Lions got SCREWED

[Big Gun]

There are the refs determing the outcome of the game on monday night football. Way to go NFL!

But were not supposed to blame the refs for the outcome of the games.

[KD in CA]

The only thing I'm sure of is that if a batting penalty had been called everyone would be bitching and moaning about how it was a crappy call, how the refs decide games, how the ball was going OOB anyway and how Seattle made a great play but got robbed. Personally I liked the no call. It looked like it was probably a bat, but as a ref you don't effectively decide the game on a call like that unless you're 100% certain.

 

Yup. Everyone would scream about how some old, dumb rule they never see called "determined the outcome" (everyone's favorite phrase) of the game.

 

 

 

 

p.s. where's all the outrage about the coin flip "determining the outcome" of the Saints-Cowboys game?

Edited October 6, 2015 by KD in CT

[dpberr]

Somebody stated in another post that you can't help but feel there are "higher powers" at play in the modern day NFL.

 

I couldn't agree more and I've had the following conspiracy theory for years.

 

I don't think it's organized crime or the casinos. They've been effectively shut out of this money tree.

 

I think it's the owners and they are ALL in on it and have been since the dawn of free agency. They've been betting on their own games for years and now have an apparatus where they now can do that legally and reap incredible profits to the tune of billions of dollars off legalized gambling.

 

The "it's not gambling" fantasy football is huge business to the tune of over a billion dollars just in it's infancy. I think the owners laid the groundwork for it twenty years ago and for it to make money, the "house" (owners) have to have consistent results. This requires very good teams and very good players and not so good teams and not so good players. Having something like a Cinderella team or a system where very wealthy owners can't buy assets (free agency) is bad for business.

 

Since the owners all make money, and stand to make even more money collectively, they organize themselves into slots - you want to be a great team, you pay X price, a good team, Y price. Want to make money on the cheap, be a crap team. It's like an auction. The trophy goes to the highest bidder.

 

So, for example, not only is it in the best interest of the owners to keep Russell Wilson and the Seahawks putting up fantastic fantasy numbers, it's also that Paul Allen probably paid a lot of money to be a top 5 team. And since we're talking insane amounts of cash, since it's an off the books, non-corporate, untraceable transaction, not every owner is going to be in the conversation. Some owners have enough for a bid or two.

 

That's why Robert Kraft is never sorry for the actions of his team. In his eyes, he's paid for that trophy fair and square.

 

The owners let the coaches coach and the players play. However, the referees, the rules and regulations and even the CBA are designed like bumpers in a bowling alley - to gently nudge to the desired outcome while hiding in plain sight. The same rules keep the offenses pumping out points and the defenses to defend just enough to make it look good.

 

All in all, the NFL is now two private entertainment enterprises - the game on the field and the gambling but don't think for a second the general outcome of the season hasn't already been purchased. So buy your jerseys and enjoy the entertainment, but the real game is a bunch of middle aged men with cash to burn and egos to satisfy.

[nkreed]

I think that all of this is a non issue, since there was almost no way for the Lions to recover the football. Johnson fumbled forward under 2 minutes, which by rule can only be recovered by him, which wasn't going to happen.

[RyanC883]

League admits it should have been called. Lots of good that does the Lions. Same corner as the Fail Mary play.

 

another terrible job by an officiating crew in the NFL. Same day, same story. Time to bring back the replacement refs. We always hear about how they are "graded" or whatever. But week in and week out, all around the league, the Refs make royal screw-ups like this, and call non-existent penalties (like on the Bills two TD's) that change the outcome of games.

 

All TD's that are called back should be subject to immediate review by a senior rules officer or something akin to that in the league office.

[The Wiz]

This is what happens when a Brady fumble gets batted.

Yet if it was fumbled and batted forward by the offense it wouldn't be an issue.

[Doc]

if you hold that opinion, what does that make you for being so invested?

Dumb. I admit it.

[FireChan]

I think that all of this is a non issue, since there was almost no way for the Lions to recover the football. Johnson fumbled forward under 2 minutes, which by rule can only be recovered by him, which wasn't going to happen.

Except the rules would've given the Lions the ball back....

[CardinalScotts]

Lions are "targets" for referees, they don't have donuts and coffee in the offcials room on Sundays like their supposed to

[judman]

Belicheat is right (just puked in my mouth a bit...) Make everything reviewable.

