Why is everyone focused on the Offense here?

[PatsFanNH]

I am really confused by this. The Offense did start off slow but:

 

1. scored 25 points against a team that was 0-24 when a team gets 24 or more points.

 

2. Got a 3 point lead with I believe 1:54 left in the game.  All the bills D had to do was stop the worst scoring O in the NFL from getting  a TD in order to not lose the game. 
 

3. Yes the Bills D has a lot of injuries on it, but hello! The Patriots have the worst O and they gave up 29 points to them, more than doubling their normal output.

 

4. The Bills D per numerous sources only got 22% pressure on Jones who up until Sunday was the most pressured QB in the NFL.

 

My point? The Bills D would worry more a heck of a lot more than the Bills O because if they gave up 29 to the worst O what will they give up to teams like Dallas,KC, and Philly?

 

Your O be fine, even sleep walking through a half they still managed 25 points. 

[MJS]

Because the offense has scored almost nothing in the first 3 quarters the past 3 weeks. Plus, with all the injuries on defense, it is kind of expected that the defense will struggle more.

 

So, pick your poison. A lot of people want more from the offense. Improved oline. Superstars at QB and WR. Maybe it would be nice if they could be really good and cover for an injury plagued defense...

[78thealltimegreat]

Just now, PatsFanNH said:

I am really confused by this. The Offense did start off slow but:

 

1. scored 25 points against a team that was 0-24 when a team gets 24 or more points.

 

2. Got a 3 point lead with I believe 1:54 left in the game.  All the bills D had to do was stop the worst scoring O in the NFL from getting  a TD in order to not lose the game. 
 

3. Yes the Bills D has a lot of injuries on it, but hello! The Patriots have the worst O and they gave up 29 points to them, more than doubling their normal output.

 

4. The Bills D per numerous sources only got 22% pressure on Jones who up until Sunday was the most pressured QB in the NFL.

 

My point? The Bills D would worry more a heck of a lot more than the Bills O because if they gave up 29 to the worst O what will they give up to teams like Dallas,KC, and Philly?

 

Your O be fine, even sleep walking through a half they still managed 25 points. 

You have to understand Pats half this board absolutely hates Josh Allen and any loss is his fault. You should read the analysis of some of the podcasters blaming Allen for everything.

The other half of this board is analytical and realizes there are other problems at work on this team. 
It’s always been like that with Josh somehow despite leading the team back to take the lead 25-22 it was Allens fault for not being able to rush the passer and get to Mac Jones. 

[Royale with Cheese]

The defense certainly sucked against the Pats so they need blame.

 

But the offense has been awful the last 3 games.  19 ppg in the last 3 games is not anywhere near our standard.

We went from not punting to probably punting more than anyone in the league in the last few weeks.  We can't even cross midfield on any sort of regular basis.

 

Our offense isn't injured like our defense.  All of our key contributors are playing and we are struggling.

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

I am really confused by this. The Offense did start off slow but:

 

1. scored 25 points against a team that was 0-24 when a team gets 24 or more points.

 

2. Got a 3 point lead with I believe 1:54 left in the game.  All the bills D had to do was stop the worst scoring O in the NFL from getting  a TD in order to not lose the game. 
 

3. Yes the Bills D has a lot of injuries on it, but hello! The Patriots have the worst O and they gave up 29 points to them, more than doubling their normal output.

 

4. The Bills D per numerous sources only got 22% pressure on Jones who up until Sunday was the most pressured QB in the NFL.

 

My point? The Bills D would worry more a heck of a lot more than the Bills O because if they gave up 29 to the worst O what will they give up to teams like Dallas,KC, and Philly?

 

Your O be fine, even sleep walking through a half they still managed 25 points. 

Because the way to beat bad teams is to score points and end the game.

 

If the Bills had scored 2-3 TDs in the first half, the game would’ve been over. same with the Giants game.

 

If you let bad teams hang around, they can get a chance to win. Which is what happened in our last two games.

[Low Positive]

5 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The defense certainly sucked against the Pats so they need blame.

