Hopkins released by Arizona (7/16: signed by Titans)

[Doc Brown]

Just now, Buffalo Junction said:

I certainly wouldn’t complain if he went to the NFC. Particularly if it was to a team that was in that second tier like NYG or Det. 

We play the Giants though.  Go to a team like the Saints or Panthers would be good with me.

[LABILLBACKER]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

I certainly wouldn’t complain if he went to the NFC. Particularly if it was to a team that was in that second tier like NYG or Det. 

Yes, either us or the NFC. 

F the Chiefs.

[newcam2012]

3 hours ago, Turbo44 said:

DHOP in a chiefs uniform makes them instantly better? Well yeah. Is there a team DHOP could sign with where he wouldn’t make the team better?

The point is that it's the Chiefs who happen to be defending champs. 

[purple haze]

13 minutes ago, dayman said:

A business where you get fired if you don’t win the Super Bowl. Especially when you have Allen as QB.

 

 Do it. It’s good for business

I’m all for it.  My point was DHop ain’t coming for dirt cheap.   It’s a business for him too.  

[Warriorspikes51]

1 minute ago, purple haze said:

I’m all for it.  My point was DHop ain’t coming for dirt cheap.   It’s a business for him too.  

when your owner is willing to pay cash$$$, it’s a lot easier to find a way to make it work by both manipulating the cap and the player getting $$$

[BLizzyMeock]

22 minutes ago, Merle said:

Actually, I don't think that's quite true.   He won't be getting ANY "new money" from the Cardinals in 2023.   That 22 mil (or more) is what Arizona is on the hook for in "dead cap space" money for what they have already paid him in the past.   He made a LOT over the past 2 years, but he's not getting paid by them now (or in the future).

Pretty sure you are wrong.... Dead money for the NFL salary cap is guaranteed cash and bonuses for a player who no longer is on that particular team. The dead money comes from what the player was owed before the team decided to move on

[Augie]

31 minutes ago, purple haze said:

The money will have to be right. It’s a business.

 

Speaking of which, from the Card perspective what are they stuck with this year, and how does it affect future years? Does he have offsets with the Cards allowing them to reduce their expense?  Can he further screw them by taking a little less?  I know he wants hi$, but this is a guy burning bridges as only a guy at the end of his career can. He will retire with a mountain of money. A guy can dream….  🤷‍♂️

 

 

I’m not saying we NEED him, but if it worked out financially we’d still have competent WR’s even when someone gets a high ankle sprain or another guy pulls a hammy. I feel good about the young guys but they are a gamble, so it will be interesting. Beane isn’t perfect, but he’s got my trust. 

 

 

.

Edited May 27, 2023 by Augie

[Buffalo Junction]

15 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

We play the Giants though.  Go to a team like the Saints or Panthers would be good with me.

The flipside though is they probably wouldn’t poach Davis if they had Hopkins on a 2-3 year deal. 

14 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Yes, either us or the NFC. 

F the Chiefs.

And definitely F the Jets. Last thing I want is sports media jets hype to get more pervasively annoying. 

[purple haze]

8 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

when your owner is willing to pay cash$$$, it’s a lot easier to find a way to make it work by both manipulating the cap and the player getting $$$

Whatever it takes.   Can’t double Diggs and DHop.  I’m willing to pay the price with Terry’s money.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, MikePJ76 said:

My personal opinion after watching football for 40 years, Wide Receivers are never the missing piece and do not put teams over the top in winning championships.  All the wr trades and big signings through the years and very few have resulted in championships.  

 

High end wr who were released traded and never won a championship

 

Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, Chris Carter, Joey Galloway, Antonio Brown, Brandon Marshall, andre rison, Roy Williams, etc. etc.

 

Its usually the guys in the trenches who make the biggest differences and the WR are usually home grown on the championship teams.  I would be really careful about giving money to an older wr who is expecting to come in and automatically win just because.  Teams with those types of guys always seemingly get beat in the playoffs.  

 

 

AJ Brown was a missing piece for the Eagles last season.    They narrowly lost the SB but that acquisition changed them from a wild-card-round-losing type of team to a #1 seed SB team.

 

The year before OBJ rounded into form about 13 months post ACL surgery and was great in the playoffs and the disappointing regular season Rams won a SB where he was trending to be the SB MVP before tearing his ACL.

 

 "40 years" is just way, way too far to go back and use as a gauge.     For about half of the past 40 years who your RB was actually mattered........which is almost an absurd notion today.  There are a lot of things that were a certain way for much of that period that are largely irrelevant to how the game is played now.  

