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Connor Orr: How Will Rams-Chiefs Impact the Future of the NFL?


26CornerBlitz

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1 minute ago, jrober38 said:

 

Teams with good offenses and good defenses can't beat either the Rams or Cheifs. 

 

Those teams look like they're playing a different sport than the one the Bills play. 

 

Hard to imagine Josh Allen ever leading an offense like that

Not hard to imagine you can find a way to turn any topic into “Josh Allen sucks.” 

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1 hour ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

What is the ultimate goal of defense in ANY sport? Keeping the other guy from scoring.

 

They failed UTTERLY in that regard.

An "UTTER" failure is intercepting the ball 3X? or forcing multiple fumbles? Both teams had 8 sacks and forced 7 punts combined. 3 Drives also ended in FGS. Both teams scored 3 defensive TDs!! How in the hell is that an "UTTER" failure?

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Just now, billsfan1959 said:

Not hard to imagine you can find a way to turn any topic into “Josh Allen sucks.” 

 

What I said applies to 50% of the teams in the NFL.

 

Anyone who can't score 30 points or more a week is in major trouble going forward as the rules are set up more than ever to encourage scoring. 

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1 minute ago, jrober38 said:

 

Teams with good offenses and good defenses can't beat either the Rams or Cheifs. 

 

Those teams look like they're playing a different sport than the one the Bills play. 

 

Hard to imagine Josh Allen ever leading an offense like that. 

 

Yes they can.  Not all the top offensive powers won it all.

 

Not to take anything from Mahomes because he's playing incredibly right now but he does have All Pros at running back, TE and WR.

Has the best playmaker in football in Hill and best tight end with Kelce and one of the best RB's who is a dual threat....

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3 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

:lol:

 

Not ENOUGH plays, apparently, as the score was a record one.

 

Three defensive TDs and a fourth TD scored on very next play after a turnover count as part of that record score.  It's not all offensive points in this game.

 

I'd say this game had everything: pre-game hype, two scoop and scores, a pick six, multiple sacks, clutch catches, ten TD passes, a goal line stand, a TD drop, excellent punting by the RAMs, a few lead changes, a missed XP by each team, and two interceptions in the last 90 seconds to give the RAMS the win.  How could this game have possibly been better?

 

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3 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

How Will Rams-Chiefs Impact the Future of the NFL?

Monday night's game between the Rams and Chiefs marked a pivotal moment for the NFL. As a result, expect many teams to make major changes this offseason.

 

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When something operates at the pace of an AAU basketball game between tireless children, there may not have been enough stoppage time to recognize the strength and direction of the undercurrent surging beneath. Football, after years of being chopped up, hacked into pieces, broken down and frantically welded together, was officially remade on Monday night. And it’s never going back.

 

This is a dumb assessment.  90% of the coaches out there hate this style of play, it’s not sustainable.  It’s never been a recipe for a SB win ever.  Top 5 offenses in history didn’t win the SB those years.  #1 all time (2013 Broncos) got blown out 41-8 by Seahawks. 

 

Coaches play for a SB, not for ratings or fantasy football.  Playoff football - Defense Matters.  

 

Manning 9 times (NFL record) was one and done in playoffs in Indy with Elite offenses.  Then he got blown out with best offense all time in SB.  He only got his 2nd one cuz of Broncos D and run game when he was worst passer in NFL and worst rating of a winning SB QB in history.  If not for the D, his crappy brother would have more SB rings than him.

 

Brees losing records most years he threw for 5000 yards.  Rivers never sniffed SB.  I mean I can go on and on showing how these insane passing attacks don’t produce SB wins nearly as much as the fan myths lead you to believe.

 

So no, this game isn’t changing much, this was two BAD defenses going up against 2 high powered offenses.  And BOTH teams were stupid in this game as both teams had incredible running backs and either cost themselves the game (KC) or nearly cost themselves the game (Rams) because late in when they didn’t run to try and control clock with their potent run game.  KC instead had several costly turnovers and Rams did the 3 stupidest play calls in NFL history when they could have damn near sealed the win but instead gave KC a legit shot to comeback WITH a timeout they failed to make them burn.  Soooooo stupid.  

