Bengals @ Bills - Post Game Thread - January 22, 2023 - NFL Divisional Round Playoffs

[goldenboy81]

Every time they lose the Bills just get pushed around and are the less physical team.

This team gets punked everytime it matters most.

It's time to get some real dogs on the roster not these soft puppies they have always had.

Edited January 23, 2023 by goldenboy81

[newcam2012]

2 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

Before the game I felt of all the outcomes Buffalo getting blown out was least likely. I was wrong. 
 

Both lines need serious retooling and reinvestment. Even without Miller and Jones who are admittedly significant losses, our 9th overall pick DT, 30th overall pick DE, 54th overall pick DE, and 61st overall pick DE got owned by a back-up offensive line. Anyone with eyes saw Allen running for his life. Both are not problems that popped up in this game, but instead long-term issues. 
 

People I’m not the least bit worried about: Beane, Allen, Cook, Hines, Diggs, Davis (so long as he’s viewed as a WR3), Knox, Dawkins, Miller, Jones, Milano, Johnson, Elam, STers. 
 

Our defensive scheme is inadequate. We lost Hyde and Miller, yes, but good coaches modify their schemes and get a Purdy-led offense into the Conference Championship. It comes down to philosophy. We need to be varied enough that we can go heavy man and jam WRs at times. Thing is it wasn’t just scheme. We often tackled poorly. 
 

While writing this I’ve come to the conclusion the worst marriage by far for the Bills is the rush-4-to-get-home scheme with repeated whiffs on high defensive line picks. We’re playing a scheme relying on talent we don’t have. It would have been nice for whoever is truly running the defense to rush 3 more yesterday. If 4 weren’t getting home then at least give coverage some help. Let Burrow try to run on you in the snow. 
 

This may be a situation where we need turnover at one or both coordinator positions but it doesn’t happen. I do wonder like others if Frazier getting fired changes much in the defensive philosophy/scheme anyways. It’s tough to look at the offense’s year-long production and say fire the rookie OC because he did a lot of great things and Allen evidently likes him. But it would be tough to pass up a Reich. 
 

The 24 Hour Rule should change to a 1 Week Rule for Playoff Losses. At the end of the day we are going into next year with Allen, Diggs, Milano, and Miller. We’ll be back in the playoffs. Hopefully we are a little healthier next year and grab that 1 seed. GO BILLS!

Good post. Agree and disagree with your points.

 

Agree, I didn't see a blowout coming either. I thought it was going to be a close fought game. I expected the Bills defense to have major problems stopping the Bengals offense. I figured Burrow would carve up the Bills D. I had little faith they would set up. Stated so here and people were patronizing me for my thoughts. No pat on my back here as it isn't consolatory. I was unfortunately correct.

 

On offense, I thought the Bills would be successful. I imagined a fairly balanced attack with TDs passes to Knox and Davis. Envisioned a great effort by Allen in crucial times. The Bengals were able to rush and pressure Allen with ease. They dropped back defenders and didn't even need to blitz often. I thought the oline would be vastly better. Unfortunately, I was incorrect.

 

Fast forward to today which I can describe as a "football hangover." I have not watched one single interview, press conference, critic, etc...The wound is too fresh. 

 

My initial thoughts going forward. The Bills are a good team. A team that will likely make the playoffs for several years to come. The have Allen and enough pieces to accomplish this feat. However, the Bills will likely fall back into the back to the likes of other playoff caliber teams. Miami is basically as good as the Bills and maybe better if Tua can stay healthy. Miami, Pitt, Jags, Jets, Pat, Balt, etc...will likely close the gap on the Bills.

