PSE has been "Dissolved"

[The Jokeman]

Just now, Shemp said:

The Beijing Bills?

to go with the Beijing Katanas. 

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, boyst said:

he's been quietly shopping the sabres for a while i have heard. this might make it easier.

 

Highly unlikely a person who has been "shopping" a team would undertake a project the size and scope of which the upgrades to Key Bank Center will likely entail, which are planned to take "years" to complete as much of the work will be done during the offseason, which is about to get a lot shorter starting next year.

 

I'll chalk this up in the bar talk coming from a friend of a friend of a cousin's sister's friend category

Edited August 28, 2023 by Big Turk

[noacls]

32 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

No way Buffalo loses the Sabres.  The league knows Buffalo is one of the best hockey towns in the NHL.

Quebec says Hi!

[Mango]

10 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I would say that is part of it.  The other is time management with Kim being in her challenges.

 

IMO, Terry would give up all the other entities that were under PSE before giving up the Bills and Sabres, and there are a bunch of them.

 

Somebody on Sabrespace noted that Terry didn't attend the RJ Behind the Mic night. 

On one hand you want to be salty. On the other hand they have a lot going on at home. You almost root for the saltiness of it all because the opposite side of the coin means maybe Kim isn't doing great. Something nobody wants to hear. 

[Warriorspikes51]

2 minutes ago, noacls said:

Quebec says Hi!

There have been multiple chances to put a team back there and the league has shown no interest in it.

[May Day 10]

2 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Really? It seems pretty nice and clean to me? 

 

Its 27 years old now.  There has never been any significant renovation, which technically makes it about the oldest arena in the league.  It is ugly/worn on the inside, the seats are decrepit and disgusting.   It was also built much cheaper than arenas around the same timeframe, and the cheapness shines through over time.

 

Most/all of its contemporaries 90s arenas have had major renovations in the hundreds of millions of dollars.

 

The seating bowl is a terrible design for site lines, the concourses (especially in the 300 level) are horrible, the bubble roof sucks the life out of the place, and the outside of it looks terrible (and worn/faded).  

 

It is going to need a decent sum of money, and the public ask will be coming.

 

 

[HIT BY SPIKES]

Just now, Warriorspikes51 said:

There have been multiple chances to put a team back there and the league has shown no interest in it.

 

The league or Gary?

[DrDawkinstein]

40 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

Guarantee that Terry will be going to the county and the state for the major part of the arena renovation.  Only problem….he can’t do it right now, after just receiving the handout for the new football stadium. 

 

"Hold my checkbook and watch this" -Terry, probably

 

They are two completely different items/issues. He not only can go ask, he pretty much has to.

 

The money he got for the Bills has nothing to do with this ask. If the teams had different owners like they have had in the past, the new Bills deal would not stop the Sabres owner from asking.

[BillStime]

This has more to do with Kim, her current capacity, and PSE being her baby than anything to do with the future of the Bills/Sabres.

 

 

[Warriorspikes51]

7 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

 

Its 27 years old now.  There has never been any significant renovation, which technically makes it about the oldest arena in the league.  It is ugly/worn on the inside, the seats are decrepit and disgusting.   It was also built much cheaper than arenas around the same timeframe, and the cheapness shines through over time.

 

Most/all of its contemporaries 90s arenas have had major renovations in the hundreds of millions of dollars.

 

The seating bowl is a terrible design for site lines, the concourses (especially in the 300 level) are horrible, the bubble roof sucks the life out of the place, and the outside of it looks terrible (and worn/faded).  

 

It is going to need a decent sum of money, and the public ask will be coming.

 

 

Yes there was....they redid multiple level concourses, the ribbon boards, video boards, scoreboard, etc
 

That being said.....they are planning upgrades
 

 

"To coin a hockey term, expect multi-year changes on the fly at KeyBank Center.

Fans attending Buffalo Sabres games and other arena events are going to see immediate differences this season with upgrades in food and beverage, both in products and point-of-sale technology.

New Buffalo Sabres COO John Roth knows there's lots of work to be done on the franchise's business side

John Roth, the newly hired COO of the Buffalo Sabres and Pegula Sports & Entertainment, spoke to The Buffalo News in an exclusive interview. 