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1 minute ago, jrober38 said:

 

What I said applies to 50% of the teams in the NFL.

 

Anyone who can't score 30 points or more a week is in major trouble going forward as the rules are set up more than ever to encourage scoring. 

And yet you singled out Josh Allen, a rookie QB who hasn’t played in five weeks, and has played 20 total quarters of NFL football.

 

No agenda there...

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2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yes they can.  Not all the top offensive powers won it all.

 

Not to take anything from Mahomes because he's playing incredibly right now but he does have All Pros at running back, TE and WR.

Has the best playmaker in football in Hill and best tight end with Kelce and one of the best RB's who is a dual threat....

 

The rules are drastically different now than they were even three years ago. 

 

Scoring is up, QB Rating is up, everything about passing the football is up, and the Bills are chugging along with the worst pass offense in the NFL. 

 

They have great weapons, but he's made them all significantly better than they were just a season ago. 

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The current NFL is hugely being remade in the image of the modern college game. And it has to be because the modern players are not being schooled in the old fundamentals once prized by the NFL. Linemen are clueless coming in with the old techniques, QBs don't know how to read complicated defenses, instead relying on mobility and the RPO and so. GB is a perfect example of a classic old NFL approach, grinding away, Rodgers struggling to score 2 or 3 TDs all game long. 

 

If you don't like the sort of game we saw last night, I don't think you will be a fan of the NFL going forward. The "old" NFL is as dead as the leather helmet era. The big question for Bills fans: Is our team building towards this new future or is it stuck in the past?

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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This is a dumb assessment.  90% of the coaches out there hate this style of play, it’s not sustainable.  It’s never been a recipe for a SB win ever.  Top 5 offenses in history didn’t win the SB those years.  #1 all time (2013 Broncos) got blown out 41-8 by Seahawks. 

 

Coaches play for a SB, not for ratings or fantasy football.  Playoff football - Defense Matters.  

 

Manning 9 times (NFL record) was one and done in playoffs in Indy with Elite offenses.  Then he got blown out with best offense all time in SB.  He only got his 2nd one cuz of Broncos D and run game when he was worst passer in NFL and worst rating of a winning SB QB in history.  If not for the D, his crappy brother would have more SB rings than him.

 

Brees losing records most years he threw for 5000 yards.  Rivers never sniffed SB.  I mean I can go on and on showing how these insane passing attacks don’t produce SB wins nearly as much as the fan myths lead you to believe.

 

So no, this game isn’t changing much, this was too BAD defenses going up against 2 high powered offenses.  And BOTH teams were stupid in this game as both teams had incredible running backs and either cost themselves the game (KC) or nearly cost themselves the game (Rams) because late In game wirhnkead then didn’t try and control clock and use their potent run game.  KC instead had several costly turnovers and Rams did the 3 stupidest play calls in NFL history when they could have damn near sealed the win and gave KC a legit shot to comeback instead.

 

You must have missed last year's SB between PHI and NE where offense ruled the day with the score of 41-33.  It's going to be the same story in SB LIII with the Saints or Rams from the NFC and the Chiefs, Patriots, or Steelers from the AFC.  You're obviously not watching the offensive schemes that are succeeding along with the way the game is officiated that puts defense at a distinct disadvantage.  Yesterday's gone!

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2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This is a dumb assessment.  90% of the coaches out there hate this style of play, it’s not sustainable.  It’s never been a recipe for a SB win ever.  Top 5 offenses in history didn’t win the SB those years.  #1 all time (2013 Broncos) got blown out 41-8 by Seahawks. 

 

Coaches play for a SB, not for ratings or fantasy football.  Playoff football - Defense Matters.  

 

Manning 9 times (NFL record) was one and done in playoffs in Indy with Elite offenses.  Then he got blown out with best offense all time in SB.  He only got his 2nd one cuz of Broncos D and run game when he was worst passer in NFL and worst rating of a winning SB QB in history.  If not for the D, his crappy brother would have more SB rings than him.

