Bills Cap Status - Approx $4.25 under cap 4/03/2024 (added roster change summary)

[sven233]

4 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Chris Jones is the main reason KC won the SB this year.   

If there is a single player in the league right now that we should consider investing huge $ in, it's him. 

I don't actually expect him to reach Monday unsigned. 

take him out of their defense, they become an above average unit 

 

He is an absolute dominant monster at key moments in games.

He can be moved all over the DL.  

You can draft young talent on offense.

 

Mahomes got the MVP because of name value.  But anyone that watched that game knows Chris Jones was the MVP and the main reason they won. 

 

Everyone is calling it one of the best Super Bowls ever.  No way.  It was a great finish, but that game was absolute trash for almost the first 3 quarters.  And the main reason the Chiefs weren't already out of the game for good was Chris Jones.  He was the most dominant player on the field.

[Warriorspikes51]

3 minutes ago, sven233 said:

 

Mahomes got the MVP because of name value.  But anyone that watched that game knows Chris Jones was the MVP and the main reason they won. 

 

Everyone is calling it one of the best Super Bowls ever.  No way.  It was a great finish, but that game was absolute trash for almost the first 3 quarters.  And the main reason the Chiefs weren't already out of the game for good was Chris Jones.  He was the most dominant player on the field.

GET HIM. 

[Nephilim17]

So the Tre White savings are NOT included in the updates. Correct?

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Just posting to show an example of how you can sign a big contract with little cap space. Mike Evans $5.5 cap hit in 2024. Big hits later but you get my point. You just better be right and lucky or you end up with a Von Miller cap anchor.

 

 

Edited March 8 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Blank Stare]

If he’s not expecting the moon, I’m going after Chase Young in free agency. 

[LabattBlue]

Being lazy, and did not read through thread.  Is there anyone other than Allen(restructure/extension) that would bring significant cap relief for 2024?

[Tuco]

33 minutes ago, Nephilim17 said:

So the Tre White savings are NOT included in the updates. Correct?

No. And they won't be until June 1st. June 1st savings don't apply to a team's cap until June 1st. 

[LABILLBACKER]

18 minutes ago, Blank Stare said:

If he’s not expecting the moon, I’m going after Chase Young in free agency. 

Doesn't give effort on every play. Hard pass

[GASabresIUFan]

@Tuco, maybe I should change my handle to "Angel Eyes"

[Nephilim17]

20 minutes ago, Tuco said:

No. And they won't be until June 1st. June 1st savings don't apply to a team's cap until June 1st. 

Yes, I know with the league it doesn't count till June, I just wanted to make sure the OP's cap update numbers were not counting it either. Thanks.

[Blank Stare]

57 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Doesn't give effort on every play. Hard pass

I get that side of it and it would certainly be a concern if it were a huge contract/commitment, but we’re talking about a 24 year old with immense physical traits. At one time this guy was up there being compared to as good as (or in some cases maybe better than) the Bosas. You’re right though, if the engine is not always running hot, then those other traits become far less important.  I guess I’m banking on McD’s ability to coach it out of him.  To me, someone worth taking a swing on under the right terms.

[mjt328]

31 minutes ago, Blank Stare said:

I get that side of it and it would certainly be a concern if it were a huge contract/commitment, but we’re talking about a 24 year old with immense physical traits. At one time this guy was up there being compared to as good as (or in some cases maybe better than) the Bosas. You’re right though, if the engine is not always running hot, then those other traits become far less important.  I guess I’m banking on McD’s ability to coach it out of him.  To me, someone worth taking a swing on under the right terms.

 

San Francisco couldn't get anything out of him.  

That was during a Super Bowl run, and with the O-Line focusing their blocking on other players like Nick Bosa.

At this point, I just don't think it's going to click for Young.

[Buffalo03]

1 hour ago, Blank Stare said:

If he’s not expecting the moon, I’m going after Chase Young in free agency. 

What if he wants the sun?

[SoonerBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Tuco said:

No. And they won't be until June 1st. June 1st savings don't apply to a team's cap until June 1st. 

