Logic Posted February 21, 2018 Author Share Posted February 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, simool said: Yet you have zero guarantees that either one of them can play in NFL. Go ahead throw away at least three picks to move up and snag one of them. You are going to look like an idiot when it does not pan out. Just about every talent evaluator worth a damn sees flaws in all of your day 1 starters. No thanks, I will take my chances on what is available at 21 or I will trade 22 back (Cause we sure as hell are not drafting a QB at 22) and draft Mike White. Who has the exact same chance of succeeding at the next level as your day one starters. Go ahead ladies flame away. Espouse your Miss Cleo abilities. I'm not quite sure why you're so angry. This isn't just about quarterbacks, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobills1212 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 jim kelly.... sadly, Reich seems busy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 If we trade up I like Darnold and Rosen. If Mayfield drops past 10 I wouldn't mind trading up for him. If we don't move up I want Luke Falk. If we sign a FA QB I want McCarron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Lamar Jackson at #22 would be ideal to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Chilly said: Lamar Jackson at #22 would be ideal to me. Never draft a QB with pick 22. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 18 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: Darnold for me, and it's not really close. But I honestly think he's out of the picture because I think he goes #1 overall to Cleveland. I'd be fine with either Mayfield or Rosen, however. I agree, I see Darnold being the 1st player drafted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Rosen is a head case. Pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 (edited) Rosen, Best QB and most mechanically sound QB in the draft. He is going to turn into a top QB in this league Edited February 21, 2018 by MAJBobby 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, joesixpack said: Rosen if trade up, Rudolph if not. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baskingridgebillsfan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Is Baker Mayfield Chase Daniels. we will see , it is possible . Smaller system guy that put up huge numbers . The more I think about it I am not trading up unless Rosen starts to fall by some miracle . GIve me Bradford and I will draft Mason Rudolph. Maybe I can use some of 2019 draft ammo to move up in the second round and snag him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Boo Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 (edited) Boggles my mind how many want Baker Mayfield, but just a year ago were so opposed to taking Deshaun Watson. It makes zero sense. I'm going get a special type of enjoyment when the Bills trade up and draft someone other than this clown. Edited February 21, 2018 by Chicken Boo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logic Posted February 21, 2018 Author Share Posted February 21, 2018 15 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said: Boggles my mind how many want Baker Mayfield, but just a year ago were so opposed to taking Deshaun Watson. It makes zero sense. I'm going get a special type of enjoyment when the Bills trade up and draft someone other than this clown. For what it's worth (not much), I DID want Watson last year. Couldn't fathom why a QB needy teem in year 1 of a rebuild with a new coach would pass on a QB. And now, here we are, once again needing a QB. Oy vey. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Right now, I like Lamar Jackson to be the one picked at #21. The Bills already have the veteran QB here in Taylor on the last year of his deal (he can start till Jackson's ready), so there's no need to sign a McCarron or a Keenan which would put the team on the hook for MULTIPLE years. This would leave the Bills with a ton of cap room in 2019 (once Taylor's contract runs out), along with four high picks in this year's draft (#22, #53, #56 and #96), and the picks in the 2019 draft to really build a contending playoff team. I just think that Rosen and Jackson are the two QBs who will have the quickest and easiest paths to success as franchise QBs. However, gut feeling I think that Rosen would be miserable in Buffalo. They will not take a guy who they think does not want to come to Buffalo. IMO, that's probably the first hurdle of acquiring new players for the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simool Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 50 minutes ago, Logic said: I'm not quite sure why you're so angry. This isn't just about quarterbacks, is it? Your anger is my logic. Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logic Posted February 21, 2018 Author Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 minute ago, simool said: Your anger is my logic. Go figure. I'm fairly certain that doesn't make any sense. But I do like your avatar picture. Have a lovely day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillyG Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 At the end of the day we need 2 QBs. McDermott has already said he wants a vet in the QB room for a variety of reasons. My 2 choices: Rookie: Baker Mayfield Vet: Josh McCown Mayfield for pretty much every reason stated. McCown because he could be a solid spot starter if needed, has been around the league for years and could be a great guy in the QB room for Mayfield. Being we don't have an experienced QB coach, McCowns experience around the league would be extremely valuable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said: Except he is NOT 5'11" tall and is over 6' tall and actually taller than both Wilson and Brees and just over an inch shorter than Rogers. This height myth will literally have ZERO to do with his success or failure in the NFL. If you are a capable NFL QB, you will succeed at 6'-0...I mean some of you act like he is Mugsy Bogues kind of short out there. This kids height will NOT determine his success or failure...his ability to play QB will. Just like Allens size in now way shape or form means he will succeed in the NFL either. I do not understand this fascination with Bakers height since he is taller than 2 of the best 4 QB's in the NFL. He was listed at 6'-1" and measured just under that officially, so even your assumption of his height is wrong. I forgot he measured in at just over 6' at the senior bowl but don't even pretend that's not a barrier - it most certainly is. You however completely dismissed 3/4th's of my argument because you got all emotional. Yes, Brees and Wilson are around the same height but they have massive hands at 10.25" and Mayfields are 9.5" - that's also a barrier. The NFL ball from everything I could find is slightly larger - which is why hand size is scrutinized so heavily. There have been players with more height and smaller hands that have succeeded in the NFL but rarely do they have both measurements going against them like Baker. Brees was a second rounder that was dismissed by his drafted team and really only took off as one of the best when he joined the Saints. He's developed into one of the best ever and at his height is an anomaly not an example of many. Wilson was a 3rd round pick who's had 2 excellent years statistically. We'll likely have to give up significant draft picks to move up and get Baker and I think it's foolish with the barriers he'll likely need to overcome. I'd gladly take a shot at him in the 2nd or 3rd round like the NFL comparisons you've provided. I've said it - he might end up being great but he's no doubt a risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Sky Diver said: Rosen is a head case. Pass. Why, because he has a brain and opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, White Linen said: I forgot he measured in at just over 6' at the senior bowl but don't even pretend that's not a barrier - it most certainly is. You however completely dismissed 3/4th's of my argument because you got all emotional. Yes, Brees and Wilson are around the same height but they have massive hands at 10.25" and Mayfields are 9.5" - that's also a barrier. The NFL ball from everything I could find is slightly larger - which is why hand size is scrutinized so heavily. There have been players with more height and smaller hands that have succeeded in the NFL but rarely do they have both measurements going against them like Baker. Brees was a second rounder that was dismissed by his drafted team and really only took off as one of the best when he joined the Saints. He's developed into one of the best ever and at his height is an anomaly not an example of many. Wilson was a 3rd round pick who's had 2 excellent years statistically. We'll likely have to give up significant draft picks to move up and get Baker and I think it's foolish with the barriers he'll likely need to overcome. I'd gladly take a shot at him in the 2nd or 3rd round like the NFL comparisons you've provided. I've said it - he might end up being great but he's no doubt a risk. Sorry, I just do not buy your logic of how his height will be a barrier to his success, especially given 2 of the top 4 guys in the NFL are smaller than him. And also, your draft comparisons in terms of "where" he should go based on PAST drafts is flawed logic too. Its a different era where the success of guys like Wilson and Brees have shown that talented players CAN succeed at HIGH levels even when shorter than the prototypical stereotype. So how teams draft NOW are no reflection of how teams USED to draft. No one is going to deny that size can create advantages or disadvantages for a QB. HOWEVER, its a complete fallacy and myth to put size as a determining criteria on why a player succeeded or failed when their height falls into the range of successful QB's. Lets assume Baker has a below average or bad NFL career. Under no circumstance is anyone going to look at Baker and say the REASON he failed is because he wasn't 1 inch taller like Rogers and if he had been he would have been an All Pro. Seriously, that is such a stretch of the imagination and I don't understand how anyone can get to that point. No one in their right mind would look at Aaron Rogers and say if he was an inch shorter he would not be a good NFL QB. Bottom line is very simple...either Baker can or cant play at the NFL level, and his height is not going to be the reason why. I am not denying that being bigger or shorter on the range of heights of NFL QB's doesn't include advantages and disadvantages, but under