Jets Fan Admitting Josh Allen is Better and Why

[WideNine]

5 minutes ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

 

Joe Flacco has been a better QB than Sam Darnold this season playing with the same team and same Coach.

 

I think Gase does alright with established QBs, and most coaches would, but he is no QB whisperer.

 

Would you really want Gase to develop your shiny new rookie QB - honestly?

 

Flacco was a 1st round pick in 2008 and has been in the league for 12 years so I would not be in a rush to attribute any better play from an established veteran at the QB position to anything Gase is doing better. That, and although Flacco may be putting up better numbers, the Jets are still pumping out the losses each week.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

2 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

 

 

Jets did no good for Darnold, no good at all. Coaching staff sucked, the players around him sucked. No OL, no WRs. Allen totally benefited from the culture AND the “Process” that McD established here. Give props to McD where it’s due. Give props to Beane, Daboll and the Pegula’s. Allen walked into the perfect landing spot.

 

Wrong again.

 

Allen in 2018 inherited a worse OL and worse WRs than Darnold. 

 

He just showed way more promise and ability than Darnold, which convinced his franchise that he was "the guy" where as Darnold was just atrocious.

 

 

[syhuang]

Not all Jets fans though, some Jets fans still think Darnold is better. Now Jets just need to sign Darnold for a long term deal instead of drafting a QB in 1st round. 😉

 

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https://forums.jetnation.com/topic/156626-josh-allen-evolving-while-darnold-regresses/?tab=comments#comment-4761606

 

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I still think darnold is better than allen. Allen has a team around him and an offensive line. Darnold has no team outside of a left tackle and a coach who believes that players need to build around his offensive play calling instead of building his playcalls around the strengths of his players. I would be surprised if darnold doesn't take a leap foward after gase is away from him.

 

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[JoshAllenReceipts]

1 minute ago, WideNine said:

 

I think Gase does alright with established QBs, and most coaches would, but he is no QB whisperer.

 

Would you really want Gase to develop your shiny new rookie QB - honestly?

 

Flacco was a 1st round pick in 2008 and has been in the league for 12 years so I would not be in a rush to attribute any better play from an established veteran at the QB position to anything Gase is doing better. That, and although Flacco may be putting up better numbers, the Jets are still pumping out the losses each week.

 

 

It doesn't matter. Stop making excuses for Sam Darnold. Joe Flacco >>> Darnold under the SAME CONDITIONS.

 

End of discussion. Darnold isn't even better than Flacco in 2020.

 

 

[Hebert19]

1 hour ago, mykidsdad said:

I can't imagine the Pats losing on purpose. But I think the math is right. A tie record, means the jags draft first.

Trevor Lawrence > any QB since Manning. I hope I'm wrong. I'm a Clemson fan, so I'm biased, but I've been watching the kid more closely, too.

I actually think he's breakable just like darnold.   While many have annointed him king i actually think Burrow and Herbert have better shots at being perennial pro bowlers. 

[Inigo Montoya]

I can't argue that the Bills front office has put Allen is a position to succeed and the Jets' front office has been inadequate in supporting Darnold's development. 

 

What I take issue with is that the guy doing the video above gives Josh Allen no credit for any of his improvement.  His position is that the Bills made Allen, and while it's true that Beane, McDermott, Daboll, and Dorsey were all a part of the equation, the person most responsible for Josh Allen's success is... Josh Allen.  That seems to get lost in the equation somewhere.

 

Revamping the O-Line last year is not responsible for how Allen is now throwing the ball with touch and anticipation causing an almost 20% jump in his completion percentage from his rookie year.   Bringing in Beasley and Brown is not responsible for Allen no longer playing Hero Ball causing turnovers and making cringe worthy plays weekly.  Bringing in Diggs in not the reason Allen leads the entire NFL in 4th quarter winning drives and come from behind victories.

 

There is just something in Josh Allen that drives him to succeed.  Brandon Beane and the coaching staff didn't create that drive in him.  Brown, Beasley, and Diggs didn't cause him to move and rent a house so he could be close to his QB coach during the off season so he could continue to work on his craft during the COVID pandemic.  The revamped O-Line isn't the reason Josh is the first and last person in and out of the building everyday.

 

Saying that the only difference between Darnold and Allen is the difference between the Jets and the Bills is overly simplistic and short changes the drive that Allen has to be the best QB he can be.  Everyone says they want to be the best, very few have the drive to make that happen.  Did Darnold get hosed going to the Jets?  Absolutely.  Would Allen find a way to get better and evolve no matter where he went?  Absolutely.  That is what the gentleman in the video above fails to acknowledge.

