Pats give DeVante Parker a Big Extension

[Blank Stare]

4 hours ago, Captain Hindsight said:

Of course they will be better with Rodgers, but Hackett is the wildcard here. He was laughably bad as a HC and apparently his plan is to let Rodgers do everything

Honestly, with as poor a coach as Hackett is, probably not a bad thing to let Rodgers call his own number. Probably one of the reasons he liked Hackett so much in GB. 

[billsfan89]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Because he is actually a solid player.  His down season are not related to his talent, it had more to do with the situation he was in.  And given the price of WR's these days, his deal is reasonable.  

 

To be honest, if Pats land Hopkins still (and most the talk still seems to lend towards them being the more likely spot), they could have a sneaky good offense this year if Mac Jones can just be solid or better now that he has a real OC again with O'Brien.

 

Pats are one of those teams no one is thinking too much about right now, but if they land Hopkins, they could be one of those sleeper teams that end up being a tougher opponent than people think this year.  Not a real contender per se, just not the roll over opponent I think people assume they will be.

 

I just don't see the talent level with the Pats on offense. At best with D-Hop they maybe have an above-average level of talent on offense. Factoring out Mac Jones (who I am not personally high on) the Pats O-line last season was a fairly average unit, not bad but not the elite unit it has been in the past and not much was added to it. The Pats at RB have Stevenson who is a good RB but not much depth. Then at WR/TE even if they added D-Hop I just don't see that unit really overwhelming anyone consistently unless D-Hop returns to his 2020 form which is unlikely given that he is 2 years older and coming off some injuries. 

 

At TE the Pats have Henry and Gesicki a solid combo but neither are dynamic TE's and at WR Bourn/Ju Ju/Parker/D-Hop is nice but there really isn't a consistent WR1 there and without that dynamic playmaker it becomes harder for a bunch of WR 2/3's to really have room to operate. 

 

Then there is Mac Jones who I just don't see being anything more than a game manager. And that's not to say you can't win with a game manager but rather that having a game manager at QB depresses the abilities of the talent around you. So even if the Pats are better at WR/TE/RB/O-line than I think having Mac Jones there means that the talent level won't be achieved and the offense will likely regress to being average.

[PatsFanNH]

20 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

I just don't see the talent level with the Pats on offense. At best with D-Hop they maybe have an above-average level of talent on offense. Factoring out Mac Jones (who I am not personally high on) the Pats O-line last season was a fairly average unit, not bad but not the elite unit it has been in the past and not much was added to it. The Pats at RB have Stevenson who is a good RB but not much depth. Then at WR/TE even if they added D-Hop I just don't see that unit really overwhelming anyone consistently unless D-Hop returns to his 2020 form which is unlikely given that he is 2 years older and coming off some injuries. 

 

At TE the Pats have Henry and Gesicki a solid combo but neither are dynamic TE's and at WR Bourn/Ju Ju/Parker/D-Hop is nice but there really isn't a consistent WR1 there and without that dynamic playmaker it becomes harder for a bunch of WR 2/3's to really have room to operate. 

 

Then there is Mac Jones who I just don't see being anything more than a game manager. And that's not to say you can't win with a game manager but rather that having a game manager at QB depresses the abilities of the talent around you. So even if the Pats are better at WR/TE/RB/O-line than I think having Mac Jones there means that the talent level won't be achieved and the offense will likely regress to being average.

Regress? Average would be a huge improvement over last year. Lol  That said it all depends on Jones, he showed in Alabama he can excel with great players around him so he won’t hold them back IMO.  I think, and I could be wrong,  the Pats will be a playoff team this year not a SB contender but a playoff team again. 

[C.Biscuit97]

Parker sucks but it’s hilarious to watch fans and media overreact to nfl contracts and their numbers which are completely meaningless 

1 minute ago, PatsFanNH said:

Regress? Average would be a huge improvement over last year. Lol  That said it all depends on Jones, he showed in Alabama he can excel with great players around him so he won’t hold them back IMO.  I think, and I could be wrong,  the Pats will be a playoff team this year not a SB contender but a playoff team again. 

Honestly, Jones at Alabama was amazing. The way he elevated that team with little nfl talent, questionable coaching staff, and little history. He did what no other quarterback could have done at that dumpster fire program. 
 

Mac is truly a special talent and totally doesn’t drive drunk. 

