Shots Fired! Tim Graham calls out Vic Carruci for Posing with The Biscuit

[K-9]

43 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

Every time and place is Timmah's time and place.

 

Heaven forbid he has enough self-awareness to keep keep his powder dry about something he saw at Jim Kelly's golf event, on a day it's announced Kelly is getting the Jimmy V award.

 

That would just require some self-awareness, and that's not Timmah's strong suit.

 

 

Another example of lack of situational awareness. Maybe Timmah needs more mental reps.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

3 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Another example of lack of situational awareness. Maybe Timmah needs more mental reps.

Reps, or 'raps'...as in the head?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

41 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

 

To PromoTheRobot: I do not have a link. I googled around and came up empty.

 

This happened a couple years ago on Twitter. Tim was doing a little Q&A, someone that knows him or knows of the situation was tweeting at him about how he lost his job at ESPN and evidently, it was because of inappropriate comments made around female staff and/or engaging in spreading offensive emails meant as jokes. I think he was technically asked to resign. Either way, Tim kinda scrambled to cover up whatever this dude was saying. I don't recall him ever really denying it and I think it was kept on the low. Tim left ESPN in 2008, I believe, and back then things were still kept quiet when it came to stuff like this. 

 

I can't say I have any proof, and I couldn't find any links about it. But you can check my post history if you want. I'm not one to make sh*t up or start rumors. I watched the whole thing unfold on Twitter and the way Tim reacted to it definitely indicated to me that there was some level of truth to what this dude was saying. Tim claimed he had to block him or report him to Twitter to "protect his family" or something but like I said, his reaction to it said he was blindsided by it and that the guy posting about it probably did have some legitimate knowledge of Tim's exit from ESPN. 

 

I respect Tim as a writer. I think he puts together some very good pieces. Where I waver on my respect for him is how he engages people on social media. He doesn't pop up on my feed as often anymore because I don't read or interact much with what he tweets but he always seemed to be engaging with trolls and people he surely felt superior to and typically ignored anyone with a decent question or counterargument to one of his articles. Seems like a fair number of sports journalists do this, though. I dunno if it's a ego thing or whatever but it gets old after a while. 

 

Thanks for sharing your back-story on those comments

 

I agree, I respect Tim Graham as a feature writer - very high quality stuff - and do not respect how he engages on social media, including what I saw of him here since 2008 (that being when I joined)

 

Edit: rereading what I wrote, it was a genuine expression of surprise - is this guy exercising an elaborate leg-pull or is it legit? But in hindsight I can see it could have been taken as snarky, so Kudos! to you for providing a genuine answer to a genuine expression of surprise.

[PromoTheRobot]

25 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

 

To PromoTheRobot: I do not have a link. I googled around and came up empty.

 

This happened a couple years ago on Twitter. Tim was doing a little Q&A, someone that knows him or knows of the situation was tweeting at him about how he lost his job at ESPN and evidently, it was because of inappropriate comments made around female staff and/or engaging in spreading offensive emails meant as jokes. I think he was technically asked to resign. Either way, Tim kinda scrambled to cover up whatever this dude was saying. I don't recall him ever really denying it and I think it was kept on the low. Tim left ESPN in 2008, I believe, and back then things were still kept quiet when it came to stuff like this. 

 

I can't say I have any proof, and I couldn't find any links about it. But you can check my post history if you want. I'm not one to make sh*t up or start rumors. I watched the whole thing unfold on Twitter and the way Tim reacted to it definitely indicated to me that there was some level of truth to what this dude was saying. Tim claimed he had to block him or report him to Twitter to "protect his family" or something but like I said, his reaction to it said he was blindsided by it and that the guy posting about it probably did have some legitimate knowledge of Tim's exit from ESPN. 

 

I respect Tim as a writer. I think he puts together some very good pieces. Where I waver on my respect for him is how he engages people on social media. He doesn't pop up on my feed as often anymore because I don't read or interact much with what he tweets but he always seemed to be engaging with trolls and people he surely felt superior to and typically ignored anyone with a decent question or counterargument to one of his articles. Seems like a fair number of sports journalists do this, though. I dunno if it's a ego thing or whatever but it gets old after a while. 

 

It wasn't meant to be a snarky "link" post. I was really hoping you had something. I did the same thing and couldn't find anything either.

