Could the new "Helmet Rule" ruin football?

[#34fan]

 

-Or, make it mostly unwatchable?  See the details on it here.

 

I'm all for player safety, but at some point you have to accept that "full contact" means exactly that.  What's next? -Tying hands?

 

 

[Dr.Sack]

The NFL is trying to get rid of injuries suffered by Ryan Shazier. I think it won’t impact or change the game as players simply won’t be using their helmet to tackle or target other players. 

[quinnearlysghost88]

Players have managed to play the game for decades without launching at opponents head-first like a missile to bring them down. This needed to be curbed a long time ago. 

[ALF]

Roquan Smith deal holdup related to new helmet rule

The Bears and Smith are at odds over the financial protections in the contract should the linebacker be suspended for such a hit. Suspensions allow teams to void guaranteed money in contracts.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000942843/article/roquan-smith-deal-holdup-related-to-new-helmet-rule

[#34fan]

13 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

The NFL is trying to get rid of injuries suffered by Ryan Shazier. I think it won’t impact or change the game as players simply won’t be using their helmet to tackle or target other players. 

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

[WhoTom]

Over the years, many rules have been implemented in order to protect players from life-threatening injuries. So far, they haven't ruined football - in fact, the NFL is thriving. I doubt that this one will be any different.

 

 

[BobbyC81]

29 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

The NFL is trying to get rid of injuries suffered by Ryan Shazier. I think it won’t impact or change the game as players simply won’t be using their helmet to tackle or target other players. 

 

Yeah, if you watch a rugby match, they aren't wearing helmets and tackle without using their heads.   The game is different though as you don't have a safety or linebacker coming at full speed from several yards behind the line.  Still, the NFL players just have to adjust.

 

I think, while helmets and shoulder pads have provided more protection, they have also provided weapons.  A defender without a helmet isn't likely to use his head to tackle.  

[Boatdrinks]

54 minutes ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

Iirc, Shaziers injury was a textbook example of how you’re not supposed to tackle. They’ve been coaching the “ new”technique up for years already. Unfortunate injury , but it was entirely avoidable . 

[Fadingpain]

59 minutes ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

Couldn't disagree more.

 

The league is attempting to eliminate the classic "using the helmet as a weapon" type of hit which has become in fashion in more recent years.  It is not basic human extinct to launch your head at an opponent.  

 

Whatever happened to proper tackling form being taught as "keep your head up and see the guy you are tackling" ???

 

As long as this rule is sensibly enforced, I don't see a problem with it.

 

 

52 minutes ago, LittleJoeCartwright said:

 

Yeah, if you watch a rugby match, they aren't wearing helmets and tackle without using their heads.   The game is different though as you don't have a safety or linebacker coming at full speed from several yards behind the line.  Still, the NFL players just have to adjust.

 

I think, while helmets and shoulder pads have provided more protection, they have also provided weapons.  A defender without a helmet isn't likely to use his head to tackle.  

Absolutely!  As equipment technology has progressed in the modern era, players have developed a feeling of invincibility, which has led directly to the type of hitting they are now trying to eliminate from the game.

 

The NHL has gone through a similar transformation in the last 20 or 30 years.  What used to be simple, basic padding has been  transformed (in hockey) into body armor.

 

If NFL football was played wearing cleats, shorts, and a t-shirt, this type of hitting would not exist, and Ryan Shazier would still be walking properly and playing in the league.

 

 

 

 

[Foxx]

1 hour ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

tackling with your head is about as unnatural a thing as there is. the only reason it is a thing now is because these helmets today protect your head. if there wasn't the helmet/shoulder pad combo equipment to protect the compression of your neck/spine, there is no way in hell these idiots would ever try it.  proper tackling includes putting your shoulder into your opponent and wrapping them up to take them to the ground.

Edited July 29, 2018 by Foxx

[Beast]

Get rid of full face masks and make everyone wear either the single bar or Joe Ferguson face mask.

