Comprehensive "Tyrod Taylor is Bad" Thread (VERY Comprehensive)

[BigDingus]

I'm just going to put everything I can out there and go all-in on this. I'm sure I'll get the "you've got too much time on your hands" comments, or "you're a hater" responses, but this is just info that backs everything we've seen, and I wanted it all in one place for future reference.

 

Bills Passing Offenses Under Tyrod Taylor

2015 - 28th (12th overall) https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2015/index.htm

2016 - 30th (11th overall) https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2016/index.htm

2017 - 32nd (23rd overall) https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2017/index.htm

4th Quarter Comebacks Under Tyrod Taylor

Tied for 231st (dead last) out of all QB's since 1960 with a total of 3.

Tied with greats like JP Losman,  Kelly Holcomb, & Jamarcus Russell, and behind other greats like Blaine Gabbert, Rob Johnson, Trent Edwards, & Tim Tebow.

Want to know some players who already have him beat that haven't even played as long?
Teddy Bridgewater - 4, Brock Osweiler - 4, Dak Prescott - 5, Marcus Mariota - 7, Kirk Cousins - 8, and Derek Carr - 13.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_career.htm

Record when down by even a single point at any time in the 4th Quarter:
 

3-20 all time.

 

2015:

1. Loss to Patriots 32-40

2. Loss to Giants 10-24

3. Win vs Titans 14-13

4. Loss to Patriots 13-20

5. Loss to Chiefs 22-30

6. Loss to Eagles 20-23

7. Loss to Redskins 25-35

2016:

8. Loss to Ravens 7-13

9. Loss to Jets 31-37

10. Loss to Dolphins 25-28

11. Loss to Patriots 25-41

12. Loss to Seahawks 25-31

13. Win vs Jaguars 28-21

14. Loss to Raiders 24-38

15. Loss to Steelers 20-27

16. Loss to Dolphins 31-34

2017:

17. Loss to Panthers 3-9

18. Loss to Bengals 16-20

19. Win vs Buccaneers 30-27

20. Loss to Jets 21-34

21. Loss to Saints 10-47

22. Loss to Patriots 3-23

23. Loss to Patriots 16-37

 

Other Fun Info:

-Took until week 12 against the Chiefs to lead a 1st Quarter TD drive.

-Leads an offense ranked 31st overall in 1st downs.

-Want to know why we kick FG's on 4th down or punt on 4th & short? We're 2 & 13 overall on 4th down this year. http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/downs

-We have the 2nd most 3 & outs in the league with 31 (only behind Indianapolis with 32).

-Therefore we have the 2nd most punts with 30 (only behind NY Giants with 31).

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/drivestatsdef

 

-Tyrod is ranked 33rd (out of 35) in passing yards per game with 178. Only Tom Savage & Brett Hundley have fewer. http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/passing/sort/passingYardsPerGame

-"Oh but he's got a great completion percentage!" - He's ranked 18th overall. Not impressive at all.

-"But what about his passer rating?!" - It's 19th overall. Still below average.

-Passing TD's he's ranked 25th overall with 13 on the year.

Record against the Patriots:

-1-5, with his 1 win coming against the 3rd string rookie Jacoby Brissett in 2016. He threw for a whopping 1 TD in that game, with us winning 16-0. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TaylTy00/gamelog/?opp_id=nwe
 

-In games against Brady-lead Patriots teams, he has 3 passing TDs, all in his first game. In the other 4, he has thrown 0.

His numbers in those games:

Game 1: 242 yards, 3 TD's, 3 INT's 76.7% completion

Game 2: 233 yards, 0 TD's, 0 INT's, 55.6% completion

Game 3: 183 yards, 0 TD's, 0 INT's, 50% completion

Game 4: 65 yards, 0 TD's, 1 INT's, 50% completion

Game 5: 281 yards, 0 TD's, 0 INT's, 55% completion
 

Addressing Common Claims:

-"Passing yards don't matter! Who cares if he doesn't throw for 300 yards!"

*Problem...The successful teams have successful passing attacks. Leaders in the league are Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Matthew Stafford, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers, Alex Smith, Russell Wilson, Kirk Cousins, Jared Goff, Matt Ryan, Case Keenum, Carson Wentz, Blake Bortles.