Edited June 5, 2018 by PromoTheRobot

[muppy]

whoa Mr Graham throws his hat into the ring of who can make the most incendiary tweet of the week SMH  the timing of this after the recent Buffalo News changes

may be telling...?   It tells me that dude doesn't care if he is sullying Jim Kellys ceremony which to me is insulting to #12  But even more than that how did he

think that kind of comment would go over, what good could come from it....ZERO.   ...is he looking for click bait? was it a brain fart ? Personal beef.....perhaps all of the above.SMH

[oldmanfan]

What I don't get is why so many writers from The News, while good writers, feel that have the right to act like complete jerks when on social media or other platforms where they interact directly with fans.  Graham is one; while I'm not on Twitter I emailed him once to comment on a story he wrote and got comments back that were on a grade school level, about how he didn't care about my opinion of his story, etc.  A recent thread here about Sullivan and Gleason had John Wawrow weighing in, and he specifically indicated he feels he is snarky and his comments were frankly insulting towards folks who wanted to engage in an actual dialog.  And of course Sullivan is legendary, as is Gleason, for their animosity towards fans.

 

Shout out to sport writers:  You're not that important.  Doctors are important.  Nurses.  Teachers.  Police officers and firemen.  You?  Not so much.  Yes, you are gifted in writing (I like much of what these guys write, although the style and the personal insults etc. were my objections to Sullivan and Gleason) but that does not give you the right to act like temperamental three year olds who have their favorite toy taken away when a reader doesn't agree and dares to express their opinion.  If you have to act that way, either grow up or stay off social media.  Ultimately it's the reader that is your consumer; you don't have a consumer you don't have a job (maybe Sullivan and Gleason just learned that).

 

As for the Bennett thing, he's a scum ball for attacking a woman.  But you can't call him a convicted rapist because he's not a convicted rapist.  And as for calling out Vic for having the temerity of taking a picture with him, if I'm Vic I just go back to the newsroom, politely invite Graham into the break room, and politely break his nose for him. 

 

How anyone can decide to write about OJ and then question the decision to take one picture with a guy that pleaded to a misdemeanor is beyond comprehension.  

[YoloinOhio]

7 minutes ago, muppy said:

whoa Mr Graham throws his hat into the ring of who can make the most incendiary tweet of the week SMH  the timing of this after the recent Buffalo News changes

may be telling...?   It tells me that dude doesn't care if he is sullying Jim Kellys ceremony which to me is insulting to #12  But even more than that how did he

think that kind of comment would go over, what good could come from it....ZERO.   ...is he looking for click bait? was it a brain fart ? Personal beef.....perhaps all of the above.SMH

My thought as well. I don’t think it’s “click bait” because there is no link to click.

Edited June 5, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[muppy]

8 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

My thought as well. I don’t think it’s click bait because there is no link to click.

well that is true on twitter but it indeed did make me click the thread here so there is that...I guess I could revise clicks to mean posts....,commentary...in any case it to   me it 's not a good look for Tim Graham  very mean spirited but also unnecessary to dredge up the past and then it not even be accurate as the topper.

Edited June 5, 2018 by muppy

[4merper4mer]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

The felony charge stemmed form the victim account and the physical evidence.  Hence the rape charge.  As everyone is familiar in these stories involving NFL players, it's going to be difficult to get a felony conviction unless the victim is absolutely committed to helping put him in jail for a long time.

 

So it gets pleaded down to what is acceptable to all--and a win for the prosecution.

 

Still, I have no problem with calling him a convicted rapist--by any definition, he raped her.

Dirt bag?  Sure.  Rapist?  Up to you.  Convicted rapist?  That is simply false.

[Trogdor]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

What I don't "get" is why you appear to be defending Graham's behavior of using Jim Kelly's charity event and a sensationalized or inflated crime above what Bennett pled guilty to and served his sentence for, and moved on, to allegedly "settle a score" with a co-worker in public.

 

Is that behavior OK with you? 

This is really an odd place to make your stand. Does pleading guilty to lesser crimes suddenly make him innocent? I don't think he inflated or sensationalized the crime at all. She had to get medical care because of him. This board can't seem to get out of there way to defend a sexual assault because they don't like the messenger. Probably how we've ended up with this good guy image of the Superbowl teams.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

This is really an odd place to make your stand. Does pleading guilty to lesser crimes suddenly make him innocent? I don't think he inflated or sensationalized the crime at all. She had to get medical care because of him. This board can't seem to get out of there way to defend a sexual assault because they don't like the messenger. Probably how we've ended up with this good guy image of the Superbowl teams.

