Roof or No Roof?

[WideRightRevenge]

21 hours ago, LabattBlue said:

...or maybe the w-l record in the playoffs has something to do with the fact that the dome team is going on the road...and more than likely an underdog. 

 

Not sure I'm following .. yes obviously a dome team is on the road most likely is playing outside ...but one could say based on below stat

 

Since NFL realignment in 2002, home teams have dominated the divisional round, winning 43 of 64 games (67 percent). Only three times, however, have home teams swept all four games. There have been six 2-2 splits.

 

That dome teams bring down this average or better said if you removed the dome team losses .. the percentage would be less dominating for home field advantage. 

Losses

• Most Postseason Games Lost, All-Time, 29

Minnesota Vikings

• Longest Losing Streak, 9 games

Detroit Lions, 1991, 1993–95, 1997, 1999, 2011, 2014, 2016^[4]

14 hours ago, mead107 said:

No roof 

 

Yes .. .medical studies show stromboli is digested better outdoors post consumption than in a climate controlled environment.  Hope all is well Rande .. see you with my son in December once again!

Edited July 3, 2019 by WideRightRevenge
spelling

[Stank_Nasty]

100% against a roof!!! 

 

Went to Lucas oil last year interested in what a domed experience would be like.... walking from a nice crisp morning into a room temp stadium COMPLETELY sucked. Took the life right out of the gameday experience IMO. 

 

Heck, my wife can’t stand the cold and she even agreed with me. 

 

I absolutely love a sharp crisp day at the Ralph where I can see my breath as I’m standing there at my seats watching warm ups. 

 

 

As a fan that goes to 4-6 home games a year I can say, WITHOUT A DOUBT, they will lose my wife and I for multiple games a season if a dome goes up downtown. In fact I legitimately don’t know anyone out of the group of 10-15 people that I tailgate with that are on board for a move downtown inside a dome. 

Edited July 3, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[row_33]

10 minutes ago, WideRightRevenge said:

 

Not sure I'm following .. yes obviously a dome team is on the road most likely is playing outside ...but one could say based on below stat

 

Since NFL realignment in 2002, home teams have dominated the divisional round, winning 43 of 64 games (67 percent). Only three times, however, have home teams swept all four games. There have been six 2-2 splits.

 

That dome teams bring down this average or better said if you removed the dome team losses .. the percentage would be less dominating for home field advantage. 

Losses

• Most Postseason Games Lost, All-Time, 29

Minnesota Vikings

• Longest Losing Streak, 9 games

Detroit Lions, 1991, 1993–95, 1997, 1999, 2011, 2014, 2016^[4]

 

Yes .. .medical studies show stromboli is digested better outdoors post consumption than in a climate controlled environment.  Hope all is well Rande .. see you with my son in December once again!

 

Home teams have always dominated, usually because they almost always were the better team, that’s why they get the home playoff game 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

 

Home teams have always dominated, usually because they almost always were the better team, that’s why they get the home playoff game 

 

Sensible takes aren't allowed here, man.

[CLTbills]

I'm an open-air stadium guy. Different vibe/atmosphere. I'd be ok with a roof that is left open for football games, but can be closed for other events as needed.

[Bakin]

Wow. Pretty close poll. 

55% favouring a Dome. 

I wonder what percent of those who favour a Dome live in Buffalo vs those who do not. 

 

As a first year season ticket holder holder who lives a good 5+ hours away...I’m really not sure what I want.

 

Actually, I want what the people of Buffalo want. 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, CLTbills said:

I'm an open-air stadium guy. Different vibe/atmosphere. I'd be ok with a roof that is left open for football games, but can be closed for other events as needed.

 

I’m with you for the most part. Unfortunately, it seems most domes are closed unless the weather is perfect. That is NOT what I want. 

[CLTbills]

19 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I’m with you for the most part. Unfortunately, it seems most domes are closed unless the weather is perfect. That is NOT what I want. 

Yeah. I understand the need for a roof to attract concerts and other events to help pay for the costs of said new stadium. But I don't want to lose the atmosphere on Sundays in the fall. 

Or, just keep the stadium that we have, which is my overall preference.

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, CLTbills said:

Yeah. I understand the need for a roof to attract concerts and other events to help pay for the costs of said new stadium. But I don't want to lose the atmosphere on Sundays in the fall. 

Or, just keep the stadium that we have, which is my overall preference.