[26CornerBlitz]

@SportsCenter

Some Lions fans bought new billboards in Detroit after last night's game... (via OutFront Media)

[SoFFacet]

At the time, I actually thought it was a really smart play by the Seahawks defender.

 

By the way, how is this any different than when the snap flies over a punter's head and he kicks it through the back of the end zone to take the safety-- a play I have seen numerous times? Maybe you can do that, so long as the ball is not in the end zone at the time it was kicked?

 

I thought the same. I honestly hope they change the rule like the did with force outs a few years ago. A defender should be able to do that. Hell, by the reactions of the MNF crew and NFL desk, most people thought you already could do that.

 

By the letter of the current law, its actually no different than when a punter kicks a bad snap through the back of the end zone. Its a penalty on the kicking team, but the penalty for a foul by the offense in the end zone is a safety. So the effect would be the same.

Edited October 6, 2015 by SoFFacet

[atlbillsfan1975]

When will the Bills be one of those teams getting the calls like Seattle or NE?

Remember in the early 90's when we did?

[ExiledInIllinois]

Can a team protest a game in The NFL like in MLB? LMAO... Yeah, that's such a 19th century concept...

When will the Bills be one of those teams getting the calls like Seattle or NE?

Remember in the early 90's when we did?

Apples and oranges, no way any stand now w/video review... That Beebe TD against HOU in The Comeback comes to mind.

[8-8 Forever?]

I didn't know the intentional bat rule to be honest.

 

Apparently tonight's officials didn't know the rule, either.

 

Sucks for Detroit, should have been 1st and goal from one foot out. Total fail by the officials.

who cares. bills board. all bills all the time... go bills. detroit has an nfl team? really?

[Smears]

There are the refs determing the outcome of the game on monday night football. Way to go NFL!

+1

refs are determining TOO MANY outcomes of games with inconsistent calls. Shows that they have too many penalties. Refs should be called out by any team or coach. This b.s. of keeping them away from scrutiny creates a void of accountability.

Lions are "targets" for referees, they don't have donuts and coffee in the offcials room on Sundays like their "They're" supposed to

 

FIXED

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

 

I thought the same. I honestly hope they change the rule like the did with force outs a few years ago. A defender should be able to do that. Hell, by the reactions of the MNF crew and NFL desk, most people thought you already could do that.

 

By the letter of the current law, its actually no different than when a punter kicks a bad snap through the back of the end zone. Its a penalty on the kicking team, but the penalty for a foul by the offense in the end zone is a safety. So the effect would be the same.

Great explanation. Thanks, man.

[ToGoGo]

Somebody stated in another post that you can't help but feel there are "higher powers" at play in the modern day NFL.

 

I couldn't agree more and I've had the following conspiracy theory for years.

 

I don't think it's organized crime or the casinos. They've been effectively shut out of this money tree.

 

I think it's the owners and they are ALL in on it and have been since the dawn of free agency. They've been betting on their own games for years and now have an apparatus where they now can do that legally and reap incredible profits to the tune of billions of dollars off legalized gambling.

 

The "it's not gambling" fantasy football is huge business to the tune of over a billion dollars just in it's infancy. I think the owners laid the groundwork for it twenty years ago and for it to make money, the "house" (owners) have to have consistent results. This requires very good teams and very good players and not so good teams and not so good players. Having something like a Cinderella team or a system where very wealthy owners can't buy assets (free agency) is bad for business.

 

Since the owners all make money, and stand to make even more money collectively, they organize themselves into slots - you want to be a great team, you pay X price, a good team, Y price. Want to make money on the cheap, be a crap team. It's like an auction. The trophy goes to the highest bidder.

 

So, for example, not only is it in the best interest of the owners to keep Russell Wilson and the Seahawks putting up fantastic fantasy numbers, it's also that Paul Allen probably paid a lot of money to be a top 5 team. And since we're talking insane amounts of cash, since it's an off the books, non-corporate, untraceable transaction, not every owner is going to be in the conversation. Some owners have enough for a bid or two.

 

That's why Robert Kraft is never sorry for the actions of his team. In his eyes, he's paid for that trophy fair and square.