[Warriorspikes51]

1 minute ago, purple haze said:

Whatever it takes.   Can’t double Diggs and DHop.  I’m willing to pay the price with Terry’s money.

not to mention Kincaid will be open all the time

The cap is going to keep going up.

We can find a way to make this work without “having a tear down”

[purple haze]

3 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Speaking of which, from the Card perspective what are they stuck with this year, and how does it affect future years? Does he have offsets with the Cards allowing them to reduce their expense?  Can he further screw them by taking a little less?  I know he wants hi$, but this is a guy burning bridges as only a guy at the end of his career can. He will retire with a mountain of money. A guy can dream….  🤷‍♂️

 

 

I’m not saying we NEED him, but if it worked out financially we’d still have competent WR’s even when someone gets a high ankle sprain or another guy pulls a hammy. I feel good about the young guys but they are a gamble, so it will be interesting. Beane isn’t perfect, but he’s got my trust. 

 

 

.

The Cards have a 22 million dead cap hit this year.  I don’t think there’s any way to lessen that because he’s not a post June 1st cut.  If he were it would be 11 million this year and next. They chose to get it over with.

 

I want DHop because teams can’t double him and Diggs.  If they did Knox, Kincaid and Cook would go berserk.

3 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

not to mention Kincaid will be open all the time

The cap is going to keep going up.

We can find a way to make this work without “having a tear down”

Knox and Cook too.

[arcadia bob]

Hello all for what's it worth I have a friend that's good friends with DH business manager He does not have an agent, and he was told that DH has been talking to about 6 gms and that he will take a few days to take everything in then decide on who he will talk contract with. He thought he may be released but not today.  His BM is out of the country.... I'm sure that will change soon.BM said he will be looking for a 2year minimum, never said anything about money. Just sharing...

[Warriorspikes51]

 

[Don Otreply]

41 minutes ago, BLizzyMeock said:

Pretty sure you are wrong.... Dead money for the NFL salary cap is guaranteed cash and bonuses for a player who no longer is on that particular team. The dead money comes from what the player was owed before the team decided to move on

According to Cover 1. Greg T, you are incorrect.

[FluffHead]

21 minutes ago, arcadia bob said:

Hello all for what's it worth I have a friend that's good friends with DH business manager He does not have an agent, and he was told that DH has been talking to about 6 gms and that he will take a few days to take everything in then decide on who he will talk contract with. He thought he may be released but not today.  His BM is out of the country.... I'm sure that will change soon.BM said he will be looking for a 2year minimum, never said anything about money. Just sharing...

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/03/09/after-going-it-alone-for-a-while-deandre-hopkins-hired-an-agent-again/amp/

[Capco]

46 minutes ago, BLizzyMeock said:

Pretty sure you are wrong.... Dead money for the NFL salary cap is guaranteed cash and bonuses for a player who no longer is on that particular team. The dead money comes from what the player was owed before the team decided to move on

I'm not 100% sure myself, but I think he's at least in the ballpark.  As I understand it, the concept of dead money is simply that every dollar paid to a player has to be allocated against the salary cap eventually, one way or another, even if that player is no longer on the roster.  

For example, a deal can be structured so that a player gets paid $10 million in real, actual dollars in Year 1, but his Year 1 cap hit is only $5 million.  If that player gets cut after Year 1, the team will have $5 million in dead money.  That is because the player was already paid $10 million, but only $5 million has been counted against the cap so far.  The other $5 million has to be accounted for, and so the team will carry a $5 million dead cap hit in Year 2.  The player doesn't actually have to receive any real, actual dollars from the team in Year 2 for there to be dead money counted against Year 2's salary cap.  

Edited May 27, 2023 by Capco

[BillsFanForever19]

Ya know, if we would have kept this to THE DeAndre Hopkins thread, it would have been over 300 by now. Here's hoping the mods merge.

[FluffHead]

16 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

Ya know, if we would have kept this to THE DeAndre Hopkins thread, it would have been over 300 by now. Here's hoping the mods merge.

It’s all that’s holding this deal

up 

[arcadia bob]

Do know if he is still his agent,,,,Sorry if true i was told the wrong intel but I trust this guy maybe he's wrong

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

Git. Er. Dun. Don’t listen to the make believe capologists here. 

[1ManRaid]

9 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Then Cardinals are overtaking the Texans as the worst run NFL franchise followed closely by the Browns and the Jests   and no we cant afford it unless he wants to come ridiculously cheap..

 

So what you're saying is that DHop is a cancer who destroyed both the Texans and Cardinals.  Go ahead, sign with the Jets then lol.

