Star released. Pre-6/1 per Joe B, $1.5M cap savings.

[GunnerBill]

20 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

He was more than meh when he played, and he never missed a game until this year outside of the COVID year he sat out.  Had he not sat out a year I would think the signing would have yielded even more results.

 

But while he was a good piece when on the field, we got noticeable better and more versatile at DT this year, so this was inevitable as you said.  

 

He had some good games. Some average games. Some poor games. I'd put his time as a Bill at a 6/10 overall. To me that is pretty meh. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

We are scrimping and saving for cap space at this point. With Settle, Jones and Jordan Philips we really didn't need him, and the 2023 cap space is going to be needed.

[BillsFanSD]

Nobody bats 1.000 at hiring, and if Star is the worst FA signing we ever make we'll be doing really well.

[Returntoglory]

5 minutes ago, No_Matter_What said:

End of an error!

Fixed  

[Bangarang]

Guess Beane couldn’t convince him to retire instead.

 

Easily the worst contract he’s given out so far.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

We are scrimping and saving for cap space at this point. With Settle, Jones and Jordan Philips we really didn't need him, and the 2023 cap space is going to be needed.

If we didn’t sign a Dt I fully believe Star was getting released.

[NewEra]

6 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

Time for me to take my victory lap.  I knew that Star was gone after Beane and McDermott stopped making excuses for him as they had in the past.  
 

This was by far the worst contract Beane has ever written as GM of the Bills and the latest line of mistakes of the Carolina Connection.  
 

The Bills had a gaping need at DT and Beane and McDermott put too much faith in their former player.  At best, Star was an average DT, at his worst the return on his deal might have been the lowest at his position.
 

I’m glad to see the Bills get out of a very bad deal and turn the page. 

Lol…..were there a lot of people that opposed this when you wrote this the first time?  I thought it was close to a given he was gone.  The only reservation I had was that McB loves certain guys and want them around.  

[GunnerBill]

26 minutes ago, Philo said:

 

*Epenesa quickly hides*

 

Like most of his first 2 years then....

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

If we didn’t sign a Dt I fully believe Star was getting released.

Fair enough. But getting more for cheaper makes it an easy call.

[ndirish1978]

Was not done as a post June 1 so we eat the hit this year and only save 1.5 - Beane trying to pump the brakes on kicking the can down the road on dead cap. 

Edited March 18, 2022 by ndirish1978

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said:

Nobody bats 1.000 at hiring, and if Star is the worst FA signing we ever make we'll be doing really well.

 

He isn't even close to the worst FA signing. He was an average to touch above average starting 1 tech for 3 seasons and opted out of another season. He was overpaid, sure. But worst FA signing? Not close for me.

[Bangarang]

2 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

Was not done as a post June 1 so we eat the hit this year and only save 1.5 - Beane trying to pump the brakes on kicking the can down the road on dead cap. 

Josh’s new money starts next year so it makes sense. 

[No_Matter_What]

 

10 minutes ago, chris heff said:

I don’t understand what any of this means can someone explain it to me like I’m twelve?

If it is pre June 1 release (standard), we save around 1,5M cap space this year and also eat all his dead cap, which is quite a lot - 7,7M.

 

We could also use post June 1 release, which means 2,6M more savings this year (so 4,1M savings, 5,1M dead cap), but those 2,6M would be dead cap next season (2023).

 

And savings this year would be effective after June 1, so we would not be able to use those money (cap space) right now in free agency.

 

Apparently we chose the former option.

 

5 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

Not a  June 1st designation

 

 

 

Good to hear. Don't have to kick every can down the road.

[Malazan]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

We are getting really low on whipping boys. Bease and Star gone. Knox improved. It’s down to edmunds and ford catching all the hands. 

 

For a team that talks about depth all the time we are getting perilously thin at whipping boy. 

Edited March 18, 2022 by Malazan

[BullBuchanan]

7 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

the 2023 cap space is going to be needed.

Is it? It looks like we'll have plenty of cap to work with next year and as other teams have shown, you can make the cap do what you need it to.

[FilthyBeast]

Pretty much all the dead weight is off this team now minus a few other bad draft picks (i.e. Ford and Epenesa) that will likely be traded or released this summer.

[DCOrange]

 

[AuntieEm]

30 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

We are getting really low on whipping boys. Bease and Star gone. Knox improved. It’s down to edmunds and ford catching all the hands. 

 

     Well problem solved Bills will just win the Supwler Bowl setting the new undefeated standard to a 20 game win streak so we can put an end to the Dolphins having only undefeated season and taking over that record. Icing would be to beat a Brady led team in the title game and let von miller give Brady the unfinished business he mistakenly  thought was to add to his SB record....  instead it will add to his sb losses record. 

[BillsFanSD]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He isn't even close to the worst FA signing. He was an average to touch above average starting 1 tech for 3 seasons and opted out of another season. He was overpaid, sure. But worst FA signing? Not close for me.