 

I have no burning desire for a new stadium. I thoroughly enjoy games at New Era in OP. But I think there is a change in our future, and I won’t condemn it before even seeing it as some seem to be doing. I get that most people hate change. People should give it a fair chance before deciding if they like it or not.

[row_33]

3 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Sensible takes aren't allowed here, man.

 

i could say my memory of almost every playoff game after wild card weekend from 1973 to around 2002 was a complete massacre of the visiting team

 

and then the NFC tore the AFC to shreds for the majority of SBs.

 

 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

18 hours ago, Augie said:

 

That is the coolest looking stadium in the league. I’ve been to neither, but I’d see a game there before Jerry World. 

I’ve been to games at both and they’re both really well done. 

[Stank_Nasty]

2 hours ago, Augie said:

 

I have no burning desire for a new stadium. I thoroughly enjoy games at New Era in OP. But I think there is a change in our future, and I won’t condemn it before even seeing it as some seem to be doing. I get that most people hate change. People should give it a fair chance before deciding if they like it or not.

I've given other domed stadiums a chance as well as other venues in more urban settings. not nearly the gameday experience as in orchard park. in fact the dome completely sucked IMO... I don't hate change. I would just hate it if that particular experience changed. I know my wife and I are just one couple but its a couple that would move our attendance down from 5 to 6 games a year to 1 or 2 at the most. I have no desire to drive 90 min from home and sit in a dome that has the same gameday feel as my living room.

 

i'm extremely surprised the poll is swayed for a roof at this point. I honestly have never talked to one single fan in person that has said they would want a dome or anything downtown.

Edited July 3, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[Gugny]

16 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

I've given other domed stadiums a chance as well as other venues in more urban settings. not nearly the gameday experience as in orchard park. in fact the dome completely sucked IMO... I don't hate change. I would just hate it if that particular experience changed. I know my wife and I are just one couple but its a couple that would move our attendance down from 5 to 6 games a year to 1 or 2 at the most. I have no desire to drive 90 min from home and sit in a dome that has the same gameday feel as my living room.

 

i'm extremely surprised the poll is swayed for a roof at this point. I honestly have never talked to one single fan in person that has said they would want a dome or anything downtown.

 

I voted "roof," based on what I think they "should," do for business purposes.

 

As much as many here opine that Buffalo doesn't have the infrastructure or the accommodations necessary to host a Super Bowl, I don't buy it.  I do, however, believe that they'll never be considered to be a Super Bowl host if it's an open-air stadium.

 

I'm with you, as far as personal preference goes.  I'd much rather sit in an open-air stadium than one that is enclosed (roof or dome).  I've never watched a football game in a closed-roof stadium, but I have been to a baseball game with a closed roof.  Totally kills the atmosphere, IMO.

[Stank_Nasty]

22 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

I voted "roof," based on what I think they "should," do for business purposes.

 

As much as many here opine that Buffalo doesn't have the infrastructure or the accommodations necessary to host a Super Bowl, I don't buy it.  I do, however, believe that they'll never be considered to be a Super Bowl host if it's an open-air stadium.

 

I'm with you, as far as personal preference goes.  I'd much rather sit in an open-air stadium than one that is enclosed (roof or dome).  I've never watched a football game in a closed-roof stadium, but I have been to a baseball game with a closed roof.  Totally kills the atmosphere, IMO.

100% agree.... we went down to indy for the colts game. stayed there with an old college buddy for the weekend. beautiful brisk 45 degree walk up to the stadium and then you walk in the front doors and it feels like you are in a mall. totally sucked IMO.

 

 

I also get all your points about the business side. as a fan i'm greedy about it though, and I realllllyyy don't wanna see a dome. I could deal with down town, although it would just become like any other tailgate experience around the league..... I really cant stand the thought of climate control though.

[Gugny]

2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

100% agree.... we went down to indy for the colts game. stayed there with an old college buddy for the weekend. beautiful brisk 45 degree walk up to the stadium and then you walk in the front doors and it feels like you are in a mall. totally sucked IMO.

 

 

I also get all your points about the business side. as a fan i'm greedy about it though, and I realllllyyy don't wanna see a dome. I could deal with down town, although it would just become like any other tailgate experience around the league..... I really cant stand the thought of climate control though.

 

Funny you say "mall."  It's the exact word I used to describe the atmosphere at Marlins Park.