 

The Bills will not be a dominate team nor will they be feared. In short, the Bills organization is taking a step back not forward. Why would I think that? Two reasons. (1) the Bills have a lot of holes to fill. Both sides of the ball in the trenches are inadequate. Poyer is likely gone and the Bills secondary isn't elite. Their defensive scheme is very beatable. It's effective vs inferior teams thus you get inflated D stats. We've seen this for several years now. Two years in a row the Bills D has crapped the bed in the playoffs. You just can't ignore this. The Bills D is not playoff reliable! (2) The coaching staff is good but not elite. Truthfully, a change is badly needed. Coach McD and company has run its course. I give coach McD credit for installing a culture, winning, making the playoffs, and being a high character guy. He's a great coach for turning around programs and developing a winning culture. Imho, coach McD isn't the coach to take the Bills to the next level. Several years of failed playoff appearances . 13 seconds still looks large and yesterday he was clearly out coached by a country mile. I suspect my views here are in the minority. I get that. My only issue is what coach is out there to replace McD? It has to be an forward offensive minded individual. Is that person out there? 

 

In concluding, I look forward to another season, the Bills moves, trades, signings, releases, and changes. No one really knows how it will play out next year. What's known is this year was one hellava roller coaster ride. So many highs and lows. Very disappointing ending to a season with the loss to Cinci. However, it was overwhelming and exhilarating to see Damar alive and well. I'll take that trade all day any day! With that said, this makes the season a success because football became secondary in my eyes. 

 

Thanks to everyone for putting up with my posts and thoughts. I know I'm not an easy read.

 

[Franco_92]

I've seen a sentiment floating around that worries about all of the upcoming talent,  ascending teams in the AFC.

 

that was us 2 years ago, it felt like we were set up for a decade of dominance. 

 

The chargers, jags, bengals etc. Aren't always going to look as dominant or promising as they do today, just like we weren't. 

 

The Bengals owner is so lacking in money that as soon as burrow gets paid, their roster is going to hit a wall faster than ours. Jacksonville will have similar issues in a couple years, and had a LOT of free agent dollars come up so small on Saturday. The chargers are the chargers.

 

The Bills can and will retool. Next year, like this year, will probably not be the best iteration of the Josh Allen Bills when all things are said and done. But the Bills are not sunk at all, and I fully believe that josh will bring us to the promised land 

[ngbills]

38 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

 

I don't disagree with what you're saying, but I don't see the massive backslide that a lot are predicting simply because the offense wasn't good this season talent-wise and Allen dragged it to the #2 spot in stats by sheer force of will.  He's just that good.  

 

 

Without an upgraded OL he is either gonna get hurt or will start being less productive. Teams are getting better at defending Allen ball. We need tools to be able run a normal offense. Or change the scheme to get the ball out quick. Problem is that is not Allen’s game. 

[Bruffalo]

10 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Without an upgraded OL he is either gonna get hurt or will start being less productive. Teams are getting better at defending Allen ball. We need tools to be able run a normal offense. Or change the scheme to get the ball out quick. Problem is that is not Allen’s game. 

Again, I agree. 

 

Lot of folks have been calling for O-Line investment for multiple drafts.  I was so disappointed when we drafted Basham instead of Humphrey, and I really wanted the Bills to grab Trey Smith as well.  Both went to the chiefs and have been productive additions.

 

I don't trust the team to make the kind of investments you're talking about. I, maybe cynically, really think that we're seeing a Cam Newton 2.0 career arc.  That being said, I expect the Bills offense to still be great to elite next season. 

Edited January 23, 2023 by Bruffalo
letters are hard.

[Scott7975]

 

 

Was medically cleared last week.  Not sure it would have made a difference but could have used him this week no?  Its not like he hasnt been practicing and keeping in shape.

 

Its time to blow this team up and spend resources on offense.  No more 200 man Dline rotation that cant get pressure on the QB despite having "fresh legs."  No more spending 1st and 2nd round picks just to have them sit on the bench.  Get em on the field and develop them.

Edited January 23, 2023 by Scott7975

[RichRiderBills]

31 minutes ago, goldenboy81 said:

Every time they lose the Bills just get pushed around and are the less physical team.

This team gets punked everytime it matters most.

It's time to get some real dogs on the roster not these soft puppies they have always had.

 

I'm not going to totally disagree here, but there is a counter. We've beat physical teams. We've met their intensity. We met the Colts intensity in the playoffs in 2020 then , the next year got pounded by them.