30 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

I just don't see the talent level with the Pats on offense. At best with D-Hop they maybe have an above-average level of talent on offense. Factoring out Mac Jones (who I am not personally high on) the Pats O-line last season was a fairly average unit, not bad but not the elite unit it has been in the past and not much was added to it. The Pats at RB have Stevenson who is a good RB but not much depth. Then at WR/TE even if they added D-Hop I just don't see that unit really overwhelming anyone consistently unless D-Hop returns to his 2020 form which is unlikely given that he is 2 years older and coming off some injuries. 

 

At TE the Pats have Henry and Gesicki a solid combo but neither are dynamic TE's and at WR Bourn/Ju Ju/Parker/D-Hop is nice but there really isn't a consistent WR1 there and without that dynamic playmaker it becomes harder for a bunch of WR 2/3's to really have room to operate. 

 

Then there is Mac Jones who I just don't see being anything more than a game manager. And that's not to say you can't win with a game manager but rather that having a game manager at QB depresses the abilities of the talent around you. So even if the Pats are better at WR/TE/RB/O-line than I think having Mac Jones there means that the talent level won't be achieved and the offense will likely regress to being average.

Pats have a bottom 5-10 offense in the nfl. No does, not a single player who scares you and a qb who has no arm strength. Just load the box and dare them to make plays over the top.

 

that said, they have a very good defense. They are going to be the most boring team in the nfl this year.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

16 hours ago, billsfan89 said:

No idea why they would invest a moderately sizable contract into a 30 year old WR who has had back to back down seasons. Parker only had one good season (2019) and a couple of other decent seasons (2020 and 2016) so it isn't like there was a big peak for him to return to. Also apparently this doesn't impact the Pats cap-wise much at all, so I don't know if this at all related to Dhop or not. Either way Pats throwing money at a WR who is unlikely to meet the expectations is a good thing. 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/devante-parker-deal-means-patriots-233503508.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

 

To create cap space for Hopkins??  Kind of risky move though as even if  Hopkins does sign with them from all accounts likely will be a one year deal.  And after that would still be stuck with a potential bad contract for Parker.

[RyanC883]

this is a drought era Bills move.  Clearly done in hopes it will elevate QB play.  He’s not a TO type player though so it makes zero sense.  

[billsfan89]

16 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Regress? Average would be a huge improvement over last year. Lol  That said it all depends on Jones, he showed in Alabama he can excel with great players around him so he won’t hold them back IMO.  I think, and I could be wrong,  the Pats will be a playoff team this year not a SB contender but a playoff team again. 

 

Regress in terms of the talent level around the QB not being reached because the QB can't get it done consistently. Obviously not compared to what they did last year. I think the Pats offense will be based on running the ball and not turning the ball over. Maybe they can make the playoffs on the strength of their defense and an offense not turning the ball over, but is a 9-8 seventh seed really all that impressive?

[PatsFanNH]

11 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Regress in terms of the talent level around the QB not being reached because the QB can't get it done consistently. Obviously not compared to what they did last year. I think the Pats offense will be based on running the ball and not turning the ball over. Maybe they can make the playoffs on the strength of their defense and an offense not turning the ball over, but is a 9-8 seventh seed really all that impressive?

Not really, but it shows IMO how good of a HC BB is.  The roster in most coaches hands be a bottom 5 team and I could see them winning 10 games w O Brian focused on the O and BB on the D.  Also I am a firm believer once you get into the dance anything can happen.. 

20 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

this is a drought era Bills move.  Clearly done in hopes it will elevate QB play.  He’s not a TO type player though so it makes zero sense.  

It would be like a 7 million cap hit next year if they cut him and it isn’t that big of a deal for them cap wise.

[RyanC883]

2 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

Not really, but it shows IMO how good of a HC BB is.  The roster in most coaches hands be a bottom 5 team and I could see them winning 10 games w O Brian focused on the O and BB on the D.  Also I am a firm believer once you get into the dance anything can happen.. 

It would be like a 7 million cap hit next year if they cut him and it isn’t that big of a deal for them cap wise.

 

well, glad the Pats fan likes it.  Wasted money is wasted money. . 

[Billl]

4 hours ago, Blank Stare said:

Honestly, with as poor a coach as Hackett is, probably not a bad thing to let Rodgers call his own number. Probably one of the reasons he liked Hackett so much in GB. 