Nearly all of those teams are either in the playoffs, or in contention.

-In 3 seasons as a starter, he has ONE career 300 yard game, and that was because the game went into OT, allowing him the extra yards to crack 300.

-"But Big-D, we're a run-first offense so he doesn't get as many attempts!"
 

*Problem...his attempts are low due to his execution on the field. When you lead the league in 3 & outs, where are you? Not on the field. If they moved the ball, he'd have more attempts by virtue of simply being out there still playing!

**Even so, he is 27th in yards per attempt with 6.52... Give him 5 extra attempts (which would be more than half the league on average), and he'd only have 32.6 extra yards (assuming he completed every pass).

-"It's the offensive coordinator! The playcalling sucks!"

*Problem...We've had 3 offensive coordinators in 3 years, and they all try their damndest to get something out of the passing game with TT. The passing game regresses each year, but at times they manage to compensate with the run game. However, teams more & more commit to stopping the run & forcing Tyrod to play QB, which has become an effective strategy. Coaches that say "we are a run-first team that wants to pound the ball & play tough defense," do so because they have no other choice.

**If a team has a competent QB, they don't have to declare anything like that. They can like to run the ball, but still pass just as often, if not more. Teams without QB's have no other choice but to try & pound the ball. You're not going to gameplan for some crazy passing attack with a QB who can't throw the ball...you try to run, and mix in short passes, play action, screens, & take a couple shots. That's it. There's no other option. Blaming every single OC who comes through town as the reason playcalling sucks, as if it's that simple, is an exercise in futility. They are working with a gimped playbook, and handicapped by the QB behind center. If the QB has shown to be unable to execute, you can only do so much.

***A simple playbook can help streamline things against certain weaker teams, but when facing top-tier coaches & talent, you run into a wall. You can question them as much as you want, but you won't know what they really want to do (or can do) until you have a QB capable of executing on the field.

More Fun Facts!

-Tyrod ranks 19th in total QBR out of 32 players...so "below average."
-Tyrod's BEST game of the season is ranked 41st out of all games played (Week 15 against Miami) out of 50. http://www.espn.com/nfl/qbr/_/type/player-game
-Above him are Jacoby Brissett, Josh McCown, C.J. Beathard, Dak Prescott, Case Keenum, Brock Osweiller, Sam Bradford, Jimmy Garoppolo, DeShaun Watson, Kirk Cousins & all the other usual suspects.

-Leader in receptions on our team: LeSean McCoy with 57. Next, Charles Clay with 43. Then comes the dropoff, Zay Jones & Jordan Matthews tied with 25 a piece. Next we have Nick O'leary with 21, tied with Deonte Thompson at 21. WR's don't get much action under TT.

-In terms of receiving yards, it's Charles Clay with 457 followed by LeSean McCoy at 350. Don't forget, Clay missed a couple games due to injuries as well, yet he still tops all actual WRs.

-Tyrod had a couple good passes to WR's today, but overall he doesn't throw their way often. He sees his outlet pass or last read as the first option and dumps off to the RB & TE, even on 3rd & long. He rarely hits receivers in stride, or won't throw to them at all unless they're wide open on all sides of the ball. He doesn't "throw guys open" nor does he audible out of plays at the line he knows are bad. He throws to the short route even though men downfield are open, and he frequently doesn't see open men at all. On top of that, how many times does he throw into the dirt to wide open receivers? All. The. Time.

-Does he hold on to the ball too long? Yes.
 Tyrod's "Time to Throw" is at 3.0 seconds, 3rd highest in the league. Only above him are DeShaun Watson & Russell Wilson.
https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#average-time-to-throw

-Also, in terms of where he throws the ball, he throws half a yard short of the sticks on average, good for 22nd in the league.

-To further highlight this point, there is a metric called "Aggressiveness/AGG%" where Tyrod is ranked 32nd. Aggressiveness rating is defined as "the amount of passing attempts a QB makes that are into tight coverage, where there is a defender within 1 yard or less of the receiver at the time of completion or incompletion. AGG is shown as a % of attempts into tight windows over all passing attempts."