[RyanC883]

I don't think so.  It's always been illegal but rarely enforced.  Your taught not to lead with your head in middle school.   About time the NFL enforces fundamentals to keep players safe.  

1 hour ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

 

putting your head to the side and tacking with your shoulder and wrapping up is much more natural, IMO.  

[Chandler#81]

1 hour ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

I can personally attest to this. Suffered the same injury as Shazier, hitting with my crown, separating C3 & C4 vertebrae and pinching my spine. After a lengthy rehab, I walked out of the hospital-albeit with 2 canes and a halo screwed into my head.. 

 

Football has gotten away from ‘old school’ wrap and tackle. They’re getting back to it.

[#34fan]

1 minute ago, RyanC883 said:

 Your taught not to lead with your head in middle school. 

 

Uh... Depends on when you went to middle school, and how deranged your coach was.

 

5 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

putting your head to the side and tacking with your shoulder and wrapping up is much more natural, IMO.  

 

From what I read about the rule itself, it goes beyond tackling.... It also seems to apply to RB's in full sprint outside the tackle box...  No more putting your head down to bang for a few more yards, I guess...

[RyanC883]

Just now, #34fan said:

 

Uh... Depends on when you went to middle school, and how deranged your coach was.

 

 

From what I read about the rule itself, it goes beyond tackling.... It also seems to apply to RB's in full sprint outside the tackle box...  No more putting your head down to bang for a few more yards, I guess...

 

humm, if it applies to RB's trying to bang for a few more yards that could impact that game for sure.  I'm thinking more Troy Polomeau (sp) flying head-first tackles.   Hopefully does not apply in RB situation, or RB's will have to play more "shifty" like shady.  Days of guys like "The Bus" would be gone.  

 

I thought my middle school coach was deranged in the 90's, but perhaps not as much as others

[#34fan]

7 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

I can personally attest to this. Suffered the same injury as Shazier, hitting with my crown, separating C3 & C4 vertebrae and pinching my spine. After a lengthy rehab, I walked out of the hospital-albeit with 2 canes and a halo screwed into my head.. 

 

Football has gotten away from ‘old school’ wrap and tackle. They’re getting back to it.

 

Sounds awful... What were you trying to bring down?... RB? -WR?

 

2 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

humm, if it applies to RB's trying to bang for a few more yards that could impact that game for sure.  I'm thinking more Troy Polomeau (sp) flying head-first tackles.   Hopefully does not apply in RB situation, or RB's will have to play more "shifty" like shady.  Days of guys like "The Bus" would be gone.  

 

I thought my middle school coach was deranged in the 90's, but perhaps not as much as others

 

80's for me... With a coach that did a couple tours in 'Nam…. Guy's face and neck were bright red year-round... Loved to cuss, too.

[North Buffalo]

9 minutes ago, #34fan said:

 

Sounds awful... What were you trying to bring down?... RB? -WR?

 

 

80's for me... With a coach that did a couple tours in 'Nam…. Guy's face and neck were bright red year-round... Loved to cuss, too.

Did you go to Amherst High School with Mr. Tripp?

Edited July 29, 2018 by North Buffalo

[Chandler#81]

7 minutes ago, #34fan said:

 

Sounds awful... What were you trying to bring down?... RB? -WR?

LB. I was QB and we were working on a gadget play in practice -shotgun inside handoff sweep right. I delay then peel out in the left flat. RB pulls up and throws back across the field to me. Neither of us saw each other til the last split second and I instinctively lowered my head, bracing for impact. Knocked out 2 of my LB’s teeth..

me? a broken neck.

[stuvian]

tackling is instinctive. It's a lttle late to relearn the game by the time you reach the NFL

[#34fan]

20 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Did you go to Amherst High School with Mr. Tripp?

 

 Nah, our coach's last name was Murphy... He was a true sadist, though.