 

Brees losing records most years he threw for 5000 yards.  Rivers never sniffed SB.  I mean I can go on and on showing how these insane passing attacks don’t produce SB wins nearly as much as the fan myths lead you to believe.

 

So no, this game isn’t changing much, this was too BAD defenses going up against 2 high powered offenses.  And BOTH teams were stupid in this game as both teams had incredible running backs and either cost themselves the game (KC) or nearly cost themselves the game (Rams) because late In game wirhnkead then didn’t try and control clock and use their potent run game.  KC instead had several costly turnovers and Rams did the 3 stupidest play calls in NFL history when they could have damn near sealed the win and gave KC a legit shot to comeback instead.

 

The rules are a lot different now than they were three years ago. 

 

This is the future of the NFL, where defenders aren't allowed to play defense the same way they were in the past. 

 

You can't touch receivers, you can't touch the QB, you can't hit players coming across the middle. 

 

Everything done over the past 2-3 years has been done to encourage passing the football which results in more points. 

 

We'll see what happens this year, but it's hard to imagine anyone other than the Rams, Chiefs or Saints winning the Super Bowl at this point, and they're the top 3 teams in scoring. Pittsburgh and New England are probably good long shots, and they're 4th and 7th in scoring. 

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1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

You must have missed last year's SB between PHI and NE where offense ruled the day with the score of 41-33.  It's going to be the same story in SB LIII with the Saints or Rams from the NFC and the Chiefs, Patriots, or Steelers from the AFC.  You're obviously not watching the offensive schemes that are succeeding along with the way the game is officiated that puts defense at a distinct disadvantage.  Yesterday's gone!

 

I love how 1 game now is the future.  Last year Brady threw for over 500 yards and lost.  Had they had played ANY D they win.  Just because two teams who played no D in the SB last year doesn’t mean that’s now the new recipe lmao.  Just like two awful defenses last night aren’t changing coaches minds either.  Come on man, that’s absurd.

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7 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

And yet you singled out Josh Allen, a rookie QB who hasn’t played in five weeks, and has played 20 total quarters of NFL football.

 

No agenda there...

 

I singled him out because he's the Buffalo Bills QB and this is a Buffalo Bills message board.

 

Who am I supposed to talk about if not our QB? 

 

The top teams in the NFL all score upwards of 28 points a game. How on earth are we going to get there from where we are now? 

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Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I love how 1 game now is the future.  Last year Brady threw for over 500 yards and lost.  Had they had played ANY D they win.  Just because two teams who played no D in the SB last year doesn’t mean that’s now the new recipe lmao.  Just like two awful defenses last night aren’t changing coaches minds either.  Come on man, that’s absurd.

 

One game? :lol: The league is in the midst of an all time offensive explosion.  Wake up and watch.

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2 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

The rules are drastically different now than they were even three years ago. 

 

Scoring is up, QB Rating is up, everything about passing the football is up, and the Bills are chugging along with the worst pass offense in the NFL. 

 

They have great weapons, but he's made them all significantly better than they were just a season ago. 

 

The top offense 3 years ago or today is still the top offense.  The 2015 Panthers were the top offense and would currently be 4th.  They looked unstoppable that year....

The 2016 Falcons offense looked unstoppable....

2013 Broncos offense looked unstoppable....

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3 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

The rules are a lot different now than they were three years ago. 

 

This is the future of the NFL, where defenders aren't allowed to play defense the same way they were in the past. 

 

You can't touch receivers, you can't touch the QB, you can't hit players coming across the middle. 

 

Everything done over the past 2-3 years has been done to encourage passing the football which results in more points. 

 

We'll see what happens this year, but it's hard to imagine anyone other than the Rams, Chiefs or Saints winning the Super Bowl at this point, and they're the top 3 teams in scoring. Pittsburgh and New England are probably good long shots, and they're 4th and 7th in scoring. 

