Connor Orr: How Will Rams-Chiefs Impact the Future of the NFL?

[Chicken Boo]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

KC is proving that's not the case.

 

Anyway, all this pearl clutching over this game already? 

 

It is a fear that this is what the Goodell and the owners have been clamoring for and now that they've seen it, the train will keep chugging along.

[dave mcbride]

31 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 There were three defensive TDs last night or did you miss that? 

44-40 is still too high. The ideal score in baseball, in my opinion, is 4-3. Same with hockey. 4-3 in football is effectively 28-21. I actually prefer 3.5 to 3 in football (24-21).  Last night was 7-6 minus the defensive scores and roughly 8-7.5 if you factor them in. That's too many goals for my liking. 

[row_33]

9 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

44-40 is still too high. The ideal score in baseball, in my opinion, is 4-3. Same with hockey. 4-3 in football is effectively 28-21. I actually prefer 3.5 to 3 in football (24-21).  Last night was 7-6 minus the defensive scores and roughly 8-7.5 if you factor them in. That's too many goals for my liking. 

 

the only thing worse in baseball than a team staking an early 6-0 lead is them coughing it up and its goes 5 hours

 

 

[Livinginthepast]

Seriously I cannot believe how many people on here are terrified about offensive football.  There were a couple of unusual characteristics of last nights game that people should maybe consider before they get their panties in a bunch. #1 those were two great young QBs skillfully operating 2 high powered stacked offenses (definitely not the norm in the NFL). #2 Those were 2 highly regarded coaches in an awesome contest there (Once again not the norm in this league of blockhead coaches). #3 The defenses didn't just lay down in that game, they actually DID make huge plays for both teams (sacks, forced fumbles, athletic INTs  which translated into defensive TDs).  This game was so great because it was so unusual. Trying to argue that every NFL coach and GM is going to emulate this game plan going forward is ludicrous. As if they could! Good luck with that! In addition what do some people want exactly on here? a 1940's muddy ground and pound game that ends 6-3? A repeat of the Bills Colts snow slugfest from last year? Is that  "real" enough football?

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

44-40 is still too high. The ideal score in baseball, in my opinion, is 4-3. Same with hockey. 4-3 in football is effectively 28-21. I actually prefer 3.5 to 3 in football (24-21).  Last night was 7-6 minus the defensive scores and roughly 8-7.5 if you factor them in. That's too many goals for my liking. 

 

Defense also set up two other TDs with very short fields.  Defense impacted that game heavily regardless of the high score.  Mahomes had 3 INT (2 on great plays) and 2 fumbles forced by Donald. This cannot be ignored.

[Maybe Someday]

To me it was a fun game to watch because it doesn't happen very often.  If that becomes the norm, it'll lose its luster.   

 

Let's see if one of these teams actually wins the Super Bowl before we talk about how they changed the future of the game.  There have been a lot of great offenses over the years that put up great numbers but didn't win the ultimate prize.  Typically offense wins awards, defense wins championships.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

2 minutes ago, Livinginthepast said:

#3 The defenses didn't just lay down in that game, they actually DID make huge plays for both teams (sacks, forced fumbles, athletic INTs  which translated into defensive TDs).

 

What is the ultimate goal of defense in ANY sport? Keeping the other guy from scoring.

 

They failed UTTERLY in that regard.

[row_33]

22 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Last night might have been the greatest offensive performances I've ever seen.

 

last year's Super Bowl amassed 1151 yards on O and only one single defensive play of valour the whole time

 

so last night is a pale second place

 

amazing how people forget the Eagles/Pats Super Bowl already

 

did you watch it?

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, row_33 said:

 

last year's Super Bowl amassed 1151 yards on O and only one single defensive play of valour the whole time

 

so last night is a pale second place

 

amazing how people forget the Eagles/Pats Super Bowl already

 

did you watch it?

 

 

 

Mpg course I watched it and good call on your end.  

 

Last night was insane though.  6 turnovers total and both still scored 50?  

[dave mcbride]

10 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Defense also set up two other TDs with very short fields.  Defense impacted that game heavily regardless of the high score.  Mahomes had 3 INT (2 on great plays) and 2 fumbles forced by Donald. This cannot be ignored.

Regardless of the source,  goals and half-goals (FGs) shouldn't be cheap. It's why I find basketball mostly boring as a spectator sport. Both winners and losers routinely score 45-55 goals every game.