no circumstance will being at either end of that range be the determining factor of their success or failure in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elite Poster Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 2 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said: Care to explain why? Doesn't have the right DNA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 35 minutes ago, KelsaysLunchbox said: At the end of the day we need 2 QBs. McDermott has already said he wants a vet in the QB room for a variety of reasons. My 2 choices: Rookie: Baker Mayfield Vet: Josh McCown Mayfield for pretty much every reason stated. McCown because he could be a solid spot starter if needed, has been around the league for years and could be a great guy in the QB room for Mayfield. Being we don't have an experienced QB coach, McCowns experience around the league would be extremely valuable. This is the exact pairing that I want. McCown would be affordable and is a good bridge guy with no appeal to be kept long-term. In the alternative, if OBD seems to want to start Mayfield (or whichever rookie they draft) from day one, then I'd suggest this guy named Fitzpatrick as the QB2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Direhard Fan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 TT and than our draft choice can compete next year. None of these drafted guys will take us to the playoffs their first year. TT will and he is under contract. Build the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Logic said: For what it's worth (not much), I DID want Watson last year. Couldn't fathom why a QB needy teem in year 1 of a rebuild with a new coach would pass on a QB. And now, here we are, once again needing a QB. Oy vey. Because we got a top corner and a 1st round pick instead They were needs also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 (edited) bills figure out a way to bring in an average vet like Bradford, mccown..... or dare I say even keep the one we have if it comes to that.... bills make the move to 5 with the broncos and take Mayfield and he beats out any of the said vets. that's my perfect qb scenario as for why? if the rookie beats them out it means the bills are winning games immediately and I want it to be Mayfield becuz I get 6 hour Viagra boners every time I see his highlights. Edited February 21, 2018 by Stank_Nasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxy312 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 I want Baker Mayfield to eventually be the starter this year. Maybe he doesn't start out of the gate and maybe he does. My reasoning is simple. The level of his play gets better with the level of competition that he faces. It's the same reason I liked Watson last year. He didn't just win. He got up for big games and lead his team to wins. They both want the competition. Don't try to sell me on the idea of a "size issue" either. Watson is just under 6-2. Mayfield is just under 6-1. He's not Muggsy Bogues. I feel like Mayfield was simply the best QB at the college level. His stats suggest that he was. Darnold/Allen/Rudolph/Rosen all feel to me like they could be the next Matt Leinart. Maybe they don't, but that's my fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 30 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: Sorry, I just do not buy your logic of how his height will be a barrier to his success, especially given 2 of the top 4 guys in the NFL are smaller than him. And also, your draft comparisons in terms of "where" he should go based on PAST drafts is flawed logic too. Its a different era where the success of guys like Wilson and Brees have shown that talented players CAN succeed at HIGH levels even when shorter than the prototypical stereotype. So how teams draft NOW are no reflection of how teams USED to draft. No one is going to deny that size can create advantages or disadvantages for a QB. HOWEVER, its a complete fallacy and myth to put size as a determining criteria on why a player succeeded or failed when their height falls into the range of successful QB's. Lets assume Baker has a below average or bad NFL career. Under no circumstance is anyone going to look at Baker and say the REASON he failed is because he wasn't 1 inch taller like Rogers and if he had been he would have been an All Pro. Seriously, that is such a stretch of the imagination and I don't understand how anyone can get to that point. No one in their right mind would look at Aaron Rogers and say if he was an inch shorter he would not be a good NFL QB. Bottom line is very simple...either Baker can or cant play at the NFL level, and his height is not going to be the reason why. I am not denying that being bigger or shorter on the range of heights of NFL QB's doesn't include advantages and disadvantages, but under no circumstance will being at either end of that range be the determining factor of their success or failure in the NFL. I'm not trying to get you to buy anything but you're just not going to convince me I'm wrong. If Mayfield was 6'4" he'd be the #1 QB on the board and the first QB taken and you know it. I mean I get that you think it's BS but not everyone has to or does. It's a different Era? Wilson was drafted in the 3rd round in this era. This makes absolutely no sense to me. "No one is going to deny that