If Darnold doesn’t go #1

[Dkollidas]

If Cleveland doesnt take the USC QB #1 overall, Is it pretty much guaranteed McDermott & Beane try to move Heaven & Earth in order to get Darnold?

 

Could see a deal directly with the Giants... #21, #22, 2019 1st Round Pick, 2019 4th Round Pick & OT- Cordy Glenn for #2.

 

Or could we see two deals? Trade to say, #7 with Tampa (#21 & 2019 1st Round Pick), and then Trade #7 plus Glenn plus #22 for #2?

 

Regardless, I just think they have been rumored to really like Darnold. If Cleveland takes a different guy, I could see the Bills making the move for Darnold.

 

If Darnold is taken #1? I honestly see them staying put and taking Rudolph. 

[Teddy KGB]

I support the trade up for any of the big 3 

[ALLEN1QB]

I think we should have tanked big time

[SouthNYfan]

12 minutes ago, Dkollidas said:

If Cleveland doesnt take the USC QB #1 overall, Is it pretty much guaranteed McDermott & Beane try to move Heaven & Earth in order to get Darnold?

 

Could see a deal directly with the Giants... #21, #22, 2019 1st Round Pick, 2019 4th Round Pick & OT- Cordy Glenn for #2.

 

Or could we see two deals? Trade to say, #7 with Tampa (#21 & 2019 1st Round Pick), and then Trade #7 plus Glenn plus #22 for #2?

 

Regardless, I just think they have been rumored to really like Darnold. If Cleveland takes a different guy, I could see the Bills making the move for Darnold.

 

If Darnold is taken #1? I honestly see them staying put and taking Rudolph. 

 

3 first rounders, a 2nd rounder, and Glenn?

 

That is definitely "full ditka"

[Dkollidas]

39 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

3 first rounders, a 2nd rounder, and Glenn?

 

That is definitely "full ditka"

 

Its 3 1st’s and a 4th, not a 2nd. But to move up to #2 it will cost a lot, but if he’s their guy, and he’s there, I think they should go for it. 

Edited February 10, 2018 by Dkollidas

[PIZ]

What about Rosen?  I'm starting to think he's the target.

[transplantbillsfan]

44 minutes ago, PIZ said:

What about Rosen?  I'm starting to think he's the target.

 

Why?

 

Mayfield please 

 

...or Darnold 

[Estro]

I think Darnold is and will be the apple of the Bills brass eye.  I think the murmurs you've heard recently of the Bills liking Rosen are smoke that is being put out intentionally.  Rosen's durability issues and his lack of pocket presence are concerns I don't see the Bills selling the farm to go get.  Darnold, OTOH, I think he's a future top tier QB in the NFL.  I think the sweet spot for the Bills to trade up is in the #2-#7 spots.  If, and I think it's a huge if, the Browns pass on Darnold I'd expect the Bills to being working the lines hard.  With all of the other teams that need a QB, and my view of Darnold as the best QB, I think it's going to be tough to leapfrog so many teams that might be also looking to trade up.  

 

In the end I think the Browns will select Darnold #1, which to me ends the possibility of the Bills making a huge move up in the draft.  As for Baker Mayfield.....not  a fan.  

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, Teddy KGB said:

I support the trade up for any of the big 3 

Darnold is the ONLY QB worthy of a trade up. Not Rosen, Mayfield or Allen. But a lot will change after the combine.  I'd still consider Rudolph and the best DT at 21/22.

[FearLess Price]

I gotta disagree. I think both Mayfield and Rosen are worth trading into the top 3 for.

 

Mayfield may lack height but hes a proven gamer and QB that can go through multi progressions and sling the rock like wu tang from the pocket. Has been the most clutch of the 3, last QB that was clutch in the draft was Watson, he adapted nicely to the nfl.

 

Rosen is a typical pocket passing QB and is prob gonna have the highest floor of the 3. If it was madden, Rosen would be the highest overall after the draft but Mayfield or Darnold might have the 'superstar' progression traits.

 

Darnold has the highest celeing but also needs the most work of the 3. This doesnt mean hes bad, he jus has more to work on but everyone says theres more to develop. He can be mobile out the pocket and make big throws. Has to clean up the INTs, the NFLs windows are even smaller and unforgiving. 

[KDIGGZ]

Rosen best of the bunch.  Best high school QB in the country coming out.  Best pro style QB in the draft since Andrew Luck.  Too bad he acts so entitled.  I don't think he's a McBeane type of guy unfortunately but he will surely mature.  He's only 20 yrs old.  Who didn't think they knew it all at that age?  I still think I know it all 

[BigDingus]

23 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Darnold is the ONLY QB worthy of a trade up. Not Rosen, Mayfield or Allen. But a lot will change after the combine.  I'd still consider Rudolph and the best DT at 21/22.