 

Beat the 49ers in a very physical game out west that same year. That was a tough defense. 

 

We beat a physical Lamar led Ravens team in the playoffs that year, also beat them this year after getting roughed up in the first half.  

 

 

[Nextmanup]

2 hours ago, Bruffalo said:

I'm still gutted the next day by this.  I'm smart enough to realize this is irrational, but I'm too emotionally invested in this team considering I have no ability to effect the outcome. 

 

I hate, hate, hate that the only reasoning we've gotten is "we didn't have the energy, we came out flat".  The fact that the team was unmotivated is a direct condemnation on the coaching staff. The whole city, hell WNY is behind the Bills, and the players aren't invested in the outcome.  That's a failure of leadership. 

 

I'm worried this is all we're gonna be able to do. We will have some fun years like the Chargers but never do anything of note, I guess it's better than the drought but it still feels just gross. 

It's not over yet!  But I fear we are more likely to regress next year than actually improve, or even remain at this year's level. 

The team is going to change around a good bit, and it needs to, if we are going to get better.

 

This off-season may dictate whether Beane and/or McDermott are still here in a few years.

 

 

[BuffaloBaumer]

I was at the game and honestly, waking up today, it feels like it never happened. It was if the Bills never showed up. Cue the tailgate jokes but I seriously can't remember many plays, I mean, it's weird. There was nothing memorable on offense, defense, nothing. It's been years since I felt that way. I really can't believe how awful it was from start to finish...

[Bruffalo]

6 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

It's not over yet!  But I fear we are more likely to regress next year than actually improve, or even remain at this year's level. 

The team is going to change around a good bit, and it needs to, if we are going to get better.

 

This off-season may dictate whether Beane and/or McDermott are still here in a few years.

 

 

You're right, it's not over yet, but my confidence in the staff is at an all time low.  

 

I expect the Bills will still be very good, and they'll win a lot in the regular season, but I don't see them turning the corner in the postseason anymore without a major philosophical shift. 

[Boatdrinks]

4 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

It's not over yet!  But I fear we are more likely to regress next year than actually improve, or even remain at this year's level. 

The team is going to change around a good bit, and it needs to, if we are going to get better.

 

This off-season may dictate whether Beane and/or McDermott are still here in a few years.

 

 

Going out on a limb there on possible regression , eh ? The team has won 13 games exactly twice in franchise history. That they likely won’t equal it in 2023 isn’t a revelation. 

1 minute ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

I was at the game and honestly, waking up today, it feels like it never happened. It was if the Bills never showed up. Cue the tailgate jokes but I seriously can't remember many plays, I mean, it's weird. There was nothing memorable on offense, defense, nothing. It's been years since I felt that way. I really can't believe how awful it was from start to finish...

I attended the game as well, and feel exactly the same way. There was nothing about the teams performance that felt like a playoff game in any way. A huge no show on the part of the Bills and the coaching staff. 

[Lothar]

1 hour ago, Bob in STL said:

Recall the MNF game, the Bengals won the coin toss and took the ball. The MNF announcers made this a point that they usually defer but hey wanted to make a statement and score first.  

Actually, no! The Bengals have preached aggressiveness and have taken the ball first since the early weeks of the season. They have supreme confidence in their offense h kinda like our offense of the last 2 late seasons (not this one obviously)

[Billsatlastin2018]

2 hours ago, Bruffalo said:

I'm still gutted the next day by this.  I'm smart enough to realize this is irrational, but I'm too emotionally invested in this team considering I have no ability to effect the outcome. 

 

I hate, hate, hate that the only reasoning we've gotten is "we didn't have the energy, we came out flat".  The fact that the team was unmotivated is a direct condemnation on the coaching staff. The whole city, hell WNY is behind the Bills, and the players aren't invested in the outcome.  That's a failure of leadership. 

 

I'm worried this is all we're gonna be able to do. We will have some fun years like the Chargers but never do anything of note, I guess it's better than the drought but it still feels just gross. 