 

The point was not Biscuit's guilt or innocence. But Graham throwing Carucci under a bus while at a charity event. Don't get distracted. Why did Graham wait for that moment to bring up Bennett's history? He had 20 years to do it.

 

Edited June 5, 2018 by PromoTheRobot

[LeGOATski]

Ha! This is amusing.

 

It's weird that some people feel the need to make personal drama so public. I'm a reserved fellow, so I guess I'll just never understand.

[IDBillzFan]

29 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

How anyone can decide to write about OJ and then question the decision to take one picture with a guy that pleaded to a misdemeanor is beyond comprehension.  

 

You're talking about a guy who, when factually challenged on social media Dec 6, 2015 during a Bills game, told a fan "You don't even follow me. So go hump a fist."

 

You think he gives a crap about anything other than his thin-skinned ego?

 

 

[BigDingus]

I get where he's coming from...but still a cheap shot. 

Whether it was a felony conviction or misdemeanor makes no difference to me. People get off on lesser charges than they deserve all the time (especially celebrities), so I'm not gonna pretend that he's somehow more innocent because of it.

What's not ok is insulting your coworker for simply being in the picture, along with several other guys who you didn't call out, all while knowing the guy is no longer on trial. Any time anyone is next to Michael Vick, are they suddenly supporting his crimes? Same with anyone else who's ever committed a crime...do you treat them like a pariah for all eternity or do you just move on after whatever legal sentence they served was completed? 

I dunno....if he gets that pissy about something like this, he should call out anyone & everyone for talking to ANY NFL player...as half of them have rap sheets too.

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

You're talking about a guy who, when factually challenged on social media Dec 6, 2015 during a Bills game, told a fan "You don't even follow me. So go hump a fist."

 

You think he gives a crap about anything other than his thin-skinned ego?

 

 

No.  I also think his time at TBN is limited at best after this.

[DriveFor1Outta5]

3 hours ago, transient said:

 

So the sanctimony of your original post was unintended?

Never intended it to be sanctimonious. I genuinely don’t understand why people care about this trash. I’ve been looking to learn for many years as to why TBD is so fascinated with Graham and Sully. 

[IDBillzFan]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

No.  I also think his time at TBN is limited at best after this.

 

Once Biscuit gets done suing him, perhaps his career will get another shot covering the Macungie Muscrats AAA dodgeball team.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

I guess off topic - but can people be rehabilitated?  I don't know what he did, but it was also 20 years ago... he attended anger management, did community service, substance abuse counseling etc.  Is it possible he's a better person now?  Like why is Tim Graham bringing this up?

[TigerJ]

Rape is a horrific crime.  I only know what I can read in the news, and I try not to make judgment on what I don't know.  Here, I don't know all the specifics of the crime Bennett committed, but even more than that, I don't know what kind of person he is today.  To me, it doesn't matter how horrific the crime, if the criminal justice system saw fit not to execute him, and indeed to let him out on the street as a free man, I would try to make my judgments about him as a person as he is today, not 21 years ago..  I believe everybody should have a second chance, if they can demonstrate a change of heart.

[Jamie Nails]

More important: Is Sapp wearing a One Buffalo shirt?

[K-9]

7 minutes ago, dneveu said:

I guess off topic - but can people be rehabilitated?  I don't know what he did, but it was also 20 years ago... he attended anger management, did community service, substance abuse counseling etc.  Is it possible he's a better person now?  Like why is Tim Graham bringing this up?

Why is Graham brining this up now? Because he’s not a better person now.

[Yav]

Tim Graham is a tool, the sooner people realize that the faster he will just go away. He's one jackass I'd like to knock out.

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, K-9 said:

He stated Bennett was convicted of RAPE; that crime. Nobody here suggested Bennett didn’t commit a crime and plead guilty to a misdemeanor.  But in your typical intellectually dishonest fashion, you must move the goal posts and twist other people’s words to make a futile point.

 

 

Yes, you did.   Read your post.   You said "a crime he didn't commit".     I didn't twist your words you wrote them.   Graham was incorrect in calling him "convicted" even though Bennett served jail time.......and you were incorrect in saying he did not commit the crime.   He wasn't tried for it.  I guess you don't like it when you present something incorrectly and get called on it.   Own your mistake and move on.    

[stony]

1 hour ago, blacklabel said:

 

To PromoTheRobot: I do not have a link. I googled around and came up empty.