 

Sorry that’s fan exaggeration.  Rules are not that much different.  You couldn’t do any of that stuff 3 years ago either, none of that’s new.  The only thing that was different this year was how often they called roughing the passer, but that’s subdued a little as the season has gone on and I suspect they will make some adjustments to that dumb rule this offseason as all the coaches hate the absurd penalties.   

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1 minute ago, jrober38 said:

 

I singled him out because he's the Buffalo Bills QB and this is a Buffalo Bills message board.

 

Who am I supposed to talk about if not our QB? 

 

The top teams in the NFL all score upwards of 28 points a game. How on earth are we going to get there from where we are now? 

 

Earlier you said if you aren't scoring 30 a game....you're in serious trouble.

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4 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said:

let's all hope he's wrong.

 

Because that's the kind of product I want no part of. It's OK to score. It's NOT ok to allow the other guy to score like that.

 

If the NFL trivializes defense and becomes arena football expect a huge viewership to disappear. 

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3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

One game? :lol: The league is in the midst of an all time offensive explosion.  Wake up and watch.

 

Ive heard that for 5 years.  And yet here we sit.  Top 5 offenses in NFL history have zero super bowl wins.  14 of last 20 SB wins went to defensive HCs.  #1 offense of all time got blown out in SB by defensive team 41-8.  

 

Sorry, this is just more fan mythology and history, stats, and facts prove that it’s not the only way to win, or even the most common.  

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Just now, Royale with Cheese said:

 

The top offense 3 years ago or today is still the top offense.  The 2015 Panthers were the top offense and would currently be 4th.  They looked unstoppable that year....

The 2016 Falcons offense looked unstoppable....

2013 Broncos offense looked unstoppable....

 

And the rules have changed since.

 

Can't touch the receivers the way you could then, can't hit the QB without threat of a personal foul call, and you can't hit anyone coming over the middle looking to catch the football. 

 

The Legion of Boom couldn't exist with the current rules. DBs can no longer play that style of physicality on the back end, and linemen can't hit QBs the way they used to be able to. 

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Earlier you said if you aren't scoring 30 a game....you're in serious trouble.

 

The top teams in the NFL are all scoring more than 30 points a game.

 

New England is down around 28 and I can't count them out. 

 

Otherwise there's no one in the NFL who scores less than 28 points a game who has any real shot at winning the Super Bowl. 

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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Ive heard that for 5 years.  And yet here we sit.  Top 5 offenses in NFL history have zero super bowl wins.  14 of last 20 SB wins went to defensive HCs.  #1 offense of all time got blown out in SB by defensive team 41-8.  

 

Sorry, this is just more fan mythology and history, stats, and facts prove that it’s not the only way to win, or even the most common.  

 

You can continue to swim in denial all you'd like to 20 years ago to an era that has nothing to do with how offenses operate in today's game.  Wake up Rip. 

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3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Sorry that’s fan exaggeration.  Rules are not that much different.  You couldn’t do any of that stuff 3 years ago either, none of that’s new.  The only thing that was different this year was how often they called roughing the passer, but that’s subdued a little as the season has gone on and I suspect they will make some adjustments to that dumb rule this offseason as all the coaches hate the absurd penalties.   

 

The rules about hitting QBs and driving them to the ground are brand new. As is hitting a defenseless receiver. 

 

Those are both rules new for the 2018 season.

 

They also made the catch rule simpler, making it easier to "catch" the football than it was 5 years ago.

 

Sorry, but the rules are very different, and all the changes encourage passing the football. 

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Just now, jrober38 said:

 

The rules about hitting QBs and driving them to the ground are brand new. As is hitting a defenseless receiver. 

 

Those are both rules new for the 2018 season.

 

They also made the catch rule simpler, making it easier to "catch" the football than it was 5 years ago.

 

Sorry, but the rules are very different, and all the changes encourage passing the football. 

 

100% the case.  

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1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

You can continue to swim in denial all you'd like to 20 years ago to an era that has nothing to do with how offenses operate in today's game.  Wake up Rip. 