 

The owners let the coaches coach and the players play. However, the referees, the rules and regulations and even the CBA are designed like bumpers in a bowling alley - to gently nudge to the desired outcome while hiding in plain sight. The same rules keep the offenses pumping out points and the defenses to defend just enough to make it look good.

 

All in all, the NFL is now two private entertainment enterprises - the game on the field and the gambling but don't think for a second the general outcome of the season hasn't already been purchased. So buy your jerseys and enjoy the entertainment, but the real game is a bunch of middle aged men with cash to burn and egos to satisfy.

 

Fantastic. I've been trying to figure out "Why the Seahawks" for a while now, since Seattle isn't that big a market. I figured it had something to do with making up for the NBA moving the Sonics. But Paul Allen makes a lot of sense. He's only one of the 10-15 richest men in the world.

 

My theory has been that's it's just about revenue share. Simple economics that the Patriots or Cowboys being good creates better TV ratings, merchandise sales, etc than the Bills or Browns being good. Since the owners share the revenue, they don't care if their team wins as long as they maximize revenue. But maybe your theory is better.

[What a Tuel]

 

Yup. Everyone would scream about how some old, dumb rule they never see called "determined the outcome" (everyone's favorite phrase) of the game.

 

 

 

 

p.s. where's all the outrage about the coin flip "determining the outcome" of the Saints-Cowboys game?

 

The problem isn't that there are rules, it is that the officials are calling them poorly and inconsistently.

 

You may take "patting your teammate on the helmet and getting a personal foul" as "eh happens", I take it as inconsistent and ineffective officiating by part time officials irrespective of what team I root for.

[jumbalaya]

Would have been a bummer to have had money on the lions today

lions were getting 14.

[thronethinker]

@chdwil1: #FANFLF fans against NFL flags. We are hard working NFL fans. We want legitimate games and less flags. We want our team to win without NFL bs.

[Bookie Man]

As long as there are clown refs, there are going to be clown calls. Unfortunately, it will, most likely never change. And that is a sad story.

[blzrul]

Seahawks seem to always get the benefit of this stuff. And in typical, bandwagon don't-know-shirt-about-football Seattle style, the 12s are all disputing the rule. The fact that their own coach knew about it and admitted they got away with one doesn't stop them. They are so clueless. On the upside, it's fun to see them running scared when their "Legion of Dumb" has yet to make an INT, Russell Wilson is running his little legs off while Least Mode sits in the box eating Skittles.

 

Seahawk fans should thank God for the 13s because without them, they'd have far less "success".

[SirPorl]

Seahawks seem to always get the benefit of this stuff. And in typical, bandwagon don't-know-shirt-about-football Seattle style, the 12s are all disputing the rule. The fact that their own coach knew about it and admitted they got away with one doesn't stop them. They are so clueless. On the upside, it's fun to see them running scared when their "Legion of Dumb" has yet to make an INT, Russell Wilson is running his little legs off while Least Mode sits in the box eating Skittles.

 

Seahawk fans should thank God for the 13s because without them, they'd have far less "success".

The 12th man was MIA for the first two weeks of the season..My facebook feed blew up on week 3....

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

I need to ask ... How many games is it now that the Ref's have "given" to the Seahawks in the last 3 or so seasons?

[dave mcbride]

Looks like the Browns got screwed too. I saw this play in real time and wondered: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/10/08/browns-cornerback-tramon-williams-says-nfl-admitted-error-on-game-winning-field-goal/

[aristocrat]

I love how in that pff article about the browns play that the league might be mad at the browns for disclosing the bad call to the public...the fans who pay all their f$%%$# salaries!

[reddogblitz]

I need to ask ... How many games is it now that the Ref's have "given" to the Seahawks in the last 3 or so seasons?

 

At least 2 or maybe 3 that I can recall in the last 3 years. The Packer MNF replacement ref game and Sunday Night's game. In the NFC Championship game a couple of years ago the Beast fumbled and the 49ers recovered on like th Seahawk 10. But, it was nonrenewable for some unknown reason.

 

They are the league's squirrelist team.

[KD in CA]

Looks like the Browns got screwed too. I saw this play in real time and wondered: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/10/08/browns-cornerback-tramon-williams-says-nfl-admitted-error-on-game-winning-field-goal/

 

For all the whining about the Seahawks game, how has this barely been mentioned? Now THIS is a case of the refs taking the game away. You can see pretty clearly from that still Williams is not any further than the guy next to him or the guy on the opposite end. That's a major blown call.