ALL of that…

 

but especially the point that with the same lack of talent at WR (other than Diggs), HC, OC & DC- unable to prepare properly, nor transition in game, GM whiffs on the D Line- who can’t rush, O Line- who can’t defend and Corners & Safeties that can’t cover- the Bills are going NOWHERE! 
 

Just not good enough across the entire team.

[ngbills]

7 minutes ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

I was at the game and honestly, waking up today, it feels like it never happened. It was if the Bills never showed up. Cue the tailgate jokes but I seriously can't remember many plays, I mean, it's weird. There was nothing memorable on offense, defense, nothing. It's been years since I felt that way. I really can't believe how awful it was from start to finish...

I think that is what is leading to a lot of the changes are needed posts. The team did not seem ready to play. It felt like they were not prepared for the game and that is on the coaches. It did feel like a preseason game. That was a game to bring out all the stops. Fake on a punt or field goal. Dial up some things that were not on tape. We ran our vanilla bend but dont break defense, throw in blitzing the house leaving a wr to make easy slant route catches. Our OL could not protect vs 3 man rushes? Our routes did not adjust to the Bengal's d or the weather. Heck, it seemed like we did not even prepare enough to wear cleats that work in the snow. Surprised the score was as close as it was. 

[ngbills]

5 minutes ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

ALL of that…

 

but especially the point that with the same lack of talent at WR (other than Diggs), HC, OC & DC- unable to prepare properly, nor transition in game, GM whiffs on the D Line- who can’t rush, O Line- who can’t defend and Corners & Safeties that can’t cover- the Bills are going NOWHERE! 
 

Just not good enough across the entire team.

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

[Negan]

6 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

Wow this is quite depressing 😩😩😩, and totally agree 💯!

[LabattBlue]

One bit of silver lining from yesterday…because it was so one sided, not much post game whining about the officials. 😂

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, LabattBlue said:

One bit of silver lining from yesterday…because it was so one sided, not much post game whining about the officials. 😂

I don't know how a team playing with three backup OL can commit zero holding penalties. 

[Billsatlastin2018]

15 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

BANG ON!

 

* I would keep Shakir & Davis as WR3 options.And you need a star to compliment Diggs.

* RB- Cook.✔️ And NO MORE GD totally wasted Draft Picks, especially 2s and 3s on RBs… Beanie Boy!!!

* TE Time for a change. Draft a Big Target. I like Knox,but he is not anywhere close to Kelce & Kittle.Bag that contract.

* OL? Disaster.

* DL? Aside from the terrible Miller loss, whiff after whiff by Beanie! NO Sacks D.

* DBs? Shake my head at the mediocrities- even a complete whiff of Round 2 Elam!

[Caesar]

1 hour ago, arcane said:

I've seen a sentiment floating around that worries about all of the upcoming talent,  ascending teams in the AFC.

 

that was us 2 years ago, it felt like we were set up for a decade of dominance. 

 

The chargers, jags, bengals etc. Aren't always going to look as dominant or promising as they do today, just like we weren't. 

 

The Bengals owner is so lacking in money that as soon as burrow gets paid, their roster is going to hit a wall faster than ours. Jacksonville will have similar issues in a couple years, and had a LOT of free agent dollars come up so small on Saturday. The chargers are the chargers.

 

The Bills can and will retool. Next year, like this year, will probably not be the best iteration of the Josh Allen Bills when all things are said and done. But the Bills are not sunk at all, and I fully believe that josh will bring us to the promised land 

This is a dated truth.  Mike Brown is not in control anymore, since he stepped away Cincy has spent aggressively in free agency lately.
DJ Reader, Von Bell, Mike Hilton, Hayden Hurst, Trey Hendrickson, BJ Hill, Chido Awuzie, Trey Flowers, Eli Apple, Ted Karras, Alex Cappa, La'el Collins, Max Scharping - all signed in the last couple years and all have been impact players.