[BillsFanForever19]

5 minutes ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

Git. Er. Dun. Don’t listen to the make believe capologists here. 

 

As I've said in another thread, it's great to want him here and figure out ways it could be done. But just because fans are comfortable with doing certain things and see a possible way to do it, doesn't mean Beane will be comfortable doing it and sees things the same way.

[Fan in Chicago]

55 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

I absolutely  loved this.  Let's make this happen.  Idc about mortgaging the future.  Make this our year,  go all in

[MiltonWaddams]

4 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

I absolutely  loved this.  Let's make this happen.  Idc about mortgaging the future.  Make this our year,  go all in

“This is not the way”

                      -Brandon Beane

[HappyDays]

Per my usual source, word for word from them - "The Bills are HEAVILY interested in DHop. It's already beyond a call being made. Work is being done."

 

Teams became aware that Hopkins would be released several days ago. Around that same time the Bills conducted an imaging review of Tre White's knee to make sure they would be comfortable tying themselves to his future in the event of a necessary restructure. White has performed very well at OTAs and the team is more confident than ever about his future.

 

That's all I have.

 

Edited May 27, 2023 by HappyDays

[Merle]

1 hour ago, BLizzyMeock said:

Pretty sure you are wrong.... Dead money for the NFL salary cap is guaranteed cash and bonuses for a player who no longer is on that particular team. The dead money comes from what the player was owed before the team decided to move on

I don't pretend to understand all the nuances of NFL contracts fully...  I was just going by a story I read in USA Today (who admittedly may have it wrong as well ...)

 

Analysis of why the Arizona Cardinals decided to release Deandre Hopkins

Quote

 Knowing the upcoming 2023 season is going to be a difficult one with Murray still months away from returning from a torn ACL and facing having to pay Hopkins $19.4 million this year and $14.9 million in 2024, it was no longer going to work.

...

Things unraveled to the point that it wasn’t going to happen here. The Cardinals knew it and that’s why they are willing to eat $22.6 million in dead cap money now to move on from Hopkins, clear $7.3 million in cap space this season, and continue with their rebuild.

 

[Thurman#1]

10 hours ago, The 9 Isles said:

Still can’t afford it. Moot. 

 

 

Yeah, this.

 

Unless he gives a hometown discount regardless of this not being his hometown.

 

I mean you always can.

 

But there are consequences that make it a bad idea in the current situation.

 

 

Edited May 27, 2023 by Thurman#1

[FluffHead]

4 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Yeah, this.

 

Unless he gives a hometown discount regardless of this not being his hometown.

When will you all realize there is always money in the banana stand? 

[Thurman#1]

33 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

I absolutely  loved this.  Let's make this happen.  Idc about mortgaging the future.  Make this our year,  go all in

 

 

This is our decade. Decade and a half. Going all in on this year, meaning sacrificing the future, is nuts.

[chongli]

59 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

Ya know, if we would have kept this to THE DeAndre Hopkins thread, it would have been over 300 by now. Here's hoping the mods merge.

 

Meanwhile, the thread about Hopkins on the Cardinals forum is just 10 pages.

[Thurman#1]

Just now, FluffHead said:

When will you all realize there is always money in the banana stand? 

 

 

Yeah, yeah, I do realize it.

 

There is always money left on the credit cards too. But the people who think that means it's a great idea to max out those cards because they can don't end up having successful financial lives.

 

There are always more shiny objects out there too. 

 

Always.

[FluffHead]

1 minute ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

This is our decade. Decade and a half. Going all in on this year, meaning sacrificing the future, is nuts.

You can reset any year at any time. When you have an elite qb, you go for it. The cap is malleable 

1 minute ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Yeah, yeah, I do realize it.

 

There is always money left on the credit cards too. But the people who think that means it's a great idea to max out those cards because they can don't end up having successful financial lives.

 

There are always more shiny objects out there too. 

 

Always.

I hope you’re currently saving for 4 christmases from now 

[BADOLBILZ]

11 minutes ago, MiltonWaddams said:

“This is not the way”

                      -Brandon Beane

 

 

Meh,  don't you know the "Beane is a wizard" movement is dead?   When it comes to UFA Beane is a total rando with an objectively terrible decision making track record.   When it comes to signing free agents save the wax.......just show us the baby Beane. 😉

[Cotton Fitzsimmons]

30 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

Per my usual source, word for word from them - "The Bills are HEAVILY invested in DHop. It's already beyond a call being made. Work is being done."

