Expectations for Shaq Lawson?

[SoCal Deek]

These Boards always crack me up! Seymour was a mid round pick last year and many were/are picking him to replace a 'shut down' corner. Lawson and Ragland were both highly sought after and everyone has pretty much ignored them.

 

Both of those guys better produce big time!!

[JerseyBills]

These Boards always crack me up! Seymour was a mid round pick last year and many were/are picking him to replace a 'shut down' corner. Lawson and Ragland were both highly sought after and everyone has pretty much ignored them.

 

Both of those guys better produce big time!!

I also see Adolphus Washington producing. He showed flashes last year but he's a perfect fit for the 43 and this scheme, which heavily relies on the D line to generate pressure. That was what Adolphus was known for- penetrating into the backfield and causing havoc. He should be very very solid depth behind Kyle and Marcel..

We really have a plethora of young defensive talent with big time upside. I feel that McDermott and Frazier are very good coaches and are the right men to get these players to reach their full potential!

[White Linen]

What I saw was several times he overpowered a OL on his way to the qb......

 

People want to see a edge bend like Von Miller and get around a OT violently hitting a qb cleaning his clock......I really dont think that is gonna be Lawson's game. It doesnt mean that he cant put consistant pressure on a qb and get their with hustle....ALSO because he will run stop he is a complete player

 

Folks need to wait and see what we have in a healthy lawson (for the first time in years) before they make final determinations on the kid....rehabbing a surgery is not the same thing as a strength and conditioning program preparing for a season.

 

I'm hoping Hughes returns to 4-3 (wide 9) form and Lawson is a better version of Mario that year. Like you said, he'll definitely get involved in run stopping (unlike Mario). Lawson needs to be powerful enough to command attention and get the strong side - let Hughes turn on the speed and get after it.

[ndirish1978]

Honestly, I don't expect him to get more than 4-5 sacks. But if he sets the edge well and shuts down the run I'll be happy with him.

[Augie]

Honestly, I don't expect him to get more than 4-5 sacks. But if he sets the edge well and shuts down the run I'll be happy with him.

 

I agree, set the edge well. I think (hope?) playing time and hustle plays will get him 5-7. Never a huge sack guy.

[BringBackOrton]

 

I'm hoping Hughes returns to 4-3 (wide 9) form and Lawson is a better version of Mario that year. Like you said, he'll definitely get involved in run stopping (unlike Mario). Lawson needs to be powerful enough to command attention and get the strong side - let Hughes turn on the speed and get after it.

If Lawson is a better version of All-Pro Mario Williams from 2014 (who excelled both rushing the passer and stopping the run), we're all winners.

 

Mario was one of the best run DE's in the NFL that year. I'm not sure why you choose to dig at his most obvious strength.

Edited May 15, 2017 by jmc12290

[TPS]

If Lawson is a better version of All-Pro Mario Williams from 2014 (who excelled both rushing the passer and stopping the run), we're all winners.

 

Mario was one of the best run DE's in the NFL that year. I'm not sure why you choose to dig at his most obvious strength.

I predict Shaq will have more sacks than Mario had the past two years combined.

[BringBackOrton]

I predict Shaq will have more sacks than Mario had the past two years combined.

6.5? It'll be close, IMO.

[Jay_Fixit]

I think he's slow and absolutely hated the pick last year.

 

But since he's a Buffalo Bills, I'll be optimistic. Since I'm an idiot.

 

8 sacks. 11 TFL. 40+ tackles.

[3rdand12]

 

I expect a big year from Dareus and Kyle. Hughes and Shaq are where I worry.

If Dareus and Kyle are playing strong Hughes will be killing it !

Lawson needs to stay in his lane and play disciplined. He will grow.

But for this season he needs to play smart. I do not care what his stats are. as long as the D is whupping butt. Team game. He can become an asset just by doing his job. sacks will come later in the season when teams give up on the interior and move the pocket outside the guard. Shaq just needs to be patient

I swear I watched Lawson display a good bit of hustle last year once healthy. I am really excited to see Lawson out there. Players who can play will find a spot, that's where a good coach comes in.

once he got the rhythm he looked much better. but i get the slow and lumbering perceptions when he first got upon the field. I did not even notice his number some games

I also see Adolphus Washington producing. He showed flashes last year but he's a perfect fit for the 43 and this scheme, which heavily relies on the D line to generate pressure. That was what Adolphus was known for- penetrating into the backfield and causing havoc. He should be very very solid depth behind Kyle and Marcel..