It is no secret ownership's main focus is on extending Burrow and Higgins immediately after the upcoming Super Bowl.  If Burrow accepts a long-term (10 year) deal with rolling guarantees the Bengals will be in ok shape moving forward.  We are definitely limited by the required escrow, but it can be managed with Burrow's assistance.  Of course he can simply name his number and we will pay it, he has said he wants to keep the core together, we will see....?

We will lose 2 key players from this team - Jesse Bates and Germain Pratt, both are up for big contracts.

[Negan]

15 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

One bit of silver lining from yesterday…because it was so one sided, not much post game whining about the officials. 😂

Lol, I thought the Tre White pass interference near the goal line was a tad ticky tacky 

[Rico]

So Sully was right again.

[Goin Breakdown]

1 hour ago, ngbills said:

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

I agree with you. You also may be correct that it's bad timing lol but ohh well. Think with the cap and draft order we will not be able to keep many of the players we know on this team. I may be ok with that. However I also do not have any faith that we will bring in anybody that will make a change for the better especially if we have the same coordinators. Maybe everyone was right and the window is closing. Idk. 

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, RichRiderBills said:

 

I'm not going to totally disagree here, but there is a counter. We've beat physical teams. We've met their intensity. We met the Colts intensity in the playoffs in 2020 then , the next year got pounded by them.

 

Beat the 49ers in a very physical game out west that same year. That was a tough defense. 

 

We beat a physical Lamar led Ravens team in the playoffs that year, also beat them this year after getting roughed up in the first half.  

 

 

 

In neither of those wins did Buffalo dominate another top offense.  The Colts game was 27-24 with 6 minutes left and a Lamar was hurt in the 2nd half...for a Ravens team that held Buffalo to 1 offensive TD. 

 

1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said:

Going out on a limb there on possible regression , eh ? The team has won 13 games exactly twice in franchise history. That they likely won’t equal it in 2023 isn’t a revelation. 

 

Regular season ended a few weeks ago.  The regression is from losing the AFC CG 2 years ago, to losing a divisional game last season in the waning minutes, to getting the snot kicked out of you this season.  If that's not regression I don't know what is  

 

No contending team falls back on regular season success in the wake of a playoff blowout. 

 

[birdo67]

(again, this has probably been pointed out already)

 

Shades of the '04 Steelers game - I know we were playing against many more backups on that day.  But still, it's discouraging how a deep roster can just shove us around whether they're using their starters or not.

[Buddy Hix]

My prediction:

 

Frazier, Dorsey and Kromer are all back. The team is a little worse than this year, gets bounced in the WC round and we’re in the same predicament as we are now.

[Wraith]

Yesterday, I was infuriated at both the offensive and defensive game planning. I went to bed thinking the Bills should let Frazier go but should continue with Dorsey, as he was a first year OC with an offense that was overall very strong this season. However, some arguments today now have me on the side that the Bills need to upgrade at OC immediately. The fact that they have prime Allen and Diggs right now means they can't afford another wasted season. Seeing a tweet like this reinforces my belief. A full 2/3rds of the Bills passing plays were perfectly covered. That is shockingly bad and speaks to how much the Bengals DC outcoached Dorsey. Incredible.

 

 

[Boatdrinks]

2 hours ago, Lothar said:

Actually, no! The Bengals have preached aggressiveness and have taken the ball first since the early weeks of the season. They have supreme confidence in their offense h kinda like our offense of the last 2 late seasons (not this one obviously)

It’s certainly the better part of their team so it makes sense. Some coaches want the chance at back to back possessions / scores that deferring can provide and that’s fine too. 

16 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Yesterday, I was infuriated at both the offensive and defensive game planning. I went to bed thinking the Bills should let Frazier go but should continue with Dorsey, as he was a first year OC with an offense that was overall very strong this season. However, some arguments today now have me on the side that the Bills need to upgrade at OC immediately. The fact that they have prime Allen and Diggs right now means they can't afford another wasted season. Seeing a tweet like this reinforces my belief. A full 2/3rds of the Bills passing plays were perfectly covered. That is shockingly bad and speaks to how much the Bengals DC outcoached Dorsey. Incredible.