 

I've said in other threads that if they take away the ability for fans to bring their own beverages, grills, smokers, etc., to tailgates, that I'll stop going to games.  I drive 5+ hours one way to get to Orchard Park.  Frankly, the game is #2 on my list of things to do.  Tailgating is what I enjoy most.  I'm not driving all that way and spending the money to go to some stiff ass tailgate where I need to buy concession food.  Eff that.

[Stank_Nasty]

6 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Funny you say "mall."  It's the exact word I used to describe the atmosphere at Marlins Park.

 

I've said in other threads that if they take away the ability for fans to bring their own beverages, grills, smokers, etc., to tailgates, that I'll stop going to games.  I drive 5+ hours one way to get to Orchard Park.  Frankly, the game is #2 on my list of things to do.  Tailgating is what I enjoy most.  I'm not driving all that way and spending the money to go to some stiff ass tailgate where I need to buy concession food.  Eff that.

right. and through a lot of these awful years its really the only thing that's been drawing me back over and over again.

 

heck, anytime I have people that know me and their team is playing ours up in orchard park they practically beg me to make room for them to go up and tailgate. I've been to 6 different NFL stadiums at this point and Lambeau in the only one I can say even holds a candle to our atmosphere. it was REALLY cool there..... I just really don't wanna lose that.

 

5 hours...…. god bless you. theres times my 90 minutes feels endless after a game.

Edited July 3, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[cba fan]

For all the die-hard outdoor fans who say they will not go downtown to a dome, that will not really be a factor if Bills/NFL studies show you would be replaced by fans who do not want to sit outside in crap weather etc etc......especially late season cold games when many of these diehards stay home.

 

Those fans who want to sit in climate control I would venture a guess are the ones who have more money, spend more money, and would not care if they tailgated in areas where they must buy most of their food and drink.

 

Hopefully the team can accommodate most by building one like MN has but making ample room for tailgating. I have been to MN and you do not feel like you are inside. It is amazing. If Bills put even more of the roof as the PTE glass than MN did and make it more like LA and LV roofs, and, make even more panels that swing open, along with Buffalo historical connection of some kind in good taste so as not to make it feel like a mall,(architecture, style, food, mini Niagra Falls somewhere? huge bison on the plaza outside, wagons circling the other plaza on opposite side etc etc) they could have a great stadium.

Edited July 3, 2019 by cba fan

[Xwnyer]

I say a retractable roof. This way stadium could be used year round, host a super bowl and let in lovely fall air and sunshine

[boater]

There is some, but not enough discussion here about cost.

 

I notice many of the "roof" voters reside outside Erie County. It's always fun to have an open wallet with OPM (other people's money). But when it's your own wallet being raided to pay for the stadium, you a become a little more circumspect about what features come along and how much they cost.

 

Don't be naive. Don't fool yourself--if you live in Erie County, one way or another the stadium cost is being passed on to you. There aren't rich guys with sacks of cash, or government slush funds to defray from the cost. There's no magical accountant tricks. And cost isn't going to be a drop in the bucket. It will be something that will impact your budget (unless you're on welfare or a refugee).

 

A 20 year construction bond on a 1.5 billion stadium will have a 9 million monthly payment.

 

Every man, woman and child in the county will pay $116 per year in increased taxes. No small change if you're a family of five.

 

I'm not opting for a roof without some argument for it's return on investment. Would it lead to other events, such as winter concerts? 

 

PS: Lucas Oil Field at $750 mil a couple years ago has been proposed as a benchmark. No way that happens in WNY. Too much graft and corruption.

 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

Keep in mind that PSLs are usually amortized over a number of years. So a $1K PSL might end up hitting you as a $20/ticket surcharge over 5 seasons.

Edited July 3, 2019 by PromoTheRobot

[apuszczalowski]

Considering weather has not been a home field factor for this team in a long time, and for financial reasons, an indoor facility will be the value for whomever pays for it, indoor will most likely be what gets built. An outdoor stadium might be what some fans want, it's not what the people shelling out the real money there will want 

[BillsfaninChicago]

I love watching games when the weather is crazy. If the 2017 Colts game were played inside I doubt we would even remember and more than likely we would have lost that game with Peterman and I think Joe Webb at QB and would be going on a 19 season playoff drought at this point. Because of that I voted no roof. Having said that I live in Chicago now and only make it to 1 or 2 games a season so I don’t really have a dog in this fight. Either way I am going to be excited that WNY is going to have a 21st century sporting venue and even more importantly this will solidify the Bill’s future in WNY and we can all watch Mike Florio cry like a baby about it!