 

6 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Yep.

 

The great Nathaniel Hackett is going to get steamrolled by Rodgers similar what happened to him in Denver with the Broncos "savior" Russell Wilson last year.  So far they have added the old  has been receiver Randall Cobb.  We will be able to see what kind of de-facto OC Rodgers can be.

Hackett failed as a HC, but Rodgers looked a lot better with him than without him.  I’m sure Ken Dorsey will scheme circles around him, though.

[billieve420]

Belicheck just trolling Mac Jones at this point now.

[NoHuddleKelly12]

21 hours ago, Einstein said:

Bill Belichick.

Great coach. Terrible GM.

Except, without Brady he’s also not a great coach! 10 seasons, 7 under .500, and only 1 playoff W. Losing record…so, I respectfully beg to differ. 😅

[Success]

I doubt the Pats will end up in 4th place while Belichick is there. They have a 4th place roster, but the coaching makes such a big difference.

 

If they get Hopkins, I think fans here underestimate how good they might be.  They could legit challenge for the division. The Bills should prevail over all 3 teams, but it's close enough where if there are a couple of weird breaks, any of the other teams could win it.

 

[Thurman#1]

9 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Because he is actually a solid player.  His down season are not related to his talent, it had more to do with the situation he was in.  And given the price of WR's these days, his deal is reasonable.  

 

To be honest, if Pats land Hopkins still (and most the talk still seems to lend towards them being the more likely spot), they could have a sneaky good offense this year if Mac Jones can just be solid or better now that he has a real OC again with O'Brien.

 

Pats are one of those teams no one is thinking too much about right now, but if they land Hopkins, they could be one of those sleeper teams that end up being a tougher opponent than people think this year.  Not a real contender per se, just not the roll over opponent I think people assume they will be.

 

 

All of this makes sense to me. 

 

My knee jerk is to hate them, but this seems OK to me. Not that I spent a lot of time watching them last year.

 

"up to" $33M. It's all in the details. The picture will become clearer as we see the numbers.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

All of this makes sense to me. 

 

My knee jerk is to hate them, but this seems OK to me. Not that I spent a lot of time watching them last year.

 

"up to" $33M. It's all in the details. The picture will become clearer as we see the numbers.

I agree with you, I want to just hate them too.  And that was the key for me “up to $33M” which means that if he performs he is making $11M per and that’s not bad for a contributing WR in todays market:  

Edited June 30, 2023 by Alphadawg7

[PatsFanNH]

2 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Except, without Brady he’s also not a great coach! 10 seasons, 7 under .500, and only 1 playoff W. Losing record…so, I respectfully beg to differ. 😅

Last year I am glad they missed the playoffs otherwise Patricia may still be here. That said that roster was horrid and was 1 win away from the playoffs and a winning record.. the first year without Brady was also a year they lost Edelman really early and then he retired before Jones started. So you were replacing not only Brady but your top WR.  (And Cam Newton was just beyond bad as a QB.)

[Richard Noggin]

8 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

Regress? Average would be a huge improvement over last year. Lol  That said it all depends on Jones, he showed in Alabama he can excel with great players around him so he won’t hold them back IMO.  I think, and I could be wrong,  the Pats will be a playoff team this year not a SB contender but a playoff team again. 

 

So you're saying the AFCE sends 3 or even 4 teams to the playoffs? 

 

Or, who from the division falters? 

[PatsFanNH]

7 minutes ago, Richard Noggin said:

 

So you're saying the AFCE sends 3 or even 4 teams to the playoffs? 

 

Or, who from the division falters? 

I expect the Jets to falter and wouldn’t be shocked if the Dolphins falter as well as I expect Tua be injured early. 

[Richard Noggin]

4 hours ago, Billl said:

 

Hackett failed as a HC, but Rodgers looked a lot better with him than without him.  I’m sure Ken Dorsey will scheme circles around him, though.

 

This is not ALL wrong. I agree that Hackett's deferential approach to a Rodgers-led offense has some demonstrable merit, and is unrelated to his disastrous experience in Denver. 