 

It's time people start to acknowledge the simple truth, Josh Allen is the single biggest reason for Josh Allen's success.

[WideNine]

2 minutes ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

 

It doesn't matter. Stop making excuses for Sam Darnold. Joe Flacco >>> Darnold under the SAME CONDITIONS.

 

End of discussion. Darnold isn't even better than Flacco in 2020.

 

 

 

How am I making excused for Sam Darnold.

 

Is it not possible that both he and Gase suck separately or suck when combined. I was only pointing out the fact that Gase has sucked the life out of two teams where he has been the HC. I just believe that it is hard to lay all that team dysfunction at the feet of a kid fresh out of college.

 

 

[Victory Formation]

1 minute ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Wrong again.

 

Allen in 2018 inherited a worse OL and worse WRs than Darnold. 

 

He just showed way more promise and ability than Darnold, which convinced his franchise that he was "the guy" where as Darnold was just atrocious.

 

 

Allen was a mess his rookie year.. Props to him, he bought into “The Process” and the rest is history.. Good coaching and a stable organization with GREAT OWNERS AND STAFF BENEFITTED HIM! 
 

I want to point out that I was flogged and beaten and slandered for having Allen as my #2 overall prospect in 2018 behind only Baker Mayfield. Get off me. I was his biggest fan on this board since 3 years ago. Lay off me. Many of you people just go with what’s hot at the moment and you miss out on the big picture. What you fail to realize is that the JETS organization is hot garbage and even if they DO draft Trevor Lawrence, HE WILL BE A BUST TOO.

 

Go back to the draft threads from three years ago. I loved Allen before 99.9% of you. If he went to the Jets it would be over for him.

[PromoTheRobot]

8 minutes ago, syhuang said:

Not all Jets fans though, some Jets fans still think Darnold is better. Now Jets just need to sign Darnold for a long term deal instead of drafting a QB in 1st round. 😉

 

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https://forums.jetnation.com/topic/156626-josh-allen-evolving-while-darnold-regresses/?tab=comments#comment-4761606

 

 

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This doesn't even make sense because Josh Allen is a physical freak. Darnold is okay for a mortal. Darnold can never be better than Allen physically.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

9 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

How am I making excused for Sam Darnold.

 

Is it not possible that both he and Gase suck separately or suck when combined. I was only pointing out the fact that Gase has sucked the life out of two teams where he has been the HC. I just believe that it is hard to lay all that team dysfunction at the feet of a kid fresh out of college.

 

 

 

Huh? Darnold's coach as a rookie wasn't Gase.

9 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

Allen was a mess his rookie year.. Props to him, he bought into “The Process” and the rest is history.. Good coaching and a stable organization with GREAT OWNERS AND STAFF BENEFITTED HIM! 
 

I want to point out that I was flogged and beaten and slandered for having Allen as my #2 overall prospect in 2018 behind only Baker Mayfield. Get off me. I was his biggest fan on this board since 3 years ago. Lay off me. Many of you people just go with what’s hot at the moment and you miss out on the big picture. What you fail to realize is that the JETS organization is hot garbage and even if they DO draft Trevor Lawrence, HE WILL BE A BUST TOO.

 

Go back to the draft threads from three years ago. I loved Allen before 99.9% of you. If he went to the Jets it would be over for him.

 

 

Allen had 18 TDs to 12 INTs as a rookie with no OL and no WRs, and made game-changing plays with his legs. Hardly a "mess"

[WideNine]

2 minutes ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Huh? Darnold's coach as a rookie wasn't Gase.

 

 

Allen had 18 TDs to 12 INTs as a rookie with no OL and no WRs, and made game-changing plays with his legs. Hardly a "mess"

 

If you watched the video that was the year that Darnold showed promise.

 

So... I am kind of done with your business.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

3 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

If you watched the video that was the year that Darnold showed promise.

 

So... I am kind of done with your business.

 

Promise?

 

Yeah, like that 4-INT game vs Miami, including a Pick 6 with the score tied 13-13 to singlehandedly lose the game. I knew right then and there, the JETS knew right then and there "This is not the guy". Darnold was benched for Luke McCown after that disaster.

 

Darnold was trash as a rookie. The Jets hired Gase because trash deserves to be with other trash. Darnold and Gase are the perfect fit. They belong together.

Edited December 15, 2020 by JoshAllenReceipts

[Augie]

2 hours ago, mykidsdad said:

Agreed. That's why I have never rooted more for the Jets to win a game.