 

But the offense has been awful the last 3 games.  19 ppg in the last 3 games is not anywhere near our standard.

We went from not punting to probably punting more than anyone in the league in the last few weeks.  We can't even cross midfield on any sort of regular basis.

 

Our offense isn't injured like our defense.  All of our key contributors are playing and we are struggling.

The Bills punted once on Sunday.

3 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Because the way to beat bad teams is to score points and end the game.

 

If the Bills had scored 2-3 TDs in the first half, the game would’ve been over. same with the Giants game.

 

If you let bad teams hang around, they can get a chance to win. Which is what happened in our last two games.

That's exactly what happened to the 49ers two weeks in a row.

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, FrenchConnection said:

The Bills punted once on Sunday.

Must mean the offense was really good.

 

My screen said we had 10 points with 5 minutes left in the fourth. Maybe it was the TV producer’s fault.

2 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

The Bills punted once on Sunday.

That's exactly what happened to the 49ers two weeks in a row.

And 49ers lost both games? Was that supposed to help your point lmao?

Edited October 24, 2023 by FireChans

[PatsFanNH]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The defense certainly sucked against the Pats so they need blame.

 

But the offense has been awful the last 3 games.  19 ppg in the last 3 games is not anywhere near our standard.

We went from not punting to probably punting more than anyone in the league in the last few weeks.  We can't even cross midfield on any sort of regular basis.

 

Our offense isn't injured like our defense.  All of our key contributors are playing and we are struggling.

I get that! But expecting an offense, even a great offense, to score 30 points to win a game is asking a lot of them. 
 

The D is injured, but they had the LEAD with less than 2 minutes to go.. facing a frankly BAD O.  They couldn’t stop a bad O. What’s going to happen when the Bills face not only very good O’s but also very good D’s like Dallas and Philly. I mean Sundays Bills D wouldn’t stop Mahomes once and they pull off what the Bills did to NE a few years ago and score TDs on every drive. 
 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

The Bills punted once on Sunday.

 

That would make 10 in 3 weeks.  Which isn't absolutely terrible but not our standard. 

[Blackbeard]

I'm focused on Offense because i think it's going to be very difficult to bring in quality help at this point, this season, on defense  

 

SO what do we need to do?  SCORE MORE than the defense will let up.

Edited October 24, 2023 by Blackbeard

[Jauronimo]

10 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

You have to understand Pats half this board absolutely hates Josh Allen and any loss is his fault. You should read the analysis of some of the podcasters blaming Allen for everything.

The other half of this board is analytical and realizes there are other problems at work on this team. 
It’s always been like that with Josh somehow despite leading the team back to take the lead 25-22 it was Allens fault for not being able to rush the passer and get to Mac Jones. 

Josh Allen is worshipped by 99.9% of the fanbase.  You do not need to white knight for him.  Wipe off your chin and go outside.

[PatsFanNH]

Just now, Blackbeard said:

I'm focused on Offense because i think it's going to be very difficult to bring in quality help at this point, this season.

 

SO what do we need to do?  SCORE MORE than the defense will let up.

I may be spoiled but BB would have them do the bend but not break routine waiting for the other team make the mistake. Most teams will. 

[DrDawkinstein]

9 minutes ago, MJS said:

Because the offense has scored almost nothing in the first 3 quarters the past 3 weeks. Plus, with all the injuries on defense, it is kind of expected that the defense will struggle more.

 

So, pick your poison. A lot of people want more from the offense. Improved oline. Superstars at QB and WR. Maybe it would be nice if they could be really good and cover for an injury plagued defense...

 

Exactly.

 

And if the offense can actually be productive in the first half, and sustain drives, and put some points up - that completely changes the rest of the game.

 

It means less possessions and scoring chances for the other team. It means our defense is on the field less. It means the opponent changes their play calling. Etc.

 

It all starts with the Offense.

 

The Defense, even with all their injuries, did enough through the first 3 quarters that any bit of a complimentary Offense should have given us the lead in the 2nd or early 3rd quarter, and then the rest of the game goes differently.