Edited July 29, 2018 by #34fan

[oldmanfan]

See what you hit.  Get back to basics.

[#34fan]

22 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

LB. I was QB and we were working on a gadget play in practice -shotgun inside handoff sweep right. I delay then peel out in the left flat. RB pulls up and throws back across the field to me. Neither of us saw each other til the last split second and I instinctively lowered my head, bracing for impact. Knocked out 2 of my LB’s teeth..

me? a broken neck.

 

Ouch!  -Brutal....  That's why I don't see how you can evenly enforce this.... So much of what you do out there is reacting to the laws of physics.

[North Buffalo]

17 minutes ago, #34fan said:

 

 Nah, our coach's last name was Murphy... He was a true sadist, though.

We had a football coach who was a science teacher vietnam vet in late 70s, early 80s who would lose it every once in a while... soft spoken until he would, felt for the guy but everyone backed off when he did... 

[#34fan]

29 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

We had a football coach who was a science teacher vietnam vet in late 70s, early 80s who would lose it every once in a while... soft spoken until he would, felt for the guy but everyone backed off when he did... 

 

Ours was a substitute math and science teacher...  Since he sucked at both, he would let kids sit in class and read whatever they wanted, as long  as they didn't talk..

 

As a coach, he thought the best place for a helmet was under a face-mask.

[Thurman#1]

As it says in the article, people are freaking out about this for no reason.

 

And it's not like they have a choice. If they don't make rules like this, the game will likely be caught up in major legal troubles and the changing of society's mores. Boxing was huge not all that long ago. Now a lot of society considers it overviolent.

 

Entertainment must change with society.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Thurman#1

[oldmanfan]

Guys on both sides of the ball need to keep their heads up and see what they're hitting.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Yes , as have most of the rules.

 

 

[Augie]

2 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

See what you hit.  Get back to basics.

 

I played football into HS, and I LOVED leading with my head, but it was face mask first. I must have a thick skull or something, because lots of targets got “dinged” while I never felt a thing. My kids were the same way. (Our family has “deceptively large” heads, meaning we are the only people wearing the different color helmet in whitewater rafting, etc.)

 

I played rugby in college, which I think in many ways is safer because you don’t act like a lethal missile launching head first. But ONE TIME was all it took. A guy broke loose down the far sideline and I had about a 30 yard sprint to push him OB. Dove head first to push him, he tried to cut back behind me and I took his thigh, as we’re both in full sprint, to the top of my head. Bad news! 

 

I came to in the grass with our coach standing over me yelling to get back on the field. (In rugby you had to be ON the field for them to stop play.) He had to point so I could find the field. (Crazy now that I think of it, I should have been immobilized on the spot!) I spent a steamy summer in a neck brace, and still have a tingle up the back of my head if I touch one little spot on the back of my neck/skull. They said it’s  scar tissue on the nerve at the base of my skull. And I was lucky! 

 

Yes, see what you hit! EVERY time! 

 

This just may explain some of the stuff I pollute this board with. It’s dain bramage! 

[Koko78]

5 hours ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

 

What an absolute load of crap. The human head and neck was not designed to take that kind of punishment or deliver a shot with the crown of the head as the impact point. There is no reflex action like a shark rolling its eyes, because our bodies weren't designed to run head-first at full speed into an object.

 

Just stop with this 'pussification of football' macho doomsday bullcrap. It doesn't make you a man to break your neck, especially when the far more effective (and intelligent) option to tackle is to keep your head up and use the parts of your body that can actually absorb the impact. Actually, I think it makes you a moron to use your head as the tip of a missile.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Koko78

[Thurman#1]

5 hours ago, #34fan said:

 

Putting your head down is kind of how your body naturally protects your eyes and vital organs from impact.

 

To me its like trying to tell a shark not to roll its eyes back when it attacks... Eons of natural selection has perfected this reflex... Shazier's injury, as awful as it was, is just

 

another "wrong place, wrong time" event we have to face sometimes... He was trying to hit a moving target, and something went wrong.