 

If Belichick is indeed as brilliant as he is said to be.................

[Victory Formation]

1 minute ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Promise?

 

Yeah, like that 4-INT game vs Miami, including a Pick 6 with the score tied 13-13 to singlehandedly lose the game. 

 

Darnold was trash as a rookie. The Jets hired Gase because trash deserves to be with other trash. Darnold and Gase are the perfect fit. They belong together.

I know what kind of fan you are.. The second Allen has a poor showing in the playoffs you’ll be right off the bandwagon.. You know what they say about wrestling with pigs.. I’ll give you the last word.

[Beast]

The video is garbage.

 

Calling Allen, currently, a top 15 QB?

 

Nah.

 

Top 5 is more like it.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

5 minutes ago, Beast said:

The video is garbage.

 

Calling Allen, currently, a top 15 QB?

 

Nah.

 

Top 5 is more like it.

 

 

And he completely ignores Josh Allen's Rushing Numbers when comparing their stats side by side.

 

How convenient.

[purple haze]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

I was talking with a Jets fan friend and he said he and his son were lamenting the Jets taking Darnold over Josh. He said his son told him “but dad it wouldn’t have mattered, the Jets would have ruined him also.”  I said “maybe, but Darnold looks like the same guy as he did when I started paying attention to during his sophomore season in college and that was the when I realized I didn’t want him.”  He agreed with that as well. 

This☝🏾
 

The Jets have done him no favors, but Darnold has not improved in any discernible way.   He was a turnover machine at SC and he still is.  He makes some great throws and makes some plays with his legs, but it doesn’t happen at the same rate now because the athleticism in the NFL is too high compared to college.  That said, I thought he would be better.

[TH3]

1 hour ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

 

Allen would have been a stud had he went to the Jets; he would have been a stud literally anywhere he went. He would have had a much much better 2019 season than Darnold with Robby Anderson, Crowder, and Lev Bell. Which would have prompted the Jets to resign Robby Anderson. Main reason Jets didn't resign Robby was because Darnold was beyond atrocious when targeting him.

 

Josh Allen would be throwing TD bombs to Robby Anderson in 2020, on the Jets.

 

Tua is awful. He's not an NFL starting caliber QB. Just a college System QB. Dude will bust so hard.

 

Facing Tua 2x a year is phenomenal for the Bills, Pats, and Jets. I can promise you that Tua is NOT good.

 

 

No...JA would not be a stud had he been a Jet

 

 

AFA the video.....guy was on point till he said if Jets had their act together ...he would still take Darnold over JA today....

Edited December 16, 2020 by TH3

[JoshAllenReceipts]

1 minute ago, TH3 said:

No...JA would not be a stud had he been a Jet

 

 

AFA the video.....guy was on point till he said if Jets had their act together ...he would still take Donald over JA today....

 

1) Yes, JA would still be a stud on the Jets.

 

2) AFA the video...the guy wasn't "on point" at all...far from it. He ignored JA's rushing stats when comparing them to try and make Darnold out to be better, and gave zero credit to JA himself for his success. Basically, his point is that "Josh is only successful because of what the Bills did"...nothing he said in that video is on point.

[RunTheBall]

Trevor Lawrence is not Andrew Luck. He’s the best of a mediocre QB crop and benefits from having the best college players next to Alabama at almost every position. There is absolutely no guarantee he’s going to be a good pro QB and its silly to talk about him as this can’t miss prospect. I could care less if the Jets draft him because they will likely destroy their next QB too. There are going to be a lot of coaching vacancies this year and just because the Jets might have the #1 pick doesn’t mean good coaching prospects will be flocking to go to that sht show of a franchise.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

31 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

I know what kind of fan you are.. The second Allen has a poor showing in the playoffs you’ll be right off the bandwagon.. You know what they say about wrestling with pigs.. I’ll give you the last word.

 

1) I am on the Josh Allen bandwagon until the day I die. I can promise you that.

 

2) Sam Darnold was TERRIBLE as a rookie. So bad that the Jets benched him for Luke McCown after his 4-INT self-destruction versus Miami.

[blacklabel]

If I'm Trevor Lawrence and the Jets secure the #1 overall pick, then I'm going back to school. The Jets are an eternal dumpster fire for as long as they're owned by Woody Johnson. 

[JoshAllenReceipts]

1 minute ago, RunTheBall said:

Trevor Lawrence is not Andrew Luck. He’s the best of a mediocre QB crop and benefits from having the best college players next to Alabama at almost every position. There is absolutely no guarantee he’s going to be a good pro QB and its silly to talk about him as this can’t miss prospect. I could care less if the Jets draft him because they will likely destroy their next QB too. There are going to be a lot of coaching vacancies this year and just because the Jets might have the #1 pick doesn’t mean good coaching prospects will be flocking to go to that sht show of a franchise.

