GoBills808 Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 3 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: The Athletic dropped their updated Mock Draft 2.0. For whatever it's worth, yet another DE... 28. Buffalo Bills: Darius Robinson, Edge, Missouri The Bills tried to move up to get one of the top four receivers, but once that didn’t work, they had a deal in place to move down … that also fell through. Moving down would be preferred if the board played out this way. But with the depth of the receiver class, there is no reason to force the pick and take someone who doesn’t fit what the Bills need in an X receiver with speed to get over the top. Instead, they used their pick on another premium position and landed a long, versatile defensive lineman — a selection that had Sean McDermott and Brandon Beane written all over it. The vision is to eventually use Robinson as a starting defensive lineman who can play on either edge or inside at defensive tackle, depending on the situation. As a prospect, Robinson has been compared to Arik Armstead, whom the Bills were in on as a free agent. — Joe Buscaglia I have a feeling that the high priority to draft a new #1 WR may exist more with the fans than at OBD. Especially given how little future-drafting Beane has done in the past. Still have my sights set on Troy Franklin tho... That would be very disappointing 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 19 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: That would be very disappointing It would. Even forget position for a moment I don't think he is even close to a first round talent. He is a positionless workout warrior. I don't care what the testing and the RAS score says. He just wasn't that explosive on tape. In terms of somewhat realistic worst case scenarios he is it for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 1 minute ago, GunnerBill said: It would. Even forget position for a moment I don't think he is even close to a first round talent. He is a positionless workout warrior. I don't care what the testing and the RAS score says. He just wasn't that explosive on tape. In terms of somewhat realistic worst case scenarios he is it for me. If I'm following the Athletic mock, I'd rather they just reach at 28 for any of the WRs that got picked in their 2nd round. Even McConky over Robinson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 Diggs is the only WR on the roster that can be a full time outside WR. Whether they are looking for his replacement or not, finding an outside WR is an absolute must early in this draft. Short term need, long term need, positional value, draft class positional strength. All of the ingredients are there. Beane just needs to do the easy thing and capitalize on it. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 3 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: If I'm following the Athletic mock, I'd rather they just reach at 28 for any of the WRs that got picked in their 2nd round. Even McConky over Robinson. In fairness this was the beat writers for each team doing a mock as if they were GMs. If Joe B was our GM we'd have been relegated to the XFL or whatever it is called these days by now..... 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 53 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Diggs is the only WR on the roster that can be a full time outside WR. Whether they are looking for his replacement or not, finding an outside WR is an absolute must early in this draft. Short term need, long term need, positional value, draft class positional strength. All of the ingredients are there. Beane just needs to do the easy thing and capitalize on it. Improving boundary WR was a no-brainer 2 years ago. Now it's a 5 alarm fire. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 On 3/23/2024 at 1:52 PM, Virgil said: As we get ready for the draft, and I get ready for the TSW Mock Draft staring next weekend, there's been a lot of conversation about needing to draft a wide receiver early. While I don't disagree with this, I do wonder what type of receiver we are looking for and what impact will they make on the offense. Before I can make that decision, there's a few things that need to be considered Diggs is under contract with a sizeable hit for this year and next. We could release him next season, but it would incur a 22 mil dead cap hit and only save us 5 million. Diggs has also gone on record saying that he will not restructure his contract to help the Bills cap space. If we bring in a capable number one receiver, how does Diggs handle being the number 2 guy? Emotional support isn't high on his capacities. We are stacked at inside receivers. Between Shakir, Knox, Kincaid, and Samuel, the slot position is locked up and deep. How do we even utilize a receiver that's not Diggs or a slot? My biggest criticism of Brady is that I don't feel like he really took advantage of the mismatches we could have created with two Tight Ends and doesn't scheme players open very well. McVay is a great example of a coach who gets people like Kupp wide open. Brady doesn't seem to be able to do that Was Davis' decline due to his ability or playcalling? To me, it's a little of both. Davis had some mental blunders in both routes and drops, but he was a big body speed guy, that on paper, most of us would clamor to draft again. So even if we get another player like Gabe, will we be able to utilize him? Free Agent Wide Receivers in 2025 look rough. There's isn't a #1 guy that will be available Some mock drafts only have 5 wide receivers going in the first round. If that's the case, there will be some great talent available in round 2 that is more than capable of becoming WR1 With all that being said, do we need to prioritize a receiver that can become out WR 1, knowing Diggs is here for the next two years, or do we just need another weapon that can compliment what we have? Even with Davis being MIA in most games, Josh put up good numbers with who we had. To me, the secret answer is what Beane did with Samuel. Samuel is documented to have the 3rd best separation in the NFL on cut routes, something badly needed on this team. Beane