I actually do think Star is the worst FA acquisition of the Beane era.  He's a perfectly okay starter, but he was getting paid to be better than that, and then you have to factor in his game-day availability which seems unreliable at this point.  

 

I know we can point back to guys like Kelvin Benjamin, Vonte Davis, and Josh Norman, but those guys didn't cost much and were mainly just warm bodies who were signed as place-holders while we built a legitimate roster.  I'm pretty sure Beane and McDermott expected Star to be a real cornerstone of the D-line, and that never happened.  

 

(Edit: I know we traded for Benjamin -- I was thinking of player acquisitions a little more broadly than just FA.)

Edited March 18, 2022 by BillsFanSD

[AuntieEm]

4 minutes ago, Malazan said:

 

For a team that talks about depth all the time we are getting perilously thing at whipping boy. 

 

 

   No whipping needed when you bring home a lombardi.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, chris heff said:

I don’t understand what any of this means can someone explain it to me like I’m twelve?

 

I'll try.

 

A player's cap hit consists of yearly cash (salary and per-year bonuses like roster and workout).  The player also gets a signing bonus fully paid to him when he signs his contract, but amortized over the years of the contract.  For example, a $10.4M signing bonus on a 4 year contract would be transferred to Star's bank account immediately when he signs. but for salary cap bookkeeping, it can be divided into 4 chunks to count against the salary cap at $2.6M/year.  

 

The player can also have all or part of his yearly cash (salary and roster and option bonuses) guaranteed.  In Star's case, he had $2.5M of his 2022 salary guaranteed. 

 

When the player is cut, the guaranteed part of his yearly cash counts against the cap ($2.5M for Star), as does the chunk of his signing bonus that counts against this year's cap ($2.6M for Star).  The team gets credit for any non-guaranteed salary or bonuses.  So that's $5.1M guaranteed for this year against Star's yearly cap hit of $9.2M, resulting in $4.1M cap savings.  BUT WAIT!

 

Now we get to the decision point: when a player is cut, any guaranteed money or amortized signing bonus from future years ALSO get charged against the cap savings.  So in Star's case, he has another chunk of $2.6M signing bonus on the books for next season.  That counts against the savings - so $4.1M - $2.6M means we only save $1.5M this season

 

UNLESS - the NFL allows the team to designate two players cut during FA as "post-June 1 cuts".  What that does, is allow the team to defer next year's guaranteed money or remaining chunks of amortized signing bonus to count against NEXT year's cap.  It's "good for the player" because it encourages teams to release players early when they have a better chance to be signed by other teams; it's "good for the team" because they can spread out the cap hit from cutting a player over two seasons.

 

The drawback is, the team does not realize the cap savings until after June 1.

 

So with Star:

Cut pre-June 1, $9.2M cap - $2.5M guaranteed salary - $2.6Mx2 amortized signing bonus for this year and next = $1.5M cap savings applicable NOW

Cut post-June 1, $9.2M cap - $2.5M guaranteed salary - $2.6M amortized signing bonus for this year and next = $4.1M cap savings applicable June 1 AND $2.6M amortized signing bonus charged against the 2023 cap.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Big Blitz]

10 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

Guess Beane couldn’t convince him to retire instead.

 

Easily the worst contract he’s given out so far.

 

 

In fairness I think Covid completely derailed him.  

 

I don't have the hate for the guy a lot of others do.

 

Something went wrong with him in 2020 and then coming back in 2021 could have been all things pandemic related.  He was good in 2019.  

[JohnNord]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He isn't even close to the worst FA signing. He was an average to touch above average starting 1 tech for 3 seasons and opted out of another season. He was overpaid, sure. But worst FA signing? Not close for me.

Ok then who was Beane’s worst free signing?  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

Was not done as a post June 1 so we eat the hit this year and only save 1.5 - Beane trying to pump the brakes on kicking the can down the road on dead cap. 

 

Source?  Do we know that for sure?  Edit: I see that's been reported by Joe Buscaglia

[billsfan714]

Hallelujah!!!!!   I no longer have to listen to morons on this board try to stand logic on its head to defend him anymore.   No more, its his job to not make plays or you don't know his assignment because I played HS football.

 

Happy Days!!!!!!

 

Now dear lord, just do the same in about 365 days when we let Tre walk.

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

Ok then who was Beane’s worst free signing?  

Kelvin Benjamin?

[JohnNord]

13 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Lol…..were there a lot of people that opposed this when you wrote this the first time?  I thought it was close to a given he was gone.  The only reservation I had was that McB loves certain guys and want them around.  

Yes there were many who still regard him as a decent player and assumed that they would keep him because the cal savings wasn’t that big.  

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

Ok then who was Beane’s worst free signing?  

Trent Murphy. His worst roster decision was also keeping Trent Murphy as a 3rd-4th DE at nealy $10 million cap hit in 2020.

[JohnNord]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

Kelvin Benjamin?