 

 

Great for CIN but Dorsey needs to take a look in the mirror here. The stat says just as much about the poor job Dorsey did as anything about the Bengals. Have to be at your best in the playoffs and Dorsey came up very small. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

26 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Yesterday, I was infuriated at both the offensive and defensive game planning. I went to bed thinking the Bills should let Frazier go but should continue with Dorsey, as he was a first year OC with an offense that was overall very strong this season. However, some arguments today now have me on the side that the Bills need to upgrade at OC immediately. The fact that they have prime Allen and Diggs right now means they can't afford another wasted season. Seeing a tweet like this reinforces my belief. A full 2/3rds of the Bills passing plays were perfectly covered. That is shockingly bad and speaks to how much the Bengals DC outcoached Dorsey. Incredible.

 

 

Wow the receivers can't get open, the scheme didn't help and the three man rush got pressure. Are you freakin kidding me....

All while the D bent over......

[KOKBILLS]

5 hours ago, Bruffalo said:

I'm still gutted the next day by this.  I'm smart enough to realize this is irrational, but I'm too emotionally invested in this team considering I have no ability to effect the outcome. 

 

I hate, hate, hate that the only reasoning we've gotten is "we didn't have the energy, we came out flat".  The fact that the team was unmotivated is a direct condemnation on the coaching staff. The whole city, hell WNY is behind the Bills, and the players aren't invested in the outcome.  That's a failure of leadership. 

 

I'm worried this is all we're gonna be able to do. We will have some fun years like the Chargers but never do anything of note, I guess it's better than the drought but it still feels just gross. 

 

I read a bunch of those quotes and it seems to me the players know their coaches are in trouble, and they were covering for them with that excuse. Saffold even said "our coaches did the best they could at trying to modify the week to get us back to snuff.” I'm glad they modified the week while rolling out that ridiculously bad game plan...But whatever...

[BillzFreak]

5 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said:

Wow the receivers can't get open, the scheme didn't help and the three man rush got pressure. Are you freakin kidding me....

All while the D bent over......

The last few years it's been about getting better players and upgrading certain positions. I understand you always have to upgrade players if you can, but this year Bean has to look at the coaching staff. The constants on this team have been McDermott and Frazier. Players go, we say they suck but these two have gotten passes from the front office. I'm not going to just act like we need better players and we'll be fine, after yesterday coaching certainly has to be addressed. And Mr. Bean hopefully makes that known to us when he speaks. No more passes for coaching, they have to be looked at as much as the players in there annual post season evaluation.

[Bruffalo]

7 minutes ago, KOKBILLS said:

 

I read a bunch of those quotes and it seems to me the players know their coaches are in trouble, and they were covering for them with that excuse. Saffold even said "our coaches did the best they could at trying to modify the week to get us back to snuff.” I'm glad they modified the week while rolling out that ridiculously bad game plan...But whatever...

I don't see it. I wanna see it, but I don't see the accountability.  There wasn't anything after 13 seconds, I don't believe that there will be here either. 

 

As much as I want to see Frazier replaced, I just don't see it happening. McD likes him way too much. 

[TheBrownBear]

42 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Yesterday, I was infuriated at both the offensive and defensive game planning. I went to bed thinking the Bills should let Frazier go but should continue with Dorsey, as he was a first year OC with an offense that was overall very strong this season. However, some arguments today now have me on the side that the Bills need to upgrade at OC immediately. The fact that they have prime Allen and Diggs right now means they can't afford another wasted season. Seeing a tweet like this reinforces my belief. A full 2/3rds of the Bills passing plays were perfectly covered. That is shockingly bad and speaks to how much the Bengals DC outcoached Dorsey. Incredible.