 

The Dorsey question will be answered one way or another in 2023. At this very moment, there is evidence (both statistical and anecdotal) to support just about any subjective conclusion. Ken Dorsey's 2022 offense was objectively ELITE. Obviously it didn't always FEEL or SEEM elite after halftime on Halloween. So we're in a kind of Schrodinger's Holding Pattern of Angst: we might have predictions or hypotheses, but we cannot actually KNOW the 2023 results until they happen. So we're in a stressful state of uncertainty and multiplicity. Therefore, many are compelled to medicate themselves with premature belief in some predictive "take." Helps us to sleep at night. 

[Nelius]

LOL go Pats. Jakobi Myers might honestly be better at this point so very weird WR to sink money into as a pseudo-1. All is not well in New England. I'll buy the hype for the Fish and the Jets and the AFC East being a warzone, but NE might be bottom 5 at the end of the year.

[PatsFanNH]

8 hours ago, Nelius said:

LOL go Pats. Jakobi Myers might honestly be better at this point so very weird WR to sink money into as a pseudo-1. All is not well in New England. I'll buy the hype for the Fish and the Jets and the AFC East being a warzone, but NE might be bottom 5 at the end of the year.

That is not WR1 type money. It is more on par with a 2 or 3 type money.  As for Meyers I wish they had signed him over JuJu just because he and Jones had chemistry. 

[Beast]

On 6/28/2023 at 11:10 PM, Einstein said:

Bill Belichick.

Great coach. Terrible GM.

Bill Belichick.

 

Overrated coach. Brady carried him. Dime a dozen without Brady.

 

***** GM.

 

Belichick may be the most fortunate coach in NFL history.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Beast

[Einstein]

47 minutes ago, Beast said:

Bill Belichick.

 

Overrated coach. Brady carried him. Dime a dozen without Brady.

 

Belichick won a Super Bowl in Brady’s first season starting when Brady was 59% passing for 145 yards and 1 TD in the Super Bowl.

 

Brady didn’t carry jack squat that year.

 

Belichick won his second Super Bowl in 2003 when Brady had 23 TD’s and 12 INT. To put that into perspective, Ryan Fitzpatrick had a nearly identical season with us in 2010, when he had 23 TD’s and 15 INT.

 

Brady didn’t carry jack squat that year either.

 

Brady didn’t have a single season with more than 28 TD’s until Belichick already had 3 rings. Allen has had more than 28 TD’s for 4 seasons now. If Brady carried Belichick with those meager stats, then Allen has been overhead shoulder presses of McDermott for nearly half a decade now.

 

Belichick also went 11-5 with Matt Cassell as his QB and went to the playoffs with Mac Jones.

 

Belichick also shut down our k-gun offense in the 90’s when practically no one else could.

 

He is great. Admitting it doesn’t make you less of a Bills fan. But not admitting it does make you look foolish.

[RoyBatty is alive]

48 minutes ago, Beast said:

Bill Belichick.

 

Overrated coach. Brady carried him. Dime a dozen without Brady.

 

***** GM.

 

Belichick may be the most fortunate coach in NFL history.

I dont disagree with you at all, but begrudgingly, Belichek has made some great gm  moves in the Patriot way by trading very popular players as they wee nearing their peak so he could get top value for them and the list is long.  Belichek did a great job resurrecting (IMO) randy moss and in the Patriot way when Moss was washed up traded him away.

[BADOLBILZ]

On 6/29/2023 at 9:33 AM, Billl said:

The guy won two of the last 3 MVPs. 

 

 

I think you have to look at Aaron Rodgers' drop-off last season.    He was far from an MVP last season.    Saying "two of the last 3" under those circumstances is like saying Tom Brady, Matt Ryan and Cam Newton have won 3 of the last 8 MVP's.   It's proof of their ability if you believe they are still that level of player but just trivia if you think they've fallen off significantly. 

[Einstein]

4 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I think you have to look at Aaron Rodgers' drop-off last season.  

 

It’s pretty much impossible to know whether the drop off was due to Rogers or due to that awful team they put around him.

[Beck Water]

On 6/28/2023 at 11:07 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

That's the market for guys like Gabe and MVS.   Big boundary WR who you hope will be your WR3 if all goes right.

 

Market for a player like Devante Parker, reasonable take

 

Market for 'WR who you hope will be your WR3...."....Factually, there are 31 players (including Parker) with a contract AAV of $11M/yr and above.

Who are the "WR who you hope will be your WR3 if all goes right" on this list?  Some WR2 there.  WR3?????