 

 

I'd argue leading with the shoulder is how your body naturally protects eyes and vital organs. 

 

But nearly every sport has sport-specific movements players are trained in that counter their natural instincts. You weren't born wearing a helmet, nor did cavemen evolve wearing a facemask. But that's how football is played, which is why players have been taught (mostly successfully) to lead with the facemask in a tackle, as that's the safest way to tackle with your head involved.

[oldmanfan]

One of the things I like about McD is his DBs in particular know how to wrap guys up.  Proper tackling instead of just throwing a shoulder at a guy.

[#34fan]

 

1 hour ago, Koko78 said:

 

What an absolute load of crap. The human head and neck was not designed to take that kind of punishment or deliver a shot with the crown of the head as the impact point. There is no reflex action like a shark rolling its eyes, because our bodies weren't designed to run head-first at full speed into an object.

 

Just stop with this 'pussification of football' macho doomsday bullcrap. It doesn't make you a man to break your neck, especially when the far more effective (and intelligent) option to tackle is to keep your head up and use the parts of your body that can actually absorb the impact. Actually, I think it makes you a moron to use your head as the tip of a missile.

 

I was starting to wonder when the "safe space" and padded playground-loving geeks of the board would show up to tell us all what terrible people we are

 

for suggesting that the best way to avoid a football injury is not to play the effing sport to begin with...  No one says you have to.... Fact is, there's absolutely no

 

safe way to run full speed into any object in any frickin' position... But don't tell that to the morons who would have you believe there's a safe way to bring down

 

a 250 pound animal running  toward you at 20 miles per hour     Don't like the risks, don't play the game... How hard is that?

 

 

 

Edited July 30, 2018 by #34fan

[CommonCents]

8 hours ago, #34fan said:

 

 

I was starting to wonder when the "safe space" and padded playground-loving geeks of the board would show up to tell us all what terrible people we are

 

for suggesting that the best way to avoid a football injury is not to play the effing sport to begin with...  No one says you have to.... Fact is, there's absolutely no

 

safe way to run full speed into any object in any frickin' position... But don't tell that to the morons who would have you believe there's a safe way to bring down

 

a 250 pound animal running  toward you at 20 miles per hour     Don't like the risks, don't play the game... How hard is that?

 

 

 

There is no absolutely safe way to play football but there certainly is ways which are safer than others. I’m sure you understand that but just need something to B word about. 

 

Do I think it will ruin the game? I hope not. I do think it might make betting on the games less enjoyable because the refs will now have even more control. That could hurt the buisness model, depending on how it is officiated. 

[Mr. WEO]

I thought the forward pass was supposed to ruin football...

[Koko78]

9 hours ago, #34fan said:

 

 

I was starting to wonder when the "safe space" and padded playground-loving geeks of the board would show up to tell us all what terrible people we are

 

for suggesting that the best way to avoid a football injury is not to play the effing sport to begin with...  No one says you have to.... Fact is, there's absolutely no

 

safe way to run full speed into any object in any frickin' position... But don't tell that to the morons who would have you believe there's a safe way to bring down

 

a 250 pound animal running  toward you at 20 miles per hour     Don't like the risks, don't play the game... How hard is that?

 

Yeah, I mean Kevin Everett was such a man when he broke his neck by using his helmet as a weapon instead of using proper tackling form.

 

But hey, it makes you feel all macho that his career was ended by being a dumbass, so that's all that matters. We certainly can't reduce your enjoyment of football by making sure that players can actually walk off the field.

[#34fan]

1 hour ago, Koko78 said:

 

Yeah, I mean Kevin Everett was such a man when he broke his neck by using his helmet as a weapon instead of using proper tackling form.

 

But hey, it makes you feel all macho that his career was ended by being a dumbass, so that's all that matters. We certainly can't reduce your enjoyment of football by making sure that players can actually walk off the field.