He wasn’t a free agent signing.  He traded for Benjamin.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, billsfan714 said:

Hallelujah!!!!!   I no longer have to listen to morons on this board try to stand logic on its head to defend him anymore.   No more, its his job to not make plays or you don't know his assignment because I played HS football.

 

Happy Days!!!!!!

 

Now dear lord, just do the same in about 365 days when we let Tre walk.

 

Huh?  Why would we let Tre' walk in 365 days?  Are you thinking he won't come back from his ACL in form?  Most guys  seem to these days

 

(If you mean Tremaine Edmunds, I don't think he goes by Tre.  He has a brother named Trey, so that would be confusing.)

[BillsFanSD]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Trent Murphy. His worst roster decision was also keeping Trent Murphy as a 3rd-4th DE at nealy $10 million cap hit in 2020.

This is actually a pretty good nominee.

[TDO'Kearney]

10 minutes ago, Malazan said:

 

For a team that talks about depth all the time we are getting perilously thing at whipping boy. 

 

And if we score less than 40 in game 1, the offensive coordinator always sucks.

[Franco_92]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'll try.

 

A player's cap hit consists of yearly cash (salary and per-year bonuses like roster and workout).  The player also gets a signing bonus fully paid to him when he signs his contract, but amortized over the years of the contract.  For example, a $10.4M signing bonus on a 4 year contract would be transferred to Star's bank account immediately when he signs. but for salary cap bookkeeping, it can be divided into 4 chunks to count against the salary cap at $2.6M/year.  

 

The player can also have all or part of his yearly cash (salary and roster and option bonuses) guaranteed.  In Star's case, he had $2.5M of his 2022 salary guaranteed. 

 

When the player is cut, the guaranteed part of his yearly cash counts against the cap ($2.5M for Star), as does the chunk of his signing bonus that counts against this year's cap ($2.6M for Star).  The team gets credit for any non-guaranteed salary or bonuses.  So that's $5.1M guaranteed for this year against Star's yearly cap hit of $9.2M, resulting in $4.1M cap savings.  BUT WAIT!

 

Now we get to the decision point: when a player is cut, any guaranteed money or amortized signing bonus from future years ALSO get charged against the cap savings.  So in Star's case, he has another chunk of $2.6M signing bonus on the books for next season.  That counts against the savings - so $4.1M - $2.6M means we only save $1.5M this season

 

UNLESS - the NFL allows the team to designate two players cut during FA as "post-June 1 cuts".  What that does, is allow the team to defer next year's guaranteed money or remaining chunks of amortized signing bonus to count against NEXT year's cap.  It's "good for the player" because it encourages teams to release players early when they have a better chance to be signed by other teams; it's "good for the team" because they can spread out the cap hit from cutting a player over two seasons.

 

The drawback is, the team does not realize the cap savings until after June 1.

 

So with Star:

Cut pre-June 1, $9.2M cap - $2.5M guaranteed salary - $2.6Mx2 amortized signing bonus for this year and next = $1.5M cap savings applicable NOW

Cut post-June 1, $9.2M cap - $2.5M guaranteed salary - $2.6M amortized signing bonus for this year and next = $4.1M cap savings applicable June 1 AND $2.6M amortized signing bonus charged against the 2023 cap.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There should be a sticky post on the forum, at least in the offseason, that generalizes this and uses this and other contracts as examples. Very helpful. 

[Warcodered]

Just now, JohnNord said:

He wasn’t a free agent signing.  He traded for Benjamin.  

I fail to see the significance of the difference there.

[DrDawkinstein]

4 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

Ok then who was Beane’s worst free signing?  

 

Murphy or Vernon Butler off the top of my head.

[NewEra]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

Yes there were many who still regard him as a decent player and assumed that they would keep him because the cal savings wasn’t that big.  

Gotcha. My bad, I must have missed it.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

Yes there were many who still regard him as a decent player and assumed that they would keep him because the cal savings wasn’t that big.  

 

I'll own it.  I thought he played very well at the start of the season before he caught Covid, that Jones is the only natural fit they've signed at 1TDT, and that McDermott's love of the DT rotation would lead him to hang on to Star at least through the draft because the cap savings aren't big

[JohnNord]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Trent Murphy. His worst roster decision was also keeping Trent Murphy as a 3rd-4th DE at nealy $10 million cap hit in 2020.

Yes…another bad signing but I would argue that Star was worse considering how much they relied on him. Plus Murphy was an injury risk.  They didn’t completely rely on him and had contract outs unlike Star.  Still Murphy and Star are close for worst contracts 

[billsfan714]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Huh?  Why would we let Tre' walk in 365 days?  Are you thinking he won't come back from his ACL in form?  Most guys  seem to these days

 

(If you mean Tremaine Edmunds, I don't think he goes by Tre.  He has a brother named Trey, so that would be confusing.)

I meant Edmunds sparky

[JohnNord]

2 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said:

This is actually a pretty good nominee.

I agree but still think Star was worse.  Tremendous opportunity cost.