Joe B's all-22 take on Spencer Brown

[BillsDad51]

Joe Buscaglia had this to say about Brown in his review of the Chiefs game:

 

"ever since the Bills returned from their bye week, Brown has been the best player of the starting five and one of their best players, period. He put together another impressive performance against the Chiefs, controlling his one-on-ones and proving to be a force as a run blocker. Since the bye week, Brown carried a 3.29 GPA over the final seven games. He went from having the lowest season GPA of the offensive line at 2.67, to passing left guard Connor McGovern and nearly passing both right guard O’Cyrus Torrence and center Mitch Morse for the year with the post-bye stretch. With how he finished the season, he’s a clear building block for the offensive line moving forward and should he have a good beginning in 2024, he likely will be a consideration for a long-term extension by the team."

 

Here's the link to full Athletic article.

 

https://theathletic.com/5230370/2024/01/26/buffalo-bills-offseason-chiefs-playoffs-stefon-diggs/

[Success]

Another guy who just needed some time.

 

Seems to be a theme w/ a lot of the Bills' younger players.

 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

The Spencer Brown reviews from this season have all been phenomenal. 

[Einstein]

Spencer Brown played a lot better starting after the bye week. But his pass blocking is still not great. Josh Allen makes up for a lot of his issues.

 

He allowed 17 QB pressures, 13 hurries and 3 sacks over the final 6 weeks.

 

So, he was better, no doubt, but still not great. And the idea that he was best player on the line is a complete joke though. Joe Buscaglia has jumped the shark.

 

 

Edited January 28 by Einstein

[RunTheBall]

We have a number of players like Brown and Bernard who prove beyond a doubt that the majority of this board has zero understanding of player development or the patience to see it happen

[Doc]

So that takes care of the right side of the OL.  Now the question is what to do with Morse?

[Roundybout]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

So that takes care of the right side of the OL.  Now the question is what to do with Morse?

Draft his replacement in round 2-3 and see if we can’t get a season or two out of Morse, or trade him to a rebuilding team. He’s probably worth a 3 or 4

[SCBills]

This year has done a lot to validate Beane as a top tier drafting GM. 
 

He has misses, but even the best do.

 

As we move forward, he may need to focus a bit more on immediate contributors, because we can’t really afford to have Top 100 draft picks taking multiple years to become above average contributors. 
 

A two year wait for a fixture at RT for the foreseeable future is certainly worth it.

 

Just need to mix those developmental picks in with some more immediate impact guys moving forward. 

[Dubie54]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

So that takes care of the right side of the OL.  Now the question is what to do with Morse?

Definitely need to pick up a center in maybe 4/5th rounds that can take his spot. I think it would be good to see Morse another year and maybe more of Bates in the center spot and then groom a young kid in the meantime to take over in '25.

[Doc]

35 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Draft his replacement in round 2-3 and see if we can’t get a season or two out of Morse, or trade him to a rebuilding team. He’s probably worth a 3 or 4

 

They'll need to reduce his cap hit and that means extension and kicking the can further down the road.  Cutting him saves $8.5M.  As for trading him, he'll be 32 before May.

Edited January 28 by Doc

[BADOLBILZ]

6 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Spencer Brown played a lot better starting after the bye week. But his pass blocking is still not great.

 

He allowed 17 QB pressures, 13 hurries and 3 sacks over the final 6 weeks.

 

So, he was better, but still not great. And the idea that he was best player on the line is a complete joke though. Joe Buscaglia has jumped the shark.

 

 

 

 

Great pass blocking at RT kinda' isn't a real thing in the NFL.

 

He's become a better player than Jawaan Taylor...........who got paid $20M aav last offseason coming off a worse year than Brown had this year.

 

I'm not predicting THAT kind of contract for Brown because his injury history and body type will raise enough concerns about durability..........but he's going to get PAID if he stays healthy next season...........because he's become a damn good RT relative to the rest of the RT's in the league.

[TheBeaneBandit]

8 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Draft his replacement in round 2-3 and see if we can’t get a season or two out of Morse, or trade him to a rebuilding team. He’s probably worth a 3 or 4

Not at his age. Maybe a 5 or a 6. As for Spencer Brown they may want to get on it sooner rather than later before the contract becomes crazy high. They could structure it where the cat doesn't get very large for a few years if done properly.

Edited January 28 by TheBeaneBandit

[Roundybout]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

They'll need to reduce his cap hit and that means extension and kicking the can further down the road.  Cutting him saves $8.5M.  Extending him  As for trading him, he'll be 32 before May.

Yeah but a lot of rebuilding teams could use a plug and play starter for a couple seasons. Panthers or Commanders, for instance. 

[ControllerOfPlanetX]

14 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Spencer Brown played a lot better starting after the bye week. But his pass blocking is still not great. Josh Allen makes up for a lot of his issues.

 

He allowed 17 QB pressures, 13 hurries and 3 sacks over the final 6 weeks.