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, PatsFanNH said:

I get that! But expecting an offense, even a great offense, to score 30 points to win a game is asking a lot of them. 
 

The D is injured, but they had the LEAD with less than 2 minutes to go.. facing a frankly BAD O.  They couldn’t stop a bad O. What’s going to happen when the Bills face not only very good O’s but also very good D’s like Dallas and Philly. I mean Sundays Bills D wouldn’t stop Mahomes once and they pull off what the Bills did to NE a few years ago and score TDs on every drive. 
 

 

 

We didn't even need our offense to be great to handle the Giants, Jags and Pats.  

When you have a healthy offense, you shouldn't be relying on an injured defense to win us games.  The offense should be picking it up but instead but instead, they're depending on the defense.  

[DrDawkinstein]

4 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

I get that! But expecting an offense, even a great offense, to score 30 points to win a game is asking a lot of them. 
 

 

Where did anyone say that?

 

What I AM expecting is 10-14 points in the 1st half, which makes it a completely different game.

[PBF81]

Uhhhh, maybe because an offense led by Josh Allen and one that averaged 41 PPG in weeks 2-4 after that Jets debacle of a game, can't even average 20 PPG in the last three games against teams currently ranked 19th, 24th, and 25th in scoring D?  

 

Because one of the best QBs in the league has played to incredibly average standards over the past three weeks?  

 

Do I win?  

 

Bueller?  Bueller?  ... anyone?  

 

  

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

18 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

I am really confused by this. The Offense did start off slow but:

 

1. scored 25 points against a team that was 0-24 when a team gets 24 or more points.

 

2. Got a 3 point lead with I believe 1:54 left in the game.  All the bills D had to do was stop the worst scoring O in the NFL from getting  a TD in order to not lose the game. 
 

3. Yes the Bills D has a lot of injuries on it, but hello! The Patriots have the worst O and they gave up 29 points to them, more than doubling their normal output.

 

4. The Bills D per numerous sources only got 22% pressure on Jones who up until Sunday was the most pressured QB in the NFL.

 

My point? The Bills D would worry more a heck of a lot more than the Bills O because if they gave up 29 to the worst O what will they give up to teams like Dallas,KC, and Philly?

 

Your O be fine, even sleep walking through a half they still managed 25 points. 

 

 

From my perspective getting the defense back to being a top 3 unit............which is basically the standard McDermott expects........is a multi-player + time on task fix.

 

And at the same time being that top defense hasn't equated to top defensive play in the playoffs when they face teams loaded with playmakers.

 

The offense is one very good WR away from being MUCH better, though. 

[Brand J]

We have a defensive HC, but with Josh Allen at QB, the team’s identity should be the offense. That has to be the unit carrying the franchise, not the decimated defense. The offense hasn’t been carrying anything since the Miami win and if they don’t snap out of it, will be in danger of missing the playoffs.

[mannc]

The defense is missing four key starters…until Knox went down, there wasn’t a single injury on offense…and expectations are justifiably high when your QB is Josh Allen.

[Jerome007]

21 minutes ago, MJS said:

Because the offense has scored almost nothing in the first 3 quarters the past 3 weeks. Plus, with all the injuries on defense, it is kind of expected that the defense will struggle more.

Exactly this. The defense - and mostly, McD - deserve a lot of the blame last Sunday, but not otherwise. The offense have been bad for the first 3 quarters 3 straight games, and had no injury of note. 

[SCBills]

The Offense has been a disaster for 4 out of 7 games.   

 

It took them an entire half to wake up against a defense missing their top pass rushers, which is devoid of talent to begin with,

 

The Defense still has:

 

Greg Rousseau

Ed Oliver

Leonard Floyd

AJ Epenesa

Taron Johnson

Terrell Bernard

Micah Hyde

Jordan Poyer

Von Miller (we hope, at some point)

 

They desperately need something to click or be added to the IDL... but there is enough talent for McDermott to keep this group middle of the pack.

