but come on. I'm saying it's irrelevant when used to support McD & Beane as an example of one of their "accomplishments". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 1 hour ago, twoandfourteen said: I hear a lot of the #TeamProcess guys touting how much cap space McD & Beane created & will have available to them to "rebuild" the offense. Apparently that is supposed to serve as evidence that these guys know what they are doing. Do you McBeaners really think ANY free agent of any offensive worth will willingly come here for the going market rate? Do you have any idea just how much you're going to have to overpay to even get one of those guys to return your call? There is going to be a MASSIVE tax on Free Agent signings for the Bills during the next offseason. That $90M is going to go pretty quick on the marginal-to-mediocre talent that will inevitably sign here. Not to mention that they are only going to bring in guys that know their Scripture passages as well as they know their playbook, so the talent pool is limited to begin with. The intelligent & rational among us will soon realize that Free Agency might as well be seen as irrelevant moving forward. McD's ineptitude and arrogance has set this team back 5-8 years, at least. I kind of agree here. The Bills are absolutely paying a premium for offensive guys. They will get some guys to help the team but they aren’t doing it at the going rate. A guy like Roger Saffold is the perfect example. He’s a guy that I think that the Bills should go after but if he is offered the same contract by the Bills and the Rams he’s staying. The Bills probably have to pay 15-20% more than he is getting with a good team. It is still worth it in my opinion but it isn’t ideal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 1 hour ago, twoandfourteen said: So you don't think that the Bills will have any problem signing quality FAs? They will have zero problems signing players. Free agency is the big pay day for established younger players, and for aging vets. The older guys may want to chase a ring but that’s not the guys they want anyways. Money talks. Best offer wins. Basically every single team in the nfl overpays in free agency. We will overpay some guys as well. Some guys (Brown in Bal) elect to sign one year “prove it” deals because their market value is too low. In his specific case he may have been smart. A 3 year deal in buffalo could be equal to the one year in Baltimore. His stats started out good this year, so his guaranteed money will go up a lot next year as long as he stays healthy and productive this season, meaning if buffalo wants to offer him a contract next offseason it’ll probably have to be double what it was this past offseason. I think they have zero issues bringing in quality free agents. We don’t need a #1 receiver, just some weapons. Very few teams actually have a true #1 receiver. We need some speed, some reliability, and an upgrade on overall talent at receiver, tight end, and offensive line. Given the current group do you really think it’s that hard to find better talent? There are going to be guys available, they just might not be superstar house hold names. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boca BIlls Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 11 minutes ago, twoandfourteen said: That's not entirely false, so I'll give you that. What exactly has McD & Beane done so far to give you hope that they can "play their cards right" and overhaul the worst professional football offense in recorded history in one offseason? Was it hiring Rick Dennison? Maybe it was hiring Brian Daboll after Dennison was fired. Was it the addition of Jordan Matthews? Maybe it was the trade for Kelvin Benjamin. How about signing Mike Tolbert to really give the offense a spark last year? I'm sure willingly going into the season with Nathan Peterman & Josh Allen at the most important position in professional sports really earned them some serious credibility with you. If we're being honest, it's building a modern team around a solid, MANLY defense and establishing the line of scrimmage in order to win every game 17-13 that shows that THESE GUYS know what they are doing, right? I'm saying it's irrelevant when used to support McD & Beane as an example of one of their "accomplishments". They haven't given me much other then the defense is about to be the best for a little while with Edmunds his second year will be scary for other teams. Only 21... I think they need to overhaul the offense with 10 picks and a ton of cap it can be done if they have the best evaluation season. I really have to give them one more year with the QB THEY chose... next year though better make the playoffs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, Rc2catch said: They will have zero problems signing players. Free agency is the big pay day for established younger players, and for aging vets. The older guys may want to chase a ring but that’s not the guys they want anyways. Money talks. Best offer wins. Basically every single team in the nfl overpays in free agency. We will overpay some guys as well. Some guys (Brown in Bal) elect to sign one year “prove it” deals because their market value is too low. In his specific case he may have been smart. A 3 year deal in buffalo could be equal to the one year in Baltimore. His stats started out good this year, so his guaranteed money will go up a lot next year as long as he stays healthy and productive this season, meaning if buffalo wants to offer him a contract next offseason it’ll probably have to be double what it was this past offseason. I think they have zero issues bringing in quality free agents. We don’t need a #1 receiver, just some weapons. Very few teams actually have a true #1 receiver. We need some speed, some reliability, and an upgrade on overall talent at receiver, tight end, and offensive line. Given the current group do you really think it’s that hard to find better talent? There are going to be guys available, they just might not be superstar house hold names. Will there be enough quality players out there to fill the holes we need? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, klos63 said: Will there be enough quality players out there to fill the holes we need? Between draft and free agency I don’t see why not. Still might be lacking a little depth, but no reason we can’t see a giant improvement in talent and skill level 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boca BIlls Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 4 minutes ago, klos63 said: Will there be enough quality players out there to fill the holes we need? Offensive line through FA, lower level WR that are more consistent. Draft 2 of the best WRs early 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 Just now, Boca BIlls said: Offensive line through FA, lower level WR that are more consistent. Draft 2 of the best WRs early You grab 2 WRs early and ignore the o-line and holy cow.... ahhhhh, it doesn’t matter.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgg716 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 They won’t have trouble signing them, but their track record shows they will very likely sign the wrong ones, for too much $, while we try to ground and pound in the air raid era 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boca BIlls Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 19 minutes ago, row_33 said: You grab 2 WRs early and ignore the o-line and holy cow.... ahhhhh, it doesn’t matter.... Rebuild the offensive line with players already established... dont want a bunch of rookies protecting Allen, replace gradually for that part. You see now more WRs making big impacts in their rookie years. Edited November 5, 2018 by Boca BIlls 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 34 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: If I were an offensive FA, I'd go to Indy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 42 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said: Rebuild the offensive line with players already established... dont want a bunch of rookies protecting Allen, replace gradually for that part. You see now more WRs making big impacts in their rookie years. There is no answer, we just sit here and say thanks may we have another Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol Dirty B Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 2 hours ago, DCOrange said: The Browns and Bucs haven't made the playoffs in roughly a combined 30 years and they still make big signings seemingly every offseason. Buffalo will be able to sign guys if they want to. Who are these big signings? DeSean Jackson? Who I like but I'm just trying to think of the big signings these teams make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 12 hours ago, Ol Dirty B said: Who are these big signings? DeSean Jackson? Who I like but I'm just trying to think of the big signings these teams make. Most of them tend to not work out, but dating back to 2011: Tampa: Ryan Jensen - arguably the #1 center on the market at the time DeSean Jackson Robert Ayers Brent Grimes Michael Johnson Anthony Collins Alterraun Verner Vincent Jackson Carl Nicks Eric Wright Cleveland: Chris Hubbard Travis Carrie Carlos Hyde Kevin Zeitler Kenny Britt Tramon Williams Donte Whitner Karlos Dansby Paul Kruger Desmond Bryant All these guys were considered to be pretty big signings at the time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 12 hours ago, stony said: If I were an offensive FA, I'd go to Indy. If I were a punter I’d come to Buffalo 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: If I were a punter I’d come to Buffalo I wouldn't. My ***** leg might fall off in the cold 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uticaclub Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 15 hours ago, Steptide said: Browns picked up some good players and they had 1 win in 2 seasons. We'll be alright. They got Baker Mayfield, we have Josh Allen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, Blokestradamus said: I wouldn't. My ***** leg might fall off in the cold Guys are always looking for playing time. This is a spectacular opportunity for a punter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 15 hours ago, KD in CA said: McBeaners? ? He's talking to a very specific subset of fans who have one Irish parent and one Mexican parent. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dablitzkrieg Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 15 hours ago, twoandfourteen said: So you don't think that the Bills will have any problem signing quality FAs? No, $$ talks. They will have no issue. They will need to overpay, but they will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnbillsbacker Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 The Bills could get some free agents to sign for market value if they guaranteed most of the money. Teams like Pittsburgh only guarantee the first year of non QBs contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsMafia13 Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 15 hours ago, twoandfourteen said: If there isn't one available, then what? Thats what im afraid of, I think we could sign all the top FAs on the line and WR and still be a bad offense. Established players on offense wont fix it, and they cant draft talent on offense/ wont make a full impact for at least another year. Who knows how the spend the cap vs draft 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoandfourteen Posted November 6, 2018 Author Share Posted November 6, 2018 10 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said: No, $$ talks. They will have no issue. They will need to overpay, but they will That's exactly the point of my original post. Thank you for agreeing with me. They may have $90M to spend, but every player they sign will cost them significantly more than any other team would have to spend. Free Agency is not going to be a solution to the Offensive problems. Also, the overpayment in terms of total dollars and contract length that the Bills will have to shell out to mediocre talent will only serve to put them in salary cap jail in a few years when these average players inevitably burst into flames. McDermott & Beane have already set this team back until 2023. The only hope they have is that Josh Allen turns into Peyton Roethlisbrady next season and is so good that he is able to overcome the abject offensive incompetence of the coaching staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 Yeh I feel you. Last time I spent $90M all I could think about was buying a bunch of overpriced mediocre crap and now I'm just a poster on a Buffalo Bills messageboard. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 4 minutes ago, twoandfourteen said: That's exactly the point of my original post. Thank you for agreeing with me. They may have $90M to spend, but every player they sign will cost them significantly more than any other team would have to spend. Free Agency is not going to be a solution to the Offensive problems. Also, the overpayment in terms of total dollars and contract length that the Bills will have to shell out to mediocre talent will only serve to put them in salary cap jail in a few years when these average players inevitably burst into flames. McDermott & Beane have already set this team back until 2023. The only hope they have is that Josh Allen turns into Peyton Roethlisbrady next season and is so good that he is able to overcome the abject offensive incompetence of the coaching staff. We may have to overpay, but if we can sign a few guys like Robert Woods, Sammy Watkins, Marquise Goodwin, and Cordy Glenn, I think we'll be fine. 2 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 Simple, jus go out and sign 8 free agents who will perfectly fill in the gaps on the team and play fully motivated and have career seasons from the get-go winning in no time flat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayjent Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 (edited) On 11/4/2018 at 6:34 PM, Rc2catch said: They will have zero problems signing players. Free agency is the big pay day for established younger players, and for aging vets. The older guys may want to chase a ring but that’s not the guys they want anyways. Money talks. Best offer wins. Basically every single team in the nfl overpays in free agency. We will overpay some guys as well. Some guys (Brown in Bal) elect to sign one year “prove it” deals because their market value is too low. In his specific case he may have been smart. A 3 year deal in buffalo could be equal to the one year in Baltimore. His stats started out good this year, so his guaranteed money will go up a lot next year as long as he stays healthy and productive this season, meaning if buffalo wants to offer him a contract next offseason it’ll probably have to be double what it was this past offseason. I think they have zero issues bringing in quality free agents. We don’t need a #1 receiver, just some weapons. Very few teams actually have a true #1 receiver. We need some speed, some reliability, and an upgrade on overall talent at receiver, tight end, and offensive line. Given the current group do you really think it’s that hard to find better talent? There are going to be guys available, they just might not be superstar house hold names. Most teams don't let good players go and resign the goods ones. You have about 10% of the remaining FAs that are worth the contracts, and that takes great pro personnel guys that know what to look for and who is a good player. As much as I didn't like Whaley as GM, he was good at identifying pro talent on other teams for the most part (but still bad contracts galore). Beane's staff has not shown that they are even close in that department, especially on the Offensive side of the ball. Building through FA is the biggest red herring in the NFL - every team that looks like they make a lot of big moves in FA usually ends up well short of expectations. You build through the draft and sign your own talent, then supplement it with value FA signings or good trades. If you can't build through the draft you are dead in the water, because those are the most valuable contracts in the NFL. Edited November 6, 2018 by Ayjent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/5/2018 at 8:57 AM, Dablitzkrieg said: No, $$ talks. They will have no issue. They will need to overpay, but they will isn't this how we got it to our dead cap problem this year....bad contracts? Also, all teams have cap space and make moves to increase it to sign players they want....The Bills won't be the only team trying to sign players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayjent Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 1 minute ago, nucci said: isn't this how we got it to our dead cap problem this year....bad contracts? Also, all teams have cap space and make moves to increase it to sign players they want....The Bills won't be the only team trying to sign players But they will be their bad contracts not the previous regime's - so that makes it okay. I actually hope that they don't go stupid and take on a lot of bad contracts that will saddle them for years. I hope that they stockpile picks and try to build a good solid foundation and keep the money for the guys they want to keep down the road. They aren't going to fix this team through FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerlyofCtown Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/4/2018 at 5:00 PM, twoandfourteen said: I hear a lot of the #TeamProcess guys touting how much cap space McD & Beane created & will have available to them to "rebuild" the offense. Apparently that is supposed to serve as evidence that these guys know what they are doing. Do you McBeaners really think ANY free agent of any offensive worth will willingly come here for the going market rate? Do you have any idea just how much you're going to have to overpay to even get one of those guys to return your call? There is going to be a MASSIVE tax on Free Agent signings for the Bills during the next offseason. That $90M is going to go pretty quick on the marginal-to-mediocre talent that will inevitably sign here. Not to mention that they are only going to bring in guys that know their Scripture passages as well as they know their playbook, so the talent pool is limited to begin with. The intelligent & rational among us will soon realize that Free Agency might as well be seen as irrelevant moving forward. McD's ineptitude and arrogance has set this team back 5-8 years, at least. 5-8 years huh. How did you arrive at that number Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerlyofCtown Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/4/2018 at 5:28 PM, twoandfourteen said: If there isn't one available, then what? draft is suppose to be deep at WR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/5/2018 at 5:57 AM, Dablitzkrieg said: No, $$ talks. They will have no issue. They will need to overpay, but they will So will every other team if they want high profile players. That's what the first couple days of Free Agency is. Bills can grab a lot of good players though. They are in good shape. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watkins90 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/4/2018 at 4:00 PM, twoandfourteen said: I hear a lot of the #TeamProcess guys touting how much cap space McD & Beane created & will have available to them to "rebuild" the offense. Apparently that is supposed to serve as evidence that these guys know what they are doing. Do you McBeaners really think ANY free agent of any offensive worth will willingly come here for the going market rate? Do you have any idea just how much you're going to have to overpay to even get one of those guys to return your call? There is going to be a MASSIVE tax on Free Agent signings for the Bills during the next offseason. That $90M is going to go pretty quick on the marginal-to-mediocre talent that will inevitably sign here. Not to mention that they are only going to bring in guys that know their Scripture passages as well as they know their playbook, so the talent pool is limited to begin with. The intelligent & rational among us will soon realize that Free Agency might as well be seen as irrelevant moving forward. McD's ineptitude and arrogance has set this team back 5-8 years, at least. I always find these posts funny. Clearly, posters like you don't pay close enough attention to this team. Beane has said time and again that he wants to build this team through the draft, and use cap space to keep the good, homegrown players. Beane might sign one or two guys to bloated contracts if they are worth it, but I'd expect a lot of depth, 1-year deals to keep cap space available to sign homegrown players. Might want to check our GMs philosophy before going on about stuff like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/4/2018 at 2:00 PM, twoandfourteen said: I hear a lot of the #TeamProcess guys touting how much cap space McD & Beane created & will have available to them to "rebuild" the offense. Apparently that is supposed to serve as evidence that these guys know what they are doing. Do you McBeaners really think ANY free agent of any offensive worth will willingly come here for the going market rate? Do you have any idea just how much you're going to have to overpay to even get one of those guys to return your call? There is going to be a MASSIVE tax on Free Agent signings for the Bills during the next offseason. That $90M is going to go pretty quick on the marginal-to-mediocre talent that will inevitably sign here. Not to mention that they are only going to bring in guys that know their Scripture passages as well as they know their playbook, so the talent pool is limited to begin with. The intelligent & rational among us will soon realize that Free Agency might as well be seen as irrelevant moving forward. McD's ineptitude and arrogance has set this team back 5-8 years, at least. You are missing the whole point of this season You are CORRECT in that we will probably miss on most of the free agents and while we are going to target other teams will also have cap money......my guess is that we are targeting free agent offensive linemen THAT IS WHY THE TOP FIVE PICK IS SO important......upgrades are mostly going to come through the draft. Your chances of hitting on draft picks increase the better postion you are in....not to mention the opportunity to trade down for more picks in the top 3 rounds is greater if you have a premium pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 16 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: You are missing the whole point of this season You are CORRECT in that we will probably miss on most of the free agents and while we are going to target other teams will also have cap money......my guess is that we are targeting free agent offensive linemen THAT IS WHY THE TOP FIVE PICK IS SO important......upgrades are mostly going to come through the draft. Your chances of hitting on draft picks increase the better postion you are in....not to mention the opportunity to trade down for more picks in the top 3 rounds is greater if you have a premium pick. They had a good draft on defense last season....here's hoping for a big one on offense. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/5/2018 at 8:39 AM, Kirby Jackson said: If I were a punter I’d come to Buffalo i said it in another thread but the sort of offensive innovation that I'd expect from McDermott is a multiple punter formation, that comes in on 3rd down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 On 11/4/2018 at 5:00 PM, twoandfourteen said: I hear a lot of the #TeamProcess guys touting how much cap space McD & Beane created & will have available to them to "rebuild" the offense. Apparently that is supposed to serve as evidence that these guys know what they are doing. Do you McBeaners really think ANY free agent of any offensive worth will willingly come here for the going market rate? Do you have any idea just how much you're going to have to overpay to even get one of those guys to return your call? There is going to be a MASSIVE tax on Free Agent signings for the Bills during the next offseason. That $90M is going to go pretty quick on the marginal-to-mediocre talent that will inevitably sign here. Not to mention that they are only going to bring in guys that know their Scripture passages as well as they know their playbook, so the talent pool is limited to begin with. The intelligent & rational among us will soon realize that Free Agency might as well be seen as irrelevant moving forward. McD's ineptitude and arrogance has set this team back 5-8 years, at least. I get what you're saying, but overall i don't think it will hamper the Bills ability to sign FA's too much. Players want $ and a chance to start. They will have that here. BUF has a young, big arm QB here and a commitment to get much better on offense. Also, the intangibles such as the "college like" atmosphere and BillsMafia has circulated around the league and nationally. Players enjoy being a part of that stuff. Not all, but some will want to come here. And the draft picks will have no choice in the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 How much of that do you let McD spend? That's the question. We're talking about a coach that is very much on the hot seat, could be gone midyear if our offense keeps sputtering. Do you really want to let this guy sign huge free agents when the next coach may not even want them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corta765 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 lol I love when people say something set a team back 5-8 years yet in the NFL literally a QB can make a team a contender overnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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