 

So, he was better, but still not great. And the idea that he was best player on the line is a complete joke though. Joe Buscaglia has jumped the shark.

 

 

Spencer Brown’s agent must be talking to Joe.

[Einstein]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Great pass blocking at RT kinda' isn't a real thing in the NFL.

 

He's become a better player than Jawaan Taylor...........who got paid $20M aav last offseason coming off a worse year than Brown had this year.

 

I'm not predicting THAT kind of contract for Brown because his injury history and body type will raise enough concerns about durability..........but he's going to get PAID if he stays healthy next season...........because he's become a damn good RT relative to the rest of the RT's in the league.

 

There is very little doubt in my mind that they extend him at some point. As you pointed out, there is simply very little in the way of quality  tackles available.

[julian]

9 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Spencer Brown played a lot better starting after the bye week. But his pass blocking is still not great. Josh Allen makes up for a lot of his issues.

 

He allowed 17 QB pressures, 13 hurries and 3 sacks over the final 6 weeks.

 

So, he was better, but still not great. And the idea that he was best player on the line is a complete joke though. Joe Buscaglia has jumped the shark.

 

 

It’s ok to be wrong on a player, don’t dig in for the sake of ego, Brown is obviously on the upswing and with his physical traits and mean attitude his ceiling is higher than any lineman on the roster.

 

 Nobody is saying he’s been perfect or was a pro bowler, people are just pointing out that those who decided he couldn’t become a legit building block were wrong and if you’re a Bills fan and you wrote Brown off you should be excited to be wrong.

 

 Brown and OCyrus have an opportunity to become one of the best right sides in all of football moving into year 2 together.

[Einstein]

Just now, julian said:

It’s ok to be wrong on a player, don’t dig in for the sake of ego,

 

lol what!?

 

I said he has played better recently but his pass blocking is still an issue. I then gave detailed and specific stats that show that his pass blocking issues remain.

 

Sometimes I feel that posters don’t actually read what they are responding to.

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

Spencer Brown’s agent must be talking to Joe.

 

Probably happens a lot more than fans want to believe.

 

The primary way that reporters get new info and leads is the quid pro quo between the player/agent and the reporter.

[julian]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

 

lol what!?

 

I said he has played better recently but his pass blocking is still an issue. I then gave detailed and specific stats that show that his pass blocking issues remain.

 

Sometimes I feel that posters don’t actually read what they are responding to.

 

 

 

 

Probably happens a lot more than fans want to believe.

 

The primary way that reporters get new info and leads is the quid pro quo between the player/agent and the reporter.

I was referring to any and all fans, not just you and in fact I had no idea what your previous stance was with Brown but obviously you much like myself were still saying it was too early to say one way or another if he was the long term answer at RG. 
 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

 

lol what!?

 

I said he has played better recently but his pass blocking is still an issue. I then gave detailed and specific stats that show that his pass blocking issues remain.

 

Sometimes I feel that posters don’t actually read what they are responding to.

 

 

 

 

Yeah but I think the point is that expectations of Brown were unrealistic and his progress was not being measured against other similar RT's.

 

It usually takes experienced college lineman several years to become a non-liability on the OL.

 

Brown entered the league having played very little in college and having played 7 man football in HS.  

 

His progression, thru injury,  has been fairly impressive.

 

[MWK]

34 minutes ago, RunTheBall said:

We have a number of players like Brown and Bernard who prove beyond a doubt that the majority of this board has zero understanding of player development or the patience to see it happen

 

Everyone was right on Gabe Davis

[HappyDays]

I wouldn't re-sign him next offseason unless he gives us a big hometown discount. Nothing to do with Spencer Brown the player, we just don't have the luxury of giving big contracts out to non-premium positions like RT while paying a franchise QB contract. Keep drafting RTs in rounds 2-7 and always have a pipeline of young talent there. I worry Beane will feel the need to extend him to highlight him as a draft success.

[Doc]

28 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Yeah but a lot of rebuilding teams could use a plug and play starter for a couple seasons. Panthers or Commanders, for instance. 

 

I'd explore it but I would bet Morse would retire if he were about to be traded.

[SoonerBillsFan]

For the 1st time in a long time, we can say going into this offseason, we have a really good OL.  Torrance will get better.  I want to see some more quality depth added and start looking at a replacement for after the 2024 season at Center.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Einstein said:

 

There is very little doubt in my mind that they extend him at some point. As you pointed out, there is simply very little in the way of quality  tackles available.

 

 

I have my doubts that they extend him.  

 

This is a good offensive tackle draft class.

 

I can see them drafting one and going back to the drawing board with a 2nd year 3rd-4th round pick battling Richard Gouraige for the RT job in 2025.

 

I've probably always been more appreciative of Brown's progress than most and would love for him to eventually reach his athletic ceiling and become an Andrew Whitworth type and play a long career with Buffalo.......but I question his durability and more importantly the Bills have cap issues and you simply do not need an excellent RT to win a championship, IMO.