We will use that to sign draft picks

 

[Blank Stare]

Just now, Buffalo03 said:

What if he wants the sun?

Nonstarter. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

A restructure of Dawkins and Allen gets us to 13 mill under the cap.  Not sure what else we really want to mess with after that.

[BuffaloBill]

6 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

A restructure of Dawkins and Allen gets us to 13 mill under the cap.  Not sure what else we really want to mess with after that.

 

 

I think that is all the Bills do as they will need not create any down the road headaches.  The only exception may be going after  someone like Floyd for pass rush.  Maybe they do a tiny splash here. Keep in mind they need to be $15-$18MM under the cap soon for rookies and in season signings (injury replacements).

[Blank Stare]

6 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

San Francisco couldn't get anything out of him.  

That was during a Super Bowl run, and with the O-Line focusing their blocking on other players like Nick Bosa.

At this point, I just don't think it's going to click for Young.

All fair points. Believe me, I realize the arguments against outweigh the fors at this point in his career. Effort is probably the one thing that would likely take him off Beane’s list completely anyhow (see Darcel Mareus). That said, I’m betting on traits here and a max 1-2 year deal for reasonable dough. I’d like our pass rushers to be guys that aren’t 107 years old for what feels like forever. If McD and Babich can’t salvage him, then I agree, just isn’t going to happen for him.

 

His 7.5 sacks last year, while not great, would’ve been third on the team behind Floyd and Oliver and one above Epenesa. All things equal, If I’m choosing between Young and Epenesa, I’d be more inclined to go with the guy with the better physical traits and higher ceiling.

[SoCal Deek]

4 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

I said crappy teams have to go to the minor leagues.  How was that wrong?  
 

I realize there is a difference between a crappy team and salary cap non-compliance, I was just using crappy English soccer teams as an example.

 

 

The term clarification isn’t synonymous with wrong. It’s a term that means adding more definition. 😉

[transplantbillsfan]

4 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

As others have pointed out, the incentive may have been that the Bills told him they would cut him, and his agent told him that his options in free agency would be limited, given the uncertainty about his recovery.  

 

I haven't read everyone's comments, but if the Bills cut him their Dead Cap would have been astronomical.  I know there are posters who claim it would have been doable, but if what you're saying really happened, I think it would have been a bluff and a bad game of chicken Von and his agent fell for and lost.

 

I don't think that's what happened, though.

[SoonerBillsFan]

30 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

I think that is all the Bills do as they will need not create any down the road headaches.  The only exception may be going after  someone like Floyd for pass rush.  Maybe they do a tiny splash here. Keep in mind they need to be $15-$18MM under the cap soon for rookies and in season signings (injury replacements).

Rookies right now cost about 11 mill and tre's post June 1st pretty much covers that

[Shaw66]

26 minutes ago, Blank Stare said:

All fair points. Believe me, I realize the arguments against outweigh the fors at this point in his career. Effort is probably the one thing that would likely take him off Beane’s list completely anyhow (see Darcel Mareus). That said, I’m betting on traits here and a max 1-2 year deal for reasonable dough. I’d like our pass rushers to be guys that aren’t 107 years old for what feels like forever. If McD and Babich can’t salvage him, then I agree, just isn’t going to happen for him.

 

His 7.5 sacks last year, while not great, would’ve been third on the team behind Floyd and Oliver and one above Epenesa. All things equal, If I’m choosing between Young and Epenesa, I’d be more inclined to go with the guy with the better physical traits and higher ceiling.

I hear what you're saying, but I think you're right that he isn't on Beane's list.  They've always said that effort, teamwork, work ethic are essential, and if you don't have that, you aren't playing for the Bills.  Compare Young to Spencer Brown.   Brown had a unique body and good athletic ability, but he wasn't all world at anything.  They took him for the intangibles.   That's the kind of upside they bet on - someone who's work ethic can make him an over-achiever.   That's who Bernard is.  And Milano.  And Taron Johnson.  Miller had the special physical traits AND the character stuff.  

 

I can't see Young.  