So in summation/TL;DR - Tyrod isn't good. Also, just to make sure people take this seriously, I have a source inside OBD that told me Tyrod is bad, and the Bills don't want him as QB. There, now it's official.

[Jackington]

Best record as Bills QB in about 20 years

[Teddy KGB]

Transplant and Badol will pick this apart soon.  ????

 

Build around Taylor ????‍♂️??‍♂️

 

Edited December 25, 2017 by Air it out Fitzy

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Excellent post. Tt supporters will be mad.

[BuffaloBillyG]

15 minutes ago, Jackington said:

Best record as Bills QB in about 20 years

So does this mean he's good or is it more a reflection on how poorly the QB position has been manned in about 20 years?

 

 

[GETTOTHE50]

Lol love it

 

 

[baskingridgebillsfan]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

Excellent post. Tt supporters will be mad.

i don't understand how anyone can support him at this point 

[stuvian]

TT is the best Bills QB since Bledsoe

[BobChalmers]

32 minutes ago, Jackington said:

Best record as Bills QB in about 20 years

14 minutes ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

So does this mean he's good or is it more a reflection on how poorly the QB position has been manned in about 20 years?

 

It means Tyrod has played his whole time in Buffalo with the best Bills RB since Thurman.

[xRUSHx]

Tyrod is the best not good enough we have had in a long time. Maybe some day we will have a good enough but for now we should enjoy the snow getting kicked in our faces because Tyrod is the best we have had at not being good enough so we should be supportive. SMH

 

OBD For the love of the Bills go big on QB next year and dump the not good enough Tyrod, the fans deserve better then Rex's choice at starter.

Edited December 25, 2017 by xRUSHx

[twoandfourteen]

1 minute ago, stuvian said:

TT is the best Bills QB since Bledsoe

 

[BillsFan130]

Got a lot of time on your hands tonight eh bud?

[Southtown Tommy]

39 minutes ago, Jackington said:

Best record as Bills QB in about 20 years

lol - that's not saying much.

[BobChalmers]

2 minutes ago, xRUSHx said:

the fans deserve better then Rex's choice at starter.

 

Well that really says it all.  Rex is infamous for his inability to identify a QB.  We are stuck with QB guru Rex Ryan's choice b/c he beat out Matt Cassel (at the end of his career) and EJ Manuel, and the staff didn't like their options this year to go QB before round 5.

 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

34 minutes ago, Air it out Fitzy said:

Transplant and Badol will pick this apart soon.  ????

 

Build around Taylor ????‍♂️??‍♂️

 

 

We are so smart when it comes to getting rid of players, but they all seem to do better once they get away from Buffalo? Why is that? I suspect it will be the same with Taylor.

[Foreigner]

Things would be different with another OC, a better OL and better WRs. I know you are

frustrated, we all are, and TT is a easy target, but he is a NFL starting QB, who in the

right situation will be successful

[PromoTheRobot]

4 minutes ago, Southtown Tommy said:

lol - that's not saying much.

 

21-19 career, 7-5 this season. What a frickin' loser! 

[Southtown Tommy]

20 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

21-19 career, 7-5 this season. What a frickin' loser! 

what a winner!  Aim higher bro!

Edited December 25, 2017 by Southtown Tommy

[BringBackOrton]

2 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

21-19 career, 7-5 this season. What a frickin' loser! 

Do you think TT is the only loser QB with a winning career record?

[Southtown Tommy]

Thank you OP for sharing the facts.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, Southtown Tommy said:

what a winner Promo!  Aim higher bro!

 

Here's an idea. Why don't you pitch a tantrum and maybe mommy will get you a better QB?

Edited December 25, 2017 by PromoTheRobot

[Southtown Tommy]

Just now, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Here's an idea. Why don't you hold your breath till you pass out? That'll make sure a better QB will magically show up.

tried that and it doesn't work! But you never know if Peterman will or won't unless you try. 

[H2o]

BigDingus........drops the mic 

[26CornerBlitz]

16 minutes ago, jmc12290 said:

Do you think TT is the only loser QB with a winning career record?