[reddogblitz]

 

For all the whining about the Seahawks game, how has this barely been mentioned? Now THIS is a case of the refs taking the game away. You can see pretty clearly from that still Williams is not any further than the guy next to him or the guy on the opposite end. That's a major blown call.

 

Refs making obvious blown calls should be suspended for 4 games. To get re instated they should have to pass a long test on the rules.

[Rob's House]

Indy just got gifted a TD in the 4th qtr of what was a 3 pt game. If this were the Bills I'd be livid. They called a phantom face mask on Clowney to turn a 2 yd loss into a 15 yd gain, a ticky tack (at best) defensive holding call to turn an interception into 5 yds and a first down, followed by a PI call on an uncatchable pass to put Indy at the goal line with a fresh set of downs. Utter horse ****.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Rob's House

[DC Tom]

Indy just got gifted a TD in the 4th qtr of what was a 3 pt game. If this were the Bills I'd be livid. They called a phantom face mask on Clowney to turn a 2 yd loss into a 15 yd gain, a ticky tack (at best) defensive holding call to turn an interception into 5 yds and a first down, followed by a PI call on an uncatchable pass to put Indy at the goal line with a fresh set of downs. Utter horse ****.

 

With all the "Wait, what?" calls the Texans are getting, it's like watching a Bills game.

[billsfan714]

its a conspiracy against the great lakes teams.

[apuszczalowski]

Refs making obvious blown calls should be suspended for 4 games. To get re instated they should have to pass a long test on the rules.

but then who would be left to ref the games?

[4merper4mer]

 

They are the league's squirrelist team.

There is a team in the AFC East that hasn't been called for holding in 14 years.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Indy just got gifted a TD in the 4th qtr of what was a 3 pt game. If this were the Bills I'd be livid. They called a phantom face mask on Clowney to turn a 2 yd loss into a 15 yd gain, a ticky tack (at best) defensive holding call to turn an interception into 5 yds and a first down, followed by a PI call on an uncatchable pass to put Indy at the goal line with a fresh set of downs. Utter horse ****.

it was late and I was starting to doze, but I believe he clarified his "call" as to not being a face mask but mentioned helmet.

There is a team in the AFC East that hasn't been called for holding in 14 years.

link?

its a conspiracy against the great lakes teams.

Houston is a Great Lake team?

[The Wiz]

Indy just got gifted a TD in the 4th qtr of what was a 3 pt game. If this were the Bills I'd be livid. They called a phantom face mask on Clowney to turn a 2 yd loss into a 15 yd gain, a ticky tack (at best) defensive holding call to turn an interception into 5 yds and a first down, followed by a PI call on an uncatchable pass to put Indy at the goal line with a fresh set of downs. Utter horse ****.

Yea I caught the 4th quarter of that game. If the rest of the game were called that unevenly the colts should have won by 20.

[peterpan]

My belief is that the NFL simply wants the reffing to be this bad.

 

College football doesn't have this problem. College footballs review system is also VASTLY superior to the NFLs. All calls get reviewed. They don't have some stupid challenge flag. Instead of a ref running across the stadium to a stupid little booth, the officials in the TV room simply radio down to the guy and tell him what the call should have been. It happens fast and fair. They don't even go to commercial usually.

 

Ahh that right, commercials! All those flags give the NFL a lot of stoppages so they can insert those!!!

[fan_in_tx]

Indy just got gifted a TD in the 4th qtr of what was a 3 pt game. If this were the Bills I'd be livid. They called a phantom face mask on Clowney to turn a 2 yd loss into a 15 yd gain, a ticky tack (at best) defensive holding call to turn an interception into 5 yds and a first down, followed by a PI call on an uncatchable pass to put Indy at the goal line with a fresh set of downs. Utter horse ****.

There was also another one of the infamous chop block calls against Houstion after a long gain and first down. On replay it looked exactly like the Bills call where the gurad blocks into the belly of the defender way above the legs and the flag gets thrown.

[Big Hurt]

Apparently, Vegas would not be happy if the Lions had won that game. Anyone can be bought with the right price.