But other major items are coming on board starting in 2024, Sabres Chief Operating Officer John Roth revealed in an exclusive conversation with The Buffalo News.

The key takeaways the team is planning to address:

Replacing the arena’s main center-hung scoreboard for the ‘24-’25 season, upgrading a board that dates to 2007 and has fallen far behind its counterparts across the NHL. At 22 feet by 12.6 feet, its video display is one of the five smallest in the league.

Addressing and upgrading the arena’s sound system, studying the acoustics and the work of the lapendary panels that hang from the ceiling.

Replacing the arena’s roof, which is the original version dating to the building’s 1996 opening

In succeeding years, addressing the seating bowl as the team may look to make major revisions to the 27-year-old building with an eye on gathering areas that have become popular in arenas and stadiums across the country."

https://buffalonews.com/sports/sabres/buffalo-sabres-keybank-center-new-scoreboard-2024-hockey-season/article_055f6402-4285-11ee-94e2-4b1f1843e36a.html
 

Edited August 28, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[boyst]

23 minutes ago, Logic said:

Don't even get me started on them. They're complete *****. Territorial, invasive, and destructive. 😡🤬

[Simon]

1 minute ago, boyst said:

Don't even get me started on them. They're complete *****. Territorial, invasive, and destructive. 😡🤬

 

You forgot "delicious"

 

 

[Doc]

23 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

to go with the Beijing Katanas. 

 

Hatori Hanzo?

[CountDorkula]

26 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

 

Its 27 years old now.  There has never been any significant renovation, which technically makes it about the oldest arena in the league.  It is ugly/worn on the inside, the seats are decrepit and disgusting.   It was also built much cheaper than arenas around the same timeframe, and the cheapness shines through over time.

 

Most/all of its contemporaries 90s arenas have had major renovations in the hundreds of millions of dollars.

 

The seating bowl is a terrible design for site lines, the concourses (especially in the 300 level) are horrible, the bubble roof sucks the life out of the place, and the outside of it looks terrible (and worn/faded).  

 

It is going to need a decent sum of money, and the public ask will be coming.

 

 

I thought They already tried to bill like 200 something mil when the Bills stadium was proposed IIRC to cover upgrades. 
 

state said no. 
 

I’ll see if I can find it

[wjag]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

I could see him doing that in the past, but the team is on the cusp of the playoffs this year.

 

Edit: Why the laughing emoji, Dillenger4?  Do I smell a wager?

I was in a casino and asked the book what the odds on the Sabres winning the Stanley Cup. I was told +4000. So I put 10 bucks on it.  When my son approached and asked me what I bet I told him 10 on Bills to win AFC East and 10 on Sabres to win it all.  He asked if I was throwing my 10 bucks away.  I said probably not going to win it all.  To which the bookie replied simply “Not going to happen.” 😀

[K-9]

56 minutes ago, WotAGuy said:

If Terry is looking for cash, he needs to hit up @Einstein   Have you seen that dude’s tax return?  🤑

I heard Einstein went broke buying all those cooking lessons for his wife. 

[LabattBlue]

37 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

"Hold my checkbook and watch this" -Terry, probably

 

They are two completely different items/issues. He not only can go ask, he pretty much has to.

 

The money he got for the Bills has nothing to do with this ask. If the teams had different owners like they have had in the past, the new Bills deal would not stop the Sabres owner from asking.

IMO…I don’t expect to see a request for county and state assistance for a major rehab to KBC until 2025 or 2026.  Only time will tell.

[Doc]

11 minutes ago, wjag said:

I was in a casino and asked the book what the odds on the Sabres winning the Stanley Cup. I was told +4000. So I put 10 bucks on it.  When my son approached and asked me what I bet I told him 10 on Bills to win AFC East and 10 on Sabres to win it all.  He asked if I was throwing my 10 bucks away.  I said probably not going to win it all.  To which the bookie replied simply “Not going to happen.” 😀

 

Never say never.  I think it was a worthwhile wager.  Probably not even enough for a drink at said casino, and you have no chance of making any money off of one of those...

