RD 5, Pick 150: WR Justin Shorter, Florida

[Coach Tuesday]

6 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Sh

 

Someone made a point somewhere about big guys and agility drills. Both Shorter’s 3 cone and shuttle are bad scores but actually better than DK Metcalf. DK has Shorter easily beat in the 40, but that’s why Shorter is a 5th round pick. Shorter’s short shuttle is better than Tee Higgins as well. Almost every measure of Shorter’s is better than Higgins and I think that is a good comp. Plus Shorter has 15 lbs on him. Those scores have not affected Higgins’ career.
 

Big guys like Mike Williams, DJ Chark, Equanimous St. Brown and Chase Claypool skipped those drills. 
 

I think those numbers are super important especially for a slot guy, but in this case for a 5th rounder with upside, it doesn’t really bother me. If he had the great 3 cone and a better 40 he would have been a first round pick. 

Higgins is the comp I made upthread - that’s his ceiling, I think.

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Looks like he's on steroids. Reminds me of David Boston. 

 

It doesn’t seem to exhaust you. Quite remarkable, I must say. 

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Higgins is the comp I made upthread - that’s his ceiling, I think.

Makes a ton of sense. Good call

[Warriorspikes51]

Josh Gordon minus the weed.
 

Gordon actually ran a 4.52 40.

 

He played at a faster game speed in his prime years with Browns

 

 

[Maine-iac]

9 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Higgins is the comp I made upthread - that’s his ceiling, I think.

Speaking of Higgins that is why the Bengals took that kid from Princeton because they will have a hard time paying Higgins pretty soon.  I was really hoping we'd take Iosivas but given the time we spent with Shorter they must really like what they've seen.

[MrEpsYtown]

6 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Josh Gordon minus the weed.
 

Gordon actually ran a 4.52 40.

 

He played at a faster game speed in his prime years with Browns

 

 

He’s another guy who skipped the agility drills. But a strong comp as well. 

4 minutes ago, Maine-iac said:

Speaking of Higgins that is why the Bengals took that kid from Princeton because they will have a hard time paying Higgins pretty soon.  I was really hoping we'd take Iosivas but given the time we spent with Shorter they must really like what they've seen.

Yeah once they pay Burrow they will probably have to move on from Higgins, Boyd. That’s probably why they drafted Charlie Jones as well. Logan Wilson will

be a free agent as well and Myles Murphy probably replaces Trey Hendrickson after this season. 

[Maine-iac]

5 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Josh Gordon minus the weed.
 

Gordon actually ran a 4.52 40.

 

He played at a faster game speed in his prime years with Browns

 

 

You don't have to be super twitchy to run a good slant.  Gordon was a beast.  He even flashed with the Pats before he got caught again.

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Higgins is the comp I made upthread - that’s his ceiling, I think.

I can live with that

[SCBills]

11 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Higgins is the comp I made upthread - that’s his ceiling, I think.

Agreed.  
 

Higgins 6’4 218 4.54

 

Shorter 6’4 229 4.55

 

I’m not saying Shorter will definitely become that, but one guy played on a program in transition, with Anthony Richardson.   The other guy played at Clemson, with Trevor Lawrence. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

My favorite part about this pick is it shows it doesn’t matter what WR and what round, people will have unrealistic expectations for the WR

 

I don’t know why WRs do that to people. 

[Bruffalo]

He has a shot to make the team as a 4 phase special teamer.  If he does make the roster I doubt we see him taking many (or any) offensive snaps.

 

This is basically a super athletic Jake Kumerow on a rookie contract.  Lots of upside, but it's gonna be hard for him to see the field. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

My favorite part about this pick is it shows it doesn’t matter what WR and what round, people will have unrealistic expectations for the WR

 

I don’t know why WRs do that to people. 

if this guy was 6’0” 195 I don’t think we would have the hopeful expectations we do. A lot of it has to do with his physical attributes.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

if this guy was 6’0” 195 I don’t think we would have the hopeful expectations we do. A lot of it has to do with his physical attributes.

How big is Shakir?

[ddaryl]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

How big is Shakir?

 

6.0' 190lbs

[Shaw66]

16 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

if this guy was 6’0” 195 I don’t think we would have the hopeful expectations we do. A lot of it has to do with his physical attributes.

It's fun to dream but really, no one should be getting too excited about Shorter's prospects.   He isn't some unknown talent who's lived his life on a farm in Mongolia, where a roving Bills scout discovered him.   There ae 31 other teams who knew how big Shorter is and how fast he can run.  Everyone's evaluated him, and no one concluded that he's the next DK Metcalf or Higgins or Moulds.  