size can create advantages or disadvantages for a QB. HOWEVER, its a complete fallacy and myth to put size as a determining criteria on why a player succeeded or failed when their height falls into the range of successful QB's." No one is going to deny it but it's a complete fallacy and myth? I don't even know what that means. You again dismiss the large portion of my argument so I assume you have no answer. If Mayfield doesn't succeed and the Bills traded 3 first round picks or 2 firsts and a 2nd and/or 3rd - You don't think it'll deserve criticism? How the heck do you know it won't be because he got balls batted down, couldn't see so ran out of the pocket or because his small hands won't allow him to throw an NFL football well enough? Let's sum it up so we don't have to go back and forth. He could end up being great and there's physical challenges that can't be ignored, IMO. You believe he has no physical challenges and either will succeed or not succeed based on factors exclusively outside of physical. I agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 4 hours ago, kota said: Also there is a big difference between hating to lose and being a Jackass. He fits into the jackass category. "Mayfield was arrested in the early morning of Feb. 25 in Fayetteville, and was charged with public intoxication, disorderly conduct, fleeing and resisting arrest." Is there evidence he makes a habitual pattern out of this? Show me a 21 yr old highly-feted male athlete who hasn't been a jackass at least once or twice and I'll show you a miracle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLEN1QB Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Anyone but TT. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Who? Johnny Unitas. Why? Because that would mean he was resurrected from the dead which means the Bills get some solid national attention and at least one prime time game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 4 hours ago, Reed83HOF said: Rosen is the best QB in the draft I agree with you, assessing him for pure QB skills - throwing motion, footwork, ability to read the field and throw into tight windows, pro-style offense. I am worried about the shoulder injuries going back to age 12 and the two concussions last fall and by his stated interest in making money outside football, even though he frames it as wanting to make money so he can take a lower salary and leave more cap for the team. I am also worried about Mayfield being able to adjust to a pro-style offense. But the more I see of Mayfield's play on the field, the more he intrigues me. I've converted, Mayfield is my first choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRUSHx Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 (edited) Rosen,Darnold, Mayfield, Rudolph or Cousins. Why? Because IMO they are very talented. Also they are not a backup QB from another team. Edited February 21, 2018 by xRUSHx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Cousins a bird in the hand (proven top 10 nfl qb) is worth 3 in the bush (crapshoot draft picks) then I still have all my draft picks (two #1's and two #2's) to fill my other holes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I agree with you, assessing him for pure QB skills - throwing motion, footwork, ability to read the field and throw into tight windows, pro-style offense. I am worried about the shoulder injuries going back to age 12 and the two concussions last fall and by his stated interest in making money outside football, even though he frames it as wanting to make money so he can take a lower salary and leave more cap for the team. I am also worried about Mayfield being able to adjust to a pro-style offense. But the more I see of Mayfield's play on the field, the more he intrigues me. I've converted, Mayfield is my first choice. With Mayfield, I worry he might be like Brees and take a few years to "git good". I do like his cockiness, we haven't had that kind of swagger since JK... I like Rosen, Darnold & Mayfield - in that order. I would be also ok with Allen, if we didn't move up too much and got him around 12. I just can't get on the Rudolph bandwagon, I have a bad feeling that he is very close to his ceiling... Like you I do worry a bit about his shoulder injury, but he is the best pure QB in the draft. I actually like his honesty; it's refreshing... There are too many threads to pay attention to and I feel like I missed this and I know you would have this info: With Tyrod his bonus is due on 3/16; so a move with him should be made by that date. Doesn't that just telegraph that we are moving up way too much too soon? I feel like at that point, you need to take care of him however and pull the trade up at like the same time. Just feels like you will get milked for even more at that point..Or am I off my rocker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Josh Rosen. He's pro ready and cost controlled for five years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 3 hours ago, BigBuff423 said: So here's legitimate question in my mind. We have two supremely gifted QBs in Mayfield and Rosen. One, is viewed as the silver-spoon brat who pisses all over anyone he wants because, he can....and the other is viewed a tough, charismatic leader who is misunderstood simply because he loves to win. If you've read up