[HIT BY SPIKES]

37 minutes ago, boyst said:

Don't even get me started on them. They're complete *****. Territorial, invasive, and destructive. 😡🤬

 

And abusive as well?

 

Damn.

 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

The fact that the team is on the cusp probably makes them more attractive to potential buyers as well as fan interest being back up compared to the past decade.

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

55 minutes ago, HIT BY SPIKES said:

 

The league or Gary?

 

Both. QC is not getting a team.

[HIT BY SPIKES]

2 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

 

Not any other city but certainly many other cities including Quebec City, Hamilton, a suburb of Toronto, Hartford,  a suburb of Chicago, etc.

 

Not every city.

 

If I were a Sabres Fan, I would worship the ground that Gary walks on.

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

No way Buffalo loses the Sabres.  The league knows Buffalo is one of the best hockey towns in the NHL.

 

Yes way. We have the highest ratings for the NHL, but the number of actual viewers is still dwarfed by any other market.

[HIT BY SPIKES]

5 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

 

Both. QC is not getting a team.

 

Never?

 

Have you looked at the growth prospects of Quebec City v the City of Buffalo?

 

Kinda going in different directions.

[PromoTheRobot]

Just now, HIT BY SPIKES said:

 

Not any other city but certainly many other cities including Quebec City, Hamilton, a suburb of Toronto, Hartford,  a suburb of Chicago, etc.

 

Not every city.

 

If I were a Sabres Fan, I would worship the ground that Gary walks on.

 

I had to check. Sabres are actually worth $610MM according to Forbes! A 22% increase in one season!

3 minutes ago, HIT BY SPIKES said:

 

Never?

 

Have you looked at the growth prospects of Quebec City v the City of Buffalo?

 

Kinda going in different directions.

 

 

[HappyCat]

2 hours ago, Dick_Cheney said:

That's true, but also I wouldn't blame him if he just wanted to pare things down a bit on account of everything with Kim. Not easy running two organizations and also dealing with her situation on top of it all.

The record label and concerts were part of Kim's duties.  She pushed it hard.  I can see Terry having little interest w/o Kim.

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

 

Key Bank lease expires in 2025.  Pegula has time to get things together plus I bet the county would add years if needed.

 

I guess a question to ask is, is Key Bank viable to staying open without the Sabres and possibly without the Bandits?

[4th&long]

A lot of speculation in here. Maybe he just realized it was a bad idea and losing money? 

[PromoTheRobot]

4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Key Bank lease expires in 2025.  Pegula has time to get things together plus I bet the county would add years if needed.

 

I guess a question to ask is, is Key Bank viable to staying open without the Sabres and possibly without the Bandits?

 

Hard to say. There's still concerts and stuff. But the building gets used at least 100 dates a year now.

[ColoradoBills]

1 minute ago, 4th&long said:

A lot of speculation in here. Maybe he just realized it was a bad idea and losing money? 

 

Terry bought the Sabres for $189M and it's worth over $600M.  He has also had possible net yearly revenues with maybe the exception of Covid

years.  Team is on the rise again and fans will go back to their seats.  He is not losing money owning the Sabres.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, 4th&long said:

A lot of speculation in here. Maybe he just realized it was a bad idea and losing money? 

 

Define losing money. Operating loss? Sabres: Probably. Bills: no way. In the meantime both franchises tripled in value.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Buy low, sell high. 
 

The NHL is obviously stupid. They just can’t sell the product effectively. 
 

id take the $ and run. 

[May Day 10]

27 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

 

Both. QC is not getting a team.

 

The Sabres' lease is up in 2025.  

 

The 'good' news is the NHL doesn't have many other places to go at this point.  They probably really want to hit Houston and maybe Atlanta, but I wonder if that will just be another round of expansion.  

 

And I agree.  No way the league expands to or agrees to relocate a team to Quebec City.  Almost no shot at any additional Canadian teams

Edited August 28, 2023 by May Day 10

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Buy low, sell high. 
 

The NHL is obviously stupid. They just can’t sell the product effectively. 
 

id take the $ and run. 