 

This happened a couple years ago on Twitter. Tim was doing a little Q&A, someone that knows him or knows of the situation was tweeting at him about how he lost his job at ESPN and evidently, it was because of inappropriate comments made around female staff and/or engaging in spreading offensive emails meant as jokes. I think he was technically asked to resign. Either way, Tim kinda scrambled to cover up whatever this dude was saying. I don't recall him ever really denying it and I think it was kept on the low. Tim left ESPN in 2008, I believe, and back then things were still kept quiet when it came to stuff like this. 

 

I can't say I have any proof, and I couldn't find any links about it. But you can check my post history if you want. I'm not one to make sh*t up or start rumors. I watched the whole thing unfold on Twitter and the way Tim reacted to it definitely indicated to me that there was some level of truth to what this dude was saying. Tim claimed he had to block him or report him to Twitter to "protect his family" or something but like I said, his reaction to it said he was blindsided by it and that the guy posting about it probably did have some legitimate knowledge of Tim's exit from ESPN. 

 

I respect Tim as a writer. I think he puts together some very good pieces. Where I waver on my respect for him is how he engages people on social media. He doesn't pop up on my feed as often anymore because I don't read or interact much with what he tweets but he always seemed to be engaging with trolls and people he surely felt superior to and typically ignored anyone with a decent question or counterargument to one of his articles. Seems like a fair number of sports journalists do this, though. I dunno if it's a ego thing or whatever but it gets old after a while. 

Interesting.  Pretty sure he started at ESPN around 08/09.  TG has noted he turned down another contract at ESPN to return to the BN.  

[Mr. WEO]

28 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

Once Biscuit gets done suing him, perhaps his career will get another shot covering the Macungie Muscrats AAA dodgeball team.

 

That would be great suit to read.  Good luck with that.

 

14 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

Rape is a horrific crime.  I only know what I can read in the news, and I try not to make judgment on what I don't know.  Here, I don't know all the specifics of the crime Bennett committed, but even more than that, I don't know what kind of person he is today.  To me, it doesn't matter how horrific the crime, if the criminal justice system saw fit not to execute him, and indeed to let him out on the street as a free man, I would try to make my judgments about him as a person as he is today, not 21 years ago..  I believe everybody should have a second chance, if they can demonstrate a change of heart.

 

You must have an equally soft spot in your heart for OJ then, right?

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, LABillzFan said:

 

Once Biscuit gets done suing him, perhaps his career will get another shot covering the Macungie Muscrats AAA dodgeball team.

 

 

The LAST thing Bennett or anyone else who got off easy for sex crimes in the past wants to do is dredge it back up in 2018.   Let alone violent sexual assault like in the case of Bennett.  

 

 

Edited June 5, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan
inappropriate language

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, 4merper4mer said:

Dirt bag?  Sure.  Rapist?  Up to you.  Convicted rapist?  That is simply false.

 

He was not convicted of rape, but he was convicted and he clearly raped her.

[John from Riverside]

I really wish Tim had not done this....he used to actually visit from time to time here on the board.

 

 

[oldmanfan]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 

He was not convicted of rape, but he was convicted and he clearly raped her.

And not convicted of rape.  Believe what you want; don't let facts alter your opinion.  And I say that thinking the guy is a scumball for his involvement in this.. 

[Mr. WEO]

7 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

And not convicted of rape.  Believe what you want; don't let facts alter your opinion.  And I say that thinking the guy is a scumball for his involvement in this.. 

 

I believe I said exactly this in my first 6 words.  Take a step closer to your screen.

 

One can correctly say he raped this woman and was convicted of a crime as a result of his rape. 

 

A person who kills another person can plead down to manslaughter.  He or she would forever be a convicted killer (not "murderer").

 

Killers kill, rapists rape, regardless of what the DA calls it in the end....

Edited June 5, 2018 by Mr. WEO

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

What I don't "get" is why you appear to be defending Graham's behavior of using Jim Kelly's charity event and a sensationalized or inflated crime above what Bennett pled guilty to and served his sentence for, and moved on, to allegedly "settle a score" with a co-worker in public.

 

Is that behavior OK with you? 

 

 

The fact that it was Jim Kelly's charity event seems entirely inconsequential.    It wasn't about the event.   Nobody asked why JK invited a person who had done time after sex assault claims.    In 2018 people are getting called out for their past sexual assaults.   The perpetrators just gotta' deal with it.   Consequences.