also wanted to bring in Harty for a similar goal. I think Beane wants quick guys that can create space, that Brandy can use wherever he wants on the field. So what receiver, if any, needs to be a priority? A 6'+ receiver who can eventually take over for Diggs in 2 years? A burner, like Hill, who we can move around in motion a lot to create mismatches from motion? My answer, and I vomit saying this, is best player available. If that happens to be a receiver that can lineup outside, then okay. But if there is a difference maker at another position available or a receiver that is only going to be lumped into our slot guys, then I go with the difference maker at another position. If this draft is so deep at receiver, I might wait and get someone in the mid rounds with the potential of a #1 guy, and if it doesn't work out, we have two more years to draft the right person. Here are ESPN's rankings of WR's with a grade of 80 or higher. Only one player is shorter than 6'. Quite a few of these guys could easily be there in the second round: Marvin Harrison - 94 - 6'3" Malik Nabers - 93 - 6' Rome Odunze - 92 - 6'3" Adonai Mitchell - 90 - 6'2" Brian Thomas Jr - 90 - 6'3" Xavier Legette - 89 - 6'1" Ladd McConkey - 88 - 6' Xavier Worth - 87 - 5'11" Keon Coleman - 87 - 6'3" Troy Franklin - 85 - 6'2" Devontez Walker - 84 - 6'2" Jermaine Burton - 82 - 6' Ricky Pearsall - 6'1" Excellent post. I think that the Bills are at the point where grabbing a real difference maker in the first round regardless of position will pay the biggest dividends in the future, especially when the depth of the WR class means that there will be good WRs available in the second. I think that Beane's moves in FA suggest that he's leaning that way himself; he's filled the glaring holes so he has the freedom to take somebody he likes best, especially if one of the two centers projected as first rounders happen to fall. If the Bills don't go WR in the first round, I wouldn't be surprised if they traded up in the second to grab one. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 4 hours ago, 3rdand12 said: When and how would you bring in Diggs "next" I think we should be discussing that. As I have said. Bills would do well to draft a WR with speed and some of the other qualities somewhere along the first two days But if they have a shot to gets Diggs some real competition from the draft , they certainly should. If that speedy x receiver happens to have most all the qualities to take him to 1A ? then , all the better. I don't understand your question in the context of my post. I said "But you don't hit the shot you don't take. Time for the Bills to shoot their shot at WR." and "In my mind, we're not trying to replace Diggs, we're trying to draft a guy who can give us a 1-2 punch WITH Diggs, and who has the potential to develop as a future #1 (not to walk in the door and hit it)." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 On 3/24/2024 at 6:27 PM, Beck Water said: I don't understand your question in the context of my post. I said "But you don't hit the shot you don't take. Time for the Bills to shoot their shot at WR." and "In my mind, we're not trying to replace Diggs, we're trying to draft a guy who can give us a 1-2 punch WITH Diggs, and who has the potential to develop as a future #1 (not to walk in the door and hit it)." Thats exactly what I said different wordings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 49 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said: Thats exactly what I said different wordings ohkay...but you responded to my post (in which I said that) All good.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 I'd say looking to the future the answer to your question would be a resounding YES !! Diggs still has some gas left in the tank and will get production in this offense but he's not getting any younger . He hasn't taken a lot of hits the way he gets down quickly after he makes a catch but still with the as they have said this year has a lot of elite type WR's coming out so it only makes sense to look to the future when it comes to that position and for that fact all positions but this year WR is a top of that list due to the amount of top talent that could be there at the Bills pick !! Plus Diggs can be a mentor to them to help them assimilate to the NFL game just as Von has helped some of the younger pass rushers he can do the same . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 It’s a really deep WR draft, WR is probably now the 2nd most important position after QB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 18 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: It’s a really deep WR draft, WR is probably now the 2nd most important position after QB I think an argument can be made to Offensive or defensive line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 22 hours ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said: I think an argument can be made to Offensive or defensive line. Definitely not Dline, the Ravens and 49ers had one of the best and got held like crazy with zero holding calls. O-Line maybe but WR is still number 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 2 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: Definitely not Dline, the Ravens and 49ers had one of the best and got held like crazy with zero holding calls. O-Line maybe but WR is still number 2. Yeah, the only reason I'd lean o-line is just because it keeps your shiny expensive QB healthy. Not to mention the Chiefs just won a super bowl with like no one at WR, and an elite offensive line. It also has the bonus effect of helping establish a good running game. Being able to sometimes run the ball effectively is a huge counter for teams built to stop your passing attack. I'll also say it is hard to find a recent super bowl team that didn't have a strong defensive line as well though. Maybe the 2018 patriots? I wouldn't say it was a particularly bad group though - Guy is solid, Flowers was in a pre-injury prime, Malcolm Brown at the nose, Wise in his 2nd year. Definitely some talent in that group, and you could do a lot worse. 