We really have a plethora of young defensive talent with big time upside. I feel that McDermott and Frazier are very good coaches and are the right men to get these players to reach their full potential!

He showed lazy and tired too.

Washington and Lawson should and need to improve quite a bit imho.

 

i do blame nearly everything on rex. including playing Lawson and others out of their natural posi

tions/ techs

[Augie]

With new coaches, I expect a little more urgency and accountability from our D-line in particular. Time will tell. Maybe a ban on silly sailor caps?

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Shaq a great addition, hope the fans haven't written him off.

 

I think 8 sacks and a handful of tackles for loss is fair.

 

Dude was a dominant college DE who Rex put at OLB. His first sack was on Tom Brady.

 

Healthy, scheme that fits him, position that he's dominate at, and real NFL coaches.

[Augie]

Shaq a great addition, hope the fans haven't written him off.

 

I think 8 sacks and a handful of tackles for loss is fair.

 

Dude was a dominant college DE who Rex put at OLB. His first sack was on Tom Brady.

 

Healthy, scheme that fits him, position that he's dominate at, and real NFL coaches.

 

But Brady survived, so it's hard to forgive him......

[BillsFan17]

Team website lists Vernon as 275- 10 pounds heavier than Shaq.

 

But size isn't everything. Robert Mathis played DE for the Colts at 250 or less. He was very, very quick though. Heck, Jerry Hughes is only listed at 254.

Nfl.com has Vernon at 275 and Lawson at 270. I'm not going to act like I know how much of a difference five pounds really makes, but to say he's not the right size for a 43 DE is crazy.

 

You see guys like Everson Griffin and Michael Bennett playing around the same exact weight.

[4merper4mer]

I predict Shaq will have more sacks than Mario had the past two years combined.

So he won't be assigned pass coverage on Beckham?

[scribo]

He was a 1st round prospect and pick for a good reason. The team knew about his need for surgery but picked him anyway because they felt he was worth waiting for. Those decision makers are all gone now, but I still expect big things from him this season.

https://youtu.be/Qn_bQctE5UY

[sjjr]

Should be great against the run and add some pass rush at times. Again, this defense fits what he can do better. Could be like Charles Johnson was in Carolina.

[Rochesterfan]

You're right. He's not that kind of player. I could see him getting 6-8 sacks though. His presence vs the run game is what will make or break his career imo. Be a force vs the run and get pressure on the qb. I can see him getting pressure often but not being able to get the sack. That can make him an impact player and worthy of a 1st rd pick.....if he's a force vs the run

 

 

This is where I am at - I think he is a good fit. I think he can set the edge and collapse the pocket - I do not think he will be beating guys based solely on quickness or anything.

 

Somewhere between 6-8 sacks is a nice place to start and hopefully just some consistent play and he will be just fine.

 

I just want to see him get better and be healthy.

[Rochesterfan]

I feel the exact opposite. Shaq is a 4-3 DE to me. He's not explosive enough to be a rush edge in the 3-4 and is too small to play DE. That's part of the reason that I thought the pick was odd. He seemed like good value at the time but was an odd scheme fit to me. He should be a pretty well-rounded DE that is solid against the run and contributes about 7 sacks.

 

100% agree - I thought from the beginning he was a better 4-3 DE and I thought it was a bad fit for Rex, but Rex loved him some Tigers.

 

Size and strength - I think he will be ok - I do not think he has the speed and quickness to just beat a RT off the ball, but I think he will be able to get some leverage and make a push.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

 

That was my reaction when I saw Edelman on the NFL's top 100 players show and remembered you insisting last year at about this time that Bob Woods was better than him.

 

It's a flawed list......but c'mon man......Bob Woods?

 

Bills are hiring scouts......

[bisonbrigade]

I would expect 60 to 75 Tackles, 6 to 8 sacks in 16 games at the least.

[thebandit27]

I would expect 60 to 75 Tackles, 6 to 8 sacks in 16 games at the least.