 

We likely don't make the playoffs, let alone make a run to the Super Bowl, with our Offense doing what they've done through 7 games. 

 

....and maybe we have in-house fixes, but when teams are taking away deep shots and that's literally all our "WR2" is good for in the passing game.... we have a major personnel problem. 

[PatsFanNH]

6 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Where did anyone say that?

 

What I AM expecting is 10-14 points in the 1st half, which makes it a completely different game.

Umm to win Sunday they needed to score 30 points..  the Pats got 29

[Success]

4 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

From my perspective getting the defense back to being a top 3 unit............which is basically the standard McDermott expects........is a multi-player + time on task fix.

 

And at the same time being that top defense hasn't equated to top defensive play in the playoffs when they face teams loaded with playmakers.

 

The offense is one very good WR away from being MUCH better, though. 

 

I think it could have been different in the playoffs this year.  The D just looked different before the injuries. We faced one of the league's more potent offenses in Miami, and we really shut them down after the early scores. We were much more swarming, and it seemed like the line was in the backfield all day.

 

Now, without Milano, Jones & White, we look a lot more like the defense that faltered in the playoffs the past few years.

 

[Big Turk]

24 minutes ago, MJS said:

Because the offense has scored almost nothing in the first 3 quarters the past 3 weeks. Plus, with all the injuries on defense, it is kind of expected that the defense will struggle more.

 

So, pick your poison. A lot of people want more from the offense. Improved oline. Superstars at QB and WR. Maybe it would be nice if they could be really good and cover for an injury plagued defense...

 

I think it works in tandem...if the O can jump out to a big lead, it puts more pressure on the opposing team to try and pass more to stay in it and causes them to become more one dimensional, which helps pass rush and TOs usually.  

 

With the Bills doing little on offense until the 2nd half, when they have caught fire, BTW, other teams can keep running the ball and keep the Bills team off balanced more which makes it easier to eat clock, sustain long drives and give the Bills O fewer possessions.

 

That's what McD means when playing complimentary football...the O helps the D by building big leads to force teams to be one dimensional and the D gets the ball back to the O with TOs and punts.  It kinda causes a positive feedback loop once it gets rolling.  With the way it's happening now, it's actually causing a negative feedback loop.  The O can't score in the 1st half when the D plays halfway decent most of the time, then the O gets cranking in the 2nd half but the D can't stop anyone. Very disjointed right now.

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

2 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Umm to win Sunday they needed to score 30 points..  the Pats got 29

 

Well you see, if the offense had been putting together 10 minute TD drives on every single possession than the DEF would've been on the field for 1-2 fewer possessions and only allowed 22 points to the worst offense in the NFL. 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, PatsFanNH said:

Umm to win Sunday they needed to score 30 points..  the Pats got 29

 

See my other post.

 

Scoring more points early means sustaining drives which means less possessions for the opponent which means less points for the opponent.

 

If the Bills scored 10-14 points in the 1st half instead of... 3 (jfc), the whole game changes from there. No guarantee the Pats still score 13 in the 1st half or 16 in the 2nd. Of course, no guarantee the Bills score in the 2nf half either. But the point is, change the outcome of one failed drive and the entire game changes.

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

I think it works in tandem...if the O can jump out to a big lead, it puts more pressure on the opposing team to try and pass more to stay in it and causes them to become more one dimensional, which helps pass rush and TOs usually.  

 

With the Bills doing little on offense until the 2nd half, when they have caught fire, BTW, other teams can keep running the ball and keep the Bills team off balanced more which makes it easier to eat clock, sustain long drives and give the Bills O fewer possessions.

 

That's what McD means when playing complimentary football...the O helps the D by building big leads to force teams to be one dimensional and the D gets the ball back to the O with TOs and punts.  It kinda causes a positive feedback loop once it gets rolling.  With the way it's happening now, it's actually causing a negative feedback loop.  The O can't score in the 1st half when the D plays halfway decent most of the time, then the O gets cranking in the 2nd half but the D can't stop anyone. Very disjointed right now.

