Jets are releasing WR Denzel Mims if they can't trade him.

[starrymessenger]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Even if you are not, Shorter's a 5rh round shot to nothing who is a very able special teamer. Mims was a very early 2nd rounder who can do nothing but run fast in straight lines.

Sure plus Shorter is a humble kid with a good attitude. I'm hoping he can develop.

[chongli]

 

 

[maddenboy]

maybe the only thing mathematially smaller would be a conditional swap of 7th round picks in 2025.

 

JETS WIN!  JETS WIN!  JETS WIN!

 

the offseason.  They just magically turned a 7th rounder in 2057 into a 6th (this year, sounds like)

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by maddenboy

[Airseven]

7 minutes ago, maddenboy said:

maybe the only thing mathematially smaller would be a conditional swap of 7th round picks in 2025.

 

JETS WIN!  JETS WIN!  JETS WIN!

 

the offseason.  They just magically turned a 7th rounder in 2057 into a 6th (this year, sounds like)

 

Nothing wrong with salvaging a shred of value for a player you’re just about to cut. 

[TheWeatherMan]

10 minutes ago, Airseven said:

Nothing wrong with salvaging a shred of value for a player you’re just about to cut. 

Except they wasted an early second round pick on said player only 3 drafts ago.  

[newcam2012]

Bills could have picked him up for nothing. It's not like the WR core is rock solid. Maybe the Jets, wouldn't trade him within the division? 

 

Mims might have produced with Allen throwing him the ball. In NY, he never had a solid QB behind him. 

Edited July 20, 2023 by newcam2012

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

3 hours ago, starrymessenger said:

Sure plus Shorter is a humble kid with a good attitude. I'm hoping he can develop.

 

Also, Shorter being about .20 seconds slower on the 40 has hopefully made him learn how to use his size to create space for catches and run better routes to get open. 

[Bookie Man]

NFL draft is a literal crap shoot

[GunnerBill]

8 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

So...."Smoke" Brown!!

 

If only he could track the ball as well as Smoke.

[Airseven]

9 hours ago, TheWeatherMan said:

Except they wasted an early second round pick on said player only 3 drafts ago.  

A separate issue.

[Mr. WEO]

6 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

If only he could track the ball as well as Smoke.

 

Smoke was catching balls at rates of 47, 53, 38, 43% for half of his career (53% total).  Caught 1 pass on the last 4 teams he played for. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 

Smoke was catching balls at rates of 47, 53, 38, 43% for half of his career (53% total).  Caught 1 pass on the last 4 teams he played for. 

 

He still tracked the ball better than Mims. He has the ball skills of a baton. 

[Mr. WEO]

8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He still tracked the ball better than Mims. He has the ball skills of a baton. 

 

That's a hair I would need an electron microscope to split..

[Utah John]

The Bills' WR room is stuffed already.  Unless the guy's last name is Hopkins, we already have several guys better than anyone available.

[RyanC883]

21 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

He is not very good that's why. He is a speed and size guy who can't really play. I was not very high on him coming out. Thought the Jets taking him right at the start of the 2nd round was a reach.

 

why can't he play?  poor route running, hands football IQ?  

 

do you think proper coaching can fix his issues?  

[Jauronimo]

6 minutes ago, Utah John said:

The Bills' WR room is stuffed already.  Unless the guy's last name is Hopkins, we already have several guys better than anyone available.

Bills WR room is stuffed like my money clip. A Franklin on the outside but a bunch of expired coupons and a 7 year old condom on the inside.  It stinks!

[Nextmanup]

3 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Bills WR room is stuffed like my money clip. A Franklin on the outside but a bunch of expired coupons and a 7 year old condom on the inside.  It stinks!

Only a Bills fan would dare suggest our WR room is "stuffed" with talent.

 

 

[Jauronimo]

13 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Only a Bills fan would dare suggest our WR room is "stuffed" with talent.

 

 

We have one elite WR then a bunch of dudes.  No one cares about Gabe Davis outside of the 585.  Then there's Scherfield, Harty, Shakir, and Shorter.  I'm surprised that much mediocrity can even fit in one room. Stuffed I tell ya. Stuffed!