 

You expect Shaq Lawson to lead the NFL in tackles by a DE?

 

Only 3 DEs in the entire NFL had more than 60 tackles last year, and 2 of them played 5-tech in a 3-4

[26CornerBlitz]

@viccarucci

.@Shaq_Lawson90 on year 2 w #Bills: 'It's time to bring what I had back when I was in college.' NEW at [bN] Blitz: http://bit.ly/2tp3Y9x

[JM2009]

Lawson and Ragland have to excel this season.

[Buffalo Bills Detective]

If they want any shot to field a decent team(outside of staying healthy due to lack of depth) more so Lawson needs to show something this year.

You hear that, Shaq? The partners at ScottLaw's firm need you to step up, or else.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

 

@viccarucci

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.@Shaq_Lawson90 on year 2 w #Bills: 'It's time to bring what I had back when I was in college.' NEW at [bN] Blitz: http://bit.ly/2tp3Y9x

always dislike these sound bites that boil down to a paraphrased version of "now I'm really going to try hard.."

[26CornerBlitz]

always dislike these sound bites that boil down to a paraphrased version of "now I'm really going to try hard.."

 

I'd interpret it as more of him being in a scheme/position that suits his skill set as well as being 100% healthy.

[DC Grid]

10-12 sacks. He's a hustle guy from all I've read. Never stopped chasing things down in college. With Hughes unleashed in a straight up 4-3 and Kyle and Marcel requiring shifts, I see a lot of opportunity for mop up sacks.

[John from Riverside]

What I am interesting in seeing is what a fully healthy Shaq Lawson actually looks like

 

He never was in college.....yet was still very productive

[BillsPride12]

It will be interesting to see what we get out of Shaq this season and not just as an assessment of Shaq himself but McDermott as well. Afterall this guy is being praised as a coach that will get the absolute most production out of guys he coaches. Should be interesting indeed

[vincec]

always dislike these sound bites that boil down to a paraphrased version of "now I'm really going to try hard.."

Exactly. "Time to start trying..."

[CaliBills92]

 

Yeah......IMO he very well MAY get only 4-5 sacks but he was drafted as a pass rusher.

 

PASS RUSHER.

 

Shaq is not the tall, long, king sized edge setting Richard Seymour type.......he'd probably be best served playing at a quicker 255-260 pounds so he ain't going to be standing up many 330 pound RT in the run game.

 

That said.......this will be a one gap front with ends lined up wide so "setting the edge" is not high on the job description.

 

I see we have some Chris Kelsay fans in this thread though. Remember when Kelsay was a "first round talent" that the Bills got in the second round and how he was a considered a run defense-first DE by his fans because he couldn't sack QB's? Even though he was undersized and awful against the run?

You obviously didn't pay much attention to the predraft stuff. And if he was drafted as one it was another abysmal failure by Whaley.

 

Lawson was never considered a pass rush specialist or that he would be one in the NFL. He was considered a base DE who could set and edge and be strong against the run. Go watch Mayock's comments when we drafted him. Read his NFL.com profile:

 

Thickly bound with very average flexibility. Average athlete for an end position. Not a natural hip bender and will have to focus on keeping pad level lower to unlock his leverage potential. Shows obvious signs of fatigue as game wears on. At times, is too content to lean on blocks when play isnt run to his side rather than working to discard. Will have snaps where he seems more concerned with imposing his will on blocking rather than diagnosing the play. Doesnt have the bend or upper body flexion to be edge turner as pass rusher. Effort sacks will diminish in pros and will need to become more nuanced pass rusher.

 

Sources Tell Us

"I see Shaq as an outside linebacker in a 3-4. He's not the guy you want to turn loose against the quarterback, but he is the guy that will make it hard for tight ends to block him in the run game. We knew we couldn't run at him and it changed how we called plays." -- ACC offensive coach

 

NFL Comparison

 

Courtney Upshaw

 

Bottom Line

 

Productive backup for two years before putting together an All­-American season in his first year as a full- time starter. Lawson is built like a full­-grown man and combines his instincts, toughness and power to fill up a stat sheet and set an early tone. Lawson's frame and game are easily translatable to the NFL, but his average athleticism and pass rush skills will likely have teams viewing him as a 3­-4 edge setter or a 4-­3 base end. Lawson may also have value as 3­-4 defensive tackle in an upfield scheme.