 

Yes. This is the point I'm trying to make as well when saying we just need 10-14 points in the 1st half instead of 3. Doesnt even need to be a big lead, but be productive early, score some points, and everything changes.

[starrymessenger]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

From my perspective getting the defense back to being a top 3 unit............which is basically the standard McDermott expects........is a multi-player + time on task fix.

 

And at the same time being that top defense hasn't equated to top defensive play in the playoffs when they face teams loaded with playmakers.

 

The offense is one very good WR away from being MUCH better, though. 

I agree that on paper and personnel wise a true # 2 (a guy like Addison who the Bills targeted) would be a major upgrade to the offence but right now I'm not sure that the Bills would be able to make the best use of this asset or that it would remedy the disfunction that we are seeing. 

[Einstein]

32 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

I am really confused by this. The Offense did start off slow but:

 

1. scored 25 points against a team that was 0-24 when a team gets 24 or more points.

 

2. Got a 3 point lead with I believe 1:54 left in the game.  All the bills D had to do was stop the worst scoring O in the NFL from getting  a TD in order to not lose the game. 
 

3. Yes the Bills D has a lot of injuries on it, but hello! The Patriots have the worst O and they gave up 29 points to them, more than doubling their normal output.

 

4. The Bills D per numerous sources only got 22% pressure on Jones who up until Sunday was the most pressured QB in the NFL.

 

My point? The Bills D would worry more a heck of a lot more than the Bills O because if they gave up 29 to the worst O what will they give up to teams like Dallas,KC, and Philly?

 

Your O be fine, even sleep walking through a half they still managed 25 points. 

I agree.

Football is a 60 minutes game. 

It doesn't matter if you score 7 points per quarter, or all 28 in the final quarter. The points still count.,

 

The offense scored 25 points and left the field with a lead, under 2 minutes to go, and kicking off the ball to a Mac Jones led offense.

 

In my opinion, the blame resides with the defense.

[HOUSE]

Because the defense can't throw pretty 70 passes that make people go wow

[CincyBillsFan]

28 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The defense certainly sucked against the Pats so they need blame.

 

But the offense has been awful the last 3 games.  19 ppg in the last 3 games is not anywhere near our standard.

We went from not punting to probably punting more than anyone in the league in the last few weeks.  We can't even cross midfield on any sort of regular basis.

 

Our offense isn't injured like our defense.  All of our key contributors are playing and we are struggling.

To be precise the offense has been unproductive in the first half and very productive in the 2nd half. 

[DrDawkinstein]

3 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

To be precise the offense has been unproductive in the first half and very productive in the 2nd half. 

 

I attribute the 2nd half production to having to play from behind, so the Offense is pressing more, taking more risks, and playing with more urgency. Which is closer to how they should be starting the game instead of flat, listless, and unprepared.

[CincyBillsFan]

14 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

We have a defensive HC, but with Josh Allen at QB, the team’s identity should be the offense. That has to be the unit carrying the franchise, not the decimated defense. The offense hasn’t been carrying anything since the Miami win and if they don’t snap out of it, will be in danger of missing the playoffs.

But to do this the team must prioritize the offense over the defense and by a wide margin. It definitely has not.  You can't skimp on an O line that has been rated in the bottom half of the NFL this season and the last couple of seasons, and then expect the Offense to carry the team when the D experiences injuries and isn't playing well. And I haven't even mentioned our collection of underwhelming offensive skill players not named Diggs.

 

 

 

 

[sunshynman]

31 minutes ago, FireChans said:

And 49ers lost both games? Was that supposed to help your point lmao?

French was saying not punting doesn't mean the offense was good. 

And was agreeing with your point that just like the 49ers let a bad team hang around by not being productive early.

Edited October 24, 2023 by sunshynman
words

[nedboy7]

So the moment the dismal offense scores a few points they are off the hook.  The offense was clearly the problem.  Any one with a clue can see this offense is completely off rhythm.   The D is holding on for dear life missing its top 3 players. 