 

Teams became aware that Hopkins would be released several days ago. Around that same time the Bills conducted an imaging review of Tre White's knee to make sure they would be comfortable tying themselves to his future in the event of a necessary restructure. White has performed very well at OTAs and the team is more confident than ever about his future.

 

That's all I have.

If HAPPY DAYS says it you can take it to the bank. Thank you my good fellow!

[Warriorspikes51]

32 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

Per my usual source, word for word from them - "The Bills are HEAVILY invested in DHop. It's already beyond a call being made. Work is being done."

 

Teams became aware that Hopkins would be released several days ago. Around that same time the Bills conducted an imaging review of Tre White's knee to make sure they would be comfortable tying themselves to his future in the event of a necessary restructure. White has performed very well at OTAs and the team is more confident than ever about his future.

 

That's all I have.

this is fantastic news!!!! You / your source have a proven record of being right, and very recently!! Appreciate you sharing!

 

I wish we would extend DaQuan as well to free up more $

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

This is our decade. Decade and a half. Going all in on this year, meaning sacrificing the future, is nuts.

Signing D-Hop, unless were paying him something crazy, isn’t “mortgaging the future”… at least not while Josh Allen is here. 
 

What we will need to do is hit at a better rate on our impact draft picks moving forward.   The money to backfill if we don’t won’t likely be as available. 

[MikePJ76]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

AJ Brown was a missing piece for the Eagles last season.    They narrowly lost the SB but that acquisition changed them from a wild-card-round-losing type of team to a #1 seed SB team.

 

The year before OBJ rounded into form about 13 months post ACL surgery and was great in the playoffs and the disappointing regular season Rams won a SB where he was trending to be the SB MVP before tearing his ACL.

 

 "40 years" is just way, way too far to go back and use as a gauge.     For about half of the past 40 years who your RB was actually mattered........which is almost an absurd notion today.  There are a lot of things that were a certain way for much of that period that are largely irrelevant to how the game is played now.  

Yes the game is vastly different...I would make the case that the NFL today resembles college football about 15 years ago.  

 

anyway, I don't buy OBJ as any missing piece to that rams championship.  The piece they were missing was stafford.  They had the defense and the running game of a championship team and upgraded at qb.

 

AJ Brown does not have  championship.  He is no different than Randy Moss, Owens etc.  They did not get over the hump and win a championship because of them. 

 

The biggest change in the eagles last year was hurts terrific play, their outstanding offensive and a defensive line about 8 deep that was all over the quarterback.  

 

I would rather the bills have an excellent defense and an excellent running game than another superstar wr on the decline.  Give Allen a real running game and an excellent defense and he will take care of the rest. 

 

I just think chasing aging expensive wr is the wrong approach.  They have a great #1 and what looks to be a good cast around him on offense.  If the running game improves allen will make one of the other wr into above average players. 

[Special K]

18 minutes ago, FluffHead said:

When will you all realize there is always money in the banana stand? 

[Thurman#1]

1 hour ago, Capco said:

I'm not 100% sure myself, but I think he's at least in the ballpark.  As I understand it, the concept of dead money is simply that every dollar paid to a player has to be allocated against the salary cap eventually, one way or another, even if that player is no longer on the roster.  

For example, a deal can be structured so that a player gets paid $10 million in real, actual dollars in Year 1, but his Year 1 cap hit is only $5 million.  If that player gets cut after Year 1, the team will have $5 million in dead money.  That is because the player was already paid $10 million, but only $5 million has been counted against the cap so far.  The other $5 million has to be accounted for, and so the team will carry a $5 million dead cap hit in Year 2.  The player doesn't actually have to receive any real, actual dollars from the team in Year 2 for there to be dead money counted against Year 2's salary cap.  

 

 

Yeah, that's right. Particularly with already paid bonuses, (signing bonuses, roster bonuses and any other kind that they guy already received for future performance) must be taken away from the team's cap.

 

There's no way to pay a guy a bonus for future performance, have it not count against that year's cap, and then when he's cut have it not count against the cap in any year. Can't happen. With the exception of money the team's sue to get back if a guy retires or something and the team feels they've been deceived about the player's commitment and intent to finish up the contract.) Think Vontae Davis requiring at halftime and voluntarily coming to Beane and returning the unused part of his signing bonus voluntarily. But other than that, if you already gave the player the bonus, it MUST be accounted for on the cap in the next year or the next two years depending when it all goes down.

 

However, dead money also includes one other kind of money for guys who are cut rather than traded. If the team guaranteed future years of salary and then cuts rather than trades them, that same team is still on the hook for the guaranteed future salary, even if the guy isn't on the team.