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/contracts/sort-average/wide-receiver/limit-100/

 

Does it strike you as weird that the Pats let Jakobi Meyers (age 26) walk in FA for a 3 yr, $33M contract with the Raiders, and are now extending Devonte Parker (age 30) the same deal?  Meyers had ~5 r/g for 57 ypg, 12 y/r and almost 70% catch %.  Parker had 2.4 r/g for 42 ypg, 17 y/r and 66% catch %. 

 

I don't watch either team unless they're playing the Bills.  Obviously Bill O'Brien thinks Parker brings something to the offense that Meyers didn't but if it's a deep threat, paying a 30 yr old seems strange.

 

13 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

I dont disagree with you at all, but begrudgingly, Belichek has made some great gm  moves in the Patriot way by trading very popular players as they wee nearing their peak so he could get top value for them and the list is long.  Belichek did a great job resurrecting (IMO) randy moss and in the Patriot way when Moss was washed up traded him away.

 

All true, but it seems to me a big part of the engine that fueled those great gm moves was Tom Brady and the Patriots record of winning championships.  Players were willing to take less than market value to play for the Pats with Tom Brady, so he had a ready pipeline to backfill when he traded away peak performers who were starting to clamor for market value pay.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, PatsFanNH said:

That is not WR1 type money. It is more on par with a 2 or 3 type money.  

 

 

You are correct but at the same time I'd hate it as a fan.    Definitely one of those signings that can only be popular among the myopic in the fan base because AT BEST you might come close to getting your money's worth out of it on an individual player basis.   But again.......that's the market that the Chiefs set with a guy like MVS.   People spent years talking about how the Packers were Davante Adams and a bunch of garbage at WR and then a championship team turns around and gives Green Bay's WR2 an 8 figure aav contract.  And then he played that role just like he always did......but as the 3rd option instead of the 2nd option........and they won a SB.  

[Billl]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I think you have to look at Aaron Rodgers' drop-off last season.    He was far from an MVP last season.    Saying "two of the last 3" under those circumstances is like saying Tom Brady, Matt Ryan and Cam Newton have won 3 of the last 8 MVP's.   It's proof of their ability if you believe they are still that level of player but just trivia if you think they've fallen off significantly. 

Of course, but 26/12 while completing 65% of his passes is still a really strong season given the lack of weapons and loss of his OC.  It’s not like he wasn’t still a great QB even though it was a down year by his standards.  It wasn’t all that far off of Allen’s season, and his QBR was nearly identical to Allen’s 2021 season.  People were preparing for his demise back in 2017, and that clearly didn’t happen.  

 

It’s always possible that he falls off a cliff, but the much more likely scenario is that he, along with his longtime OC, provides a MASSIVE upgrade to the historically bad QB play that the Jets got last season.  He’s very likely still a top 5 QB, certainly top 10.  I’m always amused by the amount of posters who want to pretend that Rodgers and Hackett are some sort of punchline.

[BADOLBILZ]

24 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Market for a player like Devante Parker, reasonable take

 

Market for 'WR who you hope will be your WR3...."....Factually, there are 31 players (including Parker) with a contract AAV of $11M/yr and above.

Who are the "WR who you hope will be your WR3 if all goes right" on this list?  Some WR2 there.  WR3?????

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/contracts/sort-average/wide-receiver/limit-100/

 

Does it strike you as weird that the Pats let Jakobi Meyers (age 26) walk in FA for a 3 yr, $33M contract with the Raiders, and are now extending Devonte Parker (age 30) the same deal?  Meyers had ~5 r/g for 57 ypg, 12 y/r and almost 70% catch %.  Parker had 2.4 r/g for 42 ypg, 17 y/r and 66% catch %. 

 

I don't watch either team unless they're playing the Bills.  Obviously Bill O'Brien thinks Parker brings something to the offense that Meyers didn't but if it's a deep threat, paying a 30 yr old seems strange.

 

 

All true, but it seems to me a big part of the engine that fueled those great gm moves was Tom Brady and the Patriots record of winning championships.  Players were willing to take less than market value to play for the Pats with Tom Brady, so he had a ready pipeline to backfill when he traded away peak performers who were starting to clamor for market value pay.

 

 

I'm a little surprised there are AS MANY as 31 WR's at $11M and above.