 

The crown of your head is the hardest part of your cranium. -Even if you don't know that, your body does... Muscles, and fluid-filled discs in the neck are there to absorb the impact... Unfortunately, they're not made of titanium, so there's only so much shock they can absorb without damage.

 

I am 100% all-in for safer football... What I am not for, is a 15 yard flag coming out every time a RB lowers his head to grind for a 1st down.

 

 

[blacklabel]

I think the confusion around the new rule is what's going to be detrimental to the game. I've seen a number of reports stating that teams are very unclear on how the rule will be imposed and how coaches can teach players how to adjust with the new rule in mind. And I think it's going to be difficult for officials to get right during games. Plays happen so fast, we see it all the time, a penalty is called but after seeing the replay, it's clear that it wasn't a penalty and the official had a bad angle to view it from and made a bad call. I can see that happening a lot here. A ball-carrier hits the seam and gets hit by a linebacker who drops his head past the ball-carrier's right hip and drives his shoulder into his midsection for a typical form tackle. The official on the right side sees that the helmet avoided contact but the official on the left side just sees a player who dropped his helmet to make a tackle, so does he throw a flag because he's uncertain if the helmet was involved or not? And then the zebras convene for a 3-hour conference (seems like it, anyway) to try and get the call right and still get it wrong. I think early on it's going to be rough and they're going to get it wrong quite a bit. As the season goes on, the hope would be that they get better at recognizing it and don't need to hold up the game with their little meetings and whatnot. It works both ways too, an offensive player can't drop their helmet and drive into another player, but, as someone already pointed out, when a ball-carrier has defenders closing in on him, what's he going to do? He's going to (usually) wrap both arms around the ball and get low, and there's going to be incidental contact with his helmet. That's the thing with this rule. How can they define when it's just part of the play or when it's intentional? That's why this rule sucks and that's why it's not going to go well, at least early on.

[LABILLBACKER]

18 hours ago, quinnearlysghost88 said:

Players have managed to play the game for decades without launching at opponents head-first like a missile to bring them down. This needed to be curbed a long time ago. 

So true. Maybe go back and teach players the correct way to tackle. With your arms. The NFL has become pinball with players bouncing off each other all the time. Or making perfect head contact and getting paralyzed. 

[Koko78]

10 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

So true. Maybe go back and teach players the correct way to tackle. With your arms. The NFL has become pinball with players bouncing off each other all the time. Or making perfect head contact and getting paralyzed. 

 

They started the 'Head's Up' training program a number of years ago to accomplish exactly that. Unfortunately, it will take another decade or more before it filters up to the NFL.

 

Until then, it's all about getting the big hits on SportsCenter.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

17 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Couldn't disagree more.

 

The league is attempting to eliminate the classic "using the helmet as a weapon" type of hit which has become in fashion in more recent years.  It is not basic human extinct to launch your head at an opponent.  

 

Whatever happened to proper tackling form being taught as "keep your head up and see the guy you are tackling" ???

 

As long as this rule is sensibly enforced, I don't see a problem with it.

 

This.  I have been deploring the "death of tackle football" for years.  Instead of learning and executing good tackling technique, players launch themselves helmet-first.  It leads to spectacular "big hits" when successful and extra yards after contact when not (see Whitner, Donte).   Can't tell you how many times I yell at the TV "WRAP HIM UP!"

 

What I want to know is if the league will 1) actually try harder to enforce this consistently 2) quit with the lip service where they write rules like this, while simultaneously issuing money-making videos celebrating the same big hits their rules purport to deplore

30 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

So true. Maybe go back and teach players the correct way to tackle. With your arms. The NFL has become pinball with players bouncing off each other all the time. Or making perfect head contact and getting paralyzed. 

 

I believe the Seahawks tried this

https://www.businessinsider.com/seahawks-tackling-style-could-change-nfl-2017-1