2016 Falcons are probably the last mediocre defensive line (and defense) to even make a super bowl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In Summary Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 Re OP, yes it's a priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warriorspikes51 Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 Top Priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortchaz Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 On 3/26/2024 at 9:09 PM, Call_Of_Ktulu said: It’s a really deep WR draft, WR is probably now the 2nd most important position after QB I think the chiefs sort of kill this argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 On 3/23/2024 at 2:40 PM, appoo said: How do you think the Bills got Diggs? There’s enough GMs out there who think you can always find WR1s in the first round, that they don’t wanna pay their current WRs. I still think stud WRs are well worth paying, and I think you can find them in the trade market and draft. Not meaning to sound offensive by any means appoo , But who can Bills afford this year , next etc , who can play that X role and usurp Diggs this season or next ? I dont think Bills have the money for that indulgence When Diggs is off the books ? Hopefully that option opens up. T spend like we did on Diggs , an immediate 1A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted March 29 Author Share Posted March 29 23 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: Definitely not Dline, the Ravens and 49ers had one of the best and got held like crazy with zero holding calls. O-Line maybe but WR is still number 2. Why not defensive line? After this year, we will be back to having minimal depth. Von could be gone. I would not be surprised if they went DL if a BPA is there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 2 minutes ago, Virgil said: Why not defensive line? After this year, we will be back to having minimal depth. Von could be gone. I would not be surprised if they went DL if a BPA is there Sweat for president ! And the WR , order does not matter. Maneuvering might be required 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 7 minutes ago, Virgil said: Why not defensive line? After this year, we will be back to having minimal depth. Von could be gone. I would not be surprised if they went DL if a BPA is there Because since 2019 the Bills have spent 2,622 points of draft capital on the defensive line. By comparison, in the same time period they have spent 126 on WR They have invested over 20x as much draft capital into dline as they have into WR...time for a new approach 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted March 29 Author Share Posted March 29 3 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Because since 2019 the Bills have spent 2,622 points of draft capital on the defensive line. By comparison, in the same time period they have spent 126 on WR They have invested over 20x as much draft capital into dline as they have into WR...time for a new approach So, the data would suggest they are more likely to value defensive line 😋. To be clear, I’m with you. I have too much ptsd from their drafting DL early. However, if there is a game wrecker there at Edge, I’d support it. I don’t think that person will be there at 28 though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 I would trade Diggs and two 1st rd picks right now if it meant we could get into the top 10 for Harrison Jr or Nabers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 if you have a chance to get a Justin Jefferson or Jamar Chase level talent on a rookie contract, you do it 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 (edited) 40 minutes ago, stuvian said: if you have a chance to get a Justin Jefferson or Jamar Chase level talent on a rookie contract, you do it You talk of it as if taking a guy in Round 1 means that's what we're getting. Ideally, we're able to Draft a guy who becomes that. But that's a MASSIVE ask at 28. Jefferson was drafted at 25 and was WR5. But he's very much the exception, not the rule. And Chase was drafted 5th overall. I think we should take a WR in Round 1. But invoking the names of Jefferson and Chase are some mighty lofty expectations. Edited March 31 by BillsFanForever19 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 3 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said: You talk of it as if taking a guy in Round 1 means that's what we're getting. Ideally, we're able to Draft a guy who becomes that. But that's a MASSIVE ask at 28. Jefferson was drafted at 25 and was WR5. But he's very much the exception, not the rule. And Chase was drafted 5th overall. I think we should take a WR in Round 1. But invoking the names of Jefferson and Chase are some mighty lofty expectations. Puka Nacua and Cooper Kupp say Hi 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 (edited) 20 minutes ago, stuvian said: Puka Nacua and Cooper Kupp say Hi That's awesome, but again, the exceptions - not the rule. I'm simply saying that you HOPE that whomever we take is good and can become great. But there's no guarantee that simply taking one means you're getting a Ja'Marr Chase, Justin Jefferson, or Cooper Kupp level talent. Round 1 at WR doesn't guarantee we've just gotten ourselves one of the best WR's in the NFL - like the names you're invoking imply. You could draft the next Justin Jefferson. Or you could end up with the next Quentin Johnston, Treylon Burks, Kadarius Toney, Rashod Bateman, Henry Ruggs, Jaelon Raegor, or N'Keal Harry level talent. The only prospects that you can consider "Ja'Marr Chase or Justin Jefferson level talents" are Marvin Harrison Jr. or Malik Nabers. Even they're projections and we aren't sniffing either one of them. Edited March 31 by BillsFanForever19 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 17 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said: That's awesome, but again, the exceptions - not the rule. I'm simply saying that you HOPE that whomever we take is good and can become great. But there's no guarantee that simply taking one means you're getting a Ja'Marr Chase, Justin Jefferson, or Cooper Kupp level talent. Round 1 