J. Palmer on Allen ‘blue collar, work ethic, farmer’

[blacklabel]

6 minutes ago, teef said:

i think you have an odd take when it comes to bills fans.  from your short time on this board i've  realized:

1.  you think only people in wny drink light beer, (and that light beer will be a thing of the past)

2.  if people are excited for training camp/football to start, they don't like summer.

 

Hey pal, you insult my light beer and my dislike for summer again and I'm.... I'm gonna sit right here and do sh*t-all about it.

[teef]

Just now, blacklabel said:

 

Hey pal, you insult my light beer and my dislike for summer again and I'm.... I'm gonna sit right here and do sh*t-all about it.

i had a cold coors light last night while sitting in my torn up back yard.  i'm a fan of light beer, and a bigger fan of the summer.

[K-9]

36 minutes ago, Jrb1979 said:

Its not a great sign but you're forgetting that you can't say anything negative about the franchise QB. You can't take away the fans hope going into the season.?

You guys have to get over the Blue collar lunch pail garbage. Its not the Rockpile days anymore. I realize a lot of you are fans from those days but teams now aren't built that way anymore. Its 2019 not 1960. 

All due respect, that’s a load of crap.

 

If you feel a solid work ethic is no longer in vogue and not essential as the foundation for success, you have little understanding of team building dynamics.

[teef]

6 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

 

Oh, I forgot the big hands for throwing the ball in the cold part.

 

Throwing the ball accurately, consistently, is what we need from the QB, that's it.  I did not hear Palmer mention that.

 

People in the media keep saying the "blue collar" garbage because there isn't much else nice to say about the Buffalo fans base.  Rust belt fans with sports organizations that never win.

 

were you in so need of attention that you actually went back and added this on to your original post?!  that is just to funny.  keep changing to new user names bud!

[MacGyver]

Just now, K-9 said:

All due respect, that’s a load of crap.

 

If you feel a solid work ethic is no longer in vogue and not essential as the foundation for success, you have little understanding of team building dynamics.

 

Talent Trumps lunch pail work ethic every time.

[K-9]

1 minute ago, MacGyver said:

 

Talent Trumps lunch pail work ethic every time.

Yep. And I’m not even remotely close to suggesting otherwise. 

 

Talent without that work ethic is useless. It’s what separates the good from the great. If you can name one great in any sport that didn’t have a superior work ethic, I might reconsider. 

[Johnnycage46]

9 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

 

Talent Trumps lunch pail work ethic every time.

 Marcel would like word...

[Boca BIlls]

10 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

 

Talent Trumps lunch pail work ethic every time.

Talent does nothing without the work ethic. To say one over the other means you have no idea at all. The only thing that makes a difference at all is the work ethic. Talent without the other has never succeeded EVER. Without the drive to be better the talent is wasted, it gets shown all the time.

Edited July 24, 2019 by Boca BIlls

[Elite Poster]

4 hours ago, Rocket94 said:

I like it...old school farm boy makes it big. Not much to do after work but Chuck footballs!

 

The farm boy pretty much had the most rich boy summer of all time. This stuff is getting silly at this point. 

35 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Sorry, I didn’t realize that hard work and taking pride in your craft no longer pays any dividends on the field?  That’s not a generational thing, it’s a universal truth, as relevant as the concept of gravity. Knock it all you want, but character still matters. 

 

Then why did Tom "Deflated Balls" Brady, Bill "Tape Your Practice" Belichick, and Robert "Cheat on Girlfriend with Prostitute" Kraft win yet another ring while we are stuck doing mental gymnastics justifying losing year after year?

 

Character and work ethic are two different things. Talent and work ethic are really all you need, everything else is just to make you feel good. 

[MacGyver]

18 minutes ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 Marcel would like word...

 

He was/is an unintelligent pothead, that's why he wasted his talent.  He didn't need to be a Ryan Denny with is level of talent, just had to not be an idiot, in which he failed.

[Johnnycage46]

2 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

 

He was/is an unintelligent pothead, that's why he wasted his talent.  He didn't need to be a Ryan Denny with is level of talent, just had to not be an idiot, in which he failed.

 

I think more importantly, and to your original point, he had loads of talent but no drive (regardless of if he was a pothead, he certainly lacked motor).  Kyle Williams is a perfect example of a "lunch pail" guy with above-average but not necessarily elite talent that had a long and successful career.  Of course talent matters, but talent without drive is nothing.

[Rocket94]

59 minutes ago, Elite Poster said:

 

The farm boy pretty much had the most rich boy summer of all time. This stuff is getting silly at this point. 

