Ol Dirty B Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 10 minutes ago, USABuffaloFan said: "But this man is not guilty of anything right now, he resigned." You need to read everything! It was big when it happened. I remember the draft and Losman, McCargo we all thought Buffalo was on it's way back. McCargo got hurt in camp but Losman looked like something. 2 years later, opps! Sorry man, but levy didn't select Losman. Maybe you're thinking of Edwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionC3 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, USABuffaloFan said: "But this man is not guilty of anything right now, he resigned." You need to read everything! It was big when it happened. I remember the draft and Losman, McCargo we all thought Buffalo was on it's way back. McCargo got hurt in camp but Losman looked like something. 2 years later, opps! "Pegula's brought the charges to Brandon and Brandon chose not to fight this and resign. This tells me Pegulas had good evidence but it wasn't so bad they wanted him charged." What this means is the investigations in Pegula's Sport agency wasn't just Brandon but he was the highest figure so it was best things get changed. Why would the Pegula's want this to linger any farther, sexual harassment charges are serious if they go to court, the individual and company have a stake! I did read everything. You used the word “charged.” It has a criminal connotation, especially when used in the context of private sector workplace misconduct. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 I see the loons have arrived. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USABuffaloFan Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, Ol Dirty B said: Sorry man, but levy didn't select Losman. Maybe you're thinking of Edwards? Brandon did 4 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: I see the loons have arrived. Landed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) UPDATED INFO (?) Some time between when this story first broke and now, apparently Russ Brandon came out with his own statement. He is saying he wanted to hit 20 years with the organization and then "transition" out of the organization. Has been planning this for a while. He hit 20 last November, the draft is now over, and the timing is right to step away now. So we have 2 competing stories as to why he left, at least for now. Brandon isn't going to come out of this thing looking very good, I guarantee. Edited May 2, 2018 by Fadingpain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USABuffaloFan Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, Fadingpain said: UPDATED INFO (?) Some time between when this story first broke and now, apparently Russ Brandon came out with his own statement. He is saying he wanted to hit 20 years with the organization and then "transition" out of the organization. Has been planning this for a while. He hit 20 last November, the draft is now over, and the timing is right to step away now. So we have 2 competing stories as to why he left, at least for now. Brandon isn't going to come out of this thing looking very good, I guarantee. That is old info. But I understand why he did that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 42 minutes ago, USABuffaloFan said: "But this man is not guilty of anything right now, he resigned." You need to read everything! It was big when it happened. I remember the draft and Losman, McCargo we all thought Buffalo was on it's way back. McCargo got hurt in camp but Losman looked like something. 2 years later, opps! "Pegula's brought the charges to Brandon and Brandon chose not to fight this and resign. This tells me Pegulas had good evidence but it wasn't so bad they wanted him charged." What this means is the investigations in Pegula's Sport agency wasn't just Brandon but he was the highest figure so it was best things get changed. Why would the Pegula's want this to linger any farther, sexual harassment charges are serious if they go to court, the individual and company have a stake! Again no “we all” didn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 So he mailed in the last couple years to get to 20? I wonder if he gets a severance package for getting axed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USABuffaloFan Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, joesixpack said: Again no “we all” didn’t. we'll or some or maybe just me. go drink a six pack! 2 minutes ago, JMF2006 said: So he mailed in the last couple years to get to 20? I wonder if he gets a severance package for getting axed? Severance = some integrity Brandon lead the charge to Ms. Wilson to sell the Bills to Pegulas at the most expensive franchise take over ever in the NFL by almost 400 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 1 hour ago, cd1 said: Why is this even a "thing"? Because Russ was the connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol Dirty B Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 45 minutes ago, USABuffaloFan said: Brandon did Landed! He didn't. Donahoe was the GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 The "black cloud" over Buffalo sports has been lifted! Bills trade up to get their (hopefully) franchise QB! Sabres win the draft lottery and right to draft Dahlin! The "architect" of the worst period in Bills franchise history resigns! All of Buffalo sports fandom, rejoice! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) 6 hours ago, stuvian said: I was very surprised that Brandon has lasted this long into the Pegula era. Usually an ownership and regime change means a total housecleaning. While Brandon likely had a very good severance package and was apparently found guilty of serious misconduct, I still find it sad when people get fired, even deservedly. Sexual harrassment is a serious issue which left unaddressed can destroy people and organizations. If Brandon is just getting his comeuppance now one wonders just what the culture at OBD was truly like. I guess our franchise was living in darkness on and off the field. Having a consensual affair is one thing, but ritual harrassment of subordinates is serious wrongdoing that cannot go unpunished. He must have been a pretty good BS artist to have cajoled this much power out of Ralph. The lack of thanks for his service in the Pegs PSA speaks volumes. First thing I told my wife after Russ' comments to Benini (sp) on Channel 2 that made me think he couldn't even stop lying. no where in the Pegulas statement, even after someone gets fired, was the standard, "we thank Russ for his years of service to the organization and wish him well in his future endeavors." Man, it was better for him even yesterday to just say nothing instead of proving to us the reasons why he was let go. Edited May 2, 2018 by dollars 2 donuts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan_34 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 12 hours ago, SDS said: He's an at will employee. His employers chose to fire him. Perhaps he should have sought union protection? I trust that the reasons for his firing were sufficient for Kim and Terry and their business. P.S. Your optics are awful. What union? Is there one for Presidents of a franchise? Ive never heard of such a thing. Even if he did have “union protection” they may have not assisted in this matter. I can tell you first hand, unions dont like to get tangled in workplace sexual misconduct. My place of employment of 15,000 with a powerful union left a guy on an island all by himself for similar stuff- he was shown the door after 15 years of faithhful service to the company and his patients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 "Don't let him leave the building" is Russ' Bills legacy. Good riddance! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Toll Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 Good riddance Russ, you never let me come inside at OBD!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 12 hours ago, SDS said: He's an at will employee. His employers chose to fire him. Perhaps he should have sought union protection? I trust that the reasons for his firing were sufficient for Kim and Terry and their business. P.S. Your optics are awful. ....he is actually under contract just like HC or GM....if he was fired, he gets paid in full like GM or HC....resignation is another matter and I do not believe he gets paid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweats Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 Lots of good stuff going on here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 6 hours ago, TakeYouToTasker said: Then we are having two different conversations. As I said in one of my first several posts in this thread, I respect the Pegula's right, which I 100% support, to negotiate Russ Brandon's exit. That is their decision, and I am far more generous in supporting the right of the employer to discharge any employee for any reason than most you'll encounter. That is not what is in dispute. What I am arguing against is the moral underpinnings of a guiding philosophy which directly ties how people should behave to how willing we are to sue people, and the hands-in-pockets, strangely humanist-yet-Puritanical, untrusting outcomes all of this dictates. I understand that you're arguing the law, because the law is on your side. I'm arguing that I think it's wrong to presume the accused is guilty simply because he's been accused. And again, this shouldn't be controversial. Edit: And if what he was fired for was dipping his pen in the company ink, the only scandal is that Kim Pegula feels herself meta enough that she should be able to dictate to people who they should !@#$. 1 If that was all you were arguing, then I agree, 100%. However, in this thread, and other threads regarding this topic, your posts appear to go beyond the bounds of merely arguing for the presumption of innocence into rants about biological imperatives and third wave feminism / #MeToo - as if (1) men have no ability to control their behavior due to biological underpinnings of human behavior and (2) every allegation of sexual misconduct is nothing more than the product of vengeful feminism. In the end, the tone of your posts sometimes makes you sound very similar to the fringe you are railing against. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET1062 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 So, who was he banging? She's certainly a very expensive piece of ass! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, Lurker said: In the 13-year stretch from 1967 to 1979 they made the playoffs once and won a total of 60 games--an average of 4.6 per year (0.322 win %). In eight of those 13 years, they won 4 games or less. They won 7 or more games only four times over that period. In the 17-year "drought" era, they won a total of 112 games or 6.5 per year (0.412 win %). In nine of those years, they had 7 or more victories. They won 4 games or less only two times. IMO, mediocre (2000-17) was a lot more palatable than bad (1967-79), and I too have been here through all that frustration... I think the difference is that between 1967-1979, effective player FA was very limited and the salary cap didn't exist, so that there was much more inertia in team success, ie, good teams tended to stay good and bad teams tended to stay bad for much longer than they do today. Today, the norm is for teams to rise and fall with considerably more frequency. The Bills have been a rare exception as they have failed to have even modest success on the field, at least until last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 36 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: If that was all you were arguing, then I agree, 100%. However, in this thread, and other threads regarding this topic, your posts appear to go beyond the bounds of merely arguing for the presumption of innocence into rants about biological imperatives and third wave feminism / #MeToo - as if (1) men have no ability to control their behavior due to biological underpinnings of human behavior and (2) every allegation of sexual misconduct is nothing more than the product of vengeful feminism. In the end, the tone of your posts sometimes makes you sound very similar to the fringe you are railing against. You misrepresent the argument. It's not that men have no ability to control their behavior, but rather that much of natural male behavior has been vilified (see "toxic masculinity"). Further, there is an active movement to expand "sexual misconduct" to apply much more broadly so as to include behavior that many don't believe should be treated as such (see Affirmative Consent). Pointing out that this agenda is advanced by third wave feminists doesn't undercut that point at all. It's just stating the obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweats Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 I don’t know about anyone else, but I’m happy the used car salesman is finally ousted. Try wheeling and dealin yer way outta this one, Russ. its a good day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akm0404 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 I think the agenda is less vilifying natural male behavior and more stop being rapey and coercing subordinates to blow you at work. No need to take things to such extremes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, kota said: The amount of glee people are having of this is truly pathetic. Cry me a river for Russ Brandon. The only thing I'm sorry about regarding Brandon's firing is that he got axed because of his personal behavior and not for his incompetence as a football executive. 4 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said: Anyone taking pleasure of this announcement is just SIC! Your not a true Bills fan, just a troll. We all have good and bad memories of Russ running the Bills in different capacities. I wanted him gone!!! Not like this. I always looked at Russ as a family man from Rochester to Western NY. Young guy who grew up in the Bills atmosphere. With power come a enormous burden to be more moral than the next guy. That is not easy, most men don't understand and alot of woman will exploit that. I would not want to be married and live their lifes. As a single guy, never married and 52 I can tell you alot of stories of the stuff I have seen with married men at bars. Doesn't matter what I do I am single but most married men behave worse than I do as a single guy. The point is don't judge or be judged. I am sure someone has seen something at one time in your life you would not want known!!!!!!!! No one but Jesus is moral enough to cast a stone here. Russ, good luck in your life. What ever happens here, be honest with your wife and keep it between your family. Us Bills fans don't need to know and don't want to know. Take care of FAMILY. Been a tough "20" years but I don't hate it, worse that happened is we needed to bomb out some times and give up on players quicker but knew alot of good men in that time, Kelsey, Williams, Woods, Jackson, Fitz, etc... You kept Levy legacy going, you loved NY. Fix your life, be a man, power isn't everything, family is. God Bless and find peace. You're only 52? Reading your post, I pegged you to be at least 80 with attitudes more appropriate to the 1950s than the 21st century. Russ Brandon cheated on his wife, apparently over a relatively long period of time. He also knowingly violated modern standards of employer/employee conduct by having a sexual affair with a subordinate. He then lied to his bosses about it, which led them to investigate and apparently find more problems with his conduct. How is any of this defensible? Let me guess ... the Devil made him do it! I don't know what kind of FAMILY you come from, but among my relatives, even the redneck ones, there's certainly not much tolerance for infidelity, lying, and bullying, much less rationalization of such behavior. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 14 hours ago, fridge said: I'm not surprised at all that this snake would just pretend there's no sexual misconduct issue that triggered his resignation. What kind of guy quits after being investigated and pretends he's been planning on quitting today for 20 years? A weasel, this guy is garbage and I've wanted him gone since day one. So glad this guy is gone. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_with_it Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 4 hours ago, Ol Dirty B said: The beginning of this thread is gross. You guys should probably just delete your posts with the gifs and all that. It wasn't for performance. So I guess sleeping with employees is a normal thing for any President. Of course it was performance. Hes inneffective at being a president if hes using inappropriate coduct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 16 minutes ago, Rob's House said: You misrepresent the argument. It's not that men have no ability to control their behavior, but rather that much of natural male behavior has been vilified (see "toxic masculinity"). Further, there is an active movement to expand "sexual misconduct" to apply much more broadly so as to include behavior that many don't believe should be treated as such (see Affirmative Consent). Pointing out that this agenda is advanced by third wave feminists doesn't undercut that point at all. It's just stating the obvious. You obviously have never had a girlfriend or wife or sister or daughter coerced into having sex with her boss in order to keep her job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said: Anyone taking pleasure of this announcement is just SIC! Your not a true Bills fan, just a troll. We all have good and bad memories of Russ running the Bills in different capacities. I wanted him gone!!! Not like this. I always looked at Russ as a family man from Rochester to Western NY. Young guy who grew up in the Bills atmosphere. With power come a enormous burden to be more moral than the next guy. That is not easy, most men don't understand and alot of woman will exploit that. I would not want to be married and live their lifes. As a single guy, never married and 52 I can tell you alot of stories of the stuff I have seen with married men at bars. Doesn't matter what I do I am single but most married men behave worse than I do as a single guy. The point is don't judge or be judged. I am sure someone has seen something at one time in your life you would not want known!!!!!!!! No one but Jesus is moral enough to cast a stone here. Russ, good luck in your life. What ever happens here, be honest with your wife and keep it between your family. Us Bills fans don't need to know and don't want to know. Take care of FAMILY. Been a tough "20" years but I don't hate it, worse that happened is we needed to bomb out some times and give up on players quicker but knew alot of good men in that time, Kelsey, Williams, Woods, Jackson, Fitz, etc... You kept Levy legacy going, you loved NY. Fix your life, be a man, power isn't everything, family is. God Bless and find peace. No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! Uhhhhh, are you a special kind of ignorant or just obtuse? You said you don't judge but yet said we have no class. And, yes, we do know what happened. Thanks to tinder, no less, I got information on this early. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fischer Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 10 hours ago, Rosen-not-Chosen said: Yes, it's starting out high, I guess we'll see where it goes from here. Yeah, you wouldn’t want to pre-judge her or anything . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said: NO No Class! No Class! I'll repeat it. Shut up. Dare to dance with me is like dancing with the devil, sweetheart. I dance good, too.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Rob's House said: You misrepresent the argument. It's not that men have no ability to control their behavior, but rather that much of natural male behavior has been vilified (see "toxic masculinity"). Further, there is an active movement to expand "sexual misconduct" to apply much more broadly so as to include behavior that many don't believe should be treated as such (see Affirmative Consent). Pointing out that this agenda is advanced by third wave feminists doesn't undercut that point at all. It's just stating the obvious. I am well aware of the term "toxic masculinity" and the problem with the argument on both sides is there seems to be a sliding scale on what constitutes "natural male behavior." Even if everyone agreed on the definition of natural male behavior, it can still manifest as appropriate or inappropriate behavior dependent upon the circumstances. I agree the pendulum has swung in regard to the broadening application of the term "sexual misconduct" and the disparity (in many instances) between behavior and the severity of consequences. I do not agree with that either. However, I also understand that, as with most instances of the pendulum swinging from one extreme to the other, that it is a reaction to the long time "willful ignorance" of many people to "real" issues of sexual misconduct - and outright predatory behaviors. Edited May 2, 2018 by billsfan1959 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, Bill_with_it said: Hes inneffective at being a president if hes using inappropriate coduct. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, TakeYouToTasker said: Edit: And if what he was fired for was dipping his pen in the company ink, the only scandal is that Kim Pegula feels herself meta enough that she should be able to dictate to people who they should !