 

How about Cutler and Siemian? 

[BillsFan692]

Thanks for making this post.  It's clear as day to me that Tyrod is a major problem.

[Bing Bong]

I could start a Peterman essay.

[BringBackOrton]

24 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Here's an idea. Why don't you pitch a tantrum and maybe mommy will get you a better QB?

She won't.  She has a bunch of suckers perfectly content to swirl around 8--8 with TT.  Buy another jersey!

[Teddy KGB]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

We are so smart when it comes to getting rid of players, but they all seem to do better once they get away from Buffalo? Why is that? I suspect it will be the same with Taylor.

 

Based on what ?   The 2300 yards passing ? ???

 

 

[BringBackFergy]

That Aggressiveness metric (if real) is absolutely dead on. If he doesn’t throw contested balls, he doesn’t get any pass intereference flags. Also, he will get sacked a lot by waiting and scampering out of pocket. See ya Tyrod. It’s been fun. 

[Estro]

Great post.  He is a slightly below average QB at best and it's been apparent for nearly 2 full seasons.  Anybody who thinks he's anything more than that has no understanding of what a good QB looks like.  His disappearing acts, where the offense goes into hiding for 20-40 minute stretches of a game is what happens when you have a poor QB. 

 

And let's remember the entire league agreed that Tyrod is a poor QB.  All of the QB needy teams in this league....... and not one was interested in him, which is why he accepted the $10M paycut.

 

Being near the league lead in 3 & out % in all 3 yrs. w/ him as a starter pretty much defines his time here.  It's infuriating, but we've come to realize, it's who he is.  A slightly below avg. QB.

[CircleTheWagons99]

2 minutes ago, Estro said:

Great post.  He is a slightly below average QB at best and it's been apparent for nearly 2 full seasons.  Anybody who thinks he's anything more than that has no understanding of what a good QB looks like.  His disappearing acts, where the offense goes into hiding for 20-40 minute stretches of a game is what happens when you have a poor QB. 

 

And let's remember the entire league agreed that Tyrod is a poor QB.  All of the QB needy teams in this league....... and not one was interested in him, which is why he accepted the $10M paycut.

 

Being near the league lead in 3 & out % in all 3 yrs. w/ him as a starter pretty much defines his time here.  It's infuriating, but we've come to realize, it's who he is.  A slightly below avg. QB.

According to some posters he will tear it up, if he is put in the perfect situation, on any other team....too bad nobody wanted him. 

[Ol Dirty B]

For someone with a great name and avatar... Just damn... such a disappointment. I'm not sure what you are even thinking you'll achieve with this post.

 

And one thing I'm confused about is why you would cite him as having the 11th and 12th best passing offenses. Isn't that about where people who like Tyrod rate him? Doesn't that kind of support, wait, he was decent for a moment, then you got this coaching staff in, changed schemes, and got rid of all his receivers, and that's a big part of his issues?

 

Also, gonna throw in a drive by Zay Jones sucks and see if I can hijack this thread, because that dude is garbage.

 

Tyrod isn't great, but he isn't the worst. I don't know why people have to think it's one or the other. Of course I'd like to try to do better. I'd just like my team to try to do better by constantly taking shots on QBs in the draft and keep him around. Not dump him, and over pay for an Alex Smith or a Kirk Cousins. This team and fanbase but doesn't want to pay anyone, but then you mention Kirk Cousin's and you get people saying they'd drop 30 mil a year on him. I don't get that. 

 

Also, this team has treated Tyrod like **** in my opinion and he's been a pro. Not saying any of the people who don't like him are saying otherwise, I just respect the hell out of the dude for dealing with this ****ty team. I wouldn't have blamed him for losing it a long time ago. 

2 hours ago, jmc12290 said:

She won't.  She has a bunch of suckers perfectly content to swirl around 8--8 with TT.  Buy another jersey!

 

So what is your plan then? I don't disagree with the going 8-8 thing, it's annoying. It's part of the reason I find this season so frustrating, but is your plan to regress next year? Or do you honestly think this team can upgrade at QB instantly... That doesn't seem realistic to me. 