at WR doesn't guarantee we've just gotten ourselves one of the best WR's in the NFL - like the names you're invoking imply. You could draft the next Justin Jefferson. Or you could end up with the next Quentin Johnston, Treylon Burks, Kadarius Toney, Rashod Bateman, Henry Ruggs, Jaelon Raegor, or N'Keal Harry level talent. The only prospects that you can consider "Ja'Marr Chase or Justin Jefferson level talents" are Marvin Harrison Jr. or Malik Nabers. Even they're projections and we aren't sniffing either one of them. I'd rather see us go defense personally I don't expect a world beater at our draft spot there either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralonzo Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 On 3/23/2024 at 2:28 PM, BarleyNY said: So we’re pretty flush with Y and Z types in Diggs, Samuel, Shakir and Kincaid. But we don’t have that X. It is difficult to find an X who can do it all. It’s easier to find a Gabe Davis who can get deep, but isn’t good at uncovering quickly on shorter routes. Obviously if you can find someone who is big, fast and agile you go get that guy. But if you can’t, then what’s your next best option? The next best option to an all-purpose WR1 playing the X is a Gabe Davis replacement who's not on a Jacksonville contract. It may be Shorter. It may be somewhere in this draft in that Gabe Davis zone - not at the top, but early Day 3 where the Bills happen to be flush with picks, maybe a guy like Devontez falls, or get value on a Cornelius Johnson or Johnny Wilson. If you're feeling sporty go back to UCF for Javon Baker, he can't run worse routes than Davis, can he? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 15 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said: That's awesome, but again, the exceptions - not the rule. I'm simply saying that you HOPE that whomever we take is good and can become great. But there's no guarantee that simply taking one means you're getting a Ja'Marr Chase, Justin Jefferson, or Cooper Kupp level talent. Round 1 at WR doesn't guarantee we've just gotten ourselves one of the best WR's in the NFL - like the names you're invoking imply. You could draft the next Justin Jefferson. Or you could end up with the next Quentin Johnston, Treylon Burks, Kadarius Toney, Rashod Bateman, Henry Ruggs, Jaelon Raegor, or N'Keal Harry level talent. The only prospects that you can consider "Ja'Marr Chase or Justin Jefferson level talents" are Marvin Harrison Jr. or Malik Nabers. Even they're projections and we aren't sniffing either one of them. Bills also have the " issue " of coaching up draft picks quickly and completely. My main reason for not reaching up the board much if at all. and certainly not next years first Now for the actual Jefferson or Chase ....😍 13 hours ago, Ralonzo said: The next best option to an all-purpose WR1 playing the X is a Gabe Davis replacement who's not on a Jacksonville contract. It may be Shorter. It may be somewhere in this draft in that Gabe Davis zone - not at the top, but early Day 3 where the Bills happen to be flush with picks, maybe a guy like Devontez falls, or get value on a Cornelius Johnson or Johnny Wilson. If you're feeling sporty go back to UCF for Javon Baker, he can't run worse routes than Davis, can he? Agreed about where you find an X receiver with wheels. But i do want the Bills to try and get a starter at WR early enough to make impact. and why I say 2 Wrs from the draft possibly. One early and one who has a nice ceiling and speed already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nephilim17 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 Now's a deep draft for receiver. Considering the Bills should be competitive most years and picking in the mid to low 20s (hopefully 32 some years)... if now now, when? We have an aging number 1. No proven young boundary receivers. When should we wait to draft a potential number 1 to replace Steph? Not every year will be loaded at WR like this. Look at last year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo44 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 On 3/29/2024 at 12:49 PM, 3rdand12 said: Sweat for president ! And the WR , order does not matter. Maneuvering might be required 28 is too early for sweat. Wouldn’t mind a wr at 28 and a trade up from 60 to the mid 40s for sweat though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 On 3/31/2024 at 4:14 PM, Turbo44 said: 28 is too early for sweat. Wouldn’t mind a wr at 28 and a trade up from 60 to the mid 40s for sweat though Agreed about the maneuvering for sure I feel much depends on the WRs they feel could jump the Offense. Could be two of em if they dont push hard My priority and , I should be BPA lol is nailing the WR room for tomorrow and the future Thanks Turbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 I think we need a WR to supplement our WR position. It has nothing to do with Diggs. Further, I don't even know how much any WR will contribute year one. WR is a complicated position and multiple Bills are on record with how complicated it is to play for us. Josh just did a video and he made this facial expression when asked about it as if to reinforce just how difficult it is. I do think we could see a draft pick potentially turn it on late in the year which is fine, that is when we need it most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCofNC Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 I look at Nacua last year and wonder how he dropped, Jefferson was late round 1, etc. those are just lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 I think so! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted April 3 Author Share Posted April 3 Just curious to see what people think now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDubya76 Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 If it wasn’t before, it is now. maybe just a little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 I already thought drafting a WR at 28 had to happen and was a massive need. Its now situation critical that we do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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