 

 

I agree with this 100%.  The identity of the team was supposed to be that we were some offensive juggernaut.   By midseason it became apparent that was no longer the case and we were scratching out wins with Josh hero ball and the occasional decent showing from the running game against subpar opponents.  We looked for scapegoats in McKenzie, Motor/Cook, Gabe Davis, Knox and even Josh to some extent, but the guy behind all that inefficiency we've seen is an in over his head Ken Dorsey.  We barely run any motion.  Can you remember anything even remotely imaginative?  Shovel passes (no, not that improvised one that Josh threw off Ike's facemask in KC)?  Traditional screen passes?  Hell, even a simple old naked bootleg?  If these things actually happened, it wasn't after week 5 or so.

[KOKBILLS]

1 minute ago, Bruffalo said:

I don't see it. I wanna see it, but I don't see the accountability.  There wasn't anything after 13 seconds, I don't believe that there will be here either. 

 

As much as I want to see Frazier replaced, I just don't see it happening. McD likes him way too much. 

 

Agreed...McD and his quest for love will definitely get in the way of doing what needs to be done...As much as I like McD...And I really like him...They roll this crap out on Defense again next year I'll be leading the charge to get rid of him. 

[Low Positive]

The thing that gets me is that the Bengals were able to use a manufactured scandal over ticket sales to whip themselves into a frenzy. And it actually worked, as evidenced by Joe Burrow's comments about ticket refunds after the game. You could see the rage in Mixon's runs. He hadn't run that hard all year. He wanted to not only win the game but stick it to the Bills and the entire city of Buffalo for wronging the Cincinnati Bengals. It went so far that the entire city of Cincinnati adapted their outrage. Just goes to show that there really is no more powerful emotion than the feeling that you and people like you are being victimized. I wonder what outrage they'll use against KC? 

[WideNine]

8 hours ago, ngbills said:

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

 

I think you first statement is the best one.

 

Probably a bad day to be doing this.

 

Emotions are raw, disappointments running deep and folks tend to want to lash out in every direction.

 

Probably the same at OBD. We know that even Diggs wanted to lash out. It is human nature, but not usually constructive to building or maintaining a competitive team.

 

There are changes that need to be made for this team that has arguably slipped down a rung on the AFC ladder.

 

It will be interesting to see what those changes are going to look like, but a lot of investment went into this season and fell short.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2023 by WideNine

[newcam2012]

3 hours ago, ngbills said:

Probably a bad day to be doing this but...Who are the building blocks of this team? 

 

QB - Allen

RB - Cook? Is the feature back?

WR - Diggs and nobody. Davis is 100% a bust. Our other guys are time a dozen NFL players. 

TE - Knox? Paid big money but dont think he will ever be a real difference make. An above average TE. 

OL - Dawkins has been bad. Who else? Morse is close to retirement.

 

DL - Miller - how many years does he have? When will he even be back. Oliver? He may be gone soon. Greg R may never be more than an avg player. No one else to speak of.

LB - Milano. Edmunds may be gone. Nobody else.

DB - Hyde is getting old. Poyer is gone. White is looking done. Johnson, Jackson, Elam and crew all look like average players. 

 

Kickers - Bass

 

So we essentially have Allen, Milano and Bass as building blocks. Miller and Diggs are aging key players. Beyond that not much more than some above average, many average and some below average. The last few drafts have yielded no building blocks to speak of on rookie deals. 

 

I will summarize what you are saying. In essence, the Bills aren't that talented or good. They were overrated. The future doesn't look as promising ad we once thought. How did I do? 

2 hours ago, FrenchConnection said:

I don't know how a team playing with three backup OL can commit zero holding penalties. 

Quote

Pretty easy not to hold when the other team's back ups are better than your starting group. 

 

To add insult to injury, the Bills Oline couldn't hold off a Bengals rush that frequently rushed only 3 or 4 players. 

[newcam2012]

2 hours ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

BANG ON!

 

* I would keep Shakir & Davis as WR3 options.And you need a star to compliment Diggs.

* RB- Cook.✔️ And NO MORE GD totally wasted Draft Picks, especially 2s and 3s on RBs… Beanie Boy!!!

* TE Time for a change. Draft a Big Target. I like Knox,but he is not anywhere close to Kelce & Kittle.Bag that contract.