Edited November 20, 2018 by dave mcbride

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Interesting factoid.. at this pace this years Chiefs, Rams and Saints will all finish top 5 all time in season point total 

 

saints on pace for 604.8

KC on pace for 587.2

rams on pace for 566.4

 

Current top 3: 

‘13 broncos 606

‘07 Pats 589 

‘11 packers 560

 

for perspective, most prolific Bills season in 1991 was 458. 

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

Regardless of the source,  goals and half-goals (FGs) shouldn't be cheap. It's why I find basketball mostly boring as a spectator sport. Both winners and losers routinely score 45-55 goals every game.

 

I thought it was great. Like I posted before there was a bit of everything in that game including impact plays by both defenses.   To each his own I guess with some being football traditionalists.

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

I thought it was great. Like I posted before there was a bit of everything in that game including impact plays by both defenses.   To each his own I guess with some being football traditionalists.

I thought it was a good game; I just don't want it to become a norm. It's not about being a football traditionalist; it's my opposition to scores (in any sport) coming too cheaply.

Edited November 20, 2018 by dave mcbride

[kbarrettb]

That game was absolutely incredible. Everything you want out of a football game. Defensive plays, offense went nuts, the playmakers on both sides of the ball showed how truly great they are. You want to know why people here aren't a fan of offenses and this game I can sum it up with one article. Bills haven't had an offense in 18 plus years. Allen has no accuracy and a cannon for an arm. 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/11/20/rams-chiefs-produced-more-touchdowns-than-the-bills-have-all-season/

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

3 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

for perspective, most prolific Bills season in 1991 was 458. 

 

because they played in an era with violent defense.

 

 

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

I thought it was a good game; I just don't want it to become a norm. It's not about being a football traditionalist; it's my opposition to scores (in any sport) coming too cheaply.

 

Well designed and executed plays by high end talent are almost impossible to slow down. It's the era we're in now until defenses adjust as they inevitably will. 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, Joe in Winslow said:

let's all hope he's wrong.

 

Because that's the kind of product I want no part of. It's OK to score. It's NOT ok to allow the other guy to score like that.

 

Absolutely.

 

I don't want the NFL to turn into the Big 12.

[Saint Doug]

1 hour ago, Like A Mofo said:

Let's just say it: If the Bills were 54-51 winners last night, most of you haters would be LOVING this

 

No. The only game with a 51 in it would be the 51-3 win over the Raiders in the 1991 AFC Championship game. That was a *game*, last night’s was not. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

1 hour ago, Like A Mofo said:

Let's just say it: If the Bills were 54-51 winners last night, most of you haters would be LOVING this

Yeah, but imagine the Bills scoring 51 points and losing. Heads would explode.
 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

12 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Yeah, but imagine the Bills scoring 51 points and losing. Heads would explode.
 

BG, as always, you have THE take!

 

 

[GunnerBill]

53 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Regardless of the source,  goals and half-goals (FGs) shouldn't be cheap. It's why I find basketball mostly boring as a spectator sport. Both winners and losers routinely score 45-55 goals every game.

 

This. I have had a few goes at articulating why I don't love games like last night or the last Superbowl but I don't think I managed it as well as you have here Dave. Goals should not be cheap. 

 

Oh and I hate Basketball. I can watch almost any sport but I can't watch that. 

[billsfan1959]

29 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Yeah, but imagine the Bills scoring 51 points and losing. Heads would explode.
 

And be demanding someone be fired...

[Jrb1979]

1 hour ago, row_33 said:

 

yes Bills, keep on building a D and insisting on a feature RB with a gold-plated contract...

 

 

 

 

i don't enjoy this at all, i like to see competence displayed in all levels of the game.

 

another reason the pro game is slipping away from my concerns.... you are losing us by the thousands Roger....

 

 

Yeah the Rockpile fans are the ones turning away from the game. I doubt you will see a team that has a top rated defense and a mediocre offense win much in this league much anymore. I personally love the way the game is now. If you have a good offense you are never out of it. 

[RiotAct]

1 hour ago, Like A Mofo said:

Let's just say it: If the Bills were 54-51 winners last night, most of you haters would be LOVING this

well, yeah... duh

[BearNorth]

People forget the no punt game Bills 49ers in 1992, and the Bills had a top defense, think the score was 34-31 and no defensive TD's.

 

[dubs]

I actually don’t think that’s a preview into the future NFL. Defenses will catch up, running the ball will be more attractive when defenses become slimmer and lighter or teams play 7 defensive back.  Not that it’ll go back to 80s football, but I also don’t think that 54-51 games will be the norm either. 

 

It was definitely entertaining though!

[CountDorkula]

Man the SAbres game was great last nigh, i'd rather they win 1-0 though.

 

That's more exciting to me.......