 

For me, Shorter is just like anyone else the Bills draft in later rounds:   I hope he makes it, and I hope he proves to be better than anyone expected, but I'll get excited when he does. 

[mannc]

10 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

It's fun to dream but really, no one should be getting too excited about Shorter's prospects.   He isn't some unknown talent who's lived his life on a farm in Mongolia, where a roving Bills scout discovered him.   There ae 31 other teams who knew how big Shorter is and how fast he can run.  Everyone's evaluated him, and no one concluded that he's the next DK Metcalf or Higgins or Moulds.  

 

For me, Shorter is just like anyone else the Bills draft in later rounds:   I hope he makes it, and I hope he proves to be better than anyone expected, but I'll get excited when he does. 

Thanks a lot.

[MrEpsYtown]

14 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

It's fun to dream but really, no one should be getting too excited about Shorter's prospects.   He isn't some unknown talent who's lived his life on a farm in Mongolia, where a roving Bills scout discovered him.   There ae 31 other teams who knew how big Shorter is and how fast he can run.  Everyone's evaluated him, and no one concluded that he's the next DK Metcalf or Higgins or Moulds.  

 

For me, Shorter is just like anyone else the Bills draft in later rounds:   I hope he makes it, and I hope he proves to be better than anyone expected, but I'll get excited when he does. 

Shaw isn’t this kind of true of all late round draft picks for all teams? That’s part of the fun of the draft is that you can dream on guys. That’s why we are fans. Shorter brings things to the table you can’t teach, and for whatever reason the Bills really like him, perhaps more than other teams. That’s just the way it is. 

He’s here now, he is ours, and we are going to root for him to succeed. 

Edited May 1, 2023 by MrEpsYtown

[SCBills]

14 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

It's fun to dream but really, no one should be getting too excited about Shorter's prospects.   He isn't some unknown talent who's lived his life on a farm in Mongolia, where a roving Bills scout discovered him.   There ae 31 other teams who knew how big Shorter is and how fast he can run.  Everyone's evaluated him, and no one concluded that he's the next DK Metcalf or Higgins or Moulds.  

 

For me, Shorter is just like anyone else the Bills draft in later rounds:   I hope he makes it, and I hope he proves to be better than anyone expected, but I'll get excited when he does. 

 

Oh, for sure.. I don't expect much from him this year aside from depth and special teams. 

 

That being said, our WR1 was a 5th Round Pick.  

 

Florida fans would tell you that their offense was a mess for the past few years, aside from the Trask/Pitts year.  Shorter has dealt with erratic QB play and injuries.  

 

I'm just glad we have a true outside WR to develop behind Diggs and Davis this year.   If he becomes a WR2 type or better, great... if he washes out of the league, so be it. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

51 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

How big is Shakir?

I see your point. Some people were pretty optimistic for Shakir last year. Coming in as a possible replacement for Beasley.

 

I know, for myself, had we drafted another 6 foot 190 pound wide receiver I would not be all that hopeful. It would just be another rinse and repeat draft pick. I like that this guy actually has elite size.

38 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

It's fun to dream but really, no one should be getting too excited about Shorter's prospects.   He isn't some unknown talent who's lived his life on a farm in Mongolia, where a roving Bills scout discovered him.   There ae 31 other teams who knew how big Shorter is and how fast he can run.  Everyone's evaluated him, and no one concluded that he's the next DK Metcalf or Higgins or Moulds.  

 

For me, Shorter is just like anyone else the Bills draft in later rounds:   I hope he makes it, and I hope he proves to be better than anyone expected, but I'll get excited when he does. 

we should hope be helpful that he’ll have spot moments this year. Davis was a fourth round pick and only selected 22 spots ahead of shorter.
 

Due to injuries Davis got a decent amount of playing time his rookie year. And Davis was even one of the heroes in the bills first playoff victory in 25 years.

[Shaw66]

4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Oh, for sure.. I don't expect much from him this year aside from depth and special teams. 

 

That being said, our WR1 was a 5th Round Pick.  

 

Florida fans would tell you that their offense was a mess for the past few years, aside from the Trask/Pitts year.  Shorter has dealt with erratic QB play and injuries.  

 

I'm just glad we have a true outside WR to develop behind Diggs and Davis this year.   If he becomes a WR2 type or better, great... if he washes out of the league, so be it. 