* OL? Disaster.

* DL? Aside from the terrible Miller loss, whiff after whiff by Beanie! NO Sacks D.

* DBs? Shake my head at the mediocrities- even a complete whiff of Round 2 Elam!

It won't surprise me at all if this team regresses. The holes are major to fill at almost every position except QB. 

[ngbills]

23 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I will summarize what you are saying. In essence, the Bills aren't that talented or good. They were overrated. The future doesn't look as promising ad we once thought. How did I do? 

 

Pretty much. Tough part is our coaching/front office either cannot evaluate talent or cannot adjust scheme to fit talent. They had all the opportunity in the world to bring in the guys they wanted and this is what happened. So many whiffs across the board. 

Quickest fix is upgrading the OL and WR positions. Even if that means ignoring the D. Come playoffs we are likely in shootouts anyway. 

[MILFHUNTER#518]

4 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

Good post. Agree and disagree with your points.

 

Agree, I didn't see a blowout coming either. I thought it was going to be a close fought game. I expected the Bills defense to have major problems stopping the Bengals offense. I figured Burrow would carve up the Bills D. I had little faith they would set up. Stated so here and people were patronizing me for my thoughts. No pat on my back here as it isn't consolatory. I was unfortunately correct.

 

On offense, I thought the Bills would be successful. I imagined a fairly balanced attack with TDs passes to Knox and Davis. Envisioned a great effort by Allen in crucial times. The Bengals were able to rush and pressure Allen with ease. They dropped back defenders and didn't even need to blitz often. I thought the oline would be vastly better. Unfortunately, I was incorrect.

 

Fast forward to today which I can describe as a "football hangover." I have not watched one single interview, press conference, critic, etc...The wound is too fresh. 

 

My initial thoughts going forward. The Bills are a good team. A team that will likely make the playoffs for several years to come. The have Allen and enough pieces to accomplish this feat. However, the Bills will likely fall back into the back to the likes of other playoff caliber teams. Miami is basically as good as the Bills and maybe better if Tua can stay healthy. Miami, Pitt, Jags, Jets, Pat, Balt, etc...will likely close the gap on the Bills.

 

The Bills will not be a dominate team nor will they be feared. In short, the Bills organization is taking a step back not forward. Why would I think that? Two reasons. (1) the Bills have a lot of holes to fill. Both sides of the ball in the trenches are inadequate. Poyer is likely gone and the Bills secondary isn't elite. Their defensive scheme is very beatable. It's effective vs inferior teams thus you get inflated D stats. We've seen this for several years now. Two years in a row the Bills D has crapped the bed in the playoffs. You just can't ignore this. The Bills D is not playoff reliable! (2) The coaching staff is good but not elite. Truthfully, a change is badly needed. Coach McD and company has run its course. I give coach McD credit for installing a culture, winning, making the playoffs, and being a high character guy. He's a great coach for turning around programs and developing a winning culture. Imho, coach McD isn't the coach to take the Bills to the next level. Several years of failed playoff appearances . 13 seconds still looks large and yesterday he was clearly out coached by a country mile. I suspect my views here are in the minority. I get that. My only issue is what coach is out there to replace McD? It has to be an forward offensive minded individual. Is that person out there? 

 

In concluding, I look forward to another season, the Bills moves, trades, signings, releases, and changes. No one really knows how it will play out next year. What's known is this year was one hellava roller coaster ride. So many highs and lows. Very disappointing ending to a season with the loss to Cinci. However, it was overwhelming and exhilarating to see Damar alive and well. I'll take that trade all day any day! With that said, this makes the season a success because football became secondary in my eyes. 

 

Thanks to everyone for putting up with my posts and thoughts. I know I'm not an easy read.

 

Sean Payton is out there, just completed his second interview with Denver. He would be a great fit here, and would most definitely rather be here with Josh than Denver with Russell. Josh would flourish under him. 

 

He is still under contract with the Saints, so it would cost us a 1st but where we will pick in this year's draft (way late in the first round) it would be worth it IMHO.