[nedboy7]

With all the problems in the world this seems...... stupid. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Trogdor said:

This is really an odd place to make your stand. Does pleading guilty to lesser crimes suddenly make him innocent? I don't think he inflated or sensationalized the crime at all. She had to get medical care because of him. This board can't seem to get out of there way to defend a sexual assault because they don't like the messenger. Probably how we've ended up with this good guy image of the Superbowl teams.

 

Where are you getting that anyone is defending a sexual assault, much less claiming the guy is innocent?

 

You appear to be creating positions so you can argue against them

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

48 minutes ago, dneveu said:

I guess off topic - but can people be rehabilitated?  I don't know what he did, but it was also 20 years ago... he attended anger management, did community service, substance abuse counseling etc.  Is it possible he's a better person now?  Like why is Tim Graham bringing this up?

LAMP? All I can think of. 

[Rico]

4 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Just speculating here, but Graham is friends with JS and BG, and given recent events there perhaps some bad blood exists there over that. Always remember that Vic did a stint at nfl.com too, and that's a place with some corporate shill-ish/propaganda-ish tendencies. Regardless, I don't dislike Carucci as a reporter and think Graham was definitely out of line. But there's a decent chance that recent workplace layoff misery has generated some backbiting and taking of names. Note also that unlike Graham, Carucci had no positive tweets about his two longtime colleagues who were forced to resign. 

Interesting take, thanks. Something going on behind the scenes led to this, no doubt.

[corta765]

Whether your religious or not the biblical verse about throwing the first stone at those with sin is pretty true here. So many people are willing to judge from their glass house without any regard to their own life. Not saying Bennett isn't a jerk for what occurred but talk about awful rhetoric and time/place by Tim Graham.

[K-9]

40 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yes, you did.   Read your post.   You said "a crime he didn't commit".     I didn't twist your words you wrote them.   Graham was incorrect in calling him "convicted" even though Bennett served jail time.......and you were incorrect in saying he did not commit the crime.   He wasn't tried for it.  I guess you don't like it when you present something incorrectly and get called on it.   Own your mistake and move on.    

Graham said he was “convicted of rape.” Bennett did not get charged with or plead guilty to that crime, ergo it was a crime he “didn’t commit.” Your parsing of language and weak semantic argument is, AGAIN, indicative of your frequent intellectual dishonesty around here. 

 

And, just as you telling people they need to choose their words better, you, AGAIN, are the LAST person to suggest anyone here should own their mistake and move on. 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Just speculating here, but Graham is friends with JS and BG, and given recent events there perhaps some bad blood exists there over that. Always remember that Vic did a stint at nfl.com too, and that's a place with some corporate shill-ish/propaganda-ish tendencies. Regardless, I don't dislike Carucci as a reporter and think Graham was definitely out of line. But there's a decent chance that recent workplace layoff misery has generated some backbiting and taking of names. Note also that unlike Graham, Carucci had no positive tweets about his two longtime colleagues who were forced to resign. 

 

Yeah something is going on there between TG and Vic.  The recent activity at TBN might have caused some to take moral inventory.   Vic was most certainly being called out.    It was a definite "this is hypocrisy" kinda' take.   Who knows?  Maybe Vic made some kind've move perceived as a skin-saver and upset TG and/or others.

 

Unfortunate to see this go down,  these are pretty much just working class dudes.........but it happens in all businesses it's just more public because of where they work and what their profession calls for.........reporting on a past time fans are passionate about.  

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

5 minutes ago, Rico said:

Interesting take, thanks. Something going on behind the scenes led to this, no doubt.

There was a lawyer in the region who defended a range of clients over the years for a variety of offence and crimes from minor to major.  No matter what the transgression, his excuse always was "Your Honour, my client had the misfortune of mixing alcohol and prescription drugs."  Sounds like a plan for Graham.  (I never said it was a good plan.)

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, K-9 said:

Graham said he was “convicted of rape.” Bennett did not get charged with or plead guilty to that crime, ergo it was a crime he “didn’t commit.” Your parsing of language and weak semantic argument is, AGAIN, indicative of your frequent intellectual dishonesty around here. 

 

And, just as you telling people they need to choose their words better, you, AGAIN, are the LAST person to suggest anyone here should own their mistake and move on. 

 

Talk about parsing language and a weak semantic approach.

 

Again.........it wasn't by any means necessarily a "crime he didn't commit".    In fact he served time, which indicates a good degree of guilt.

 

Don't quit your day job, counselor.