 

As you well know......you can't stack contracts and say "well that's 31st and there are only 32 teams so that is a WR1 contract".    There are lot's of players on rookie contracts who are top 2 WR and then there are players that were signed to deals when the cap was much lower.    If you add those up and he falls in the mid WR2 range.........that makes sense for a veteran with good timing on his contract.    As the past 6 years or so of SB history have told us you really want a WR1 as your WR2 if you expect to reach a SB.    And you want a mid level WR2 as your WR3.   Critically important position in the game today.

 

As for Jakobi Meyers.........yeah I think he is a better WR than Parker.   That doesn't necessarily change Parker's individual value to a team that thinks they can win a SB,  which maybe the Pats feel like now.    Maybe they thought for sure they were going to come down with a top WR on draft day but had to pull the trigger when such a talented CB was on the board.  So their plans got re-arranged.

 

And I didn't say I'd like the deal.   Quite the opposite,  if Beane made that deal I'd feel the same way I feel about paying a terribly rated guard like Connor McGovern $7M per year or a relative scrub WR like Deonte Harty above $2M flier level.    On what they've done to this point in their careers?   Big overpays.  But in Parker's case you can at least point to the market for a 600+ yard per season veteran WR.   I don't know where the market for Connor McGovern and Harty came from.   That arose from thin air it seems.  

 

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by BADOLBILZ

[BADOLBILZ]

27 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

It’s pretty much impossible to know whether the drop off was due to Rogers or due to that awful team they put around him.

 

Maybe but VERY reasonable to speculate that he might be past a full bounce back stage either way entering his age 40 season.    

[Captain Hindsight]

32 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

It’s pretty much impossible to know whether the drop off was due to Rogers or due to that awful team they put around him.

Oh please, he had a great o line, a top running attack and a few young WRs. He was hurt, but he also didn't lack for talent. 

 

I am very curious to see how he does with the Jets. For the first time in his career he is playing for a defensive minded HC and his OC was an absolutely train wreck when he was in charge of the offense on his own (with a damn good QB too). The Jets will be better, but I think Rodgers days as an MVP level QB are long gone

[Beast]

1 hour ago, Einstein said:

 

Belichick won a Super Bowl in Brady’s first season starting when Brady was 59% passing for 145 yards and 1 TD in the Super Bowl.

 

Brady didn’t carry jack squat that year.

 

Belichick won his second Super Bowl in 2003 when Brady had 23 TD’s and 12 INT. To put that into perspective, Ryan Fitzpatrick had a nearly identical season with us in 2010, when he had 23 TD’s and 15 INT.

 

Brady didn’t carry jack squat that year either.

 

Brady didn’t have a single season with more than 28 TD’s until Belichick already had 3 rings. Allen has had more than 28 TD’s for 4 seasons now. If Brady carried Belichick with those meager stats, then Allen has been overhead shoulder presses of McDermott for nearly half a decade now.

 

Belichick also went 11-5 with Matt Cassell as his QB and went to the playoffs with Mac Jones.

 

Belichick also shut down our k-gun offense in the 90’s when practically no one else could.

 

He is great. Admitting it doesn’t make you less of a Bills fan. But not admitting it does make you look foolish.

He sucks.

79-87 without Tom Brady.

 

That is worse than Lovie Smith in the win percentage column.

 

Lovie Belichick.

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Maybe but VERY reasonable to speculate that he might be past a full bounce back stage either way entering his age 40 season.    

 

That would indeed be wonderful. The thought of the Jets wasting all those picks and money on a washed up player gives me great joy.

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Captain Hindsight said:

Oh please, he had a great o line, a top running attack and a few young WRs. He was hurt, but he also didn't lack for talent. 

 

I am very curious to see how he does with the Jets. For the first time in his career he is playing for a defensive minded HC and his OC was an absolutely train wreck when he was in charge of the offense on his own (with a damn good QB too). The Jets will be better, but I think Rodgers days as an MVP level QB are long gone

 

Rodgers:  "I must leave Green Bay, they give me NOTHING at WR"

Rodgers: "Now that I'm with the Jets, please sign my GB WR Allen Lazard and Randall Cobb"

 

We'll see how that works out.

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

I'm a little surprised there are AS MANY as 31 WR's at $11M and above.