[Doc]

50 minutes ago, Leonhart2017 said:

I love watching games when the weather is crazy. If the 2017 Colts game were played inside I doubt we would even remember and more than likely we would have lost that game with Peterman and I think Joe Webb at QB and would be going on a 19 season playoff drought at this point. Because of that I voted no roof. Having said that I live in Chicago now and only make it to 1 or 2 games a season so I don’t really have a dog in this fight. Either way I am going to be excited that WNY is going to have a 21st century sporting venue and even more importantly this will solidify the Bill’s future in WNY and we can all watch Mike Florio cry like a baby about it!

 

I disagree.  The weather was the only thing equalizing the game in favor of the Colts because they were terrible that year. 

 

As for the elements, maybe once in every 4-5 years they impact a game and very rarely do you get something like that Colts game.  Meanwhile the elements serve more to keep people away from games in winter.

[BillsfaninChicago]

12 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I disagree.  The weather was the only thing equalizing the game in favor of the Colts because they were terrible that year. 

 

As for the elements, maybe once in every 4-5 years they impact a game and very rarely do you get something like that Colts game.  Meanwhile the elements serve more to keep people away from games in winter.

I can’t say I agree with your first point when you have Nate Peterman starting the game. If he was in a climate controlled environment he would be throwing more and we know what happens with him. The second point I do totally agree. To build a 700 to possibly 1 billion dollar stadium because on a rare occasion  you think you will have home field advantage would be silly and while I did say i loved watching crazy weather games, the caveat I didn’t mention was I liked watching them on TV most of the time and not taking the brunt of it in the 300 sections (something I have done for well over 25 yeas of going to games but usually avoid if I am going to make a trip home now). Like I said though when they do decide on the stadium whether be it dome, retractable, or open air, I am going to be stoked!

[Doc]

19 minutes ago, Leonhart2017 said:

I can’t say I agree with your first point when you have Nate Peterman starting the game. If he was in a climate controlled environment he would be throwing more and we know what happens with him. The second point I do totally agree. To build a 700 to possibly 1 billion dollar stadium because on a rare occasion  you think you will have home field advantage would be silly and while I did say i loved watching crazy weather games, the caveat I didn’t mention was I liked watching them on TV most of the time and not taking the brunt of it in the 300 sections (something I have done for well over 25 yeas of going to games but usually avoid if I am going to make a trip home now). Like I said though when they do decide on the stadium whether be it dome, retractable, or open air, I am going to be stoked!

 

The Colts were bad enough on defense that Peterman starting wouldn't have negatively impacted the Bills. 

[Stank_Nasty]

8 hours ago, cba fan said:

For all the die-hard outdoor fans who say they will not go downtown to a dome, that will not really be a factor if Bills/NFL studies show you would be replaced by fans who do not want to sit outside in crap weather etc etc......especially late season cold games when many of these diehards stay home.

 

Those fans who want to sit in climate control I would venture a guess are the ones who have more money, spend more money, and would not care if they tailgated in areas where they must buy most of their food and drink.

 

Hopefully the team can accommodate most by building one like MN has but making ample room for tailgating. I have been to MN and you do not feel like you are inside. It is amazing. If Bills put even more of the roof as the PTE glass than MN did and make it more like LA and LV roofs, and, make even more panels that swing open, along with Buffalo historical connection of some kind in good taste so as not to make it feel like a mall,(architecture, style, food, mini Niagra Falls somewhere? huge bison on the plaza outside, wagons circling the other plaza on opposite side etc etc) they could have a great stadium.

Wait. So your income apparently dictates the weather in which you enjoy watching a game in? I can assure you the amount of money I have made has literally NO bearing on how I prefer to watch my games. That’s a really absurd thing to say IMO. 

 

15 years ago I was a broke, drunk, obnoxious college kid loving a good brisk outdoor gaming experience. I’m now in a spot where the money it takes to have a good seat in orchard park or any other Stadium isn’t really an issue. And guess what..... I’ll take that brisk and crisp December air on gameday. 

 

Win. They need to freaking win. Nothing is gonna dictate attendance like winning or losing will. Do the packers have problems with attendance? How about the Steelers? Both great gameday stadiums btw. Lucas oil? Not so much. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[WideRightRevenge]

On 7/3/2019 at 7:28 AM, row_33 said:

 

Home teams have always dominated, usually because they almost always were the better team, that’s why they get the home playoff game 

 

On 7/3/2019 at 7:31 AM, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Sensible takes aren't allowed here, man.