 

 

[Mynamemike]

1 hour ago, Success said:

Another guy who just needed some time.

 

Seems to be a theme w/ a lot of the Bills' younger players.

 

We sure love drafting big physical freaks and when they are coached right and allowed to develop it’s great.  Hopefully Groot takes a big leap next year too.  

[No_Matter_What]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

I wouldn't re-sign him next offseason unless he gives us a big hometown discount. Nothing to do with Spencer Brown the player, we just don't have the luxury of giving big contracts out to non-premium positions like RT while paying a franchise QB contract. Keep drafting RTs in rounds 2-7 and always have a pipeline of young talent there. I worry Beane will feel the need to extend him to highlight him as a draft success.

I am not sure about Brown but I fully agree with the idea behind it. Beane has shown some ability to let guys go, but he need to be a little bit more ruthless at times imo. Let Davis and AJ go, let Brown go if need be.

[3rdand12]

3 hours ago, Doc said:

So that takes care of the right side of the OL.  Now the question is what to do with Morse?

get a bigger body in there, and just as smart. ASAP

no offense to Morse

2 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

For the 1st time in a long time, we can say going into this offseason, we have a really good OL.  Torrance will get better.  I want to see some more quality depth added and start looking at a replacement for after the 2024 season at Center.

Takes all five. Brown getting his game on , and next to Torrance ? Yea Buddy !

[MrEpsYtown]

I told you guys Brown was gonna be good! I’m wrong a lot so I will take this slight victory! Much improved this year. 

[OldTimer1960]

3 hours ago, SCBills said:

This year has done a lot to validate Beane as a top tier drafting GM. 
 

He has misses, but even the best do.

 

As we move forward, he may need to focus a bit more on immediate contributors, because we can’t really afford to have Top 100 draft picks taking multiple years to become above average contributors. 
 

A two year wait for a fixture at RT for the foreseeable future is certainly worth it.

 

Just need to mix those developmental picks in with some more immediate impact guys moving forward. 

Some (a lot?) of that wait with Brown was due to his back injury that prevented him from training in 2022 offseason and missed most of 2022 camp.  Really a lost season even though he played.

[freddyjj]

9 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

 

3 hours ago, Doc said:

So that takes care of the right side of the OL.  Now the question is what to do with Morse?

get a bigger body in there, and just as smart. ASAP

no offense to Morse

 

From last preseason it appears OBD sees Ryan Bates or Alec Anderson as their next OC.  In his post season locker room interview, Morse expressed an interest in playing one more year. 

[Roundybout]

He played every game this season, why are we worried about his durability? The back injury was a freak thing last year. 

[Aussie Joe]

Let’s see him do it again.. but if he does… im not going to have a problem paying him…. You got to invest in the OL…

 

Im ok with paying 3 of the 5 guys on the OL provided the other 2 are on rookie deals ,.,, find a C in the draft that can start in 2025 …

 

Also … Dawkins and McGovern are not overpaid …

 

Edited January 28 by Aussie Joe

[Doc]

8 minutes ago, freddyjj said:

From last preseason it appears OBD sees Ryan Bates or Alec Anderson as their next OC.  In his post season locker room interview, Morse expressed an interest in playing one more year. 

 

Yeah I can see Bates or Anderson taking over.  The cap savings from cutting Morse is too tempting. 

[finn]

3 hours ago, Success said:

Another guy who just needed some time.

 

Seems to be a theme w/ a lot of the Bills' younger players.

 

Bernard, Oliver, and Dane Jackson, for sure. Hopefully Elam and Dorian Williams, too. The glaring exception is Gabe Davis. 

[BigAl2526]

4 hours ago, Success said:

Another guy who just needed some time.

 

Seems to be a theme w/ a lot of the Bills' younger players.

 

The Bills drafted Brown in the second round.  If you're not drafting in the first round, you're going to be getting something less than a complete prospect.  In the case of Brown, the Bills drafted for traits.  They got a tall, athletic tackle who has very long arms.  He lacked the polish from playing in a big time college program.  They might have been able to draft a player with better experience in place of Brown, but they probably would have had to sacrifice something - size or athleticism, if not both.  

[K-9]

Not surprised in the least. His problem has been a recurring issue with his back, but when healthy, he can dominate. And he’s got that mean streak you love to see in an offensive lineman. 

[Aussie Joe]

2 minutes ago, BigAl2526 said:

The Bills drafted Brown in the second round.  If you're not drafting in the first round, you're going to be getting something less than a complete prospect.  In the case of Brown, the Bills drafted for traits.  They got a tall, athletic tackle who has very long arms.  He lacked the polish from playing in a big time college program.  They might have been able to draft a player with better experience in place of Brown, but they probably would have had to sacrifice something - size or athleticism, if not both.  

They drafted him at pick 90 or so… at the end of the third