 

As you well know......you can't stack contracts and say "well that's 31st and there are only 32 teams so that is a WR1 contract".    There are lot's of players on rookie contracts who are top 2 WR and then there are players that were signed to deals when the cap was much lower.    If you add those up and he falls in the mid WR2 range.........that makes sense for a veteran with good timing on his contract.  

 

OK, so it sounds like we agree that Parker is a WR2 getting paid like a good WR2.  And I think that's where Davis will slot (sounds like you agree)

 

Yes, I'm aware you can't look at the top 31 contracts and say "those are the WR1" for the reasons you cite.  That's why I just asked who on that list you saw as the WR3? 

 

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

As the past 6 years or so of SB history have told us you really want a WR1 as your WR2 if you expect to reach a SB.    And you want a mid level WR2 as your WR3.  Critically important position in the game today.

 

It would certainly be desirable to have a WR-1 capable guy as our WR2 and a WR2-type as our WR3, but I'm not sure that's what the last few Superbowls really showed us.  For example, was TikTok Boy a WR1 playing 2nd receiver for the Chiefs?  JSS put up #1 type numbers once upon a time with Big Ben, but hindsight seems to say that was the Antonio Brown effect and when he became "#1" on the team, it was learned he wasn't?  Was MVS a WR2 playing 3rd receiver for the Chiefs?  The situation you cite is surely true of the Bengals and the Eagles, but was it true of the 2021 Rams - Van Jefferson, Really?  The 2020 Bucs - is Chris Godwin a WR1 playing WR2 or another case of a guy making yards behind an unreal #1?  The 2018 and 2019 Pats?  I mean, the 2nd receiver for yards on the 2018 and 2019 pats was an RB fergoshsakes.

 

 

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

And I didn't say I'd like the deal.   Quite the opposite,  if Beane made that deal I'd feel the same way I feel about paying a terribly rated guard like Connor McGovern

 

I'm interested in this.  Where is he terribly rated, and by whom?

[billieve420]

 

Parker is not going to do any favors for Mac Jones. Aging player who gets dinged up a lot. A guy who can’t separate and gets QB in trouble because he is now forced to throw contested passes.

[BADOLBILZ]

47 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

OK, so it sounds like we agree that Parker is a WR2 getting paid like a good WR2.  And I think that's where Davis will slot (sounds like you agree)

 

Yes, I'm aware you can't look at the top 31 contracts and say "those are the WR1" for the reasons you cite.  That's why I just asked who on that list you saw as the WR3? 

 

 

It would certainly be desirable to have a WR-1 capable guy as our WR2 and a WR2-type as our WR3, but I'm not sure that's what the last few Superbowls really showed us.  For example, was TikTok Boy a WR1 playing 2nd receiver for the Chiefs?  JSS put up #1 type numbers once upon a time with Big Ben, but hindsight seems to say that was the Antonio Brown effect and when he became "#1" on the team, it was learned he wasn't?  Was MVS a WR2 playing 3rd receiver for the Chiefs?  The situation you cite is surely true of the Bengals and the Eagles, but was it true of the 2021 Rams - Van Jefferson, Really?  The 2020 Bucs - is Chris Godwin a WR1 playing WR2 or another case of a guy making yards behind an unreal #1?  The 2018 and 2019 Pats?  I mean, the 2nd receiver for yards on the 2018 and 2019 pats was an RB fergoshsakes.

 

 

 

I'm interested in this.  Where is he terribly rated, and by whom?

 

1. Yes if your squad goal is just to be "in the hunt" for a wildcard spot still at Thanksgiving then Parker is an adequate WR2.    If you expect to be playing in February he'd better CLEARLY be your WR3.   The position has become that much of an indicator of success.   

 

2. McGovern had a dreadful 52 overall rating with PFF.   And then he and Edwards(58) images were used in a re-tweet about PFF offensive line unit rankings like they were big upgrades.    Whatever people want to say about PFF.........if you are south of 60 on their scale you are clearly putting a lot of bad on tape. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

This is great news 

[stevewin]

On 6/30/2023 at 9:23 AM, Beast said:

Bill Belichick.

 

Overrated coach. Brady carried him. Dime a dozen without Brady.

 

***** GM.

 

Belichick may be the most fortunate coach in NFL history.

Always amazes me people bring up the Brady thing with Bellicheat but not the cheating