 

Then why did Tom "Deflated Balls" Brady, Bill "Tape Your Practice" Belichick, and Robert "Cheat on Girlfriend with Prostitute" Kraft win yet another ring while we are stuck doing mental gymnastics justifying losing year after year?

 

Character and work ethic are two different things. Talent and work ethic are really all you need, everything else is just to make you feel good. 

I was kidding. I like Allen and I find his honesty and work ethic refreshing. Many of the good virtues that he possesses were obviously instilled in him growing up. I believe that he did remarkably well last year considering what he was up against. He didn't even play a full season!

[Paulus]

9 hours ago, The Bills Blog said:

I'm concerned about Allen's anticipation. In Embedded, you see Beasley telling him to throw with anticipation, and Allen protests, saying he'll put it on Beasley as soon as he turns (in other words, "My arm is so strong I don't have to worry about anticipation"). Not a great sign.

Is this the new reporter chick's account? Like, Rodak but with balls?

[ColoradoBills]

2 hours ago, blacklabel said:

 

Yeah, every time I see stuff about work ethic, character, competitiveness, etc. it'll remind me of EJ. Good dude, I'm sure he worked hard as well. He didn't get the best deal in having Marrone/Hackett tell him from day one, "If it isn't there, just run." He already had that mentality in college and I thought it was something he needed to work on but Marrone was all about his 1970s-style power run game so that's what we got. The other thing for EJ that never came together was the mental side of things. I recall reading an article on the official website just before the 2014 season began and it mentioned how he struggled in school quite a bit and needed tutors. Nothing wrong with that, but I'm sure that puts someone even more behind the 8-ball when trying to study/recall/execute all the things a professional QB does. He also looked like he lacked a degree of trust in his teammates. If the play wasn't there as designed, his instinct was to do it himself somehow. 

 

EJ was a highly recruited High School prospect whose Dad was friends with Bruce Smith.

His was given every opportunity to succeed in college and the pro's.

I hoped he would be a great franchise QB for the Bills.  He wasn't.

 

Josh Allen went to JUCO and was throwing cantaloupe crates on the trailer.

That's blue collar in my book and I also hope he becomes a great franchise QB for the Bills.

[C.Biscuit97]

So sick of the term blue collar.  I think it’s a subtle put down. They do with Buffalo a lot and it’s residents.   You aren’t super smart or talented, you just work hard.  Like there are no other type of people in Buffalo or that “white collar” people don’t work hard.

 

and to make the nfl, you have to work your @ss off.  Very few dudes are so talented that can coast to make it to the league.  How many Bills players have been recently who’s problem was not working hard enough as opposed to just not being good enough?  The foundation of the rosters for the last 18 years is hard working guys who just aren’t good enough. 

[IDBillzFan]

28 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So sick of the term blue collar.  I think it’s a subtle put down. They do with Buffalo a lot and it’s residents.   You aren’t super smart or talented, you just work hard.  Like there are no other type of people in Buffalo or that “white collar” people don’t work hard.

 

Yikes. It's the total opposite to me. The difference between blue collar and white collar, to me, is that blue collar is willing to do whatever is necessary. They go where you need them, how you need them, when you need them. Resolve.Grit. Determination. Commitment. They don't blame others for their failures and they don't pound their chest for their wins. 

 

[ColdFront_USAF]

9 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

I see your point. The other 2 had great college programs and coaching Josh didn’t have. Allen’s arm strength is solely what he had to offer and with near zero help in quality coaching. It appears he knows this too and is willing to learn. He’s just a couple years behind the other two in quality coaching. I’m hopeful his cannon and unreal running skills will bode us well while he completes his apprenticeship for a couple more years..

 

I like what you said about a couple more years. I feel like too many fans expect Superbowl or bust for a sophomore QB, and that's a really unfair standard to set. I would be ecstatic if Allen becomes a top 5-10 QB this year, but I'm more looking for across the board improvements. Can he throw with more anticipation like Palmer mentioned? Can he develop his touch passes more, and raise the completion percentage in the short game? Can he take what the defense gives him instead of always looking for the deep play? Can he learn to trust his new o line and weapons, stay in the pocket and get the most of their abilities when the blocking allows it? I can't wait to find out, just a few more weeks. 

[Victory Formation]

I'm excited that he is working on anticipation and touch specifically.

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

Yikes. It's the total opposite to me. The difference between blue collar and white collar, to me, is that blue collar is willing to do whatever is necessary. They go where you need them, how you need them, when you need them. Resolve.Grit. Determination. Commitment. They don't blame others for their failures and they don't pound their chest for their wins. 

 

There are some very whiny blue collar people out there who complain about everything and everyone.   There are white collar people who do what you describe blue collar people as. 