Nothing Insaid had anything to do with 20 years ago...all within the last 2 to 10 years.  You’re in denial and working off opinion rather than facts.  

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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Nothing Insaid had anything to do with 20 years ago...all within the last 2 to 10 years.  You’re in denial and working off opinion rather than facts.  

 

Your words: "14 of last 20 SB wins went to defensive HCs"

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3 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

:lol:

 

Not ENOUGH plays, apparently, as the score was a record one.

 

I agree, I don't think it's good for the defense to completely fall apart on 95% of the plays and make a spectacular play 5% of the time. That's not good defense. That's occasionally making a really good play.  

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Kind of odd to see such a futuristic game played in a relic of an NFL venue.

 

When I was a kid, you needed a quarterback. Now that I'm a bit older, you still need a quarterback.

 

All this apoplectic talk about the collapse of the league is a bit overblown IMO. Andy Reid has been around the league for 30 years, 20 as a head coach. He found a freak QB. Of course rule changes have benefited the offense. That doesn't mean 54-51 games are the new norm. You will always need skill players executing at a high level. That's what you saw last night.

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2 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

And the rules have changed since.

 

Can't touch the receivers the way you could then, can't hit the QB without threat of a personal foul call, and you can't hit anyone coming over the middle looking to catch the football. 

 

The Legion of Boom couldn't exist with the current rules. DBs can no longer play that style of physicality on the back end, and linemen can't hit QBs the way they used to be able to. 

 

The top teams in the NFL are all scoring more than 30 points a game.

 

New England is down around 28 and I can't count them out. 

 

Otherwise there's no one in the NFL who scores less than 28 points a game who has any real shot at winning the Super Bowl. 

 

There's only 3 teams scoring 30 points per game so when you say "you're in serious trouble" if you don't score 30....that would include all teams below 30 including the Pats.  Those are your words and not mine.  So basically only 3 teams right now have a real shot at winning the Super Bowl I guess.

 

So what that the rules have changed.  That year, that offense was the best.  So it's even more impressive what the 2016 Falcons, 2011 Pats and 2013 Broncos did because they were scoring at a very high rate when they didn't have these new rules.  They were still scoring at a really high rate.

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1 minute ago, jrober38 said:

 

The rules about hitting QBs and driving them to the ground are brand new. As is hitting a defenseless receiver. 

 

Those are both rules new for the 2018 season.

 

They also made the catch rule simpler, making it easier to "catch" the football than it was 5 years ago.

 

Sorry, but the rules are very different, and all the changes encourage passing the football. 

 

Skrry, the catch had no impact.  All that did was eliminate things that are real catches like Dez in playoffs and Calvin TDs from being incomplete.  Plays that happened like 3 times over a couple years.  

 

It literally has almost no impact other than being sure to get a couple plays correct a year.  And the QB hit thing is what I said was the only difference, but those resulted in unneccesarry penalties, not more explosive offenses.  

 

Again, way over exaggerated as if it’s somehow a completely different game now.  

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Just now, LSHMEAB said:

Kind of odd to see such a futuristic game played in a relic of an NFL venue.

 

When I was a kid, you needed a quarterback. Now that I'm a bit older, you still need a quarterback.

 

All this apoplectic talk about the collapse of the league is a bit overblown IMO. Andy Reid has been around the league for 30 years, 20 as a head coach. He found a freak QB. Of course rule changes have benefited the offense. That doesn't mean 54-51 games are the new norm. You will always need skill players executing at a high level. That's what you saw last night.

 

Andy Reid is also borrowing heavily from CFB and even HS with formations and plays he has incorporated into his offense. 

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22 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yes they can.  Not all the top offensive powers won it all.

 

Not to take anything from Mahomes because he's playing incredibly right now but he does have All Pros at running back, TE and WR.

Has the best playmaker in football in Hill and best tight end with Kelce and one of the best RB's who is a dual threat....

Yep,

 

Mahomes and Goff are quite fortunate to have the weapons and schemes they have.

 

Still have to execute, but it’s easier when everyone is a threat.