 

OK .. let's take out playoffs and look overall .. again we can all have our opinion .. my just is that dome teams typically are worse (softer) than non-dome teams.  Granted there is a little age on this (from 2014) but it basically shows road records for dome teams vs. non dome teams in regular season .. though not crazy dramatic .. dome teams winning percentage on the road is 39% and non-dome teams road winning percentage is 44%.

 

But to above as well this link also talks about dome teams as #1 seed in playoffs ... you say potato .. I say spud.  

 

https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/blog/2014/dome-sweet-dome-not-a-chance

 

Fresh air in December in OP after 1pm .. rocks!

 

[wppete]

No roof..... Home field advantage.

[Big Gun]

49 minutes ago, wppete said:

No roof..... Home field advantage.

Because it has worked so well for the last 25 years.

 

Just build it with a roof. 

 

Build it and they will come!

[zonabb]

On 7/1/2019 at 9:03 PM, Heitz said:

Roof for me.  

 

Am I old?  Soft?  Spending too much time in SoCal?  Probably...

 

I'm going to continue to call out US Bank Stadium in Minneapolis as a great example of what can be done with a "roof".  When you're in that stadium it feels like you're outside - it's pretty cool.  And the entire front is basically big-ass doors that you can open for a breeze and open-air feel on those nice fall days...

 

https://www.popularmechanics.com/adventure/sports/a19066/minnesota-viking-football-stadium-roof/

 

 

The difference is Minny has I believe 5-7 Fortune 500 companies. Buffalo has zero. Minneapolis' economy is constantly growing at least at the national rate, Buffalo, well that thought is laughable. Despite an estimated increase in population in 2017 for the first time since 1970, the county population is about 200,000 less than it was in OJ's sophomore season. In the end, IF, and that's a huge IF, they get a new stadium, you can bet it'll be what it should be for this market... a simple, open air stadium, likely somewhat enclosed like Seattle. This region can't support large events that many here want. Not enough hotel rooms for a Super Bowl or Sweet 16 or Final Four or any national event that would draw 10s of 1000s of out of towners.

 

So to what end is an overly expensive enclosed stadium justified given that this team, which has sucked for two decades, still draws extremely well. And that answer isn't more club seats and boxes. That's not working now. 

 

I hope the Pegulas are smart enough to know that a) a good product on the field will be received with open arms by b) a region of diehards willing to pony up the money to sit outside and watch. And in doing so, throws up the collective Pegula middle finger to Robert Rub-and-Tug and his band of greedy municipal fund pillagers. 

[cba fan]

On 7/3/2019 at 10:24 PM, Stank_Nasty said:

Wait. So your income apparently dictates the weather in which you enjoy watching a game in? I can assure you the amount of money I have made has literally NO bearing on how I prefer to watch my games. That’s a really absurd thing to say IMO. 

 

15 years ago I was a broke, drunk, obnoxious college kid loving a good brisk outdoor gaming experience. I’m now in a spot where the money it takes to have a good seat in orchard park or any other Stadium isn’t really an issue. And guess what..... I’ll take that brisk and crisp December air on gameday. 

 

Win. They need to freaking win. Nothing is gonna dictate attendance like winning or losing will. Do the packers have problems with attendance? How about the Steelers? Both great gameday stadiums btw. Lucas oil? Not so much. 

income does not dictate anything. Older fans who are weather sensitive will likely be further along into their careers and have more money to spend vs the younger students and college grads who like the weather factor who are just starting out working.

 

main point is if studies show/prove you will be replaced by fans who want to sit indoors at Dec and Jan games you will be replaced.

 

why would Bills care as long as Bills fans still show up?  I believe attendance will be better with a dome as the area residents continue to get older. JMO but we will see.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

Every time I ask my dog ? he says 

 

roof

 

Edited July 6, 2019 by ShadyBillsFan

[HOUSE]

On 7/1/2019 at 9:18 PM, Happy Gilmore said:

I want no roof, but I think a new stadium will have a roof, which will allow multiple events in the stadium and more revenue for the stadium owner(s).

IMO, retractable roofs, while good in theory, rarely seems to be retracted.  Is it actually worth the extra money?  I'd lean toward no, it is not worth it.