 

 

Trevor Lawrence isn't Josh Allen.

 

Trevor Lawrence will never be as good of an NFL QB as Josh Allen.

[DuckyBoys]

Darnold is just not any good.  Continuing to make excuses for him three years in is just as bad as people still knocking Allen based on pre draft narrative.  Yes the Jets are garbage but I have yet to see Sam even flash anything special. 

[djp14150]

2 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

Well it's Fields or Lawrence for them either way.  

 

How the hell did the Jags beat the Colts?

 

Best case, New England tanks week 17.  Jags don't win another game.  Lawrence decides to stay. 

jags have at least 7 loses where it was just a one score deficit in the 4th. They have played close games.

 

they have had injuries at Wub.

 

Remrmber in week 1 Co,TS had a new QB in Rivers so this was a preseason game.

[WideNine]

19 minutes ago, Beast said:

The video is garbage.

 

Calling Allen, currently, a top 15 QB?

 

Nah.

 

Top 5 is more like it.

 

There was more than a bit of homerism in that video and he did ignore Allen's rushing TDs, and the work Allen put in himself both during the season and offseason to correct flaws in his game and mechanics.

 

I always thought Allen had a higher ceiling, and that has never changed as he simply has rare physical abilities.

 

I also believe with better coaching and support Darnold could salvage his career with probably another team that could bring him along slowly, and support him.

 

The league and its history are littered with QBs that found more success after failing with their 1st team.

 

This is all conjecture, but hard to toss the 3rd overall pick after he fails under a coach that has not proven he can lead a team or a QB not named Manning to success.

 

 

 

 

[Beast]

2 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

There was more than a bit of homerism in that video and he did ignore Allen's rushing TDs, and the work Allen put in himself both during the season and offseason to correct flaws in his game and mechanics.

 

I always thought Allen had a higher ceiling, and that has never changed as he simply has rare physical abilities.

 

I also believe with better coaching and support Darnold could salvage his career with probably another team that could bring him along slowly, and support him.

 

The league and its history are littered with QBs that found more success after failing with their 1st team.

 

This is all conjecture, but hard to toss the 3rd overall pick after he fails under a coach that has not proven he can lead a team or a QB not named Manning to success.

 

 

 

 

I’m far from calling Darnold a bust. 
 

I remember Gase and Tannehill.

 

Yeah.

[djp14150]

To develop a QB you need stability with coaches.  Especially with offense.

 

Darnell situation was unfair to him with all the changes.

 

 

[JoshAllenReceipts]

8 minutes ago, Beast said:

I’m far from calling Darnold a bust. 
 

I remember Gase and Tannehill.

 

Yeah.

 

Why do people keep making this comparison?

 

Tannehill was not a bad QB with Gase in Miami. He was a decent QB. He just wasn't great. But at least he was decent. He made accurate throws when they were there to be made. He actually graded well in Miami throw4throw by PFF. Tannehill had solid PFF grades in Miami with Gase, and his play in general was solid; He was NOT bad.

 

The same cannot be said for Darnold. Darnold has been absolutely horrible in every way shape or form. Eye test shows it. Conventional stats show it. Even PFF grades show it. (UNLIKE Tannehill, Darnold is at or near the bottom in PFF grading all the time)

 

To summarize:

Tannehill = Decent QB under Gase

Darnold = Atrocious QB under Gase

 

Decent and Atrocious are not equivalent.

Edited December 16, 2020 by JoshAllenReceipts

[Beast]

Just now, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Why do people keep making this comparison?

 

Tannehill was not a bad QB with Gase in Miami. He was a decent QB. He just wasn't great. But at least he was decent. He made accurate throws when they were there to be made. He actually graded well in Miami throw4throw by PFF. Tannehill had solid PFF grades in Miami with Gase.

 

The same cannot be said for Darnold. Darnold has been absolutely horrible in every way shape or form. Eye test shows it. Conventional stats show it. Even PFF grades show it. (UNLIKE Tannehill, Darnold is at or near the bottom in PFF grading all the time)

 

To summarize:

Tannehill = Decent QB under Gase

Darnold = Atrocious QB under Gase

 

Decent and Atrocious are not equivalent.

They are making it because Gase is an absolute disaster and that has an effect on a QB.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

27 minutes ago, Beast said:

They are making it because Gase is an absolute disaster and that has an effect on a QB.