 

I can see them doing that too... But it just smells like the painful 2004 Draft all over again.

The top 3 QB's go before we pick, then the Bills have their pick of the scraps & hope for a miracle. Instead of getting Eli Manning, Big Ben or Rivers, we got JP Losman (and coincidentally at #22 like we have this year) as our 1st rounder. 

This year, Darnold, Rosen & Mayfield will be gone, so we'll likely get to pick from Rudolph, Jackson & possibly Allen (yuck).... 

[transplantbillsfan]

Honest question... why isn't Mayfield the best of this bunch?

 

Is it height? He's still 6'1"... his behavior? McDermott seems like a coach who can channel that visceral competitive moxy... so what is it?

 

Mayfield please. He excites me the most. Then Darnold.

[KingRex]

It makes far more sense to this football fan for the Bills to follow the Pitts model they used to build a team and then go after a QB (who turned out to be Big Ben to win an SB.  Look, we have one of the oldest rosters in the NFL and now having to find a stud center, it seems even more obvious to  use the 2- 1st rounders and 2 nd rounders to rebuild this TEAM rather than invest all resources to put a formula 1 engine in our VW bug team.

 

Trading up for the next Andrew Luck (or worse the next Ryan Leaf) would be a disaster for this team.

[CajunBillsBacker]

I know I’m in the minority but I just don’t see the hype in Darnold. He just looks too jittery in the pocket, not comfortable at all, and he’s a turnover machine. I have him 4th behind Rosen, Allen, and Mayfield.

[White Linen]

4 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Darnold is the ONLY QB worthy of a trade up. Not Rosen, Mayfield or Allen. But a lot will change after the combine.  I'd still consider Rudolph and the best DT at 21/22.

 

When you have pick 21 and 22 all these QB's are worthy of a trade up because they're not going to be there at your slot.  Offers would vary depending on where you project needing to be to get each one but they all have consideration for trading for.  I hope the Bills pick one they like and do every single thing they can to go get him.

[SouthNYfan]

4 hours ago, KingRex said:

It makes far more sense to this football fan for the Bills to follow the Pitts model they used to build a team and then go after a QB (who turned out to be Big Ben to win an SB.  Look, we have one of the oldest rosters in the NFL and now having to find a stud center, it seems even more obvious to  use the 2- 1st rounders and 2 nd rounders to rebuild this TEAM rather than invest all resources to put a formula 1 engine in our VW bug team.

 

Trading up for the next Andrew Luck (or worse the next Ryan Leaf) would be a disaster for this team.

 

We would be blessed to get the next Andrew Luck.

He had an injury, he was a stud, and is nothing close to a bust unless the injury ruins his career.

 

[xRUSHx]

5 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

Honest question... why isn't Mayfield the best of this bunch?

 

Is it height? He's still 6'1"... his behavior? McDermott seems like a coach who can channel that visceral competitive moxy... so what is it?

 

Mayfield please. He excites me the most. Then Darnold.

Honest question?

 

You have admitted to not watch any college ball but yet you call Mayfield as the best if the bunch, he excites you the most. How is it he excites you the most out of all of them, is it highlight videos? 

 

Truth is IMO he is a polarizing QB and he should be one of the choices for QB but for you to be so sure while not being one that watches college ball it makes it hard for me to understand how your so sure of your choice out of these top 3.

 

Truth is IMO any of the top 3, Darnold, Rosen,Mayfield would be fun here. I watch college ball and for me to call any of these 3 better then the other is hard to do. All 3 excite me so any of these 3 please. If none of these 3 Rudolph is my 4th choice for draft value of not moving up, size and over all talent of his career in college ball at QB. Allen is a talent but needs a bunch of work just like Jackson who is more of a runner then QB and I think many fans have had enough of the inaccurate run first QB. 

 

So honest question, why you all in on Mayfield now over Darnold,Rosen?

[xRUSHx]

6 hours ago, BigDingus said:

 

I can see them doing that too... But it just smells like the painful 2004 Draft all over again.

The top 3 QB's go before we pick, then the Bills have their pick of the scraps & hope for a miracle. Instead of getting Eli Manning, Big Ben or Rivers, we got JP Losman (and coincidentally at #22 like we have this year) as our 1st rounder. 

This year, Darnold, Rosen & Mayfield will be gone, so we'll likely get to pick from Rudolph, Jackson & possibly Allen (yuck).... 

I agree with your comparison, I also agree Jackson-Allen yuk.