Edited December 25, 2017 by Ol Dirty B

[Utah John]

It isn't the successes Taylor has that people focus on, it's the failures.  His S/F ratio is decent but not good enough.  He fails to make makeable plays way too often.  Today on two occasions he took sacks on first down that critically affected the play calling and the scores.  And he's the chokemaster, completely unable to make plays when trailing in the fourth quarter.

 

He's an adequate QB for teams in two positions.  First, very strong defense, great supporting cast on the offense.  In other words, a situation where there are other guys who can make plays.  Second, a mediocre team for whom mediocrity is a step up.  And that's where the Bills have been.  He is NOT an adequate QB for a team that is learning to win but has so many holes that they need the QB to find ways to win.

 

My preferred option for next year is not to have the Bills spend all those draft picks moving up to take the third or fourth best QB in the draft, and failing to address all those holes at DT, DE, MLB, OLB, WR, OL.  Also RB since Shady is still great but is on borrowed time.  Putting a good rookie into this situation will turn him into a bad rookie.  Look what happened to Peterman when he had to face the ferocious pass rush of the Chargers.  I hope Peterman can recover.  Mayfield would have the same thing happen to him. 

 

So the Bills should draft to build the entire team, and pay a lot for an experienced FA QB who understands and can execute all aspects of the game.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

2 hours ago, baskingridgebillsfan said:

i don't understand how anyone can support him at this point 

 

Me either

 

 

2 hours ago, stuvian said:

TT is the best Bills QB since Bledsoe

 

Not good enough.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

We are so smart when it comes to getting rid of players, but they all seem to do better once they get away from Buffalo? Why is that? I suspect it will be the same with Taylor.

 

It won't. He might have one 10 win year the way Fitzt did. But he will have more 7 or 8 win years. That is who he is. 

1 hour ago, Ol Dirty B said:

 

So what is your plan then? I don't disagree with the going 8-8 thing, it's annoying. It's part of the reason I find this season so frustrating, but is your plan to regress next year? Or do you honestly think this team can upgrade at QB instantly... That doesn't seem realistic to me. 

 

You see people said this to me last year. You can't upgrade.... there is nobody in  the draft.... there was an upgrade in the draft. And we passed. It is what we do. We are the Buffalo Bills. QB apparently doesn't matter here cos we are different. 

[billzfan]

Great post!

Ya’ll are probably probably too young to have ever seen a real NFL quarterback wearing a Bills jersey. Thanks JK, JF, JK (RIP)

[Sky Diver]

On the 4th down play near the goaline yesterday, he looked down McCoy and threw the ball at his feet. That was sad.

 

I would like to see the offensive stats for this year vs last year. Dennison needs to be shown the door too.

[Buffalo Boy]

Mr. The Dingus,

      While this is fairly exhaustive, I’m afraid you didn’t include a comparison to other Buffalo Greats of the past.

      Would love to see how he stacks up against Stan Gelbaugh, Vince Feragamo, Dufek and Mathison....

       To all the CoT ‘rs out there, I would bet my lefty that some of the above have better numbers than your beloved “ Best option next week.”

      However, I’m sure this thread will do NOTHING to dissuade the “ True Believers”.

SAD, SAD, SAD!!!!!

[Scott7975]

That's a lot of good info, but is it really necessary?  I think pretty much everyone would agree the Bills need to do better in the future.  The ones that don't... who cares.

[xRUSHx]

8 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

Thanks for making this post.  It's clear as day to me that Tyrod is a major problem.

I agree man

 

Sadly some still like to blame everyone else. The D not only should stop a SB HOF QB the entire game they need to score more TDs because it is not the QB that is suppose to lead us to score.

46 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

On the 4th down play near the goaline yesterday, he looked down McCoy and threw the ball at his feet. That was sad.

 

I would like to see the offensive stats for this year vs last year. Dennison needs to be shown the door too.

Tyrods 3rd OC, hey the others did not last with him so of course he needs another one to try because it is not the limited QB it is the OC. Bring on #4. SMH

 

I am sure it is not that teams know to make Tyrod be a QB it is the OC that can not hide him well enough