 

I would bet bet a lot of people would say Brady and Rodgers are white collar.  But those dudes were completely overlooked and worked their butts off to get where they are at.  

[Bring it]

10 hours ago, H2o said:

Throwing with anticipation will come with familiarity and trust. When Allen can know what his guys are going to do, how they run their routes, the nuances about their game, then he will trust them to throw the ball earlier. He has to build that chemistry with all of the new guys. You could already see him doing it with Zay and Foster toward the end of the year. 

Yeah I agree. It’s going to take time but Beasley and Josh are both right  to some extent. Allen can shorten that window because of arm strength but he will still need some anticipation. They will get on the same page but it’s even more important that Josh puts it where Beasley wants it. Catch in stride! To make him really dangerous! He will flash it this year maybe a lot. But watch out once the two of them get a season together!!!

[The Bills Blog]

On 7/24/2019 at 4:56 AM, Boca BIlls said:

Dear God man... Stop with this crap. Two different scenarios, one is Matt and then later Beasley is talking about a route where the ball is supposed to be on him the second he turns around. I hate when people troll for controversy.

 

Yes just watched it again and you basically made this whole BS up. Good job.

Seriously, what? It's obvious that Beasley is asking him to throw the ball sooner, and Allen defensively explains why he doesn't have to. Trolling? Not... Not at all? So confused.

 

Edited July 26, 2019 by Hapless Bills Fan
If you feel you are being bullied, the "report" function is at your service.

[Bring it]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

EJ was a highly recruited High School prospect whose Dad was friends with Bruce Smith.

His was given every opportunity to succeed in college and the pro's.

I hoped he would be a great franchise QB for the Bills.  He wasn't.

 

Josh Allen went to JUCO and was throwing cantaloupe crates on the trailer.

That's blue collar in my book and I also hope he becomes a great franchise QB for the Bills.

It’s really hard to compare the two, hard to see what’s under the hood so to speak. The only attribute I can really see Josh having more of is confidence. He is convinced that he will succeed!! When asked if he ever doubted that he would get to the NFL he quickly and firmly said no.

 I don’t know who worked harder, but I m sure glad we have Allen!!

[C.Biscuit97]

9 minutes ago, The Bills Blog said:

Seriously, what? It's obvious that Beasley is asking him to throw the ball sooner, and Allen defensively explains why he doesn't have to. Trolling? Not... Not at all? So confused.

 

I swear I can't post on here without borderline cyber-bullying or actual cyber-bullying in response.

It’s cult like if you don’t agree with the majority.  There was nothing rooting wrong with your criticism and non Bills fans would say the same.  You didn’t say Allen sucked or couldn’t improve.  Everyone is so sensitive.

[Gugny]

16 minutes ago, The Bills Blog said:

Seriously, what? It's obvious that Beasley is asking him to throw the ball sooner, and Allen defensively explains why he doesn't have to. Trolling? Not... Not at all? So confused.

 

I swear I can't post on here without borderline cyber-bullying or actual cyber-bullying in response.

 

Stop it.  You know you're not being bullied just as much as everyone else knows you're a troll.

 

Try to be better at it.

[NoHuddleKelly12]

15 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

 

This place is quite biased against non-homers. 

I respectfully disagree. There is a significant cabal on the boards who almost reflexively take issue with most of the Bills’ moves and/or roster quality, yet have not been banned or barred from expressing themselves however they please. The fact that any opinions here are subject to push-back is hardly a sign of bias—make rational arguments supported by facts and citations, and let good discussions flow from there. 

[Johnnycage46]

38 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

There are some very whiny blue collar people out there who complain about everything and everyone.   There are white collar people who do what you describe blue collar people as. 

 

I would bet bet a lot of people would say Brady and Rodgers are white collar.  But those dudes were completely overlooked and worked their butts off to get where they are at.  

 

Ironic.

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

Ironic.

 Nailed you, huh?

[T master]

Heard his statements on J Allen lets hope he is correct in what he says !! 

[Johnnycage46]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

 Nailed you, huh?

 

No thanks.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

4 hours ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

Kind of an odd statement from a Bills fan. You'd think most Bills fans would appreciate the value of blue collar lunch pail farm boy types.

 

Blue collar lunch pail farm boys don't retire at halftime. They don't let their mouth do all talking and walk off the field in a huff because they didn't get enough attention during a game. They don't ignore a kid looking for an autograph, and they don't take days off. They know half an effort is no effort, and they know everything works better when everyone works together. And they know how to lead and be leaders.

 

So, y'know...yeah, accuracy...but accuracy minus solid core and work ethic = backup QB.

 

You should know by now that this fanbase has a fixed percentage of permanently miserable whiners and rear-view-mirror guys.