Exactly.   It's sort of what I said a day or two ago, something that I often forget:  the guys you take in the back half of the draft, and the undrafted rookies you sign, are development projects.  Teams project a future for these guys, acquire them, then work with them for two or three years to make them contributors.   Along the way, they have walk the practice squad tight rope, activating and deactivating guys, taking the risk that players will leave for lesser teams willing to put them on the 53 before the Bills are willing to do it.   And, occasionally, a guy like Milano shows and demonstrates from the beginning that he needs to be on the field.  And you get some guys like Shakir, who flashes some good things, and gets to play, but also shows he needs time to grow.  

 

And this is all different than it used to be for the Bills.   It's not hard to remember ten years ago, when we were trying to convince ourselves that these fifth and sixth rounders were going to be the plug that would fit into one hole or another.  The Bills don't go into the draft with a lot of holes anymore, so we don't have to count on those guys to step in have 800 yards in receptions as a rookies, or 90 tackles, or whatever.  And that's why these days, the Bills can draft Kincaid and Torrence and we can all relax knowing it was a good draft regardless of how they did in the later rounds.   That isn't completely true, of course, because, you have to get a decent yield out of those development guys, but you don't NEED them to make your upcoming season.  

[Warcodered]

1 hour ago, Bruffalo said:

He has a shot to make the team as a 4 phase special teamer.  If he does make the roster I doubt we see him taking many (or any) offensive snaps.

 

This is basically a super athletic Jake Kumerow on a rookie contract.  Lots of upside, but it's gonna be hard for him to see the field. 

Yep pretty much what Beane said has a good chance to make the team playing special teams in 4 phases and adds a dynamic to the WR room we don't have. Makes since to pick a guy that has a way to contribute on the team while he has time to develop on the offense.

[Mat68]

He is the new offseason and camp favorite.  Big and fast.  He looks the part.  He has a chance to be a solid player.  Idk if anything special comes from him but I think he will be a better pro than college player.  

[Warriorspikes51]

Beane on OBL speaking of him. Expect him to have a gameday jersey because he's already very good on ST and will continue to develop as an outside receiver. 

 

Likes him as vertical threat & ability to adjust, make "off schedule plays" that Josh is so good at

Edited May 1, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

21 hours ago, Maine-iac said:

If Shorter shows he can do Gave Davis type things it would be a real cost savings as Davis hits the end of his contract.  I like Davis but he has enough stats to demand a decent contract.  Money we might not have.

Maybe thats what Beane was thinking.

 

Shorter becomes Gabes replacement.  They are similar in size and speed.  Gabe ran a 4.55 too.

[Warriorspikes51]

I’m really excited about him
 

[balln]

Boy if you look ups gabe RAS and this guys RAS

 

theyre identical. 
 

Shorter is just bigger. 

11 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

Oh, for sure.. I don't expect much from him this year aside from depth and special teams. 

 

That being said, our WR1 was a 5th Round Pick.  

 

Florida fans would tell you that their offense was a mess for the past few years, aside from the Trask/Pitts year.  Shorter has dealt with erratic QB play and injuries.  

 

I'm just glad we have a true outside WR to develop behind Diggs and Davis this year.   If he becomes a WR2 type or better, great... if he washes out of the league, so be it. 

Every pass I saw on his highlights was pretty poor that he caught. Except one deep one against tenn and bama. Nothing in stride. Thrown late. Underthrown. 

[John from Riverside]

This guy is tee Higgins without the production

[Chandler#81]

Size, strength & soft hands. Shorter is LARGER!

 

[MrEpsYtown]

1 hour ago, Chandler#81 said:

Size, strength & soft hands. Shorter is LARGER!

 

So many of those catches he is making are against NFL corners from the SEC as well. I really like this pick. 

[The Wiz]

1 hour ago, Chandler#81 said:

Size, strength & soft hands. Shorter is LARGER!

 

Shorter's shorter than Shaver but Shaver and Shorter are taller than Shakir.

 

Now say it five times, fast 😜

Edited May 2, 2023 by The Wiz

[colin]

This guy and kincaid are both long large guys w really soft hands.  that's something that we have totally been missing (that i thought we'd get from trading for dhop).  the two things we lacked on o last year (this is aside from just poor blocking when our line broke down because that doesn't need mentioning) was burner speed on O and big targets who can catch.

 

we've addressed all of those needs, so it's a matter of these picks and signings hitting as well as dorsey putting it all together.

[Ralonzo]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

Shorter's shorter than Shaver but Shaver and Shorter are taller than Shakir.

 

Now say it five times, fast 😜

 

These guys need a nickname... how about the "Sh.. List"?