 

IMO

Rudolph has had a solid college career and would be a good pick for value IMO If he is still available at 21. Sadly I think if they wait around to 21 to pick we could miss on possibility the top 6 QBs. Possible yes, likely no.

 

IMO waiting till 21 will have us miss out on the top 3 (Darnold,Rosen,Mayfield) for sure and a big possibility also Rudolph to end up with a  choice of Allen or Jackson, yuk.

 

Little crazy to think 6 could go so early but QB value is at a all time high and teams know if your going to spend on anything QB is it. If all these QBs go this early even Falk,White could jump to 2nd rounders. This could be one crazy QB draft for sure.

 

Sadly OBD with the luck and stupidity of trying to wait for maximum value of a QB in a draft for decades now I can see the Bills screwing up yet another draft not taking a QB till the 3rd or 4th after the top 8 are gone to end up with scraps again with QB draft talk set up for 2019 season because all we would have is late rounders in Peterman and 2018 3rd or 4th round scraps to fight for the franchise worthy spot.

 

Will we ever have a franchise worthy QB? Is this staff different or is the Whaley win now who cares about the future still OBD way of running things that have produced one wild card (thank you Dalton)after the longest playoffless drought ever in the NFL. If Tyrod is given the bonus I think we will have our answer.

Edited February 10, 2018 by xRUSHx

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

This is what I hope we avoid for the first time maybe ever. If they like Darnold. If that’s the guy they want to build around. Go to #1 today. Don’t hope he falls anywhere. Stop settling for the guys who are left. Go up and get him for sure. “IF” that’s who they like. 

[RochesterRob]

5 hours ago, KingRex said:

It makes far more sense to this football fan for the Bills to follow the Pitts model they used to build a team and then go after a QB (who turned out to be Big Ben to win an SB.  Look, we have one of the oldest rosters in the NFL and now having to find a stud center, it seems even more obvious to  use the 2- 1st rounders and 2 nd rounders to rebuild this TEAM rather than invest all resources to put a formula 1 engine in our VW bug team.

 

Trading up for the next Andrew Luck (or worse the next Ryan Leaf) would be a disaster for this team.

  We can't get a dozen ordinary joe's to agree on a consensus top QB and yet the Bills are suppose to vault to number to take somebody that clearly has drawbacks as well as positives?  I am hoping when it comes to personal decisions that the wives hold the checkbook for these genius keyboard GM's.

[SouthNYfan]

1 minute ago, RochesterRob said:

  We can't get a dozen ordinary joe's to agree on a consensus top QB and yet the Bills are suppose to vault to number to take somebody that clearly has drawbacks as well as positives?  I am hoping when it comes to personal decisions that the wives hold the checkbook for these genius keyboard GM's.

 

Difficulty agreeing on a consensus #1 isn't uncommon.

 

Your logic is comply faulty.

You are using an unfounded basis to come to the conclusion that all 3 top QBs are bad because people cannot agree on which one is best.

 

That's like saying that "because we can't decide if Brady, Manning, or Montana is the GOAT, then all three must not be very good at all"

 

The lack of consensus between which of the 3 (Mayfield, Rosen, darnold) is the "best pick" does not inherently mean that none of the 3 are good, it means they are all viewed as equal (in different ways) as great QB draft picks.

 

Listen, all 3 could suck, all 3 could be elite, who knows.

 

My point is, your "logic" that none are good/worth it because nobody can decide who the best one is, is completely faulty.

[Mat68]

Yes, I would go hard for Darnold or Rosen.  Probably for Mayfiled or Allen too.

[RochesterRob]

34 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

Difficulty agreeing on a consensus #1 isn't uncommon.

 

Your logic is comply faulty.

You are using an unfounded basis to come to the conclusion that all 3 top QBs are bad because people cannot agree on which one is best.

 

That's like saying that "because we can't decide if Brady, Manning, or Montana is the GOAT, then all three must not be very good at all"

 

The lack of consensus between which of the 3 (Mayfield, Rosen, darnold) is the "best pick" does not inherently mean that none of the 3 are good, it means they are all viewed as equal (in different ways) as great QB draft picks.

 

Listen, all 3 could suck, all 3 could be elite, who knows.

 

My point is, your "logic" that none are good/worth it because nobody can decide who the best one is, is completely faulty.

  My logic is no more or less faulty than anyone else's here.  I believe drafting high for need does not help the team long term if a much better (graded) prospect at another  position is left for another team.  Barkley who is a running back seems to carry a higher degree of respect versus any of the top 3 QB's and with Shady most likely not having many years left would fit the needs of the Bills just as much as any of the QB's.  Guys here complain about reaching and reaching for a QB can be just as bad as reaching for any position.  The Ravens back in 2000 won with a game manager QB along with a powerful running game along with a stiff defense.  The Ravens would most likely have missed that window for a SB if they had reached for a QB versus taking the best player regardless of position.