 

You know the kind. Never happy with what the team does.

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 hours ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

I think more importantly, and to your original point, he had loads of talent but no drive (regardless of if he was a pothead, he certainly lacked motor).  Kyle Williams is a perfect example of a "lunch pail" guy with above-average but not necessarily elite talent that had a long and successful career.  Of course talent matters, but talent without drive is nothing.

 

 

...he CERTAINLY was.....we struck gold in the 5th round......and we did AGAIN with Milano.....and potentially AGAIN with Neal & Teller (2018) and Joseph (2019)....hell at this rate, we could all sleep in until day 3 and use every pick on 5ths......

[teef]

28 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Stop it.  You know you're not being bullied just as much as everyone else knows you're a troll.

 

Try to be better at it.

it's fun.  the posters that say the stupidest ***** are the first ones to claim they're being attacked.  

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

EJ was a highly recruited High School prospect whose Dad was friends with Bruce Smith.

His was given every opportunity to succeed in college and the pro's.

I hoped he would be a great franchise QB for the Bills.  He wasn't.

 

Josh Allen went to JUCO and was throwing cantaloupe crates on the trailer.

That's blue collar in my book and I also hope he becomes a great franchise QB for the Bills.

...I like his work ethic, attitude, humility, community involvement, outlook ("it is OUR team and OUR family"), mindfulness and respect for the game....he knows what he has to do to get better and continually works with Professor Palmer....other than THAT?...MEH.........

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

Yikes. It's the total opposite to me. The difference between blue collar and white collar, to me, is that blue collar is willing to do whatever is necessary. They go where you need them, how you need them, when you need them. Resolve.Grit. Determination. Commitment. They don't blame others for their failures and they don't pound their chest for their wins. 

 

 

...NAILED IT bud.......nice......worker bees versus the "privileged" because they got their foot in the door............

 

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, Elite Poster said:

 

The farm boy pretty much had the most rich boy summer of all time. This stuff is getting silly at this point. 

 

Then why did Tom "Deflated Balls" Brady, Bill "Tape Your Practice" Belichick, and Robert "Cheat on Girlfriend with Prostitute" Kraft win yet another ring while we are stuck doing mental gymnastics justifying losing year after year?

 

Character and work ethic are two different things. Talent and work ethic are really all you need, everything else is just to make you feel good. 

Cant we have both?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So sick of the term blue collar.  I think it’s a subtle put down. They do with Buffalo a lot and it’s residents.   You aren’t super smart or talented, you just work hard.  Like there are no other type of people in Buffalo or that “white collar” people don’t work hard.

 

and to make the nfl, you have to work your @ss off.  Very few dudes are so talented that can coast to make it to the league.  How many Bills players have been recently who’s problem was not working hard enough as opposed to just not being good enough?  The foundation of the rosters for the last 18 years is hard working guys who just aren’t good enough. 

 

...sorry but it is a relevant term.....connotes NEVER forgetting your roots or upbringing........it breeds humility and respect, citing families who brought their kids up right despite their struggling  efforts financially, albeit parents with multiple jobs, single parents with multiple jobs, etc......and look how many of those kids recognize that, sign with the NFL and go buy Mom a new house or new car (NEITHER of which she NEVER had).....that my friend is honor and respect versus some of the products today coming through with a "privileged, I'm entitled to" attitude....Allen is a product of that upbringing as are many others regardless of race, creed, religion or color...."blue collar" is the epitome of respect in my book...sorry we differ.....tell me otherwise...

Edited July 24, 2019 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

49 minutes ago, Johnnycage46 said:

Ironic.

isn't it though, that's all the dude does is whine about those that see things through a brighter light, unlike he and those who always seem to have a dark cloud hovering over them.

[3rdnlng]

1 hour ago, MacGyver said:

 

This place is quite biased against non-homers. 

Keep it up with your negativity and knocking of Buffalo and there'll come a time when you can't escape, MacGyver.

[ColoradoBills]

11 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

isn't it though, that's all the dude does is whine about those that see things through a brighter light, unlike he and those who always seem to have a dark cloud hovering over them.

 

What gets me is that it's the eve of training camp.  One would think even the most cynical could find some hope.

Oh well.

 

 

[Cripple Creek]

9 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

What can be heard in the clip is pretty clear and I doubt @The Bills Blog can hear anything in it that the rest of us cannot. There is simply not enough there to put the statements in any real context.

 

My point was that, without context, any analysis is nothing more than pure speculation - and why would anyone choose to speculate that it is something to be concerned about?

Well, that’s what we do here, isn’t it? Speculating this entire century could be the motto of this place? WTF is your real point?