Edited June 20, 2017 by CaliBills92

[gr8billsfan]

38 tackles and 9.5 sacks.

[Augie]

Super Bowl MVP.

[4merper4mer]

McDermott doesn't appear optimistic. Sounds like Rex's draft of this guy and Ragland set us way back. Maybe Shaq was Rex's kids buddy or something. It sure was a weird pick as it turns out.

[26CornerBlitz]

Not really shocking.

 

Rex needed "his guys" to fix the defense. He got them, and the defense got worse.

 

Ew.

 

Looks like a waste of a first round pick from that scouting report.

 

Why stop at just one scouting report:

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2016/04/04/nfl-draft-scouting-report-shaq-lawson-clemson

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-pff-scouting-report-shaq-lawson-de-clemson/

 

http://draftwire.usatoday.com/2015/12/22/shaq-lawson-scouting-report-2016-nfl-draft-evaluation-round-grade-projection-film/

[vincec]

 

Why stop at just one scouting report:

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2016/04/04/nfl-draft-scouting-report-shaq-lawson-clemson

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-pff-scouting-report-shaq-lawson-de-clemson/

 

http://draftwire.usatoday.com/2015/12/22/shaq-lawson-scouting-report-2016-nfl-draft-evaluation-round-grade-projection-film/

I don't like reading all this "not a natural pass rusher" stuff. The Bills are in a division with Tom Brady and need everyone to be a strong pass rusher if they ever want to beat him before he retires.

[3rdand12]

I don't like reading all this "not a natural pass rusher" stuff. The Bills are in a division with Tom Brady and need everyone to be a strong pass rusher if they ever want to beat him before he retires.

Setting the edge, Forcing or tightening the pocket is something I think he will do very very well !

Lets keep in mind who he is lining up next to.

If he is smart and patient he can get many sacks, till QB realize they can't roll away from inside pressure to his side.

lets consider Hughes on the other side. Hughes can be the risk taking full on attacker he does best with.

The Middle could be the best in the league depending on the Fat Stoner kid. But i got this feeling, Kyle was having some sit downs with MD and feeling him out before deciding to come back another season. cuz it ain't for money with KW anymore.

 

so in summation

I do firmly believe Lawson will be a solid contributor and key to the success of this front seven.

D line ? Koolaid time. This is going to be fun

Go Bills

Edited June 21, 2017 by 3rdand12

[vincec]

Setting the edge, Forcing or tightening the pocket is something I think he will do very very well !

Lets keep in mind who he is lining up next to.

If he is smart and patient he can get many sacks, till QB realize they can't roll away from inside pressure to his side.

lets consider Hughes on the other side. Hughes can be the risk taking full on attacker he does best with.

The Middle could be the best in the league depending on the Fat Stoner kid. But i got this feeling, Kyle was having some sit downs with MD and feeling him out before deciding to come back another season. cuz it ain't for money with KW anymore.

 

so in summation

I do firmly believe Lawson will be a solid contributor and key to the success of this front seven.

D line ? Koolaid time. This is going to be fun

Go Bills

Lawson is going to face RTs 1v1 until he shows that he can beat that. If he can't, then the extra blocker will make the other three guys much less effective. I think you can get by with 1 strong interior rusher out of two, but you're DEs both have to be good for you to have a strong pass rush without blitzing.

[3rdand12]

Lawson is going to face RTs 1v1 until he shows that he can beat that. If he can't, then the extra blocker will make the other three guys much less effective. I think you can get by with 1 strong interior rusher out of two, but you're DEs both have to be good for you to have a strong pass rush without blitzing.

I think Shaq is more power than speed. he just need to get off the ball quicker. He should learn from Jerry how to stunt shed to get in the QB's face.

I think he can drive tackles backfield. But i just don't see him turning the edge and getting back into the pocket from the outside.

But.. I never watched him in College till highlights came up. And i did watch for him last year.

He improved his awareness over time. Looked like he was still unsure his responsibilities at times.

Again the Rex and Rob factor skew the perception of what these young players are able to do. I look at A. Washington the same way