 

 

Darnold is an absolute disaster and that has an effect on his Coach.

[MJS]

3 hours ago, Starr Almighty said:

Sign Sam "Ghosts" Darnold to be Josh's backup 🤷🏻‍♂️

I don't hate that idea, actually. Those two are already friends. I thought he looked a lot better the past two years and just fell off a cliff (with the rest of the franchise) this year. He made similar improvements from year one to year two as Allen did. He is a top 3 draft pick do you know he has the physical attributes and potential.

 

Give him a couple of years in the process and he could be turned around.

31 minutes ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Why do people keep making this comparison?

 

Tannehill was not a bad QB with Gase in Miami. He was a decent QB. He just wasn't great. But at least he was decent. He made accurate throws when they were there to be made. He actually graded well in Miami throw4throw by PFF. Tannehill had solid PFF grades in Miami with Gase, and his play in general was solid; He was NOT bad.

 

The same cannot be said for Darnold. Darnold has been absolutely horrible in every way shape or form. Eye test shows it. Conventional stats show it. Even PFF grades show it. (UNLIKE Tannehill, Darnold is at or near the bottom in PFF grading all the time)

 

To summarize:

Tannehill = Decent QB under Gase

Darnold = Atrocious QB under Gase

 

Decent and Atrocious are not equivalent.

Gase isn't even trying anymore, though. He's just waiting for the season to end.

[JoshAllenReceipts]

29 minutes ago, Beast said:

They are making it because Gase is an absolute disaster and that has an effect on a QB.

 

 

If Darnold had good weapons, he would just be a bad QB with good weapons.

 

If Darnold had a good Coach, he would just be a bad QB with a good Coach.

 

Darnold is a bad QB. This is the root of the problem.

[DJB]

3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

I dont think that Darnold has the Desire and Want to (in order to get better).  Is he putting the work it, his mechanics are still as bad as they were in USC.

 

Take ANYONE but Fields (he will become the best QB in that class).

 

Nah. 

 

Hes going to have a ton of INT's in the NFL. He perpetually locks onto his first target regardless and struggles with reading the entire field. 

 

https://www.dynastyfootballlife.com/justin-fields

[Doc Brown]

1 hour ago, blacklabel said:

If I'm Trevor Lawrence and the Jets secure the #1 overall pick, then I'm going back to school. The Jets are an eternal dumpster fire for as long as they're owned by Woody Johnson. 

What's he going to do when the Jets have the #1 pick again the following year then?

[Beast]

8 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

What's he going to do when the Jets have the #1 pick again the following year then?

 

The Canadian League, eh?

[TheBrownBear]

The bloom was off the rose for Darnold starting in his final season at USC.  Defenses had sort of figured him out and were already getting him to turn the ball over in bunches.  I'm a UCLA guy and pretty much only watch Pac-12, and I was never high on Darnold and did not want the Bills to select him.  I think in the right situation he could be a Nick Foles kind of guy, but that's pretty much it.

[Bob in STL]

I don’t know how you guys know who is going to be better than who when scouts and GMs dedicate their professional life to this and are usually wrong.  
 

It would not surprise me if the Jets do a bad job with whoever they draft or that Darnold is actually salvaged by another program. 

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, JoshAllenReceipts said:

 

Why do people keep making this comparison?

 

Tannehill was not a bad QB with Gase in Miami. He was a decent QB. He just wasn't great. But at least he was decent. He made accurate throws when they were there to be made. He actually graded well in Miami throw4throw by PFF. Tannehill had solid PFF grades in Miami with Gase, and his play in general was solid; He was NOT bad.

 

The same cannot be said for Darnold. Darnold has been absolutely horrible in every way shape or form. Eye test shows it. Conventional stats show it. Even PFF grades show it. (UNLIKE Tannehill, Darnold is at or near the bottom in PFF grading all the time)

 

To summarize:

Tannehill = Decent QB under Gase

Darnold = Atrocious QB under Gase

 

Decent and Atrocious are not equivalent.

Problem  with you summary is that the Jets under Gase, and Miami under Gase, are not equivalent.  The Jets are far worse.  You can’t make a straight and simple comparison.  
 

Im not a Darnold fan and I’m no expert on his ceiling or on developing a QB.    Someone that needs a QB will give him a shot and if lands in a better place he just might improve. 
 

 

[jimmy10]

4 hours ago, Greg S said:

They will be making the argument that Lawrence is the best QB in the division once they draft him.

If the Jets end up with #1 overall, watch Lawrence decide to go to grad school.