[GunnerBill]

37 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

why can't he play?  poor route running, hands football IQ?  

 

do you think proper coaching can fix his issues?  

 

Poor route running, can't track the ball, poor hands, no release package to speak of. He is a bigger guy who runs fast in straight lines. Can you coach it up? To coach all of that up is an ask. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

12 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

Bills could have picked him up for nothing. It's not like the WR core is rock solid. Maybe the Jets, wouldn't trade him within the division? 

 

Mims might have produced with Allen throwing him the ball. In NY, he never had a solid QB behind him. 

I get the thought process, but if they thought so little of him that they were cutting bait before camp opens I highly doubt they would fear trading him within the division. 

[newcam2012]

10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Poor route running, can't track the ball, poor hands, no release package to speak of. He is a bigger guy who runs fast in straight lines. Can you coach it up? To coach all of that up is an ask. 

Gunner are you referring to Gabe Davis? 

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Gunner are you referring to Gabe Davis? 

 

Gabe is better than Mims. I believed that before the 2020 draft and took a lot of heat for that view. I still believe it. 

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Gabe is better than Mims. I believed that before the 2020 draft and took a lot of heat for that view. I still believe it. 

Perhaps he's better but your description of Mims certainly is applicable to Davis. It was not about whose better rather than comparing their short comings. 

 

Just food for thought. How good do you think Davis would be if he was in Mims situation in NY? Vice versa?

 

I'd argue Allen has greatly enhanced Gabe's game while the Jets situation did the opposite for Mims. 

Edited July 20, 2023 by newcam2012

[Sestak4ever]

People forget how good Davis was the previous two seasons, especially when Allen would break the pocket and scramble around. Davis would continue working to get open and make some amazing sideline catches, many on 3rd down. I’m hoping last season was just a down year for him.

[uninja]

25 minutes ago, Sestak4ever said:

People forget how good Davis was the previous two seasons, especially when Allen would break the pocket and scramble around. Davis would continue working to get open and make some amazing sideline catches, many on 3rd down. I’m hoping last season was just a down year for him.

 

Or how we was basically playing for most of the regular season on a bum leg because he was the only WR we had who could block. Crowder and Kumerow going down for the year early really sucked for our depth and forcing us to trot out players that were not 100%.

 

It's also odd that we talk about what kind of bum Davis is when he basically had a great year statistically for yards and TDs last year and his catch rate didn't drastically go up or down either, its pretty in line with previous years because he's mostly used as an X receiver who runs deep so you're gonna see more drops/throwaways.

[John from Riverside]

14 hours ago, TheWeatherMan said:

Except they wasted an early second round pick on said player only 3 drafts ago.  

Only three drafts ago
That’s three years you’re making it sound like it was last draft lol

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, newcam2012 said:

Perhaps he's better but your description of Mims certainly is applicable to Davis. It was not about whose better rather than comparing their short comings. 

 

Just food for thought. How good do you think Davis would be if he was in Mims situation in NY? Vice versa?

 

I'd argue Allen has greatly enhanced Gabe's game while the Jets situation did the opposite for Mims. 

 

I think Mims would suck with Josh too. I don't see Gabe as like him at all. Gabe is a good ball tracker, he has a limited route tree but the routes he can run he runs well and his release package is the area he has most improved since the draft. I will give you his hands. They are sub-optimal. But he is just better than Mims. That is why Gabe is gonna get paid next spring and Mims just got traded for a conditional pick. 

[Sestak4ever]

1 hour ago, uninja said:

 

Or how we was basically playing for most of the regular season on a bum leg because he was the only WR we had who could block. Crowder and Kumerow going down for the year early really sucked for our depth and forcing us to trot out players that were not 100%.

 

It's also odd that we talk about what kind of bum Davis is when he basically had a great year statistically for yards and TDs last year and his catch rate didn't drastically go up or down either, its pretty in line with previous years because he's mostly used as an X receiver who runs deep so you're gonna see more drops/throwaways.

Yes, I forgot about the injury. You are correct.

[Beck Water]

5 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

That's a hair I would need an electron microscope to split..

 

Seriously?