[Warriorspikes51]

Beane on Rich Eisen show:

"Outside perimeter receiver to learn, be a key backup for Stef and Gabe. Can stretch field vertically, win with size.  Really good STer. Hopeful he can grow into a productive receiver"

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

On 4/29/2023 at 4:51 PM, Bockeye said:

Dudes a beast and if we’re lucky, he shows out. Imagine him, Knox, Kincaid, and Diggs lined up. Would be silly trying to cover all of that. 

Exactly the Bills plan.  Flood the field with receivers, and watch Josh 'RB' Allen run for the first down. 🙄😁😇

Edited May 2, 2023 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[BADOLBILZ]

44 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Beane on Rich Eisen show:

"Outside perimeter receiver to learn, be a key backup for Stef and Gabe. Can stretch field vertically, win with size.  Really good STer. Hopeful he can grow into a productive receiver"

 

 

His initial description of the pick was that they had a similarly graded defensive player but chose him instead because he had a better chance to make the roster as a special teamer.   He's since given him more props.    His tape is better than you'd think, IMO...........but my actual expectations for him are like this guy below.  4th rounder Marcus Easley.   Very little college production but big, strong and fast.  We waited on him to play up to the sum of his perceived talents for many years.  He was a beast on ST's but never put it together as an offensive player and injuries didn't help.

 

 

[Warriorspikes51]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

His initial description of the pick was that they had a similarly graded defensive player but chose him instead because he had a better chance to make the roster as a special teamer.   He's since given him more props.    His tape is better than you'd think, IMO...........but my actual expectations for him are like this guy below.  4th rounder Marcus Easley.   Very little college production but big, strong and fast.  We waited on him to play up to the sum of his perceived talents for many years.  He was a beast on ST's but never put it together as an offensive player and injuries didn't help.

 

 

 

Fair, however I'm guessing Easley wasn't the 5 star #1 WR recruit (over A.Ra St.Brown Waddle, Chase) out of high school that Shorter was.

[BADOLBILZ]

2 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Fair, however I'm guessing Easley wasn't the 5 star #1 WR recruit (over A.Ra St.Brown Waddle, Chase) out of high school that Shorter was.

 

Yeah, and I follow all that stuff.   Every day I get updated on recruiting so I know most of these top guys and that colors your opinion of them as prospects when the time comes.   I'm just very underwhelmed by his production.   There is not a huge difference between an Easley or Kumerow level nobody and a Gabe Davis level big play, very good WR3.  The difference really shows up in actual games and in availability.   A lot has to go right at that size.   But if it does.......it's a great advantage.

[Warriorspikes51]

Just now, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Yeah, and I follow all that stuff.   Every day I get updated on recruiting so I know most of these top guys and that colors your opinion of them as prospects when the time comes.   I'm just very underwhelmed by his production.   There is not a huge difference between an Easley or Kumerow level nobody and a Gabe Davis level big play, very good WR3.  The difference really shows up in actual games and in availability.   A lot has to go right at that size.   But if it does.......it's a great advantage.

 

maybe wishful thinking on my part, but in order to have the muscularly defined body Shorter does....it takes an insane amount of work and discipline. Couple that with him valuing education and being on the honor role....I view his ceiling as extremely high. Hopefully he grows quickly this summer.  His highlights looked rather impressive to me 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

23 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

His initial description of the pick was that they had a similarly graded defensive player but chose him instead because he had a better chance to make the roster as a special teamer.   He's since given him more props.    His tape is better than you'd think, IMO...........but my actual expectations for him are like this guy below.  4th rounder Marcus Easley.   Very little college production but big, strong and fast.  We waited on him to play up to the sum of his perceived talents for many years.  He was a beast on ST's but never put it together as an offensive player and injuries didn't help.

 

 

 

Decent comp. I forgot that Easley was 6'3". However, this guy Shorter is just larger in every way, taller, heavier, longer arms, much larger hands. There are few receivers in the league bigger than him when you consider all the measurables together. He's like 90th percentile for all of them. 

[BADOLBILZ]

Just now, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

maybe wishful thinking on my part, but in order to have the muscularly defined body Shorter does....it takes an insane amount of work and discipline. Couple that with him valuing education and being on the honor role....I view his ceiling as extremely high. Hopefully he grows quickly this summer.  His highlights looked rather impressive to me 

 

 

Easley was like that.   Hardest worker type.  Very high character.   The difference between those guys and good NFL WR's is the details.   If you don't have them at a smaller size you don't even get a chance at the NFL.   But the big guys sometimes do.   Kumerow would shred practices but in game situations it was clear that his technique and hands weren't good enough to beat NFL CB's.   Easley actually almost looked like he was going to make the jump to a starting NFL WR(which was admittedly a lower bar in the NFL back then)  but then had a broken leg that cooked his career if I recall correctly.