 

 You need to explain this. The last expansion fee was $650MM. If that's stupid, sign me up.

[MJS]

26 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

My worry is the Sabres are worth 2X-3X more in any other city. I don't know what their lease situation is but I bet they aren't as tied down as the Bills are. (And the Bills aren't even that tied down when you really look at it.)

 

Both. QC is not getting a team.

The Bills are building a new stadium as we speak. They are tied down.

[PromoTheRobot]

6 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

 

The Sabres' lease is up in 2025.  

 

The 'good' news is the NHL doesn't have many other places to go at this point.  They probably really want to hit Houston and maybe Atlanta, but I wonder if that will just be another round of expansion.  

 

The NHL prefers expansion to relocation because expansion comes with a fat fee that was $500MM (Vegas) and $650MM (Seattle.) Houston and Atlanta (believe it or not) are being mentioned. Salt Lake City wants in as do Kansas City, Hartford and Quebec City. But as a Buffalo sports fan, I never relax and think our teams are set.

5 minutes ago, MJS said:

The Bills are building a new stadium as we speak. They are tied down.

 

Yes they are...kind of. Any attempt to move the team would incur an $850MM penalty.

 

But the Bills are worth around $4B right now. What would they be worth in, say, Toronto? $6B?  $5B for a Toronto NFL team sounds like a bargain.  Not saying that's gonna happen. Just that a $1B penalty isn't as big an obstacle as it sounds.

Edited August 28, 2023 by PromoTheRobot

[BillsFan4]

2 hours ago, wppete said:

Hmmm this is very interesting…. There is no way the Bills leave Buffalo after the stadium deal but can’t say the same for the Sabres. 

I don’t really see Gary Bettman allowing the Sabres to move. This area is consistently one of the strongest TV markets in the NHL. Bettman had an easy chance to move the Sabres when they declared bankruptcy and the league took over operations. But he fought to keep the team in Buffalo.

 

Look at how he’s stuck with the Arizona Coyotes despite terrible attendance for years and major arena issues, etc. They are currently playing in a 2000 seat college arena. Bettman doesn’t move teams easily.

 

Tom Golisano also apparently put some type of no-movement clause in the sale of the team.

 

https://www.espn.com/nhl/news/story?id=6087856

 

He took less money for the Sabres to ensure they never moved. Now, if Terry sells I don’t know if that clause would carry over but if it doesn’t I would hope it would be something Terry would ensure, especially with still being the owner of the Bills and a very sentimental Sabres fan.

 

 

This rumor about Pegula selling has been around for years. I’ve heard it would just be selling a minority stake in the team, but even that has been refuted. Im not sure how much stock I put into any of it anymore. I guess time will tell.

[PromoTheRobot]

2 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

They are currently playing in a 2000 seat college arena.

 

It's 5,000 but point taken. It's a joke.

[Yard Monkey]

8 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

….

But the Bills are worth around $4B right now. What would they be worth in, say, Toronto? $6B?  $5B for a Toronto NFL team sounds like a bargain.

Ha! Ask Jon Bon Jovi and Trump about that value 😆

[RiotAct]

2 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Deer Derry,

Ah beed wahn undred dow-zand dollarz.  Doze ahr yang-ee dollarz.

 

Yoorz drool-ee,

Mar-DEE BOO-rahn

lol.  I had to read that a few times, slowly, to understand what you… err, Marty… was saying

[May Day 10]

7 minutes ago, Yard Monkey said:

Ha! Ask Jon Bon Jovi and Trump about that value 😆

 

You also have to add in an NFL relocation fee as well as $ out of pocket to build a stadium.  It adds up.

 

I don't think the NFL will have an appetite to leave a city/state who just gave them nearly $1 Billion... at least within a couple decades.  That is bad business.  

 

 

 

Tim Graham just wrote about this in the Athletic.  

 

Basically said nothing indicates the Sabres are being sold (in fact, they just announced Pegula is pouring some money into the arena).  He seems to think this is just kind of cleaning up a lot of Kim Pegula's structure/excess she had with PSE and some of the staffing/redundancy.  

Edited August 28, 2023 by May Day 10