Edited July 5, 2019 by HOUSE

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

Here's my take: I grew-up in Buffalo and lived here until 30. I've been to many Bills games - some bright sunshine and a gorgeous Fall day and some where it was 20 degrees and snowing. I loved everyone of them. It's part of the experience going to  a game. I live in Houston now and Reliant stadium has a retractable roof. I've never been there when it has been open!! The arguments have been: 1. Roof closed provides a loud, home advantage crowd 2. It's too hot to open it. 3. It takes too long to open it during a game.

 

I hate it. It's a huge waste when it's never opened. If they put one in Buffalo, you'd get similar excuses. Close it - make it loud. Oh, it's going to snow. Oh, it's too cold out there. 

 

Give me the open air and stop with all the damn p-words that "don't enjoy it"....

[TheFunPolice]

Beautiful fall day in WNY and everyone has to sit inside a dark airplane hangar for a football game....

 

Totally gross. Buffalo Bills football belongs outside.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

Beautiful fall day in WNY and everyone has to sit inside a dark airplane hangar for a football game....

 

Totally gross. Buffalo Bills football belongs outside.

...here are some of my experiences to share....you decide what fits...

 

1. MLB at the Kingdome: Mariners vs Twins-in Seattle for software conference; host company rented late Paul Allen's suite (Microsoft); Big Papi jacked a moon shot for the Twins; no aroma of ball park dogs, beerman or peanut guy yellin', boring

2. Bills games outside in the winter-you all know that drill; bundle up

3. Our corporate suite games-despite the conveniences of food & beverage delivered as well as rest rooms across the hall, like watching a football game from an aquarium

4. M&T Club-theater style seating, open bar and a continual buffet with snacks and then dinner throughout the day-nice presentation

 

...so it's a tough call for Pegula as to what would optimize seat sales...BUT ...the principal factor will always be if still competitive late November of December....I know with our corporate suite, when the Bills were officially out of it in late November, we would have to BEG people to go to a game...mind you it would include $1,500+ in suite food & beverage and $1,080 for limo bus transportation bus from Roch-Cha-Cha...

 

 

 

 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

5 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Every time I and my dog ? he days 

 

roof

[Augie]

4 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...here are some of my experiences to share....you decide what fits...

 

1. MLB at the Kingdome: Mariners vs Twins-in Seattle for software conference; host company rented late Paul Allen's suite (Microsoft); Big Papi jacked a moon shot for the Twins; no aroma of ball park dogs, beerman or peanut guy yellin', boring

2. Bills games outside in the winter-you all know that drill; bundle up

3. Our corporate suite games-despite the conveniences of food & beverage delivered as well as rest rooms across the hall, like watching a football game from an aquarium

4. M&T Club-theater style seating, open bar and a continual buffet with snacks and then dinner throughout the day-nice presentation

 

...so it's a tough call for Pegula as to what would optimize seat sales...BUT ...the principal factor will always be if still competitive late November of December....I know with our corporate suite, when the Bills were officially out of it in late November, we would have to BEG people to go to a game...mind you it would include $1,500+ in suite food & beverage and $1,080 for limo bus transportation bus from Roch-Cha-Cha...

 

 

 

 

 

You can beg ME!   ?

 

I get both sides of this, and as long as they remain in WNY (which I 100% expect), then I don‘t care what decision they make. I’ll still go. There are a lot of pros and cons. I’m good with whatever. I will say, as a kid part of the fun of late season games was getting ready and surviving. Newspaper insulation in my boots, getting the layers of clothing just right, taking that thermos of hot bullion (those were the days!) to keep you warm, etc. I’d really miss the tailgating too, but I’m not a little kid anymore, so.....whatever. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

12 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

You can beg ME!   ?

 

I get both sides of this, and as long as they remain in WNY (which I 100% expect), then I don‘t care what decision they make. I’ll still go. There are a lot of pros and cons. I’m good with whatever. I will say, as a kid part of the fun of late season games was getting ready and surviving. Newspaper insulation in my boots, getting the layers of clothing just right, taking that thermos of hot bullion (those were the days!) to keep you warm, etc. I’d really miss the tailgating too, but I’m not a little kid anymore, so.....whatever. 

 

...BEG you?.....you get the "red carpet" my good friend......they make me use the back door..........

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

3 hours ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

   

Not 1 but 2 typos 

 

roof