@#$. The closest thing to pure evil I've seen on this forum. Congrats. EDIT: you were better off without the "edit." Edited May 2, 2018 by Coach Tuesday 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 14 minutes ago, SoTier said: You obviously have never had a girlfriend or wife or sister or daughter coerced into having sex with her boss in order to keep her job. Please explain how you drew that conclusion from my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 18 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: I am well aware of the term "toxic masculinity" and the problem with the argument on both sides is there seems to be a sliding scale on what constitutes "natural male behavior." Even if everyone agreed on the definition of natural male behavior, it can still manifest as appropriate or inappropriate behavior dependent upon the circumstances. I agree the pendulum has swung in regard to the broadening application of the term "sexual misconduct" and the disparity (in many instances) between behavior and the severity of consequences. I do not agree with that either. However, I also understand that, as with most instances of the pendulum swinging from one extreme to the other, that it is a reaction to the long time "willful ignorance" of many people to "real" issues of sexual misconduct - and outright predatory behaviors. I agree. We're seeing what might someday be considered a slight over-correction, but it makes sense viewed in the context of, well, the last ten thousand years. I understand why it upsets certain people but that's probably just the price we need to pay as a society to fix systemic inequalities. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teef Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said: Anyone taking pleasure of this announcement is just SIC! Your not a true Bills fan, just a troll. We all have good and bad memories of Russ running the Bills in different capacities. I wanted him gone!!! Not like this. I always looked at Russ as a family man from Rochester to Western NY. Young guy who grew up in the Bills atmosphere. With power come a enormous burden to be more moral than the next guy. That is not easy, most men don't understand and alot of woman will exploit that. I would not want to be married and live their lifes. As a single guy, never married and 52 I can tell you alot of stories of the stuff I have seen with married men at bars. Doesn't matter what I do I am single but most married men behave worse than I do as a single guy. The point is don't judge or be judged. I am sure someone has seen something at one time in your life you would not want known!!!!!!!! No one but Jesus is moral enough to cast a stone here. Russ, good luck in your life. What ever happens here, be honest with your wife and keep it between your family. Us Bills fans don't need to know and don't want to know. Take care of FAMILY. Been a tough "20" years but I don't hate it, worse that happened is we needed to bomb out some times and give up on players quicker but knew alot of good men in that time, Kelsey, Williams, Woods, Jackson, Fitz, etc... You kept Levy legacy going, you loved NY. Fix your life, be a man, power isn't everything, family is. God Bless and find peace. No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! No Class! i'm sure you just ooze class. classy mcclaster. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 19 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: I am well aware of the term "toxic masculinity" and the problem with the argument on both sides is there seems to be a sliding scale on what constitutes "natural male behavior." Even if everyone agreed on the definition of natural male behavior, it can still manifest as appropriate or inappropriate behavior dependent upon the circumstances. I agree the pendulum has swung in regard to the broadening application of the term "sexual misconduct" and the disparity (in many instances) between behavior and the severity of consequences. I do not agree with that either. However, I also understand that, as with most instances of the pendulum swinging from one extreme to the other, that it is a reaction to the long time "willful ignorance" of many people to "real" issues of sexual misconduct - and outright predatory behaviors. You hit the nail on the head. It's not the correction, but rather the overcorrection where inlies the danger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 5 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said: No matter how you feel about what Russ did, this is not how it should end. Wison is crying right now real tears, same with Butler. Sad Bills day, this doesn't help our cause! He resigned not fired, statement was he was looking to leave after 20 years of service anyway. Means he was around to long and things got too comfortable. Sad but I can see this happening. No Class! No Class! No Class! 20 years in the same place with disfunction everywhere and small success but a power position. I am hoping One Bills Drive survives, sad day! Your right he has no class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 3 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: I agree. We're seeing what might someday be considered a slight over-correction, but it makes sense viewed in the context of, well, the last ten thousand years. I understand why it upsets certain people but that's probably just the price we need to pay as a society to fix systemic inequalities. Unfortunately, it is the price. As Thomas Jefferson said, "...a little rebellion, now and then, is a good thing...," and what you are seeing is a rebellion against inequities that have existed for a long, long time. I hate to see anyone unjustly treated as a result; however, I do understand the reasons behind what we are seeing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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