[dubs]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Well designed and executed plays by high end talent are almost impossible to slow down. It's the era we're in now until defenses adjust as they inevitably will. 

 

Agreed. I think they will adjust though. It’s kind of what makes football so cool, there is always a new approach that works to combat other new approaches. 

[ComradeKayAdams]

3 minutes ago, BearNorth said:

People forget the no punt game Bills 49ers in 1992, and the Bills had a top defense, think the score was 34-31 and no defensive TD's.

 

 

Walt Corey defenses were not "top." Very good at times, and featuring the greatest DE in NFL history, but never elite like some of the ones you'd see in the NFC East. Hence the 4 Super Bowl losses...

[CountDorkula]

2 hours ago, Like A Mofo said:

Let's just say it: If the Bills were 54-51 winners last night, most of you haters would be LOVING this

No, no.

 

I want more games like the 10-3 Jax/buf  Playoff game last year.

 

Scoring is for losers. I like being lulled to sleep by what is supposed to be entertainment. 

[oldmanfan]

Put this in another thread.  Five years from now you'lll have 11 guys on D that will cover or blitz from anywhere on the field.  Guys like Milano and Edmunds will be highly valued.  Guys like Kyle won't be in the league.  And then offenses will have to adapt.  And likely by getting back to pounding the ball on the ground.

 

Anyone remember our first Super Bowl?  Belichick had a couple down linemen and had his DBs just keep guys in front of them and punish them when they got the ball?  An innovative coach could do something similar and slow these offenses down right now.

[CountDorkula]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

I thought it was great. Like I posted before there was a bit of everything in that game including impact plays by both defenses.   To each his own I guess with some being football traditionalists.

 

Give me more of this. This game was SOOOOOOOO EXCITING!

[dubs]

2 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

 

Give me more of this. This game was SOOOOOOOO EXCITING!

 

Right. Forgot we live in a binary world. Either you love video game scoring with no defense or 85 Bears Defense vs ‘18 Bills Offense. 

 

Not picking on the Count but it’s amazing how every thread (and many conversation) devolves into a binary fight to the death. Hah!

[dpberr]

2 hours ago, Mat68 said:

That's a wrong observation.  If Kc or La went zone and played 1 or 0 Lbs.  Hunt and Gurley would have ran for 200 yards.  They are both well balanced and dictate personal to the defense.  No different than the 90's Bill's, greatest show on turf Rams.  The difference is the rules have changed.  No contact down the feild.  No real ability to hit wrs in the air.  However, no matter the era what Reid and Mcvay have in terms of talent and play calling would be dynamic anywhere. 

 

Have to play within the rules of the game.  I'm not saying you abandon "where" the linebackers play but you replace them with safeties that can tackle and it turns into a basketball strategy where you have man coverage on everybody.  You just get carved up in zone anymore.  Too many gaps.  

 

Linebackers are too slow and heavy to play that short area in a man/man scheme.  Safeties and corners are going to have to evolve in tackling and the new generation of these players will have to enjoy tackling a lot more than the current crop does.  

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I think you might have misread my earlier post.  I was FOR balance....

 

 

You said more balance was needed for success.  I pointed out that the Chiefs are proving that wrong.  You need a shoutout offense and about 5 minutes of defense to for 1 or 2 big plays.

2 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

It is a fear that this is what the Goodell and the owners have been clamoring for and now that they've seen it, the train will keep chugging along.

 

 

Chugging along to....what?  There are 3 or 4 teams in the league who can do this.  Anything think Titans-Texans is going to be like this next week?

 

Everyone on the planet knew this was going to be a shootout...and it was a shootout.  It hasn't 'changed the game" at all, not even a little bit.

[wppete]

Maybe the Best game I have ever watched. 

[aceman_16]

Until either wins the super bowl.... they won't.

[jrober38]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I’d rather have a good offense with a good defense than a great offense and below average defense.  More balanced is better sustainable for success IMO.

 

Teams with good offenses and good defenses can't beat either the Rams or Cheifs. 

 

Those teams look like they're playing a different sport than the one the Bills play. 

 

Hard to imagine Josh Allen ever leading an offense like that. 

[billsfan1959]

6 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

You said more balance was needed for success.  I pointed out that the Chiefs are proving that wrong.  You need a shoutout offense and about 5 minutes of defense to for 1 or 2 big plays.

I believe he said balance was needed for “sustained” success, which I interpreted as long-term, not within season.  I wouldn’t exactly describe Kansas City as a team with sustained success.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

6 minutes ago, wppete said:

Maybe the Best game I have ever watched. 

 

not a fan of defense, I take it.