on both, and only if you have, please tell me which of these two present the greatest challenge to Draft based on the "character" concerns alone? In other words, which do you view as merely, "needs to grow up", vs. "he's whacked out and wont' get it right" or maybe you feel it's both or neither....I'm just curious. Well, first of all, can you dole me some gouge about Rosen actually "pissing all over anyone he wants because he can"? Because I haven't....outside of some college-boy hijinx like rearranging lawn ornaments and buying an inflatable hot tub to put in his room, the "knocks" I've read on Rosen are that he's 1) politically naive about the impacts of sharing his opinions in public 2) in terms of coaching, he will question everything (especially authority) and expect answers. He "doesn't know what he doesn't know", as Dilfer once said. I don't think Mayfield is "misunderstood" either. I think he's naive about the organizational impacts of his public behavior and gestures They both need to grow up, I don't see either of them as huge "red flags", though they both need to be understood during the interview process. Rosen is perhaps a bit more concerning, in that he needs to be in the hands of a personally secure, grounded coach who will hold up well under a barrage of questions and not interpret it as a "dis" on his authority. I don't see him as a "good fit" for Hue Jackson, not sure about Ken Zampese. I'm also not sure whether he has "bought in" to the idea that he needs to button it up and choose his words with care, or whether Mora has him in a head-lock and he's just waiting to get out of his grip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Formerly Allan in MD said: Why, because he has a brain and opinions? No, because people don't agree with his opinions. Move up - Rosen - best prospect in the draft IMO Stay at 21 - Jackson - may have the highest upside of any of the QBs Edited February 21, 2018 by Chuck Wagon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBean Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Kirk Cousins. Keep the picks and build through the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said: There are too many threads to pay attention to and I feel like I missed this and I know you would have this info: With Tyrod his bonus is due on 3/16; so a move with him should be made by that date. Doesn't that just telegraph that we are moving up way too much too soon? I feel like at that point, you need to take care of him however and pull the trade up at like the same time. Just feels like you will get milked for even more at that point..Or am I off my rocker? No, I think you're raising a valid point that concerns me also - not about wanting to "move up", but a more general one. That said, I don't think moving on Tyrod by 16 March necessarily telegraphs a "move up". It depends upon what else we do - trade for a QB, sign a FA QB and who. If we sign someone like McCarron, it might plausibly be considered we want to give him a shot to start and we're off the 1st round QB carousel. I personally don't think we should cut ties with Tyrod until we have someone we see as equal or better under contract. I think that is more important, frankly, than saving $6M. That was the lesson of 2013 IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillyG Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, JohnBonhamRocks said: This is the exact pairing that I want. McCown would be affordable and is a good bridge guy with no appeal to be kept long-term. In the alternative, if OBD seems to want to start Mayfield (or whichever rookie they draft) from day one, then I'd suggest this guy named Fitzpatrick as the QB2. Fitzpatrick is more consistent than the Madden Curse. In the fact that every place he goes the starting QB misses long stretches of games lol. I'd still want McCown as the #2 guy. From what I have read on him he has the making of an excellent QB coach in the opinion of many of his coaches. Iirc there was some interest in him becoming a coach if he couldn't latch on anywhere else last season. I wouldn't be upset if Fitz came back. He's an E-P guy so he fits (ha..Fitz fits) but I think we could definitely do better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, KelsaysLunchbox said: Fitzpatrick is more consistent than the Madden Curse. In the fact that every place he goes the starting QB misses long stretches of games lol. I'd still want McCown as the #2 guy. From what I have read on him he has the making of an excellent QB coach in the opinion of many of his coaches. Iirc there was some interest in him becoming a coach if he couldn't latch on anywhere else last season. I wouldn't be upset if Fitz came back. He's an E-P guy so he fits (ha..Fitz fits) but I think we could definitely do better. I've heard that said on these board before about Fitz being a curse. My response has been that, hey, we're living in a post-drought world, so all bets are off concerning curses! I would like McCown as a QB2, too, but I'm not sure he would want that role. He could very well go somewhere that ensures him at least the opportunity to battle for QB1. Curse aside, I think Fitz would be at least a top 10 back-up QB in the league, if not top 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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