[BillsFanForever19]

3 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

GET HIM. 

 

If I didn't know any better, I'd think your posts were just troll jobs.

[jahnyc]

Even with a restructuring of Josh's contract, will we even have enough cap space to sign bargain basement free agents?  Seems that we have a lot of roster spots to fill, particularly on defense, after releases and expiring contracts.  Our draft will supply some of the needed players, but we will need significantly more.

[GASabresIUFan]

Updated to reflect Rapp’s cap hit and the Morris signing.

Edited March 8 by GASabresIUFan

[78thealltimegreat]

43 minutes ago, jahnyc said:

Even with a restructuring of Josh's contract, will we even have enough cap space to sign bargain basement free agents?  Seems that we have a lot of roster spots to fill, particularly on defense, after releases and expiring contracts.  Our draft will supply some of the needed players, but we will need significantly more.

Oh yes easily Josh’s contract alone takes them to 20 million under and that’s without the tre whites cut which covers the draft picks alone add that to a restructure of Deion and and Matt Milano will take them to around 30-35 million under. 

[No_Matter_What]

@Tuco, I saw you around explaining things... Could you please have a look at Sportrac and confirm that it is showing nonsense about Matt Milano's dead cap in 2025 and 2026?

 

Besided his normal numbers he has another row just with some dead money ($2,586,000), which are apparently last two years of prorated signing bonus restructured in 2022. These were originally void years, but in 2023 they were "covered" by extension so this dead cap should dissappear and become part of his regular cap hit. Therefore, those 2025 and 2026 dead caps should not be there, and his only dead cap is $4,889,000 in 2027 (void year for another signing + option bonuses), right?

 

In other words, we actually have more cap space in 2025 ($35,319,356 + $2,586,000), right?

 

 

[Westside]

4 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

I think that is all the Bills do as they will need not create any down the road headaches.  The only exception may be going after  someone like Floyd for pass rush.  Maybe they do a tiny splash here. Keep in mind they need to be $15-$18MM under the cap soon for rookies and in season signings (injury replacements).

How did our cap situation get so screwed up? How many rookies are they counting on to start because of the cap situation? 

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, Westside said:

How did our cap situation get so screwed up? How many rookies are they counting on to start because of the cap situation? 

Allen, Diggs, Von, Tre contracts + way too much being spent on above average vets/rotational DL. 
 

The Defense will look fine when they bring in another above average Safety vet or two to go with Rapp.  Couldn’t ask for a better year to one… or two. 
 

We’re good at LB and CB.. just need a couple Day 3 draft picks to develop as depth. 
 

OL looks pretty good.  TE is set.  Can take a day 3 RB and sign a cheap vet. 
 

DL and WR need high level investment. 
 

We can likely afford one pass rusher or wide receiver.   Going to need to lean on the draft heavy for whichever of those position groups we don’t spend a moderately splashy contract on. 

 

 

Edited March 9 by SCBills

[khlax3]

4 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Rookies right now cost about 11 mill and tre's post June 1st pretty much covers it

 

Even if we draft 11 players in the draft the picks will only cost between 4-5 million in cap space. 
 

round 1- 2.4 million

Round 2- 1.17 million

Round 3- 1.011 million

 

All other rounds are a minimum type salary. All of these players would replace existing minimum contracts on the roster and it would be a wash cap wise. Honestly if you drafted 11 players and they all made the team you might actually gain space as they would likely be replacing guys who make more than the rookie contracts 

[SoonerBillsFan]

28 minutes ago, khlax3 said:

 

Even if we draft 11 players in the draft the picks will only cost between 4-5 million in cap space. 
 

round 1- 2.4 million

Round 2- 1.17 million

Round 3- 1.011 million

 

All other rounds are a minimum type salary. All of these players would replace existing minimum contracts on the roster and it would be a wash cap wise. Honestly if you drafted 11 players and they all made the team you might actually gain space as they would likely be replacing guys who make more than the rookie contracts 

Sporttrac has our rookie pool at nearly 11.5 million.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap/

Edited March 9 by SoonerBillsFan

[khlax3]

11 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Sporttrac has our rookie pool at nearly 11.5 million.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap/

they are not factoring in the guys they would replace on the roster. If your adding 11 guys through the draft you would be eliminating the bottom 11 salaries on the team would are all about 797k-989k each.