[4merper4mer]

2 hours ago, Sestak4ever said:

People forget how good Davis was the previous two seasons, especially when Allen would break the pocket and scramble around. Davis would continue working to get open and make some amazing sideline catches, many on 3rd down. I’m hoping last season was just a down year for him.

They don’t forget.  They troll.

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, uninja said:

 

Or how we was basically playing for most of the regular season on a bum leg because he was the only WR we had who could block.

 

 

Just a little note that Davis was injured in practice prior to week 2, at which point in the season Kumerow was healthy and taking 70% of the ST snaps

It's true he was injured the following week against Mia, but since Davis played like a full game against Mia, presumably he played because they thought he could, not because he needed to play (and block).

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, Sestak4ever said:

People forget how good Davis was the previous two seasons, especially when Allen would break the pocket and scramble around. Davis would continue working to get open and make some amazing sideline catches, many on 3rd down. I’m hoping last season was just a down year for him.

 

I remember exactly how good Davis was before he was a full time WR2. I'm fact his rookie season to me was his best, and statistically it was his most efficient. My hope was that we would use this offseason to push him back to his preferred role as the 3rd or 4th WR on the depth chart. Unfortunately that didn't happen.

[newcam2012]

55 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think Mims would suck with Josh too. I don't see Gabe as like him at all. Gabe is a good ball tracker, he has a limited route tree but the routes he can run he runs well and his release package is the area he has most improved since the draft. I will give you his hands. They are sub-optimal. But he is just better than Mims. That is why Gabe is gonna get paid next spring and Mims just got traded for a conditional pick. 

Let's just hope the Bills don't pay him. He's not worth 10-15 million. 

 

I wonder if the Bills looked to trade him this off season. He's likely to hit the free market and the Bills will get little to nothing in return now. Did they error in judgement?  

 

The Davis love on this board is kind of crazy. Folks, he's just average and limited. The Bills need to improve the WR2 position. Diggs production playoff time will be dramatically reduced again without another viable passing weapon. Gotta hope someone else steps it up because Davis isn't that guy. 

 

Yet, Beane continues to pound the table for him. Feeding the fans a ray of hope. 

Edited July 20, 2023 by newcam2012

[newcam2012]

34 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Just a little note that Davis was injured in practice prior to week 2, at which point in the season Kumerow was healthy and taking 70% of the ST snaps

It's true he was injured the following week against Mia, but since Davis played like a full game against Mia, presumably he played because they thought he could, not because he needed to play (and block).

Come on folks stop with the Davis injury excuses. The guy was heathly in the last 3rd of the season and the playoffs. During this period, he was average at best because hes an average WR2. He will never be a top end WR2 because of his well known limitations. 

 

Let's be honest here. Gabe is best used as a WR 3/4. He's able to be less skilled CBs and less attention is on him. Think of the KC playoff game as a great example. 

38 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I remember exactly how good Davis was before he was a full time WR2. I'm fact his rookie season to me was his best, and statistically it was his most efficient. My hope was that we would use this offseason to push him back to his preferred role as the 3rd or 4th WR on the depth chart. Unfortunately that didn't happen.

Bingo. Spot on right here!!!!

36 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

He’s always playing with a bum leg… it’s his baseline. I’m sure at some point this season he’ll be playing with a bum leg.

Oh maybe that's why he can't make those contested catches very well. 

[Beck Water]

39 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I remember exactly how good Davis was before he was a full time WR2. I'm fact his rookie season to me was his best, and statistically it was his most efficient. My hope was that we would use this offseason to push him back to his preferred role as the 3rd or 4th WR on the depth chart. Unfortunately that didn't happen.

 

All respect, I don't think WR3 or WR4 is "his preferred role" to Gabe Davis.

[GunnerBill]

21 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Let's just hope the Bills don't pay him. He's not worth 10-15 million. 

 

I wonder if the Bills looked to trade him this off season. He's likely to hit the free market and the Bills will get little to nothing in return now. Did they error in judgement?  

 

The Davis love on this board is kind of crazy. Folks, he's just average and limited. The Bills need to improve the WR2 position. Diggs production playoff time will be dramatically reduced again without another viable passing weapon. Gotta hope someone else steps it up because Davis isn't that guy. 