[cgg716]

Because a good chunk of fans believe all the credit and all the blame goes to the qb. Which is dumb

39 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The defense certainly sucked against the Pats so they need blame.

 

But the offense has been awful the last 3 games.  19 ppg in the last 3 games is not anywhere near our standard.

We went from not punting to probably punting more than anyone in the league in the last few weeks.  We can't even cross midfield on any sort of regular basis.

 

Our offense isn't injured like our defense.  All of our key contributors are playing and we are struggling.

It just doesn't have good players because we need 13 d-lineman

[nedboy7]

2 minutes ago, cgg716 said:

Because a good chunk of fans believe all the credit and all the blame goes to the qb. Which is dumb

 

How many times did I read all you need is a franchise QB to win.  Well then.....

[Royale with Cheese]

3 minutes ago, cgg716 said:

Because a good chunk of fans believe all the credit and all the blame goes to the qb. Which is dumb

It just doesn't have good players because we need 13 d-lineman

 

Did you know that Philly and SF rotate a lot of DL?

[FireChans]

12 minutes ago, Einstein said:

I agree.

Football is a 60 minutes game. 

It doesn't matter if you score 7 points per quarter, or all 28 in the final quarter. The points still count.,

 

The offense scored 25 points and left the field with a lead, under 2 minutes to go, and kicking off the ball to a Mac Jones led offense.

 

In my opinion, the blame resides with the defense.

It absolutely does matter, and you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the psychology of football if you don’t realize that.

 

Look at the Dolphins game. We went score for score with Miami, they knew they had to be on their A game to compete, it put immense pressure on their team and they wilted. The game ended in the third Q because we put it on them. The defense wasn’t good, at all, in the first half, but a couple turnovers (again, because their offense needed to score to keep pace), and the offense capitalizing on those mistakes ended the football game. 
 

If the Dolphins went up 14-0, the psychology of the game would’ve been completely different.

 

When one unit does next to nothing for 3 Q’s, it changes everything. It lets the Mac Jones and Tyrod Taylor’s of the world be comfortable, take easy completions, and hang onto a lead, rather than pressing.

[sunshynman]

3 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

So the moment the dismal offense scores a few points they are off the hook.  The offense was clearly the problem.  Any one with a clue can see this offense is completely off rhythm.   The D is holding on for dear life missing its top 3 players. 

Like looking unstoppable at the start of last year. To looking bad at times afterwards (although Allen's injury had caused most of this). 

 

This year it went Bad, not in rhythm, Hot and on point, To Aweful, unfocused, no rhythm. I think alot of it is the push to make Allen a pocket passer. To much getting in his head from coaches. Also we need a #2. And open up Kincaids routes! I'd like to see more of Shakir and Sherrfield than Gabe at this point. 

 

1 minute ago, cgg716 said:

Because a good chunk of fans believe all the credit and all the blame goes to the qb. Which is dumb

Not all of course. But he does dictate the ebbs and flows of the O. Starting out with a pick when he didn't even see the defender does not help. But Knox would have probably dropped it anyway had it got there. 

[CincyBillsFan]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I attribute the 2nd half production to having to play from behind, so the Offense is pressing more, taking more risks, and playing with more urgency. Which is closer to how they should be starting the game instead of flat, listless, and unprepared.

This is a great point and it suggests to me that the problem isn't Allen or even Dorsey but it's a strategic issue arising from the head coach.

 

It seems like against inferior teams McD wants to win putting out the minimum effort. He does this I suspect in recognition that it's a long season and believes there will be less attrition of he does it this way.  Of course the challenge is that in the NFL the difference between the best and worst team isn't that great.

 

Think about the Dolphins game. McD saw the fish as a real threat and a great team. So how did the offense start that game - explosively and aggressively.  I'll throw the Jags game out because the issue there was the travel.  But against the Giants & Pats McD believed the Bills could win putting out 80% effort.  Then when things went south the O was turned lose as you note and they performed very well at that point in BOTH games.