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2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Your words: "14 of last 20 SB wins went to defensive HCs"

 

All those record setting offenses that happened over recent years:  ZERO SB wins.  Top 2 all time COMBINED to score 22 points in SB while opponents with mediocre offenses combined to score 58.  

 

That’s the top two in history oursocred 58-22 in the SB despite their opponent having marginal offenses.  

 

 

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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Skrry, the catch had no impact.  All that did was eliminate things that are real catches like Dez in playoffs and Calvin TDs from being incomplete.  Plays that happened like 3 times over a couple years.  

 

It literally has almost no impact other than being sure to get a couple plays correct a year.  And the QB hit thing is what I said was the only difference, but those resulted in unneccesarry penalties, not more explosive offenses.  

 

Again, way over exaggerated as if it’s somehow a completely different game now.  

 

The catch rule happened all the time. At least one game a week would have what is now a TD called back. 

 

The QB hit keeps the offense on the field. It's an automatic first down that bails out 3rd and long situations where the defense historically would have got off the field.

 

All of these things reward passing.

 

More passes are now caught.

 

More penalties are called in the defensive backfield that result in automatic first downs.

 

More penalties are called against the QB that result in automatic first downs.

 

All of these rule changes keep offenses on the field longer, allowing them to score points because they have to punt less frequently.

 

The result is obvious. More scoring. 

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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

All those record setting offenses that happened over recent years:  ZERO SB wins.  Top 2 all time COMBINED to score 22 points in SB while opponents with mediocre offenses combined to score 58.  

 

That’s the top two in history oursocred 58-22 in the SB despite their opponent having marginal offenses.  

 

So getting back to the here and now, what great defensive team is going to win SB LIII?   

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8 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

The catch rule happened all the time. At least one game a week would have what is now a TD called back. 

 

The QB hit keeps the offense on the field. It's an automatic first down that bails out 3rd and long situations where the defense historically would have got off the field.

 

All of these things reward passing.

 

More passes are now caught.

 

More penalties are called in the defensive backfield that result in automatic first downs.

 

More penalties are called against the QB that result in automatic first downs.

 

All of these rule changes keep offenses on the field longer, allowing them to score points because they have to punt less frequently.

 

The result is obvious. More scoring. 

 

Sorry man, more fan exaggeration.  It didn’t happen remotely close to one a week.  Facts matter, I get it felt that way as it was frustrating, but the impact of that rule is minimal.  Necessary rule for sure, but affects the offensive scoring out in a minimal way.

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7 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Andy Reid is also borrowing heavily from CFB and even HS with formations and plays he has incorporated into his offense. 

I lived in Philly when Reid first started out as a HC.

 

They would routinely blast him on the radio for this very thing. He's always been one to tinker. I would guess he's doing it even more now with the rule changes and his current QB, but it's not entirely new.

 

I think Wade is done as a DC. The league is changing and it's changing fast. You either adapt or you die(career wise). Reid has clearly adapted.

 

I don't think quality defense is antiquated. I think the way we view quality defense is antiquated. Defensive coaches have to be more creative.

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Just now, LSHMEAB said:

I lived in Philly when Reid first started out as a HC.

 

They would routinely blast him on the radio for this very thing. He's always been one to tinker. I would guess he's doing it even more now with the rule changes and his current corner, but it's not entirely new.

 

I think Wade is done as a DC. The league is changing and it's changing fast. You either adapt or you die(career wise). Reid has clearly adapted.

 

I don't think quality defense is antiquated. I think the way we view quality defense is antiquated. Defensive coaches have to be more creative.

 

McVay, Payton, Shanahan, and others are doing the same.   As I posted earlier, defenses will eventually adjust before something else takes hold. 

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Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Sorry man, more fan exaggeration.  It didn’t happen remotely close to one a week.  Facts matter, I get it felt that way as it was frustrating, but the impact of that rule is minimal.  Necessary rule for sure, but affects the offensive out out in a minimal way.

 

Then why are NFL offenses scoring more points than ever before? 

 

As you said, the facts matter. 

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