 

Yet, Beane continues to pound the table for him. Feeding the fans a ray of hope. 

 

I wouldn't pay him as the Bills either. He will be signed as an expensive #2 on a team with a QB on a rookie deal. Gabe is a bottom 3rd of the league #2 option. That isn't showing him love. It is being realistic about where he is.

 

But if he gets 10-15m he is at worst returning the 4th round pick we spent as a comp. So no, they should not trade him. He is on a rookie contract that he will massively outproduce again this year. You take advantage of that, and then you take the comp pick on offer.

 

EDIT: but you are comparing him to a guy with 600 yards and 0 touchdowns in 3 seasons and then trying to put that difference just down to Josh Allen. That is ludicrous.

Edited July 20, 2023 by GunnerBill

[TheWeatherMan]

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Only three drafts ago
That’s three years you’re making it sound like it was last draft lol

Not sure how 3 drafts ago sounds like the last draft to you.  BTW 3 drafts ago was 2 years ago…lol.  

[Einstein's Dog]

1 hour ago, newcam2012 said:

Let's just hope the Bills don't pay him. He's not worth 10-15 million. 

 

I wonder if the Bills looked to trade him this off season. He's likely to hit the free market and the Bills will get little to nothing in return now. Did they error in judgement?  

 

The Davis love on this board is kind of crazy. Folks, he's just average and limited. The Bills need to improve the WR2 position. Diggs production playoff time will be dramatically reduced again without another viable passing weapon. Gotta hope someone else steps it up because Davis isn't that guy. 

 

Yet, Beane continues to pound the table for him. Feeding the fans a ray of hope. 

Why would the Bills look to trade away their #2WR, they are not rebuilding.  And as GB mentions, it's possible to get a compensation pick if the Bills don't sign him.  There is no error to even be considered here.  Even if we had DHop, you keep Davis.

 

I don't see how you come to the conclusion Beane is pounding the table for Davis.  The Bills have been discussed in the OBJ and DHop sweepstakes.  Of course Beane is not going to bad mouth Davis to the press, who would?

 

It's posts like these that just reek of an anti-Beane bias.  Posing a question on error in judgment when none exists, and claiming Beane is feeding the fans a ray of hope because he hasn't publicly bashed his current WR2.  C'mon.

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Seriously?

 

Seriously.  Brown's career shows a guy with often mediocre, sometimes below that catch %.  That doesn't speak to great ball tracking.

[newcam2012]

45 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

Why would the Bills look to trade away their #2WR, they are not rebuilding.  And as GB mentions, it's possible to get a compensation pick if the Bills don't sign him.  There is no error to even be considered here.  Even if we had DHop, you keep Davis.

 

I don't see how you come to the conclusion Beane is pounding the table for Davis.  The Bills have been discussed in the OBJ and DHop sweepstakes.  Of course Beane is not going to bad mouth Davis to the press, who would?

 

It's posts like these that just reek of an anti-Beane bias.  Posing a question on error in judgment when none exists, and claiming Beane is feeding the fans a ray of hope because he hasn't publicly bashed his current WR2.  C'mon.

That's one way to look at. I'm on the record saying Davis is a good WR 3/4. So I'm more than fine having him in the role. 

 

My contention is that Gabe is not a good WR2. What is his current role on the team? I was advocating that the team needed to upgrade the position. That's where I think Beane has errored. Granted he had difficult choices to make.

 

Beane has talked highly of Gabe and he's given him the reigns to the WR2 position. I believe that is a mistake and a weakness of the team. Hopefully, Gabe stays heIalthy and is more productive. I'm not optimistic but it certainly is a possibility; especially if others step up and the oline is better. 

 

I did not consider the level of compensation the Bills would receive if Gabe gets picked up. Plus, as mentioned getting him on the cheap for this year is advantageous. I WAS WRONG.

 

However, I still stand by Beane failed to upgrade the WR2 position. Perhaps you disagree. That's fine. I don't think that Beane bashing. Rather, it's Beane criticizing. Big difference.

 

Hope that clarifies my position. 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by newcam2012