 

so you would only have a net of couple million needed for draft picks

[Westside]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

Allen, Diggs, Von, Tre contracts + way too much being spent on above average vets/rotational DL. 
 

The Defense will look fine when they bring in another above average Safety vet or two to go with Rapp.  Couldn’t ask for a better year to one… or two. 
 

We’re good at LB and CB.. just need a couple Day 3 draft picks to develop as depth. 
 

OL looks pretty good.  TE is set.  Can take a day 3 RB and sign a cheap vet. 
 

DL and WR need high level investment. 
 

We can likely afford one pass rusher or wide receiver.   Going to need to lean on the draft heavy for whichever of those position groups we don’t spend a moderately splashy contract on. 

 

 

I'm worried about our depth if we have another year of a rash of injuries. Not much money to spend on free agents, we're gonna have to rely on late round picks to fill in if that happens. i'm not feeling really confident about that. I'm really worried about our DL and OL depth now. Pray for a injurie free (as much as possible) year!

[EmotionallyUnstable]

16 minutes ago, khlax3 said:

they are not factoring in the guys they would replace on the roster. If your adding 11 guys through the draft you would be eliminating the bottom 11 salaries on the team would are all about 797k-989k each.

 

so you would only have a net of couple million needed for draft picks

This is referring to the “top 51” rule.

 

Prior to the Final Cut down day, teams salary cap figures are calculated by the top 51 salaries. Are you mentioned, guys signing for less than a mill, likely aren’t breaking into that top 51. Yea, they still get paid, but at the end of the day, they won’t count against the cap until the regular season starts at which point all 53 must be under the cap. This gives Beane all summer to continue to work and maneuver as needed.

 

Im still expecting 1 or 2 extensions, but bare minimum, they are fine. 

[Tuco]

2 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

@Tuco, I saw you around explaining things... Could you please have a look at Sportrac and confirm that it is showing nonsense about Matt Milano's dead cap in 2025 and 2026?

 

Besided his normal numbers he has another row just with some dead money ($2,586,000), which are apparently last two years of prorated signing bonus restructured in 2022. These were originally void years, but in 2023 they were "covered" by extension so this dead cap should dissappear and become part of his regular cap hit. Therefore, those 2025 and 2026 dead caps should not be there, and his only dead cap is $4,889,000 in 2027 (void year for another signing + option bonuses), right?

 

In other words, we actually have more cap space in 2025 ($35,319,356 + $2,586,000), right?

 

 

Are you talking about the $1,293,000 figures that are listed each year from 2023-2026? The ones that say "restructure" above them? That's what it is. It was salary that was turned into bonus in 2023 and spread out over the years until 2026. Yes it was supposed to be dead cap, but that was only if the contract voided and accelerated all that cap to 2024.

 

And yes the new cap kept the contract from voiding so those figures never became actual dead cap. But they're still real figures. Instead of becoming dead cap after the contract would void, the contract years became real years and the prorated restructure charges just stayed where they were - $1,293,000 each year through 2026.

 

They're not phantom numbers. It's a real charge to the cap. But it never became actual "dead cap" because dead cap is a cap charge for a player who's no longer under contract. Since he's still under contract those figures just stayed where they always were - prorated cap charge for the 2023 restructure.

 

When we see a dead cap charge on Spotrac for a player who's actually still under contract, that isn't really a dead cap figure yet. It's just Spotrac listing the figure as dead cap because that's what's expected to happen when a contract with void years actually voids. If a new contract is reached and the void years don't void, the dead cap charge doesn't disappear in real life because it was never there as dead cap in real life. It just disappears off Spotrac because they were listing it as dead cap even though it technically wasn't yet.