[Chuck Wagon]

Honestly I wouldn't be shocked to see the Browns go outside of QB #1 overall, IF they've evaluated Rosen - Darnold - Mayfield (or even Allen) to the point they'd be happy with any of them.  There's a tiny bit of logic in saying "we are happy with any of these QBs, lets make sure we get Barkley / Chubb / Fitzpatrick, whoever it is at #1 and take whoever is left at 4".

 

I still think Indy is the pivot point on a QB trade and it depends on them being sold on a top 6-7 guy or wanting more depth.  Us trading #21 / #22 / #96 (philly third rounder) / 2019 1st is roughly the same value as Denver or NYJ trading # 6 / #7 their 2019 1st.  If we can give up that package (basically 3 1st and a 3rd, though the last 3rd) and walk out with one of Darnold or Rosen and still have 2 picks on day 2, I do it without hesitation.  That gets our QB, hopefully two more starters in the 2nd and we are just out 1 pick next year.

[OldTimer1960]

I know that Darnold is considered a very good prospect, but his 13 interceptions and 11 fumbles this year would make me think very hard before I would be willing to trade what it would take to get high enough in the draft to get him.  That is an awful lot of turnovers in one season...

[Nihilarian]

7 hours ago, Estro said:

I think Darnold is and will be the apple of the Bills brass eye.  I think the murmurs you've heard recently of the Bills liking Rosen are smoke that is being put out intentionally.  Rosen's durability issues and his lack of pocket presence are concerns I don't see the Bills selling the farm to go get.  Darnold, OTOH, I think he's a future top tier QB in the NFL.  I think the sweet spot for the Bills to trade up is in the #2-#7 spots.  If, and I think it's a huge if, the Browns pass on Darnold I'd expect the Bills to being working the lines hard.  With all of the other teams that need a QB, and my view of Darnold as the best QB, I think it's going to be tough to leapfrog so many teams that might be also looking to trade up.  

 

In the end I think the Browns will select Darnold #1, which to me ends the possibility of the Bills making a huge move up in the draft.  As for Baker Mayfield.....not  a fan.  

Rosen worries me with his concussions as he needed to sit out the Cactus Bowl because he sustained two so close together in 2017. There are only so many concussions a person can sustain before their NFL career is over. The kid also had shoulder surgery his sophomore season in which he only played five games and missed the rest of the season. 

 

It will be interesting to see what happens over the next few months and how the scouts evaluate the QBs with so many teams QB needy and so many QBs in this draft that could be picked in the first round. The future for Bills fans could be very bright indeed if this new GM, scouting staff know their stuff. 

 

Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen, Rudolph, and possibly Jackson. While the #1 Browns, #2 Giants, (even the #3 Colts if Luck's shoulder is still in question) #5 Broncos, #6 NY Jets, (#11 Miami if a top QB is still there they like)#15 Arizona, #21 Buffalo.  A possible Six first round QBs and six teams or more with a strong need. 

[SouthNYfan]

14 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  My logic is no more or less faulty than anyone else's here.  I believe drafting high for need does not help the team long term if a much better (graded) prospect at another  position is left for another team.  Barkley who is a running back seems to carry a higher degree of respect versus any of the top 3 QB's and with Shady most likely not having many years left would fit the needs of the Bills just as much as any of the QB's.  Guys here complain about reaching and reaching for a QB can be just as bad as reaching for any position.  The Ravens back in 2000 won with a game manager QB along with a powerful running game along with a stiff defense.  The Ravens would most likely have missed that window for a SB if they had reached for a QB versus taking the best player regardless of position.

 

Your logic which you are describing has absolutely nothing to do with what I was referring you.

 

You implied that because nobody can decide which of the three between Mayfield, Rosen, Darnold is a consensus "best" then none will be good at all.

That's just completely faulty logic.

 

Drafting BPA is only good sometimes.

Barkley looks to be a stud RB, I think he's going to have a good career.

He could be the best running back in a decade.

He's still not as valuable as an elite franchise QB.

He's still not as valuable as a very good QB either.

This is a QB driven league, and the impact of anybody else on the team in today's game isn't anywhere close at any other position.

I'm not sure what you are referring to work the 2000 Ravens, or what that has to do with this discussion.

That was almost 2 decades ago.

The game has changed and evolved.

It's no longer a "grind it out, manage the game" league.

Rule changes have shifted the needle wayyyyyy towards the offensive side of the ball, specifically to the passing game.

You still need a balanced team to win in the league, but you aren't going to win with a stout defense, running game, and subpar QB anymore.

If you reach for a QB and hit, it will change your franchise for a decade in the right direction.

A very good franchise QB automatically puts you into Superbowl contention.

An elite defense and running game with QB question marks (see: Jax and Minny) still leaves you as a "well if they get a QB then we can talk about them contending every year)

Edited February 10, 2018 by SouthNYfan

[Just Joshin']

10 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

I support the trade up for any of the big 3 

Who are your big 3?  If Allen is in that group, no thanks. Mayfield then yes.

[Teddy KGB]

1 minute ago, Dalton said:

Who are your big 3?  If Allen is in that group, no thanks. Mayfield then yes.

 

Rosen, Darnold, Mayfield.  

[HumbleAndHungry]

I think we should follow the same blueprint as Philadelphia when they got Carson Wentz. Rosen and Darnold are both potentially franchise -changing quarterbacks.  I would make the trade to number two right now with the Giants. That way you're guaranteed one of the two. 

Edited February 10, 2018 by Finkle Is Einhorn

[sven233]

Whatever it takes......picks or players......

 

Just get me one of Darnold, Rosen, or Mayfield.

 

I'll find a way to fill in around them.  Just take the swing on one of these QBs.

[oldmanfan]

If we get Darnold, within two games some will be yelling about his propensity for throwing picks and will ask why we got rid of Taylor

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

43 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen, Rudolph, and possibly Jackson. While the #1 Browns, #2 Giants, (even the #3 Colts if Luck's shoulder is still in question) #5 Broncos, #6 NY Jets, (#11 Miami if a top QB is still there they like)#15 Arizona, #21 Buffalo.  A possible Six first round QBs and six teams or more with a strong need. 

 

And then you have Pittsburgh and the LA Chargers who could draft a QB earlier to groom under Big Ben or Rivers.

[RochesterRob]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

If we get Darnold, within two games some will be yelling about his propensity for throwing picks and will ask why we got rid of Taylor

  We all know that is true.  The same guys hollering today we need to reach for a QB will be the same ones to run Beane out of town in 2 years when that plan back fires.  I am willing to bet that Beane likes his 7 figure per year job too much to play riverboat gambler.

[1st&ten]

8 hours ago, kdiggz said:

Rosen best of the bunch.  Best high school QB in the country coming out.  Best pro style QB in the draft since Andrew Luck.  Too bad he acts so entitled.  I don't think he's a McBeane type of guy unfortunately but he will surely mature.  He's only 20 yrs old.  Who didn't think they knew it all at that age?  I still think I know it all 

 

I believe Rosen said at one time he didn't want to play for the Browns. I wonder how he feels about the Bills ?

[KDIGGZ]

1 minute ago, 1st&ten said:

 

I believe Rosen said at one time he didn't want to play for the Browns. I wonder how he feels about the Bills ?

Probably the same.  I think he would be most happy in NY even if he has to back up Eli for 2 yrs.  Big city, good receivers.  Otherwise i doubt he makes it past Denver or NYJ at 5 and 6.  Jim Kelly didn't want to come here either but he was a PA guy who liked hunting and fishing and he met a girl and now he's here for life.  Rosen is a rich kid from the beach in LA.  Besides Cleveland, i think Buffalo would be his worst nightmare

[RochesterRob]

4 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

And then you have Pittsburgh and the LA Chargers who could draft a QB earlier to groom under Big Ben or Rivers.

  I agree.  There easily could be a dozen teams interested in this spring's prospects at QB.  If they are good enough to win a SB for Buffalo as some here imply then they must be good enough for other teams as well.  Also, that QB's are going to play at a highly productive level going into their 40's is wishful thinking and not much more.

[ndirish1978]

9 hours ago, Dkollidas said:

 

Its 3 1st’s and a 4th, not a 2nd. But to move up to #2 it will cost a lot, but if he’s their guy, and he’s there, I think they should go for it. 

 

You're working off of an old trade value chart. If we're including Glenn in the trade we shouldn't need 3 1st rd picks. 

14 minutes ago, 1st&ten said:

 

I believe Rosen said at one time he didn't want to play for the Browns. I wonder how he feels about the Bills ?

 

I think that kid has all the talent in the world and I also think he's going to have a short career due to injury.

[KDIGGZ]

Additionally, I would not put it past Rosen to tank his interview with the Browns and Bills in hopes that he will go elsewhere.  He seems like a prick like that.  That's probably why Bills are in favor of Darnold.  You would really have to talk yourself out of Rosen to choose anyone else imo.  Or have him talk you out of it instead!