[Beck Water]

5 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Sporttrac has our rookie pool at nearly 11.5 million.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap/

 

First off, I would not bet Beane won't be wheeling and dealing some of those picks.  So expect the pool to change.

 

Second, until we need to cut to 53 just before the season opens, we only need top-51.  So the amount of cap needed for rookie pool will be cut down because  they will bump lower paid FA and vets out of the top 51.

6 hours ago, Westside said:

How did our cap situation get so screwed up? How many rookies are they counting on to start because of the cap situation? 

 

Our cap situation got screwed up because Beane counted on Tre White to continue as a lockdown corner and a cornerstone on our roster, but Tre got hurt for the last 2 years; he also "shot his shot" on trading for/re-signing Diggs then recruiting Von Miller, only to see him go on season ending reserve one year, and come back as a ghost of himself this season.

 

Honorable mention goes to inadequate DL performance from our own guys, thus the need to back-fill with FA signings.

[Niagara Dude]

20 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't know what Miami is thinking, but I don't think of it that way.   Yes, for any other position, the question is whether the player is worth the money.  That is, if you're talking about a linebacker, is he the best LB in the league, and what does the best LB cost?  Or is he the 10th best, and what's 10th best worth?  If he's depth and he's the 50th best LB, what is that worth.  

 

But for QB, I think the question is different.  I think to a great extent, if you don't have a true franchise QB, you don't have anything.   That is, I'm not interested in paying 10th best money to the 10th best QB, because the 10th best QB isn't a franchise QB.   If I have the 10th best QB, I'm still looking for my QB.   It's the position Washington was in and Minnesota now is in with Cousins.   

 

So, from my point of view, Miami's question is whether they believe Tua is their franchise QB.   If he is, then sign him up at whatever cost.   If he isn't, signing him to a mid- to high- contract is a mistake, because they'll be stuck with that contract when they decide to move on from him in a year or two or three.  

"Insist" may be too strong a word, but I would be amazed if Beane and McDermott haven't talked about WR with Allen.  They certainly would like his input about what kind of receiver Allen sees as helping.  And to some extent I'm sure Allen is saying to them, "Just figure out who we need to win."   It's not like Allen's priority is a 5000-yard season or 50 TD passes.  He wants to win the Super Bowl, and if they can win the Super Bowl running 35 QB sneaks a game, Allen will sign up for it. 

I prefer he not be doing 2-3 QB sneaks a game and just get back to the offence we had a few season ago where we just outscored teams.  Not interested in these 12-13 play 7-8 min drives. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

We are going in the wrong direction lol.  We went from 12 to 14 million overnight.

 

Beane should be making some moves today.

Edited March 9 by SoonerBillsFan

[BuffaloBill]

13 hours ago, Westside said:

How did our cap situation get so screwed up? How many rookies are they counting on to start because of the cap situation? 

 

I don’t believe the cap situation is “screwed up.”  Josh is a big number that the Bills have to work around.  The Bills also got “old” in NFL years and they are having to shed that age and expense.  Finally, the Bills put big money on Von and got about a halfish season out of him.

 

The Bills are making moves to get younger.  The Chiefs did the same thing.   

[SCBills]

33 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

I don’t believe the cap situation is “screwed up.”  Josh is a big number that the Bills have to work around.  The Bills also got “old” in NFL years and they are having to shed that age and expense.  Finally, the Bills put big money on Von and got about a halfish season out of him.

 

The Bills are making moves to get younger.  The Chiefs did the same thing.   

Our cap is ok given the moves we’ve now made.  Beane’s drafting in recent years will help lessen the blow.  Now he just needs to nail this upcoming one.

 

The Diggs, Von & Tre contracts are tough.. because all of them have big cap hits and none of them played as we expected them to last year:  Diggs as an elite WR1, Von as an elite pass rusher and Tre as a lockdown corner. 
 

Then you add in all the money & picks constantly spent on DL and a guy like Knox, who is just a weird situation now given the Kincaid pick.. and that’s how we got here.   Again, not in a bad position, but a slightly uncomfortable one with a day like Wednesday & another, likely, non-splashy FA period being necessary.